Donegal Forum

NFL 2020

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Replying To ManusFromHeaven:  "Lads im just gonna make a very simple point and im not gonna name any individuals because people rally in with the excuses then.

When Donegal are in a tight game and taken down the home straight neck and neck.... we fold first.

And we dont just fold in the conventional way.... we fold spectacularly and gift wrap the game for the opposition.

Anyone want examples?

4pt 2nd half lead vs Tyrone in '18- folded.
Leading in Croke Park in injury time vs Kerry '19 and passed up a gift of a late goal chance to win the game
Castlebar '19- look at the goal we conceded- shots for points dropping short and its in our net. Then proceed to kick wide after wide.
And then you can take your pick from the catalog of errors that leave us on 3 league pts after 4 games...when we SHOULD be on 8 having held significant 2nd half leads in ALL 4 games.

This Donegal team look great romping over a Down, Derry or Cavan on a nice summers days in Clones- but there are huge and glaring mental strength issues both as a team and as individuals. When the pressure comes on.. the schoolboy errors kick in and Donegal are easy meat in a final 20mins.

It must be called out, acknowledged and addressed immediately by the management and players as the fundamental thing that is undermining this team and the reason they not got past the super 8 nor wont till its resolved."
So what is your remedy Manus ,it is obvious our backs aren't good enough compare them with the Naomh Conaill backs ,who held the flying Gweedore forwards who destroyed Kilcar and not one of them on the Donegal team ,that whole Naomh Conaill half back line would have done better not to mention the full back line ,how many goals did the flying Cassidy or the much lamented McNeilus get ,

gaanervous (Donegal) - Posts: 186 - 24/02/2020 12:35:06    2269684

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Replying To ManusFromHeaven:  "Lads im just gonna make a very simple point and im not gonna name any individuals because people rally in with the excuses then.

When Donegal are in a tight game and taken down the home straight neck and neck.... we fold first.

And we dont just fold in the conventional way.... we fold spectacularly and gift wrap the game for the opposition.

Anyone want examples?

4pt 2nd half lead vs Tyrone in '18- folded.
Leading in Croke Park in injury time vs Kerry '19 and passed up a gift of a late goal chance to win the game
Castlebar '19- look at the goal we conceded- shots for points dropping short and its in our net. Then proceed to kick wide after wide.
And then you can take your pick from the catalog of errors that leave us on 3 league pts after 4 games...when we SHOULD be on 8 having held significant 2nd half leads in ALL 4 games.

This Donegal team look great romping over a Down, Derry or Cavan on a nice summers days in Clones- but there are huge and glaring mental strength issues both as a team and as individuals. When the pressure comes on.. the schoolboy errors kick in and Donegal are easy meat in a final 20mins.

It must be called out, acknowledged and addressed immediately by the management and players as the fundamental thing that is undermining this team and the reason they not got past the super 8 nor wont till its resolved."
At this moment in time, your assessment is probably correct but there are mitigating circumstances. A lot of people refer back to the Jim McGuinness days when we would never lose a lead. Once Jim left, we were never going to get a manger that good to replace him, we have to be realistic. Also Jim had a very experienced team of great footballers who were able to close out games.

I still think this current team are on the right path but we do need a few more of the younger players to step up and take more responsibility. Eoghan Ban and Stephen McMenamin have done this in the past couple of years but we need a few more to reach this level. Jamie Brennan and Michael Langan are very close, just a bit more consistency required. I am still positive about the team and they have years ahead of them, we must have the youngest average age of all the div 1 teams. It is the league after all and we are even in March, important not to overreact.

Green_Gold (Donegal) - Posts: 1734 - 24/02/2020 12:45:03    2269691

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Replying To ManusFromHeaven:  "Lads im just gonna make a very simple point and im not gonna name any individuals because people rally in with the excuses then.

When Donegal are in a tight game and taken down the home straight neck and neck.... we fold first.

And we dont just fold in the conventional way.... we fold spectacularly and gift wrap the game for the opposition.

Anyone want examples?

4pt 2nd half lead vs Tyrone in '18- folded.
Leading in Croke Park in injury time vs Kerry '19 and passed up a gift of a late goal chance to win the game
Castlebar '19- look at the goal we conceded- shots for points dropping short and its in our net. Then proceed to kick wide after wide.
And then you can take your pick from the catalog of errors that leave us on 3 league pts after 4 games...when we SHOULD be on 8 having held significant 2nd half leads in ALL 4 games.

This Donegal team look great romping over a Down, Derry or Cavan on a nice summers days in Clones- but there are huge and glaring mental strength issues both as a team and as individuals. When the pressure comes on.. the schoolboy errors kick in and Donegal are easy meat in a final 20mins.

It must be called out, acknowledged and addressed immediately by the management and players as the fundamental thing that is undermining this team and the reason they not got past the super 8 nor wont till its resolved."
That argument is fairly reductive. You could use the Tyrone and Kerry games from last year as counter-examples to what you brought up. Was the pressure not on in the Ulster semifinal?

greatpoint (USA) - Posts: 325 - 24/02/2020 12:56:07    2269696

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Ml Murphy is as god a full forward as has ever played the brutality he suffers the Dublin backs especially John Small not very nice to say least M Deegan as is the wont of referees took soft option and gave both players a yellow Small should have got a Black much earlier

Match officials useless dont protect the innocent nut Murphy is a awesome footballer Dublin no where near as good as they think they are Mayo should have beaten them in some of there 5 in a row

Donegal well up for them

clooney (Clare) - Posts: 583 - 24/02/2020 14:16:22    2269744

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Replying To greatpoint:  "That argument is fairly reductive. You could use the Tyrone and Kerry games from last year as counter-examples to what you brought up. Was the pressure not on in the Ulster semifinal?"
Quite simply- no it wasnt.

We got an early lead on Tyrone and Cavan last year and sought (with difficulty) to see it out.

These were games won and bagged early- not down the home straight.

ManusFromHeaven (Donegal) - Posts: 326 - 24/02/2020 14:37:03    2269750

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Replying To gaanervous:  "So what is your remedy Manus ,it is obvious our backs aren't good enough compare them with the Naomh Conaill backs ,who held the flying Gweedore forwards who destroyed Kilcar and not one of them on the Donegal team ,that whole Naomh Conaill half back line would have done better not to mention the full back line ,how many goals did the flying Cassidy or the much lamented McNeilus get ,"
Lets get one thing out in the open- there wasnt a Glenties man worthy of being put on that Croke Park pitch on Saturday night, and if i were a Glenties man id be concerned by that fact going forward, county champs or not. Wasnt me who didnt put them on the pitch, the experts- Bonner and Rochford didnt.

Regarding a remedy- we must defend better as a team and in better numbers, here is a fact regarding Saturday night- in the 2nd half when Dublin found their grove, every one of their attacks resulted in the following

- A Point
- A Wide
- A Free

Every single attack bar none. We have an absolute inability now to strip a team of a ball and i'm asking out loud, what is Karl Lacys part in this? Does he not take some responsibility for our collective defending? Is he seeing this? whats being done about it. I see names being mentioned as absent etc- but i dont think any individual will improve things when its the collective defending as a unit that is totally non functional.

We are losing scores at will and at ease.

ManusFromHeaven (Donegal) - Posts: 326 - 24/02/2020 14:45:36    2269755

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@ManusFromHeaven, Good Post, but you risk being classified as a 'fool' for pointing out the absolute obvious. The defeat of Meath, that's it to date,not even a McKenna cup. @gaanervous, You could be right,Glenties should have more representation on the field. Ethan O Donnell all day before Paul Brennan,Jack McKelvey and McGettigan.Guess these are 'foolish' assumptions for a losing team.By the way let's look at the injury situation on sat night. Cluxton,Cooper,McCaffrey,McCauley,Connolly,OCallaghan and Philly McMahon. Everyone multiple all stars and Player of the year winners. Donegal, McGrath, McMenamin,McGee and Gallen. No Allstar, McGrath and McMenamin do a solid job, McGee a loss, Gallen not even established in the team.The Dubs at the bigger disadvantage.

thelowball (USA) - Posts: 279 - 24/02/2020 14:57:19    2269763

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Corofin are all Ireland champions and they had only two starters yesterday. Just because your county champions doesn't have you a right to be on the county team. Apart from the obvious Thompson would any n conall player do any better that what we're on. I don't think so Mc Kelvey one for the future. As for Ethan I like him as a player but he looks well down the pecking order. If any man knows a good defender I would say Lacey would..

rorysboys (Donegal) - Posts: 880 - 24/02/2020 15:41:43    2269783

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Replying To rorysboys:  "Corofin are all Ireland champions and they had only two starters yesterday. Just because your county champions doesn't have you a right to be on the county team. Apart from the obvious Thompson would any n conall player do any better that what we're on. I don't think so Mc Kelvey one for the future. As for Ethan I like him as a player but he looks well down the pecking order. If any man knows a good defender I would say Lacey would.."
Some posters on here r a joke ,u r saying if any player is worth his place Karl Lacey would know ,and a little further back Manus is blaming him for the defeats ,u both can't be right and as far as Karl is concerned he was one of our best ever ,but he doesn't decide which players should be on our County team ,and don't bring Corofin into it ,Galway have a host of great players to choose from we sadly don't ,and all this talk of blaming the management team ,for when the players cross the line to the field it is up to the players to work it out for themselves .Back to Manus that arrogant statement that Naomh Conaill have no players that r worth their place ,is someone who knows nothing about football ,

gaanervous (Donegal) - Posts: 186 - 24/02/2020 16:25:40    2269799

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What has Corofin got to do with Donegal football malaise? Winners and losers, does that sum it up!

thelowball (USA) - Posts: 279 - 24/02/2020 16:42:42    2269803

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If Donegal are defending so badly ,how come we have conceded less than any team in the division.I thought we defended quite well on Saturday and had a good shape.The goal was an unfortunate individual error i.e. no hiding place for a keeper.The goals Mayo got had a lot of luck about them in fairness.We were caught out a bit by the Galway goals but overall 2-8 was not a big score to concede Some of the cheap scores we conceded on Sat were from silly turnovers not from backs I might add.People should look at facts and not become part of a group think about what is wrong.We are playing quite well and with a bit more cleverness in the execution of chances we would be in good shape by now.

gunman (Donegal) - Posts: 698 - 24/02/2020 17:29:48    2269820

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Replying To ManusFromHeaven:  "Quite simply- no it wasnt.

We got an early lead on Tyrone and Cavan last year and sought (with difficulty) to see it out.

These were games won and bagged early- not down the home straight."
So because we got an early lead there was no pressure? Surely there's more pressure in trying to maintain a lead for an entire game?

Not sure why you're referencing the Cavan game.

greatpoint (USA) - Posts: 325 - 24/02/2020 18:39:25    2269831

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Replying To thelowball:  "What has Corofin got to do with Donegal football malaise? Winners and losers, does that sum it up!"
You do realise that the rest of this forum is well aware that you are not a genuine supporter?

greatpoint (USA) - Posts: 325 - 24/02/2020 18:46:20    2269833

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Replying To RoryGall35:  "Another lead lost..this is getting worrying now. I do think the players are there to beat Dublin in Croke park in the summer but we need jimmy back. Couldn't see Donegal giving up the leads with Jimmy back on the dugout. On a positive note well done to Donegal u20 beating monaghan. Anybody know anything about the u20s...are they contenders?"
Regarding the under twenties that was an exceptional result despite the circumstances which was completely unfair on both sides. No qualms with fixture pressure to end a game that way but with not without a replay......very tough on Monaghan. Overall if at full strength we would be serious challengers I think. Just go back to 3 years ago this group and Tyrone were very closely matched. We played them in the championship but we were far from full strength due to selfish politics and they went on and won the all Ireland.....we pushed them as hard as any team despite being far from full strength. Unfortunately under different circumstances again the squad is depleted. Make no mistake with a fully fit Oisin Gallen and Conor O'Donnell we be big challengers to Tyrone and possibly beyond. The fly in the ointment is Dublin who take this grade very seriously and rightly strictly keep players eligible for the grade at it but who else can do that? Not even Kerry which cost them an all Ireland or 2. Think Down will be another close affair and if we can get a player or 2 back who knows but think it will be a tough ask even to get out of Ulster.

panamasam (Australia) - Posts: 2479 - 24/02/2020 18:51:53    2269838

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Replying To gunman:  "If Donegal are defending so badly ,how come we have conceded less than any team in the division.I thought we defended quite well on Saturday and had a good shape.The goal was an unfortunate individual error i.e. no hiding place for a keeper.The goals Mayo got had a lot of luck about them in fairness.We were caught out a bit by the Galway goals but overall 2-8 was not a big score to concede Some of the cheap scores we conceded on Sat were from silly turnovers not from backs I might add.People should look at facts and not become part of a group think about what is wrong.We are playing quite well and with a bit more cleverness in the execution of chances we would be in good shape by now."
Spot on gun we defended well just conceded a needless goal (Monaghan done the same) and other scores from individual errors rather than collective bad defending. Again pretty confident we will retain Division one status. Beyond that we need to become more ruthless and show more conviction bar the obvious players. They have the talent so should be no excuses.

panamasam (Australia) - Posts: 2479 - 24/02/2020 19:07:01    2269842

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@greatpoint, Pray tell,who anointed u judge and jury of this forum?

thelowball (USA) - Posts: 279 - 24/02/2020 20:05:32    2269864

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Replying To gunman:  "If Donegal are defending so badly ,how come we have conceded less than any team in the division.I thought we defended quite well on Saturday and had a good shape.The goal was an unfortunate individual error i.e. no hiding place for a keeper.The goals Mayo got had a lot of luck about them in fairness.We were caught out a bit by the Galway goals but overall 2-8 was not a big score to concede Some of the cheap scores we conceded on Sat were from silly turnovers not from backs I might add.People should look at facts and not become part of a group think about what is wrong.We are playing quite well and with a bit more cleverness in the execution of chances we would be in good shape by now."
At last a voice of reason calling out the tripe

eunans4ever (Donegal) - Posts: 1176 - 24/02/2020 20:33:31    2269876

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Replying To thelowball:  "@greatpoint, Pray tell,who anointed u judge and jury of this forum?"
Red Hugh himself.

greatpoint (USA) - Posts: 325 - 24/02/2020 21:44:47    2269895

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Replying To gunman:  "If Donegal are defending so badly ,how come we have conceded less than any team in the division.I thought we defended quite well on Saturday and had a good shape.The goal was an unfortunate individual error i.e. no hiding place for a keeper.The goals Mayo got had a lot of luck about them in fairness.We were caught out a bit by the Galway goals but overall 2-8 was not a big score to concede Some of the cheap scores we conceded on Sat were from silly turnovers not from backs I might add.People should look at facts and not become part of a group think about what is wrong.We are playing quite well and with a bit more cleverness in the execution of chances we would be in good shape by now."
100% agree and this backs up what I think about the performances so far - if we'd taken a few more of the chances we've created, we'd be on 8 points right now. The problems as I see them are in finishing off attacks.

Manus you made a point about the 2nd half and no turnovers, but in the Mayo match we were incredible for turnovers and weathered their 2nd half storm really well defensively. We've been sucker punched a couple times yes but this comes down to individual concentration rather than defensive structure or tactics for me. When you look at what we're conceding, I'd be happy conceding a similar average come the summertime. We have to improve our accuracy going forward.

JoeSoap (Donegal) - Posts: 1161 - 24/02/2020 21:55:27    2269897

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Big crowd needed on sunday Banty has Monaghan back at full throttle.Going to be a feisty affair.

neutral (None) - Posts: 298 - 24/02/2020 21:56:42    2269899

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