Donegal Forum

Championship 2020

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here we are again, who'd have thought after last year it would be a repeat never mind on a cold wet November on front of empty stands. there is no doubt that donegal are raging hot favourites. theres not just one or two or even 5 players that need watching, its an entire team and bench of super footballers, the potential weaknesses you talk about wouldn't even be mentioned in 30 other counties (outside yourselves and dublin) that been said of course there is potential for an upset, just look at cork!!! but lets be realistic, a litany of things would need to go wrong for donegal and a lot would need to go right for cavan, along with that its very hard to replicate two almighty comebacks with fierce intensity like cavan have done twice this year in championship.
from a donegal perspective i would warn you not to read too much in to the armagh game. armagh although being promoted this year are average at best and massively overrated. id put cavan above them (ignoring league status) truth be told if cavan put anything in to the league armagh wouldn't have been promoted.
its a shame to have to sit at home watching it as last year was a great occasion (disregarding the result for us) of all the counties in ulster i always felt we had the best relationship with donegal. but for 70 minutes that'll have to be parked if the unthinkable is to happen.

theweanling (Cavan) - Posts: 400 - 17/11/2020 14:25:16    2310642

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Replying To theweanling:  "here we are again, who'd have thought after last year it would be a repeat never mind on a cold wet November on front of empty stands. there is no doubt that donegal are raging hot favourites. theres not just one or two or even 5 players that need watching, its an entire team and bench of super footballers, the potential weaknesses you talk about wouldn't even be mentioned in 30 other counties (outside yourselves and dublin) that been said of course there is potential for an upset, just look at cork!!! but lets be realistic, a litany of things would need to go wrong for donegal and a lot would need to go right for cavan, along with that its very hard to replicate two almighty comebacks with fierce intensity like cavan have done twice this year in championship.
from a donegal perspective i would warn you not to read too much in to the armagh game. armagh although being promoted this year are average at best and massively overrated. id put cavan above them (ignoring league status) truth be told if cavan put anything in to the league armagh wouldn't have been promoted.
its a shame to have to sit at home watching it as last year was a great occasion (disregarding the result for us) of all the counties in ulster i always felt we had the best relationship with donegal. but for 70 minutes that'll have to be parked if the unthinkable is to happen."
I see Bonner is expressing concern about the condition of the pitch in Armagh.Yous were there last week ,any talk about it in Cavan.The new Prunty pitch in Cavan seems to be holding up well and might have been a better choice.With no supporters I don't think home advantage would be any advantage to Cavan but I am sure there will be no change at this stage.

gunman (Donegal) - Posts: 698 - 17/11/2020 15:34:00    2310679

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Replying To gunman:  "I see Bonner is expressing concern about the condition of the pitch in Armagh.Yous were there last week ,any talk about it in Cavan.The new Prunty pitch in Cavan seems to be holding up well and might have been a better choice.With no supporters I don't think home advantage would be any advantage to Cavan but I am sure there will be no change at this stage."
The BBC Sport website says that the goalmouth areas of the pitch in Armagh are being re-sodded this week in advance of Sundays game. It doesn't sound great. The decision to hold it in Armagh is obviously a political one, with little thought in terms of player welfare.

SouthOfTheGap (Donegal) - Posts: 142 - 17/11/2020 16:40:19    2310718

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Replying To gunman:  "I see Bonner is expressing concern about the condition of the pitch in Armagh.Yous were there last week ,any talk about it in Cavan.The new Prunty pitch in Cavan seems to be holding up well and might have been a better choice.With no supporters I don't think home advantage would be any advantage to Cavan but I am sure there will be no change at this stage."
no real talk about the pitch here but considering our home record is average at best maybe its not such a surprise. i heard on a cavan podcast today that it was between 3 pitches, brewster, omagh and armagh and armagh won the vote. seems to me political. however i also heard that donegal were anxious enough to get it played in breffni which is hardly surprising as the pitch absolutely suits donegal down to the ground. as another poster mentioned armagh is being resodded this week. funny enough the rest of the pitch actually looked pretty decent!!! considering the weather that is to come its going to be a game for a old stags rather than peacocks.

theweanling (Cavan) - Posts: 400 - 17/11/2020 17:29:25    2310738

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Replying To theweanling:  "no real talk about the pitch here but considering our home record is average at best maybe its not such a surprise. i heard on a cavan podcast today that it was between 3 pitches, brewster, omagh and armagh and armagh won the vote. seems to me political. however i also heard that donegal were anxious enough to get it played in breffni which is hardly surprising as the pitch absolutely suits donegal down to the ground. as another poster mentioned armagh is being resodded this week. funny enough the rest of the pitch actually looked pretty decent!!! considering the weather that is to come its going to be a game for a old stags rather than peacocks."
Celtic Park too far from Cavan, Newry too far from Donegal. Brewster too wet. There was some mention of Owenbeg, but a bit far from Cavan. And with no lights in Clones, Omagh would have been the obvious choice, especially when you consider it was reseeded in the Spring.

SouthOfTheGap (Donegal) - Posts: 142 - 17/11/2020 18:25:25    2310763

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Replying To SouthOfTheGap:  "Celtic Park too far from Cavan, Newry too far from Donegal. Brewster too wet. There was some mention of Owenbeg, but a bit far from Cavan. And with no lights in Clones, Omagh would have been the obvious choice, especially when you consider it was reseeded in the Spring."
What difference does the distance make with no Crowds travelling.

gunman (Donegal) - Posts: 698 - 17/11/2020 18:53:58    2310774

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Replying To gunman:  "What difference does the distance make with no Crowds travelling."
Players travelling, planning around where they will get pre match meal, will they get togged out before they leave, get changed where they get the meal or at the ground. Or do they have to stay in a hotel the night before, where do they get a hotel in the present climate? Then there's the after match meal etc.

SouthOfTheGap (Donegal) - Posts: 142 - 17/11/2020 20:38:37    2310826

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Replying To gunman:  "What difference does the distance make with no Crowds travelling."
My Fermanagh friends tell me that Brewster was considered and in good shape but suspect to flooding same as Omagh don't know why Down or Derry pitch is not an option and yes with no supporters distance shouldn't be a problem.

Jmcg[email protected] (Cavan) - Posts: 44 - 17/11/2020 21:14:57    2310849

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Replying To JoeSoap:  "What would be your starting lineup for Sunday folks? I would like to see Ward given the start, he has been consistent for us and done a job in the full back line previously. We are all scratching our heads as to why he is not getting minutes so there must be something we don't know, but all the same I'd like to see him line out on Sunday:

Patton

Ward
N.McGee
Eoghan Bán

R.McHugh
P.Brennan
Mogan

McGonagle
McFadden (if fit, if any doubt, bring in J.McGee)

Thompson
O'Donnell
Langan

J.Brennan
Murphy
McBrearty

I'd like to see McBrearty from the start as well to give him the minutes too. Harsh on Eoin McHugh who has been excellent I have to say."
Cannot see Ward starting Joe or possibly even playing any part. We know Declan likes and has consistently used him and O'Baoill so the fact neither has seen game time since the Kerry game is telling. Pity too as we know both have plenty to offer when on their game. I would say McKelvey will start myself as well as Eoin McHugh with Paddy coming off the bench.

panamasam (Australia) - Posts: 2479 - 17/11/2020 22:24:25    2310889

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See Ryan mchugh making his 100th appearance for donegal on Sunday and his 43rd championship match in a row. What a player he has been over the last few years and best of luck to him on Sunday. He was back to his best on Saturday playing a great game. They were under clear instruction to kick the ball in and he was doing this frequently. Against tyrone he had to actually mark meyler and reckon that negated his influence a little.
Having watched the game again murphy played well. Armagh were far too obsessed with as well and dud curtail him a bit though the goal was partially a result of this. Overall the punishment he took allowed others to flourish.

Armagh is quite a small pitch, its long enough though not that wide so that actually might curtail pattons kickouts as there won't be as much space.

It would seem based on subs that mckelvey would start in Sunday instead of mcmenamin (mcgrath a definite option if fit). Mckelvey or mcgrath does not have height though. It will be interesting to see. It would seem fairly evident that players are being picked on how training is going.

Ulsterchamps_32 (Donegal) - Posts: 350 - 17/11/2020 22:46:26    2310898

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Replying To Ulsterchamps_32:  "See Ryan mchugh making his 100th appearance for donegal on Sunday and his 43rd championship match in a row. What a player he has been over the last few years and best of luck to him on Sunday. He was back to his best on Saturday playing a great game. They were under clear instruction to kick the ball in and he was doing this frequently. Against tyrone he had to actually mark meyler and reckon that negated his influence a little.
Having watched the game again murphy played well. Armagh were far too obsessed with as well and dud curtail him a bit though the goal was partially a result of this. Overall the punishment he took allowed others to flourish.

Armagh is quite a small pitch, its long enough though not that wide so that actually might curtail pattons kickouts as there won't be as much space.

It would seem based on subs that mckelvey would start in Sunday instead of mcmenamin (mcgrath a definite option if fit). Mckelvey or mcgrath does not have height though. It will be interesting to see. It would seem fairly evident that players are being picked on how training is going."
It has same width as croke park - can't believe people still fall for this stuff

Check out the pitch dimensions

eunans4ever (Donegal) - Posts: 1176 - 17/11/2020 23:07:50    2310901

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Replying To Ulsterchamps_32:  "See Ryan mchugh making his 100th appearance for donegal on Sunday and his 43rd championship match in a row. What a player he has been over the last few years and best of luck to him on Sunday. He was back to his best on Saturday playing a great game. They were under clear instruction to kick the ball in and he was doing this frequently. Against tyrone he had to actually mark meyler and reckon that negated his influence a little.
Having watched the game again murphy played well. Armagh were far too obsessed with as well and dud curtail him a bit though the goal was partially a result of this. Overall the punishment he took allowed others to flourish.

Armagh is quite a small pitch, its long enough though not that wide so that actually might curtail pattons kickouts as there won't be as much space.

It would seem based on subs that mckelvey would start in Sunday instead of mcmenamin (mcgrath a definite option if fit). Mckelvey or mcgrath does not have height though. It will be interesting to see. It would seem fairly evident that players are being picked on how training is going."
I reckon Cavan will play Madden and Galligan inside and look to bombard us early on, so could be the case that McFadden and/or McGonigle drop back a bit to combat this. If this tactic doesn't work for Cavan then I find it hard to see how they'll play through us. Early on I'd like to see us take the sting out of the game by holding possession and getting a couple of early scores. We've seen how Cavan have come back from the dead twice already in the last few weeks so it would be unforgivable if we allow them to do the same.

If we go about our business in the right way and apply the same intensity we did against Armagh then I think we'll be ok.

Lockjaw (Donegal) - Posts: 7105 - 18/11/2020 09:05:19    2310923

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Replying To eunans4ever:  "It has same width as croke park - can't believe people still fall for this stuff

Check out the pitch dimensions"
Yep, the high pitch of the TV cameras in Croker seems to have everyone fooled. There are very few "tight" intercounty pitches anywhere in the country. Ennis for example is among the biggest but you woudn't think it watching a game there on TV.

cavanman47 (Cavan) - Posts: 4314 - 18/11/2020 09:45:57    2310937

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Replying To eunans4ever:  "It has same width as croke park - can't believe people still fall for this stuff

Check out the pitch dimensions"
There's an interesting feature on Google earth that you can measure distance. Athletic ground on Armagh has a width of 82.5 metres ( the min width of a pitch is 80 metre). It is in the tight side and one of the smaller pitches about. I suppose it's not that big a deal though.

Ulsterchamps_32 (Donegal) - Posts: 350 - 18/11/2020 11:57:40    2310997

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Replying To Ulsterchamps_32:  "There's an interesting feature on Google earth that you can measure distance. Athletic ground on Armagh has a width of 82.5 metres ( the min width of a pitch is 80 metre). It is in the tight side and one of the smaller pitches about. I suppose it's not that big a deal though."
the official size of the Athletic Grounds is 143 x 88 m, Croke Park is 145 x 88 m, MacCumhaill park is 145 x 90m and Breffni Park is 143 x 86m. some grounds may appear tighter due to proximity of stands etc. I don't think Armagh is a problem for us and it is the same for both teams anyway.

totalrecall (Leitrim) - Posts: 529 - 18/11/2020 12:04:45    2311000

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Replying To Ulsterchamps_32:  "There's an interesting feature on Google earth that you can measure distance. Athletic ground on Armagh has a width of 82.5 metres ( the min width of a pitch is 80 metre). It is in the tight side and one of the smaller pitches about. I suppose it's not that big a deal though."
Interesting post, thanks for the share.

I would agree with Leitrim poster above. We shouldn't worry about the athletic grounds.
Our record there in recent years has been 100% good in the athletic grounds, league and McKenna cup. We had 1 championship win there in 2015 v Armagh.
I could be wrong, but our u21s had good results there too.

Hopefully we can add Cavan to the list this coming weekend. I think we have a great chance of getting our 3 in a row, which would be an astonishing start by Bonner as Donegal manager. Lets see.

Donegalman (None) - Posts: 3786 - 18/11/2020 12:41:45    2311020

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Replying To totalrecall:  "the official size of the Athletic Grounds is 143 x 88 m, Croke Park is 145 x 88 m, MacCumhaill park is 145 x 90m and Breffni Park is 143 x 86m. some grounds may appear tighter due to proximity of stands etc. I don't think Armagh is a problem for us and it is the same for both teams anyway."
I'm not sure where you get the official size from though I know one thing, that mccumhaill park is not a 145 metre long. There is not 15 metres between the 2 65s. It is very wide though and therefore makes it overall quite a big pitch. According to this link croke park is 86 metre wide and that's what the Google earth tool indicates it as.
https://www.irishtimes.com/sport/gaelic-games/september-road-the-long-and-the-short-of-pitches-1.1844127

I'm not sure I want to keep going down this rabbit hole. The tool I mentioned is very straight forward to use for anyone interested!!!

Ulsterchamps_32 (Donegal) - Posts: 350 - 18/11/2020 12:52:48    2311027

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Replying To Ulsterchamps_32:  "I'm not sure where you get the official size from though I know one thing, that mccumhaill park is not a 145 metre long. There is not 15 metres between the 2 65s. It is very wide though and therefore makes it overall quite a big pitch. According to this link croke park is 86 metre wide and that's what the Google earth tool indicates it as.
https://www.irishtimes.com/sport/gaelic-games/september-road-the-long-and-the-short-of-pitches-1.1844127

I'm not sure I want to keep going down this rabbit hole. The tool I mentioned is very straight forward to use for anyone interested!!!"
Interesting post alright. Personally speaking I would be more concerned about the condition of the pitch rather than the width. Regardless I think we will have far too many guns for Cavan at the weekend. While I have great respect for Graham and his team as well as having many friends from Cavan I just think we are operating at a different level. When you analyze each of their games there are legitimate reasons for each of their opponents to not feel like they threw it away. While Cavan have shown great character and indeed skill especially McKiernan, Galligan and Reilly a similar showing at the weekend and there won't be any coming back. The way Cavan have been opened up I can see Donegal getting at least a couple of goals and with the accurate shooters in our team you know we will get a fair few points. Of course if the weather is atrocious during game time that will be a leveler. However we already played Tyrone in such conditions so it won't be anything we are not used to. Going for a 4 plus win.

panamasam (Australia) - Posts: 2479 - 18/11/2020 13:07:08    2311034

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Replying To Donegalman:  "Interesting post, thanks for the share.

I would agree with Leitrim poster above. We shouldn't worry about the athletic grounds.
Our record there in recent years has been 100% good in the athletic grounds, league and McKenna cup. We had 1 championship win there in 2015 v Armagh.
I could be wrong, but our u21s had good results there too.

Hopefully we can add Cavan to the list this coming weekend. I think we have a great chance of getting our 3 in a row, which would be an astonishing start by Bonner as Donegal manager. Lets see."
Yes the under 21's beat Derry there in the last Ulster final for the grade. It was on a Monday night with many players especially on the west side of the county not getting home till the middle of the night apparently. It was a bittersweet one as they had to play the semi final the following Saturday afternoon against a Dublin side whom if a am not mistaken had a 3 week run into that game but could have been 2. Of course this was grossly unfair but the attitude was tough luck. Ironically the GAA then ditched the under 21 grade citing player welfare as one of the main reasons and introducing an eligibility rule which to me and many others gave a blatant advantage to certain counties. Actually I think the following years under 21 team was probably stronger but they were forgotten wrongfully with all these changes. They would have been the 2015 minors who also beat Armagh in the Athletic grounds. There was nothing put in place for them for the years overlap so they didn't get to put right the wrongs of losing to an inferior but well coached Derry side. Probably explains why Declan has become very vocal around unfair advantages playing games at Croke Park involving Dublin and the Super eights. He managed that under 21 side who were treated with total disregard by those in suits.

panamasam (Australia) - Posts: 2479 - 18/11/2020 13:22:37    2311040

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Replying To eunans4ever:  "It has same width as croke park - can't believe people still fall for this stuff

Check out the pitch dimensions"
Hi eunans4ever: I always smile when I hear people saying "the big wide open spaces in Croker".

AudiMan (Donegal) - Posts: 479 - 18/11/2020 13:36:13    2311047

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