Donegal Forum

Championship 2020

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Who thinks now that Donegal's fitness and strength and conditioning is up to standard, Cavan way ahead of them last week, to night Cavan had run out of steam before half time.

jacktheboy (Donegal) - Posts: 97 - 05/12/2020 19:11:56    2318631

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Replying To jacktheboy:  "Who thinks now that Donegal's fitness and strength and conditioning is up to standard, Cavan way ahead of them last week, to night Cavan had run out of steam before half time."
Careful now.... you'll upset the experts.

peiledoir20 (Donegal) - Posts: 63 - 05/12/2020 19:32:41    2318676

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Replying To jacktheboy:  "Who thinks now that Donegal's fitness and strength and conditioning is up to standard, Cavan way ahead of them last week, to night Cavan had run out of steam before half time."
Hmm didn't Donegal put 1-24 on Cavan in the 2019 Ulster final? Cavan scored 12 points this even and 1-13 in the Ulster final not much difference there.

panamasam (Australia) - Posts: 2519 - 05/12/2020 20:01:11    2318720

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Replying To peiledoir20:  "Careful now.... you'll upset the experts."
And empty heads don't get upset too?

panamasam (Australia) - Posts: 2519 - 05/12/2020 20:02:11    2318725

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Replying To panamasam:  "And empty heads don't get upset too?"
Another fine retort from Barrister Brolly.

peiledoir20 (Donegal) - Posts: 63 - 05/12/2020 20:41:17    2318777

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See Paul fisher head of s&c has stepped down after 6 year. Wonder who will get the role now. Any word if rochford staying hopefully he does.

rorysboys (Donegal) - Posts: 946 - 05/12/2020 21:32:05    2318834

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I love how people think that strength and conditioning is the silver bullet that separates teams when in fact it is a small percentage of a team's success.

Yes Dublin are machines but they also can put the ball over the bar, which we failed to do against Cavan. Langan and MC gonagle both missed chances to win it for us in that match. The other thing that was noticeable tonight was how Dublin keeper dealt with high ball, which was our downfall as well, as Patton made a huge error in dealing with that high ball.

Strength and conditioning can only take you so far, Cavan looked hungrier on the day and that can't be coached or done in the gym, that's up to the group and how much they want it. It was clear Donegal went into that game with one eye on Dublin. No way would Thompson have been on bench if that was Tyrone we were playing in final. We gambled on that and it back fired.

We were also missing our out and out defenders and didn't employ a sweeper to negate the long ball tactic favoured by Cavan which was a huge mistake from the management. There are a lot of things that need analysed but criticising the s&c when no one knows anything about what was done is just lazy analysis with nothing concrete to back it up.

We're making strides and young lads are coming up to their peak years but if we are to win an all Ireland it has to be next year before Murphy starts to go downhill. We need to keep him in the opposition half and not playing in our full back line.

Onwards and upwards and let's get behind the lads for 2021 and see if we can topple the blue juggernaut.

ballboy101 (Donegal) - Posts: 165 - 06/12/2020 00:23:59    2318949

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Replying To jacktheboy:  "Who thinks now that Donegal's fitness and strength and conditioning is up to standard, Cavan way ahead of them last week, to night Cavan had run out of steam before half time."
Nothing to do with s & c , more to do with Bonner and Rochford running the sh1te out the players in the week between Armagh and cavan game, in preparation for the dubs... players were out on their feet before ball was thrown in

totalrecall (Leitrim) - Posts: 548 - 06/12/2020 07:18:32    2318981

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Replying To ballboy101:  "I love how people think that strength and conditioning is the silver bullet that separates teams when in fact it is a small percentage of a team's success.

Yes Dublin are machines but they also can put the ball over the bar, which we failed to do against Cavan. Langan and MC gonagle both missed chances to win it for us in that match. The other thing that was noticeable tonight was how Dublin keeper dealt with high ball, which was our downfall as well, as Patton made a huge error in dealing with that high ball.

Strength and conditioning can only take you so far, Cavan looked hungrier on the day and that can't be coached or done in the gym, that's up to the group and how much they want it. It was clear Donegal went into that game with one eye on Dublin. No way would Thompson have been on bench if that was Tyrone we were playing in final. We gambled on that and it back fired.

We were also missing our out and out defenders and didn't employ a sweeper to negate the long ball tactic favoured by Cavan which was a huge mistake from the management. There are a lot of things that need analysed but criticising the s&c when no one knows anything about what was done is just lazy analysis with nothing concrete to back it up.

We're making strides and young lads are coming up to their peak years but if we are to win an all Ireland it has to be next year before Murphy starts to go downhill. We need to keep him in the opposition half and not playing in our full back line.

Onwards and upwards and let's get behind the lads for 2021 and see if we can topple the blue juggernaut."
If S&C yields only a small percentage why are teams pumping huge money into it? Building state of the art gyms, satilite gyms etc? Why have Tyrone broke the bank to take Peter Donnelly back? Why did we have employ two S&C coaches this year, would one not have been enough?

peiledoir20 (Donegal) - Posts: 63 - 06/12/2020 10:12:05    2319032

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Replying To totalrecall:  "Nothing to do with s & c , more to do with Bonner and Rochford running the sh1te out the players in the week between Armagh and cavan game, in preparation for the dubs... players were out on their feet before ball was thrown in"
Nobody ran the sh1t out of players more than McGuinness and Fisher in 2012 and it worked then. Don't think its Fishers fault that the players didn't perform on the day against Cavan ,that's more down to the Management team and they should do the decent thing and not let Fisher take the blame.

jacktheboy (Donegal) - Posts: 97 - 06/12/2020 10:25:05    2319038

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Lads if you believe we are going to beat Dublin anytime soon get real.We can give out and rant about certain things but Sam is staying in the capital for the foreseeable future.Also to say we need to do it next year with MM going downhill he has been in decline for a while now.His legendary status ensures his poor performances are glossed over.

neutral (None) - Posts: 299 - 06/12/2020 11:49:09    2319080

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Replying To jacktheboy:  "Nobody ran the sh1t out of players more than McGuinness and Fisher in 2012 and it worked then. Don't think its Fishers fault that the players didn't perform on the day against Cavan ,that's more down to the Management team and they should do the decent thing and not let Fisher take the blame."
I read Paul fisher tweet last night. From the tweet it sounded like he left himself. Don't know the ins ant outs of it. In saying that it's nearly a gimme that there will be changes to back room and squad.

rorysboys (Donegal) - Posts: 946 - 06/12/2020 12:00:12    2319091

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Replying To ballboy101:  "I love how people think that strength and conditioning is the silver bullet that separates teams when in fact it is a small percentage of a team's success.

Yes Dublin are machines but they also can put the ball over the bar, which we failed to do against Cavan. Langan and MC gonagle both missed chances to win it for us in that match. The other thing that was noticeable tonight was how Dublin keeper dealt with high ball, which was our downfall as well, as Patton made a huge error in dealing with that high ball.

Strength and conditioning can only take you so far, Cavan looked hungrier on the day and that can't be coached or done in the gym, that's up to the group and how much they want it. It was clear Donegal went into that game with one eye on Dublin. No way would Thompson have been on bench if that was Tyrone we were playing in final. We gambled on that and it back fired.

We were also missing our out and out defenders and didn't employ a sweeper to negate the long ball tactic favoured by Cavan which was a huge mistake from the management. There are a lot of things that need analysed but criticising the s&c when no one knows anything about what was done is just lazy analysis with nothing concrete to back it up.

We're making strides and young lads are coming up to their peak years but if we are to win an all Ireland it has to be next year before Murphy starts to go downhill. We need to keep him in the opposition half and not playing in our full back line.

Onwards and upwards and let's get behind the lads for 2021 and see if we can topple the blue juggernaut."
I think you're doing McGonagle a disservice he actually was one who had his shooting boots on and got a great score to level it up to add to one in the first half. However your points are spot on. When Dublin got into the same positions as Donegal last night they made the routine scores whereas Donegal did not. That has nothing to do with your weekly spinach intake etc.... the bottom line is that Donegal choked when in the same position for the last 3 years. It is not the fault of one factor or person but a collective one. Blaming S & C and management doesn't change the point that in the clutch moments between goal chances, decision making leading to a goal and taking routine scores Donegal failed. Can crib about missing defensive players and that edge but still only conceded 1-13 which is respectable compared to the 12 points Dublin conceded.

panamasam (Australia) - Posts: 2519 - 06/12/2020 12:34:15    2319102

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Replying To peiledoir20:  "If S&C yields only a small percentage why are teams pumping huge money into it? Building state of the art gyms, satilite gyms etc? Why have Tyrone broke the bank to take Peter Donnelly back? Why did we have employ two S&C coaches this year, would one not have been enough?"
My point is that it's not as important as other aspects of success and people are over hyping its importance and laying blame at the hands of an s&c coach.

As I said we missed easy scores that day, no one can say that has anything to do with strength and conditioning. That's purely psychological and something that needs to be addressed as we've capitulated several times now when the game is in the melting pot.

As for Murphy, I don't think there's many players in Ireland who could do what he's at, trying to play everywhere. If we keep him in the opposition half, we will see a different Murphy. Definitely think he has so much to offer the team that way and I can see this group winning the big one within a few years if they get things right.

ballboy101 (Donegal) - Posts: 165 - 06/12/2020 12:41:09    2319108

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Replying To jacktheboy:  "Nobody ran the sh1t out of players more than McGuinness and Fisher in 2012 and it worked then. Don't think its Fishers fault that the players didn't perform on the day against Cavan ,that's more down to the Management team and they should do the decent thing and not let Fisher take the blame."
This isn't 2012, we had a condensed championship in 2020, we had cavan one week after Armagh, we lost gallen and Thompson because not gruelling running in the week between, we had players who were sluggish because the tank had been emptied on the training ground. This was Bonner's call, no one else's.

totalrecall (Leitrim) - Posts: 548 - 06/12/2020 20:27:46    2319466

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Replying To totalrecall:  "This isn't 2012, we had a condensed championship in 2020, we had cavan one week after Armagh, we lost gallen and Thompson because not gruelling running in the week between, we had players who were sluggish because the tank had been emptied on the training ground. This was Bonner's call, no one else's."
How do you know this to be the case?

panamasam (Australia) - Posts: 2519 - 06/12/2020 20:53:22    2319487

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Replying To totalrecall:  "This isn't 2012, we had a condensed championship in 2020, we had cavan one week after Armagh, we lost gallen and Thompson because not gruelling running in the week between, we had players who were sluggish because the tank had been emptied on the training ground. This was Bonner's call, no one else's."
I think your wrong, from what I heard both got injured in an in house game. Big difference from being trained hard I may add.

rorysboys (Donegal) - Posts: 946 - 06/12/2020 21:23:24    2319510

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Replying To rorysboys:  "I think your wrong, from what I heard both got injured in an in house game. Big difference from being trained hard I may add."
Why would you risk in house games the way the Championship was so condensed this year? all they needed was a bit of maintenance and recovery work, why run the hell out of them on heavy ground and play full contact games on the same heavy ground? nuts.

Tirchonaill1 (Donegal) - Posts: 1369 - 07/12/2020 00:14:06    2319584

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Replying To Tirchonaill1:  "Why would you risk in house games the way the Championship was so condensed this year? all they needed was a bit of maintenance and recovery work, why run the hell out of them on heavy ground and play full contact games on the same heavy ground? nuts."
Because they were looking beyond Cavan.

gunman (Donegal) - Posts: 730 - 07/12/2020 10:00:47    2319638

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I know we all should have moved on from the Ulster final by now. But I couldn't help feeling that we'd have given Dublin more to think about than Cavan the other night. Cavan beat us fair and square on the day but it was apparent from fairly early on in Saturday's game that Dublin would win it at a canter. The problem for us now is we've no idea just how close or how far we're off Dublin.

Anyway, luckily 2021 isn't too far away. It will be interesting to see how the GAA go about organising the calendar. A lot of it Covid dependent I'm sure. They will want to avoid another year where the coffers are low from no crowds. I think that will dictate what they do. I can see club getting played off first, leaving inter county until further on in the year with the hope that the Covid restrictions will have been eased.

Lockjaw (Donegal) - Posts: 7302 - 07/12/2020 10:32:56    2319662

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