National Forum

Wexford Intercounty Hurling 2023

(Oldest Posts First) - Go To The Latest Post


Replying To Timbertony:  "Wouldnt like to see you being critical after that first sentence! Anyway the 2024 panel has lots of issues to address on the evidence of the last couple of seasons, goalkeeper being one."
1st sentence fairly blunt ok: D

Viking66 (Wexford) - Posts: 15258 - 04/08/2023 12:57:20    2499022

Link

Replying To TerribleFootwork:  "The mistakes against KK and Clare happened after the Mullingar game which is the exact point I'm making."
Great servant down the years don't get me wrong please, but an absolute liability.

countyman2022 (Wexford) - Posts: 784 - 04/08/2023 13:52:02    2499031

Link

Replying To Viking66:  "Biggest worry I'd have about Lawlor is his short and medium puckouts. Fanning wasn't great at them either. With the height and size of our Intercounty squad, coupled with the way successful teams play these days mixing the puckouts up, I think this is more important than actual shot stopping. Against Clare in the League several of their goals resulted directly or indirectly from poor short and medium puckouts. Its a worry I'd have about Mahon also, having watched him play for club and county. He seems to take too long and often a wingback or midfielder who was open wasn't by the time he actually pucked the ball out. Lawlor was the same. Carty, Devitt and Donohue were often open during the Walsh Cup and early League games but Lawlor and Fanning ended up pucking it long down on top of lads who were never going to win a contested aerial ball."
Both of them are a fair bit behind the top goalkeepers out there, puckouts a problem for both. Seamus Casey worth a go if willing to commit.

FearBeag (Mayo) - Posts: 83 - 04/08/2023 14:39:37    2499044

Link

Replying To FearBeag:  "Both of them are a fair bit behind the top goalkeepers out there, puckouts a problem for both. Seamus Casey worth a go if willing to commit."
Casey is an excellent accurate striker of a ball.

Viking66 (Wexford) - Posts: 15258 - 04/08/2023 15:10:17    2499052

Link

Replying To Viking66:  "Biggest worry I'd have about Lawlor is his short and medium puckouts. Fanning wasn't great at them either. With the height and size of our Intercounty squad, coupled with the way successful teams play these days mixing the puckouts up, I think this is more important than actual shot stopping. Against Clare in the League several of their goals resulted directly or indirectly from poor short and medium puckouts. Its a worry I'd have about Mahon also, having watched him play for club and county. He seems to take too long and often a wingback or midfielder who was open wasn't by the time he actually pucked the ball out. Lawlor was the same. Carty, Devitt and Donohue were often open during the Walsh Cup and early League games but Lawlor and Fanning ended up pucking it long down on top of lads who were never going to win a contested aerial ball."
I understand your point regarding short term medium puck outs but any keeper needs time to adapt to the mngrs instructions and directions on puck outs. I actually feel lawlor done quite well on them and the goals we coincided when we went short were the results of lads running the ball straight into contact and getting turned over by not moving the ball quick enough. Definitely an aspect for us to develop and lime any positions, it should be reviewed. However as of now I haven't seen a better keeper than lawlor

cragask1234 (Wexford) - Posts: 29 - 04/08/2023 16:11:54    2499060

Link

Fanning is a fantastic goalkeeper who has been very reliable and consistent for about 10/12 years. He didn't have a good season last year but some of the criticisms of him in recent posts are totally unfair.

He is still our best goalkeeper and it would be great to see him back in the Purple and Gold

Onfor15 (Wexford) - Posts: 533 - 04/08/2023 16:31:00    2499062

Link

Replying To ExiledInWex:  "In my opinion, Mark Fanning is still the best goalkeeper Wexford have bar none. He should be back in Wexford squad next year.
No offence but you can't concede 15 goals in 3 championship matches. Can't say I remember any memorable saves?"
I think that's unfair, our defence gave up way too many chances in the first place, any goalkeeper would be under pressure. "No offence but you can't concede 15 goals in 3 championship matches" is a statement which is badly lacking in context

ElGranSenor (Wexford) - Posts: 412 - 04/08/2023 23:43:25    2499088

Link

Replying To Onfor15:  "Fanning is a fantastic goalkeeper who has been very reliable and consistent for about 10/12 years. He didn't have a good season last year but some of the criticisms of him in recent posts are totally unfair.

He is still our best goalkeeper and it would be great to see him back in the Purple and Gold"
That's the issue with fanning ,consistently inconsistent making crucial errors over and over again over a long period of time. Every player makes mistakes but doing so consistently is just lack of quality . fanning simply isint and never was good enough for inter County hurling period,time to move on....

cragask1234 (Wexford) - Posts: 29 - 05/08/2023 12:19:30    2499113

Link

Replying To ElGranSenor:  "I think that's unfair, our defence gave up way too many chances in the first place, any goalkeeper would be under pressure. "No offence but you can't concede 15 goals in 3 championship matches" is a statement which is badly lacking in context"
Also, realise I'm being pedantic here (not like me at all! lol), but those 15 goals weren't in three championship games. The six goals in the match v Clare happened during the League.

Pikeman96 (Wexford) - Posts: 2800 - 05/08/2023 12:44:50    2499119

Link

Replying To ElGranSenor:  "I think that's unfair, our defence gave up way too many chances in the first place, any goalkeeper would be under pressure. "No offence but you can't concede 15 goals in 3 championship matches" is a statement which is badly lacking in context"
OK. Let me ask a different question. When did a team last concede 15 goals in 3 championship games and win anything?
I am not at all saying they were all on the goal keeper, I would say many began with problems in Wexford half forward line not putting enough pressure on the opposition coming out with ball or not winning primary possession.
The other thing Mark Fanning gave Wexford was a penalty taker. I would be expecting him to score 8 out of 10 penalties. Chin scored one v KK I know but to me Fanning has a bullet of a penalty.
As a blow in Wexford fan, I hope the new man brings him back in to the fold.

ExiledInWex (Dublin) - Posts: 1292 - 05/08/2023 14:44:26    2499136

Link

Replying To ExiledInWex:  "OK. Let me ask a different question. When did a team last concede 15 goals in 3 championship games and win anything?
I am not at all saying they were all on the goal keeper, I would say many began with problems in Wexford half forward line not putting enough pressure on the opposition coming out with ball or not winning primary possession.
The other thing Mark Fanning gave Wexford was a penalty taker. I would be expecting him to score 8 out of 10 penalties. Chin scored one v KK I know but to me Fanning has a bullet of a penalty.
As a blow in Wexford fan, I hope the new man brings him back in to the fold."
He misses more than he scores.

More important for me is how badly we needed somebody to slow things down and take the pressure off late on against tipp in 19 and again with clare last year.

Tie your shoe, change your hurl, take issue with the ball in your hand,... Anything.

Totally unforgiveable at that level with the experience he has.

Doylerwex (Wexford) - Posts: 3462 - 05/08/2023 20:06:08    2499175

Link

Replying To Doylerwex:  "He misses more than he scores.

More important for me is how badly we needed somebody to slow things down and take the pressure off late on against tipp in 19 and again with clare last year.

Tie your shoe, change your hurl, take issue with the ball in your hand,... Anything.

Totally unforgiveable at that level with the experience he has."
Fanning has been a great servant to Wexford. Unfortunately if a goalkeeper makes a mistake it's magnified just by the very nature of the position.
He had little or no competition for the No. 1 jersey down through the years and remain to be convinced the current incumbent is any better.

HurlingBuzz (Wexford) - Posts: 529 - 06/08/2023 11:45:12    2499222

Link

Replying To ExiledInWex:  "OK. Let me ask a different question. When did a team last concede 15 goals in 3 championship games and win anything?
I am not at all saying they were all on the goal keeper, I would say many began with problems in Wexford half forward line not putting enough pressure on the opposition coming out with ball or not winning primary possession.
The other thing Mark Fanning gave Wexford was a penalty taker. I would be expecting him to score 8 out of 10 penalties. Chin scored one v KK I know but to me Fanning has a bullet of a penalty.
As a blow in Wexford fan, I hope the new man brings him back in to the fold."
'A penalty taker'…?!!! Have you seen Fannings record as a penalty taker…everyone remembers the one he stuck in the Leinster final but he has missed loads others. I think you are being totally unrealistic with your expectation that he would convert 8/10…for me it's more like 2/10 and that's being generous. Having a bullet of a penalty is not much good when they are blazed over the bar

Purpleandgold72 (Wexford) - Posts: 242 - 06/08/2023 16:39:08    2499260

Link

Replying To Purpleandgold72:  "'A penalty taker'…?!!! Have you seen Fannings record as a penalty taker…everyone remembers the one he stuck in the Leinster final but he has missed loads others. I think you are being totally unrealistic with your expectation that he would convert 8/10…for me it's more like 2/10 and that's being generous. Having a bullet of a penalty is not much good when they are blazed over the bar"
To be fair to him his probably 50 50 but that's not good enough.

If he stuck one of the 2 he missed in 22 we'd probably have been in the leinster final

Doylerwex (Wexford) - Posts: 3462 - 07/08/2023 12:02:06    2499353

Link

Replying To HurlingBuzz:  "Fanning has been a great servant to Wexford. Unfortunately if a goalkeeper makes a mistake it's magnified just by the very nature of the position.
He had little or no competition for the No. 1 jersey down through the years and remain to be convinced the current incumbent is any better."
I appreciate that, but we aren't talking about conceding goals.

There's no shared accountability in constantly pucking a free shot over the sideline

Doylerwex (Wexford) - Posts: 3462 - 07/08/2023 12:03:48    2499354

Link

Replying To HurlingBuzz:  "Fanning has been a great servant to Wexford. Unfortunately if a goalkeeper makes a mistake it's magnified just by the very nature of the position.
He had little or no competition for the No. 1 jersey down through the years and remain to be convinced the current incumbent is any better."
That is how I would see it.
Goalkeeper is quickly abused over a bad mistake yet if a full back or corner back fails to control a ball or misses it and it ends up in the net more often than not they will get no grief.
In all the championship games this year, and the only ones I missed was Antrim and Westmeath, did the goalkeeper make any memorable save? None spring to mind to me, I am not convinced he is any better than Fanning.

ExiledInWex (Dublin) - Posts: 1292 - 07/08/2023 16:09:15    2499396

Link

Replying To ExiledInWex:  "That is how I would see it.
Goalkeeper is quickly abused over a bad mistake yet if a full back or corner back fails to control a ball or misses it and it ends up in the net more often than not they will get no grief.
In all the championship games this year, and the only ones I missed was Antrim and Westmeath, did the goalkeeper make any memorable save? None spring to mind to me, I am not convinced he is any better than Fanning."
Ah no if someone in the backs makes mistakes leading to goals they get the blame not the keeper. And get the praise if good play saves goals, as do keepers also. Donohue has got criticised on this forum several times over the years for errors leading to goals, but has got so much better now. Devitt too. Shane Reck took the brunt of the criticism for Dublins goal this year, although maybe MOH and Shane Reck should've been swapped from the start so it was partly managements fault also. Joe O Connor also drew quite a bit of criticism for letting the ball by when playing halfback, which led to goals, and getting subbed off early against Kilkenny.
Its too lazy to say keepers always get the criticism. I think Fanning has had his day, and should've been thanked properly and acknowledged for all his time that he has put into Wexford hurling over many years, but equally Lawlor was far from perfect. Competition in training and pre season over winter might raise his game, or find a replacement who is better. To suggest we don't need to look at other keepers is laughable.

Viking66 (Wexford) - Posts: 15258 - 07/08/2023 19:51:06    2499417

Link

I never said Wexford didn't need to look at alternatives. My point was and is that Fanning is still as good as anything else that Wexford have.
Competition is good for a goalkeeper, I 100% agree with that.

ExiledInWex (Dublin) - Posts: 1292 - 08/08/2023 11:48:11    2499495

Link

Well we know for definite now that Joe Fortune wont be the next Wexford senior hurling manager anyway.

tearintom (Wexford) - Posts: 1466 - 08/08/2023 14:18:17    2499537

Link

Joe Fortune confirmed for Westmeath next year so won't be getting the job anyway.

TerribleFootwork (Wexford) - Posts: 1760 - 08/08/2023 14:20:32    2499538

Link