Replying To FrankieJoe: "Absolute mess from day one. Thanks GAA, can always be counted on to mess something up.
And all this is after feck all of it will be shown on television. Absolutely clueless and it won't last a crack." Again this thing with it being on TV. Teams from lower divisions should probably have more of their games on TV. But the way people on here are going on about it you'd think they've been getting wall to wall coverage as it is.
oneoff (UK) - Posts: 1373 - 14/05/2022 09:31:28
2416942
Link
0
|
Replying To oneoff: "Again this thing with it being on TV. Teams from lower divisions should probably have more of their games on TV. But the way people on here are going on about it you'd think they've been getting wall to wall coverage as it is." Just from semis. So 4 of the teams. Most of the teams in it (three quarters of them) are still not getting any coverage anyway
Loughduff Lad (Cavan) - Posts: 2360 - 14/05/2022 10:22:24
2416949
Link
0
|
This Tailteann Cup discussion has generated far more interest than the Joe McDonagh discussion. Is this a reflection of the Tailteann in football having a high profile? Comparing football and hurling tiers is like comparing apples and oranges. The Tailteann can enjoy the fruits of a higher profile.
legendzxix (Kerry) - Posts: 7757 - 14/05/2022 10:22:58
2416950
Link
0
|
Replying To oneoff: "Again this thing with it being on TV. Teams from lower divisions should probably have more of their games on TV. But the way people on here are going on about it you'd think they've been getting wall to wall coverage as it is." I think people in certain counties just have to accept that their teams are not going to get coverage other than 2-3 minutes on the sunday game. If the national broadcaster rte and tng don't feel the need to show these teams than sky most definitely won't. The general punter out there are probably happy that munster hurling and certain teams in hurling and football get most of the coverage. No disrespect to any county but i don't want to watch waterford versus limerick playing three times in a matter of weeks but maybe that's just me. I would like to see some counties i haven't seen before but this is about money not romance. Teams in the Tailteann cup just like its predecessor the Tommy Murphy cup won't be on the media's wish list. These teams only hope is to get to Division 1 which is where the coverage is focused i both codes.
wicklowsupport (Wicklow) - Posts: 1890 - 14/05/2022 10:24:15
2416951
Link
0
|
Isn't the whole point of changes to Championship structures to help so called 'weaker' counties and bring the levels up all over rather than concentrate on getting as much money out of the big fixtures?
How does the Tailteann Cup help? Before Covid any of these counties would get 2 Championship games every year - a defeat in their province followed by a defeat in the qualifiers. Year over in June. Now it's a defeat in the Province followed by a defeat in the TC. Year over in May.
All counties, except the top 4, need more Championship games.
Remove the Provinces from the AI series, 8 groups of 4, one County from each league division in each 4. Division 4 team gets 3 home games, div 3 team 2 home games, div 2 team 1 home game. Top 2 into AI last 16, bottom 2 into TC. Last 16 two-legged so all counties get minimum 5 Championship games every year. Imagine Dublin, Derry & Antrim going to Ruislip in the group games. Of course there will be mismatches initially but no worse than current.
Makes League more important too.
In 5 years the gap would be much smaller provided counties put the effort in.
opa01 (Cavan) - Posts: 500 - 14/05/2022 10:28:29
2416952
Link
0
|
Replying To opa01: "Isn't the whole point of changes to Championship structures to help so called 'weaker' counties and bring the levels up all over rather than concentrate on getting as much money out of the big fixtures?
How does the Tailteann Cup help? Before Covid any of these counties would get 2 Championship games every year - a defeat in their province followed by a defeat in the qualifiers. Year over in June. Now it's a defeat in the Province followed by a defeat in the TC. Year over in May.
All counties, except the top 4, need more Championship games.
Remove the Provinces from the AI series, 8 groups of 4, one County from each league division in each 4. Division 4 team gets 3 home games, div 3 team 2 home games, div 2 team 1 home game. Top 2 into AI last 16, bottom 2 into TC. Last 16 two-legged so all counties get minimum 5 Championship games every year. Imagine Dublin, Derry & Antrim going to Ruislip in the group games. Of course there will be mismatches initially but no worse than current.
Makes League more important too.
In 5 years the gap would be much smaller provided counties put the effort in." There are more than 32 counties playing football. There are 38 at my last count. New york, Kilkenny, Gloucestershire, Warwickshire, Lancaster and Scotland are the 6 extra.
Why should they go Junior but Waterford, who have not won a game all year could potentially draw Kerry, Dublin and Cavan in your system?
The Senior needs to be split. So guys don't like being intermediate. Well fine. Win the intermediate and justify your senior place.
skirge7 (UK) - Posts: 245 - 14/05/2022 11:15:56
2416969
Link
0
|
Replying To opa01: "Isn't the whole point of changes to Championship structures to help so called 'weaker' counties and bring the levels up all over rather than concentrate on getting as much money out of the big fixtures?
How does the Tailteann Cup help? Before Covid any of these counties would get 2 Championship games every year - a defeat in their province followed by a defeat in the qualifiers. Year over in June. Now it's a defeat in the Province followed by a defeat in the TC. Year over in May.
All counties, except the top 4, need more Championship games.
Remove the Provinces from the AI series, 8 groups of 4, one County from each league division in each 4. Division 4 team gets 3 home games, div 3 team 2 home games, div 2 team 1 home game. Top 2 into AI last 16, bottom 2 into TC. Last 16 two-legged so all counties get minimum 5 Championship games every year. Imagine Dublin, Derry & Antrim going to Ruislip in the group games. Of course there will be mismatches initially but no worse than current.
Makes League more important too.
In 5 years the gap would be much smaller provided counties put the effort in." 2022 is an intermediary year. From 2023 onwards, the Sam Maguire 16 will enter 4 groups of 4. The Tailteann 16 will enter 4 groups of 4. 12 of the 16 Tailteann teams are well capable of winning it. With the winner qualifying for the Sam Maguire 16, a fair reward is being offered.
legendzxix (Kerry) - Posts: 7757 - 14/05/2022 11:19:08
2416973
Link
0
|
Can anyone explain why there is a north and a south section without using the words bias,county ,6,anti ?
GaelicLion (Tyrone) - Posts: 12 - 14/05/2022 11:36:18
2416977
Link
0
|
Replying To wicklowsupport: "I think people in certain counties just have to accept that their teams are not going to get coverage other than 2-3 minutes on the sunday game. If the national broadcaster rte and tng don't feel the need to show these teams than sky most definitely won't. The general punter out there are probably happy that munster hurling and certain teams in hurling and football get most of the coverage. No disrespect to any county but i don't want to watch waterford versus limerick playing three times in a matter of weeks but maybe that's just me. I would like to see some counties i haven't seen before but this is about money not romance. Teams in the Tailteann cup just like its predecessor the Tommy Murphy cup won't be on the media's wish list. These teams only hope is to get to Division 1 which is where the coverage is focused i both codes." TG4 don't have any championship rights. They've been sold to RTÉ, BBC, and Sky. It's on the GAA to drive what rights they sell, with packages of games. If the TC isn't being shown enough, it's because they didn't push it in the rights package. It really shows where the mentality is actually at
Loughduff Lad (Cavan) - Posts: 2360 - 14/05/2022 11:37:46
2416978
Link
0
|
Replying To GaelicLion: "Can anyone explain why there is a north and a south section without using the words bias,county ,6,anti ?" Apparently it's to save on travel costs, but that's an absolute joke. We're relatively speaking a small island. If this were true, the old Qualifier system would have similarly been split. They're making it up as they go
Loughduff Lad (Cavan) - Posts: 2360 - 14/05/2022 12:18:48
2416988
Link
1
|
Replying To opa01: "Isn't the whole point of changes to Championship structures to help so called 'weaker' counties and bring the levels up all over rather than concentrate on getting as much money out of the big fixtures?
How does the Tailteann Cup help? Before Covid any of these counties would get 2 Championship games every year - a defeat in their province followed by a defeat in the qualifiers. Year over in June. Now it's a defeat in the Province followed by a defeat in the TC. Year over in May.
All counties, except the top 4, need more Championship games.
Remove the Provinces from the AI series, 8 groups of 4, one County from each league division in each 4. Division 4 team gets 3 home games, div 3 team 2 home games, div 2 team 1 home game. Top 2 into AI last 16, bottom 2 into TC. Last 16 two-legged so all counties get minimum 5 Championship games every year. Imagine Dublin, Derry & Antrim going to Ruislip in the group games. Of course there will be mismatches initially but no worse than current.
Makes League more important too.
In 5 years the gap would be much smaller provided counties put the effort in." This format has been proposed lots and there's a reason it hasn't been taken up, it wouldn't be that good.
The Tailteann isn't just about promoting weaker counties, it's about being better for the whole game and the proposed 2 tier system should be good for the middle teams and them getting more opportunity at playing the really top teams.
Whammo86 (Antrim) - Posts: 4172 - 14/05/2022 12:52:09
2416993
Link
0
|
Replying To GaelicLion: "Can anyone explain why there is a north and a south section without using the words bias,county ,6,anti ?" Cut down travel and costs for teams. Encourage more encounters between local rivalries? I don't think it's as big of a deal as some of you are making out.
Whammo86 (Antrim) - Posts: 4172 - 14/05/2022 13:07:12
2416996
Link
2
|
Replying To Loughduff Lad: "TG4 don't have any championship rights. They've been sold to RTÉ, BBC, and Sky. It's on the GAA to drive what rights they sell, with packages of games. If the TC isn't being shown enough, it's because they didn't push it in the rights package. It really shows where the mentality is actually at" They should give tng the tailteann cup. This secondary competition is a slippery slope to oblivion for a lot of weaker counties.
wicklowsupport (Wicklow) - Posts: 1890 - 14/05/2022 13:13:16
2417000
Link
1
|
Replying To Loughduff Lad: "Apparently it's to save on travel costs, but that's an absolute joke. We're relatively speaking a small island. If this were true, the old Qualifier system would have similarly been split. They're making it up as they go" Or maybe they've now realised that it's a good idea to do it this way? But of course you'll disagree with that as well.
oneoff (UK) - Posts: 1373 - 14/05/2022 13:34:01
2417005
Link
0
|
The Kerry propaganda machine in full flow with lines straight from the political playbook.
Phrases such as "big reward", "fair reward", "massive reward", "carrot of a Sam Maguire 16 spot for the winner is a massive reward", "when people see the reality of the reward, they will want to be part of it" So a ploy used in politics, keep using the same word in a sentence until it sticks with people, in this case the word reward, brainwashing. Other phrases such as "equal opportunities provider" & "can enjoy the fruits of a higher profile", "qualification to the Sam Maguire will be respected currency", are basically more brainwashing.
When this was passed at Congress, it was reported that prior to the voting a text was received from a TV company saying they would be interested in showing the games live, no confirmation of this was ever given. Now it turns out there will be only 3 games televised, the 2 semi finals & final. So only 4 Counties will get televised coverage out of the 17 teams, not what people were expecting. Lack of coverage for the other 13 Counties will make it harder to generate support amongst supporters & young people playing the game in those counties & worst of all, greater difficulty trying to retain or recruit new sponsors. It was also said that the Tailteann cup might be given a high profile by being played prior to the All Ireland final, that never materialised. It's now to be played prior to an All Ireland semi final & the Kerry poster states that this "ensures that more supporters of the Tailteann finals can attend the final", which is codswallop as very few of those supporters would even get tickets for an All Ireland final, more excuses.
Amazingly this poster was able to know the format when some of the competing counties didn't seem aware, "Rd 1 & quarter finals shall be organised on a geographical basis with Northern & Southern sections" & that "financial reasons are influencing the North South split", another let down in profiling the competition. Most counties wanted an open draw & no county came out publicly requesting a North South split for financial reasons. Seems like the Kerry poster has an answer for all shortcomings.
Bottom line in all of this, is that the GAA & TV Rights companies got exactly what they wanted, a Super 16 / Super 8's with the top teams playing each other more. More top games televised means more Revenue for the GAA & TV Rights companies & the GPA. The lower tier counties are dumped to the Tailteann Cup with 3 televised games. This was actively pushed by 2 ex Presidents, all profile & legacy stuff. The lower tier counties who already play each other in the league will now meet each other again, so standards will never raise & the ability to measure themselves against top teams will be gone. Playing at this level will create difficulty in creating a profile to get kids to play, difficulty retaining sponsorship & basically the weaker teams will get even weaker. This competition has already had two incarnations & failed, once this Honeymoon year is over, this competition faces the same path. The gap between the top & the bottom counties is about to get even bigger & the football C'ship will resemble the hurling with only a handful of top teams capable of competing. The money around this competition should have been invested in the lower tier counties in helping them to bridge the gaps.
moc.dna (Galway) - Posts: 1212 - 14/05/2022 13:41:15
2417007
Link
1
|
Replying To Whammo86: "Cut down travel and costs for teams. Encourage more encounters between local rivalries? I don't think it's as big of a deal as some of you are making out." It is a big deal, most of the counties expressed their disappointment that it wasn't an open draw, making it more exciting. Cutting down on costs is just an excuse, not one county came out saying they wanted a North South divide, it's just further dilution of the competition.
moc.dna (Galway) - Posts: 1212 - 14/05/2022 13:59:46
2417013
Link
0
|
Replying To Loughduff Lad: "Apparently it's to save on travel costs, but that's an absolute joke. We're relatively speaking a small island. If this were true, the old Qualifier system would have similarly been split. They're making it up as they go" Spot on, it's an after thought, no planning of it. The initial selling of it, had some individuals saying that it would get a high profile like been played before the senior All Ireland final, now its before an All Ireland semi final. Spin around it is gas, people failing to see the reality of the bigger picture, Super 16/Super 8's is all that matters as that brings in the big bucks from TV Rights. Tailteann Cup will only ensure that the chasm between the top tier & lower tier will get even bigger.
moc.dna (Galway) - Posts: 1212 - 14/05/2022 14:06:39
2417016
Link
0
|
Replying To moc.dna: "The Kerry propaganda machine in full flow with lines straight from the political playbook.
Phrases such as "big reward", "fair reward", "massive reward", "carrot of a Sam Maguire 16 spot for the winner is a massive reward", "when people see the reality of the reward, they will want to be part of it" So a ploy used in politics, keep using the same word in a sentence until it sticks with people, in this case the word reward, brainwashing. Other phrases such as "equal opportunities provider" & "can enjoy the fruits of a higher profile", "qualification to the Sam Maguire will be respected currency", are basically more brainwashing.
When this was passed at Congress, it was reported that prior to the voting a text was received from a TV company saying they would be interested in showing the games live, no confirmation of this was ever given. Now it turns out there will be only 3 games televised, the 2 semi finals & final. So only 4 Counties will get televised coverage out of the 17 teams, not what people were expecting. Lack of coverage for the other 13 Counties will make it harder to generate support amongst supporters & young people playing the game in those counties & worst of all, greater difficulty trying to retain or recruit new sponsors. It was also said that the Tailteann cup might be given a high profile by being played prior to the All Ireland final, that never materialised. It's now to be played prior to an All Ireland semi final & the Kerry poster states that this "ensures that more supporters of the Tailteann finals can attend the final", which is codswallop as very few of those supporters would even get tickets for an All Ireland final, more excuses.
Amazingly this poster was able to know the format when some of the competing counties didn't seem aware, "Rd 1 & quarter finals shall be organised on a geographical basis with Northern & Southern sections" & that "financial reasons are influencing the North South split", another let down in profiling the competition. Most counties wanted an open draw & no county came out publicly requesting a North South split for financial reasons. Seems like the Kerry poster has an answer for all shortcomings.
Bottom line in all of this, is that the GAA & TV Rights companies got exactly what they wanted, a Super 16 / Super 8's with the top teams playing each other more. More top games televised means more Revenue for the GAA & TV Rights companies & the GPA. The lower tier counties are dumped to the Tailteann Cup with 3 televised games. This was actively pushed by 2 ex Presidents, all profile & legacy stuff. The lower tier counties who already play each other in the league will now meet each other again, so standards will never raise & the ability to measure themselves against top teams will be gone. Playing at this level will create difficulty in creating a profile to get kids to play, difficulty retaining sponsorship & basically the weaker teams will get even weaker. This competition has already had two incarnations & failed, once this Honeymoon year is over, this competition faces the same path. The gap between the top & the bottom counties is about to get even bigger & the football C'ship will resemble the hurling with only a handful of top teams capable of competing. The money around this competition should have been invested in the lower tier counties in helping them to bridge the gaps." Yet another person going on about coverage. Have Division 4 teams been given wall to wall coverage up to now? What do you suggest? Every game be shown live?
Seeing as you're another who knows everything wrong with it tell us all your suggestions?
oneoff (UK) - Posts: 1373 - 14/05/2022 14:43:22
2417026
Link
0
|
Replying To moc.dna: "It is a big deal, most of the counties expressed their disappointment that it wasn't an open draw, making it more exciting. Cutting down on costs is just an excuse, not one county came out saying they wanted a North South divide, it's just further dilution of the competition." From what I seen only one manager said they were disappointed. Plus it's been pointed out that it's only for this year but sure just ignore that.
The one's that have all the excuses are the likes of you. Had it been an open draw this year you'd find some fault with it.
oneoff (UK) - Posts: 1373 - 14/05/2022 14:46:14
2417027
Link
0
|
Replying To GaelicLion: "Can anyone explain why there is a north and a south section without using the words bias,county ,6,anti ?" Don't know. I suppose it increases the chances of local rivalry games for bragging rights that might bring a few more to games than if it was an Ulster team trekking to Munster or vice versa. Though I don't have a notion. that it's planned as such. Maybe Eamonn Ryan is the new sponsor and shorter journeys will save the planet. He'll probably encourage teams to cycle to games like the Netherlands football team do to training. Good old Eamonn.
GreenandRed (Mayo) - Posts: 7290 - 14/05/2022 14:52:37
2417029
Link
1
|