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All Ireland Senior Hurling Championship 2023

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Replying To Oldtourman:  "Well maybe not, Tiobraid. If all that was to happen, but Limerick beat Cork, Limerick and Clare would have 4 points each and score difference would come into play."
Almost certain it would be head to head as only two teams could finish on 4 points. Open to correction on that but pretty sure that would be the case. Wont happen tho!

tiobraid (Tipperary) - Posts: 4119 - 12/05/2023 12:28:27    2477837

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Replying To clooney:  "I am fierce nervous of the Waterford match they will hardly paly the full forward line named in these positions ,but if they did and got a decent supply of ball they could fairly thump you they are missing great hurlers but when you read there team you get Goosebumps as despite the injuries they still have some marvellous hurlers.

They have put us to the Sword on more than one occasion when least expected and while I would love they to qualify Clare simply have to win to have a chance of qualification themselves.

Derek McGrath had a very good article in todays paper he seems to be saying to Davy to forget the stupid nonsense with Logan and focus on Waterford.

I will be very happy with a 1 point win"
Plenty of good players there alright but I'd be worried for that half forward line against the Clare half back line. That half back line is the only one that comes close to Limericks and its the real foundation of this Clare team.

If I was Waterford I'd probably look to lump the ball in to the full forward line as quickly as possible and almost any way at all as long as its going in quickly. I'm surprised Hayes has found his way back into the Clare team. Good hurler but extremely loose as a corner back. Daly and Gleeson as corner backs for Waterford is a big plus for them.

All form suggests a Clare win but if Waterford can get a win here then it really spices things up again.

tiobraid (Tipperary) - Posts: 4119 - 12/05/2023 12:35:45    2477842

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Replying To Doylerwex:  "That's the nature of sport.

We have it in us but aren't doing the business.

It's very fine margins at this level.

We drew with Westmeath after dominating but leaving them in it.

We threw it away against Dublin (twice).

Should have put Clare away but didn't, and Kilkenny beat them well after losing to us.

There's nothing that says we shouldn't be competing at the top end of leinster."
Speaking from my experience as a Limerick supporter of over 40 years who went through years of hard luck stories, bad luck and coming so close to glory, I realise now that you have to be a significant amount better and make substantial changes at all levels if you want to move from nearly winning big games and winning the odd big game here and there to a stage where you are consistently winning. That final 5% required to turn those 2-3 point losses to regular wins is so hard to find

Fitzy01 (Limerick) - Posts: 387 - 12/05/2023 13:02:24    2477852

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Replying To Fitzy01:  "Speaking from my experience as a Limerick supporter of over 40 years who went through years of hard luck stories, bad luck and coming so close to glory, I realise now that you have to be a significant amount better and make substantial changes at all levels if you want to move from nearly winning big games and winning the odd big game here and there to a stage where you are consistently winning. That final 5% required to turn those 2-3 point losses to regular wins is so hard to find"
Yes it is.

Viking66 (Wexford) - Posts: 11847 - 12/05/2023 13:29:47    2477865

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Replying To tiobraid:  "Plenty of good players there alright but I'd be worried for that half forward line against the Clare half back line. That half back line is the only one that comes close to Limericks and its the real foundation of this Clare team.

If I was Waterford I'd probably look to lump the ball in to the full forward line as quickly as possible and almost any way at all as long as its going in quickly. I'm surprised Hayes has found his way back into the Clare team. Good hurler but extremely loose as a corner back. Daly and Gleeson as corner backs for Waterford is a big plus for them.

All form suggests a Clare win but if Waterford can get a win here then it really spices things up again."
Tiobraid I believe we have more versatility in defence, Callum Lyons could not man mark Fitzgibbons. Daly can play centre half and Fitzgerald is used to the corner. A lot depends on A. Gleeson and what edition of him we see or in fact how well he is able to play. In fact it depends on the version of Waterford that shows up and the way they are asked to play. I would be fairly sure if ten balls were sent into Hutchison he would at least score five. No good if he is out in the middle fighting to win ball and two sent in to him in a game. A waste in the Davy style.
Clare are on a role and put a beating on us last year and our record again them in Thurles is abysmal.

Canuck (Waterford) - Posts: 2660 - 12/05/2023 15:16:46    2477899

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Replying To Canuck:  "Tiobraid I believe we have more versatility in defence, Callum Lyons could not man mark Fitzgibbons. Daly can play centre half and Fitzgerald is used to the corner. A lot depends on A. Gleeson and what edition of him we see or in fact how well he is able to play. In fact it depends on the version of Waterford that shows up and the way they are asked to play. I would be fairly sure if ten balls were sent into Hutchison he would at least score five. No good if he is out in the middle fighting to win ball and two sent in to him in a game. A waste in the Davy style.
Clare are on a role and put a beating on us last year and our record again them in Thurles is abysmal."
Agreed. Lyons is a top class hurler but his best position is debateable. I'd always have said he has to be at 5 but he's a really good midfielder too. Daly if fit enough is going to be a serious centre back.
Agreed on Dessie. He's completely unmarkable with any kind of decent ball going in but he has got so little of that this year. Hed have thrived on Waterford teams of the past
Clare backed up their performances throughout the
Munster campaign last year and if they maintain the form of the last day then I can't see Waterford winning. They've been very disappointing this year. The huge thing for Waterford is though that the full forward line named is a scary prospect for Clare. All 3 have an eye for goal and have put up big scores regularly. Could end being a crazy match full of goals

tiobraid (Tipperary) - Posts: 4119 - 12/05/2023 22:37:37    2477972

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Replying To tiobraid:  "Agreed. Lyons is a top class hurler but his best position is debateable. I'd always have said he has to be at 5 but he's a really good midfielder too. Daly if fit enough is going to be a serious centre back.
Agreed on Dessie. He's completely unmarkable with any kind of decent ball going in but he has got so little of that this year. Hed have thrived on Waterford teams of the past
Clare backed up their performances throughout the
Munster campaign last year and if they maintain the form of the last day then I can't see Waterford winning. They've been very disappointing this year. The huge thing for Waterford is though that the full forward line named is a scary prospect for Clare. All 3 have an eye for goal and have put up big scores regularly. Could end being a crazy match full of goals"
No good having that full forward line when 2 of them will end up sweeping

LohansRedHelmet (Clare) - Posts: 2479 - 13/05/2023 12:35:37    2478038

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I'd love to see Waterford go with that full forward line but I think Gleason might go further out the field..could Calum lyons play at 5 with daragh lyons playing as an extra defender..Clare look to be on the up big times specially with minor and 20s also flying..they have Mc Carthy back this year and what a difference,takes free taking pressure off Kelly..this is make or break for Waterford and I'll give them a very hesitant vote..ref might have a very busy afternoon..

CTGAA10 (Limerick) - Posts: 2214 - 13/05/2023 14:57:01    2478063

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When Cork beat limrik in the last Round limrik will finish 4th and can enjoy their Summer Holidays!!!
Looks like Clare, Cork and Tipperary all to qualify!!

katser (Galway) - Posts: 2193 - 13/05/2023 19:19:33    2478110

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Jesus what are Waterford at..they have players as good as any county and I just feel they need to be left off the leash..I really thought they'd come with something different today but I'm afraid no sign of change..if Clare beat cork it will be a straight shoot out on last day if tipp beat Limerick next week..Clare coped very well without Mc Carthy today..

CTGAA10 (Limerick) - Posts: 2214 - 13/05/2023 19:59:06    2478119

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Very disappointing for Waterford.. The Davy factor didn't work..

Ban (Westmeath) - Posts: 1415 - 13/05/2023 20:08:34    2478130

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Replying To Ban:  "Very disappointing for Waterford.. The Davy factor didn't work.."
Big men with no backbone. Was a poor 2nd half to watch. Clare playing well now.

Viking66 (Wexford) - Posts: 11847 - 13/05/2023 20:16:29    2478134

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Replying To CTGAA10:  "Jesus what are Waterford at..they have players as good as any county and I just feel they need to be left off the leash..I really thought they'd come with something different today but I'm afraid no sign of change..if Clare beat cork it will be a straight shoot out on last day if tipp beat Limerick next week..Clare coped very well without Mc Carthy today.."
1. The players are not good enough.
2. They don't look nearly fit enough to compete at this level.
3. Style of play unsuited for Waterford teams.
4. No support and this was completely predictable as the majority did not want Davy Fitzgearld and said they were not going to travel.
We now resemble our 70 and 80's levels. On top of that no success at under age since 2016 and what developed this team.
Congratulations to Clare and I hope they have a great run in the rest of this championship. I also hope they are not going to start this simulation stuff like today. The ref had to give Lyons the first yellow but the antics of the Clare player after was theatrical. If Lyons was a yellow what was the other card in that incident ? Also later in the game a Clare player gets a little push and rolls around again. The ref did not fall for it this time but these embellishments should be a yellow card. This is what people on here were slating us for.

Canuck (Waterford) - Posts: 2660 - 13/05/2023 20:22:18    2478137

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Counted 8 across the Waterford half back line twice for their own puckouts. Really F**cked up tactics. Dessie H regularly back on his own 45....let about two decent balls the whole game into the full forward line. I've never really criticised Davy in the past but that was just ridiculous stuff. These mad things hes coming up with will never work. Felt sorry for the likes of Bennett and Dessie H who are top class players who thrive on good ball in day in day out.
Clare can't read anything at all in to that. Lose against Cork and they are likely to go out - win and theyre probably in Munster final. Home game in Ennis should suit them but its not clear cut and the pressure is still on them.

tiobraid (Tipperary) - Posts: 4119 - 13/05/2023 20:28:48    2478140

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Canuck I don't agree with you saying players aren't good enough..ye have a lot of fellas who a lot of counties would take..Davy will get a lot of blame for crazy tactics but for me it goes back to derek Mc Grath,from memory he got these fellas playing very defensive..de burca huge loss I know but he wasn't going to add to the attack..they have to nail down a position for Aussie,way to good to be left out..if he's fit enough to be brought on,should be started.pa Curran has always impressed but can't nail a starting spot..dessie and bennet playing inside and that is a fair threat..maybe it's time Waterford looked inside their own county for a manger..also the results at minor/under 20!are not very inspiring..hurling needs Waterford..

CTGAA10 (Limerick) - Posts: 2214 - 13/05/2023 21:40:25    2478174

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Replying To Canuck:  "1. The players are not good enough.
2. They don't look nearly fit enough to compete at this level.
3. Style of play unsuited for Waterford teams.
4. No support and this was completely predictable as the majority did not want Davy Fitzgearld and said they were not going to travel.
We now resemble our 70 and 80's levels. On top of that no success at under age since 2016 and what developed this team.
Congratulations to Clare and I hope they have a great run in the rest of this championship. I also hope they are not going to start this simulation stuff like today. The ref had to give Lyons the first yellow but the antics of the Clare player after was theatrical. If Lyons was a yellow what was the other card in that incident ? Also later in the game a Clare player gets a little push and rolls around again. The ref did not fall for it this time but these embellishments should be a yellow card. This is what people on here were slating us for."
I agree with your points 2, 3, and 4, but dont agree that the players are not good enough. Waterford to me looked like a team totally lacking in confidence and lacking belief in the game plan (if it could be called as such) that they were trying to implement. Certainly the players ought to be good enough to be competitive in Munster and to be in the mix for qualifying out of Munster in the last round of games but when a player like Dessie Hutchinson is starved of possession and gets the majority of what few possessions he gets when he is out around midfield there is something terribly wrong in the way the team is set up.

PoolSturgeon (Galway) - Posts: 1903 - 13/05/2023 21:40:40    2478175

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Waterford need to compete in Leinster.
Or, have an open draw for Liam.

suckvalleypaddy (Galway) - Posts: 1669 - 13/05/2023 21:50:51    2478179

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Replying To Canuck:  "1. The players are not good enough.
2. They don't look nearly fit enough to compete at this level.
3. Style of play unsuited for Waterford teams.
4. No support and this was completely predictable as the majority did not want Davy Fitzgearld and said they were not going to travel.
We now resemble our 70 and 80's levels. On top of that no success at under age since 2016 and what developed this team.
Congratulations to Clare and I hope they have a great run in the rest of this championship. I also hope they are not going to start this simulation stuff like today. The ref had to give Lyons the first yellow but the antics of the Clare player after was theatrical. If Lyons was a yellow what was the other card in that incident ? Also later in the game a Clare player gets a little push and rolls around again. The ref did not fall for it this time but these embellishments should be a yellow card. This is what people on here were slating us for."
Hard luck Canuck.

You did well there's until you ranted for 75% of your post about supposed Clare simulation. Lots more going on to focus on from a Waterford perspective then such deflection

LohansRedHelmet (Clare) - Posts: 2479 - 13/05/2023 22:38:41    2478195

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Replying To Canuck:  "1. The players are not good enough.
2. They don't look nearly fit enough to compete at this level.
3. Style of play unsuited for Waterford teams.
4. No support and this was completely predictable as the majority did not want Davy Fitzgearld and said they were not going to travel.
We now resemble our 70 and 80's levels. On top of that no success at under age since 2016 and what developed this team.
Congratulations to Clare and I hope they have a great run in the rest of this championship. I also hope they are not going to start this simulation stuff like today. The ref had to give Lyons the first yellow but the antics of the Clare player after was theatrical. If Lyons was a yellow what was the other card in that incident ? Also later in the game a Clare player gets a little push and rolls around again. The ref did not fall for it this time but these embellishments should be a yellow card. This is what people on here were slating us for."
Waterford were clear second favs for last years AI a little more than 12 months ago. They're definitely good enough to compete in Munster.
The 3 lads in that named full forward line walks on to any team as does Barron and Lyons. That's the mentality Mcgrath had too when he went with his sweeper system.
Davys time has come and gone. The life has been sucked out of them and I take no pleasure in watching that today. Clare for me weren't even near their best and still won so easily.

tiobraid (Tipperary) - Posts: 4119 - 13/05/2023 22:59:56    2478203

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Replying To LohansRedHelmet:  "Hard luck Canuck.

You did well there's until you ranted for 75% of your post about supposed Clare simulation. Lots more going on to focus on from a Waterford perspective then such deflection"
I will always tell it as I see it. The simulation was as obvious as the nose on your face. The antics were because he thought his buddy was getting red for the shot to the head. The second simulation was an out and out joke. He got a slight push.

Anyway it was also obvious who was the best team by a country mile. Good luck to ye and I will be rooting for ye next week. Ye have a good team there and a few gears above what was needed today.

Canuck (Waterford) - Posts: 2660 - 13/05/2023 23:27:19    2478206

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