National Forum

Wexford Hurling Championship 2022

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Replying To alwaysasub:  "I would tend to agree with you but unfortunately there just isnt enough time with the new schedule, at the minute there is a game every weekend, no break, pick up a small injury and you might be gone for the rest of the championship. Also would it really weaken it that much. Both Fethard and Oulart would certainly not weaken it and maybe Bunclody. You might have one team who might struggle but I think anyone that argues that it would weaken the championship is not a realistic reason.

Certainly the less games would be an issue but unless the Leinster Championship is pushed out and the All ireland clubs moved even into February next year would free up some time. Maybe you could have an extra round where as the bottom of the group plays the top seed in another group, that way you have a guaranteed four matches, just one less than the 5. I would also like to see the return of two weeks football, two weeks hurling."
I agree with you on all your points

Viking66 (Wexford) - Posts: 6074 - 15/07/2022 13:55:23    2432224

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The schedule would be much better and seem less onerous if it returned to hurling one week, football the next.

Anyone who thinks that there are 16 teams good enough to be senior is deluded.

Let's say hypothetically that the 4 semi finalists from intermediate this year are promoted to make 16... probably Oulart, Bunclody, Fethard and Buffers Alley (maybe).

That would mean in 2024, the 17th best team would become senior. Someone like Taghmon, Askamore, Tara Rocks, Gusserane, Blackwater etc.

Any one of those would be miles off senior standard.

That's what used to happen under the old system of 16.

Very mediocre teams kept replacing each other as the whipping boys.

Onfor15 (Wexford) - Posts: 459 - 15/07/2022 14:08:16    2432229

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Replying To alwaysasub:  "I would tend to agree with you but unfortunately there just isnt enough time with the new schedule, at the minute there is a game every weekend, no break, pick up a small injury and you might be gone for the rest of the championship. Also would it really weaken it that much. Both Fethard and Oulart would certainly not weaken it and maybe Bunclody. You might have one team who might struggle but I think anyone that argues that it would weaken the championship is not a realistic reason.

Certainly the less games would be an issue but unless the Leinster Championship is pushed out and the All ireland clubs moved even into February next year would free up some time. Maybe you could have an extra round where as the bottom of the group plays the top seed in another group, that way you have a guaranteed four matches, just one less than the 5. I would also like to see the return of two weeks football, two weeks hurling."
Yep totally agree,

Back to alternate weeks for both codes is the only solution if there is any respect at all for football in this county or heaven forbid put football on first!!

I dont see how exposing another 60+ hurlers in the county to senior hurling weakens it in any way, sure there will be 1 or 2 games where teams cop beatings but would the likes of Bunclody, fethard and Oulart + an other up there weaken it, not at all.

We apparently had one of the most competitive championships in the country which has done what exactly for Clubs in Leinster Club championships??

The ironic thing is many teams under this format are crying out for a break and a game or two less to get injuries cleared and a bit more work on the training pitch. We have some of our best hurlers in the county totally flogged, National League with the county, straight into championship, straight into club hurling championship and then straight into club football championship. More games doesnt necessarily mean better and if there is still an obsession with more games again its possible as you have pointed out!!

tearintom (Wexford) - Posts: 1044 - 15/07/2022 14:40:02    2432238

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Replying To Onfor15:  "The schedule would be much better and seem less onerous if it returned to hurling one week, football the next.

Anyone who thinks that there are 16 teams good enough to be senior is deluded.

Let's say hypothetically that the 4 semi finalists from intermediate this year are promoted to make 16... probably Oulart, Bunclody, Fethard and Buffers Alley (maybe).

That would mean in 2024, the 17th best team would become senior. Someone like Taghmon, Askamore, Tara Rocks, Gusserane, Blackwater etc.

Any one of those would be miles off senior standard.

That's what used to happen under the old system of 16.

Very mediocre teams kept replacing each other as the whipping boys."
I said before when I first moved to Wexford and tried to get to know club scene, there was 2-3 contenders, 7-8 journeymen clubs and 3-4 happy to stay up and get hammered.
I don't think that is the same now a days. In fact, you could make an argument for 8-10 of the 12 teams as contenders.
I am not saying it is definite that they won't be whipping boys, but I don't believe the gap between Rapps and Bunclody or Fethard is as big as the gap between Oulart and Marshelstown back in the day. Do you?
With regard to the structure, the GAA like to play "whack a mole" with everything and every Tom Dick and Harry has an opinion. I never remember (as a daily Independent reader and some podcast listener) ONCE any of these geniuses raising issues with any change when it is at proposal stage. They all come out of the wood work once it is agreed. If they have the answers, go on the GAA committees who decide these things.
I know one thing, the All-Ireland in September was a disaster for the club player and I don't give a hoot who thinks the All-Ireland has nostalgia with children going back to school, the hurling ball was always white, or whatever the latest GAA moan is.

ExiledInWex (Dublin) - Posts: 440 - 15/07/2022 18:13:13    2432278

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Replying To ExiledInWex:  "I said before when I first moved to Wexford and tried to get to know club scene, there was 2-3 contenders, 7-8 journeymen clubs and 3-4 happy to stay up and get hammered.
I don't think that is the same now a days. In fact, you could make an argument for 8-10 of the 12 teams as contenders.
I am not saying it is definite that they won't be whipping boys, but I don't believe the gap between Rapps and Bunclody or Fethard is as big as the gap between Oulart and Marshelstown back in the day. Do you?
With regard to the structure, the GAA like to play "whack a mole" with everything and every Tom Dick and Harry has an opinion. I never remember (as a daily Independent reader and some podcast listener) ONCE any of these geniuses raising issues with any change when it is at proposal stage. They all come out of the wood work once it is agreed. If they have the answers, go on the GAA committees who decide these things.
I know one thing, the All-Ireland in September was a disaster for the club player and I don't give a hoot who thinks the All-Ireland has nostalgia with children going back to school, the hurling ball was always white, or whatever the latest GAA moan is."
I'm as traditional as they come. conservative with a small c. But you make fair points. The most important of which is about the clubs. Back in the day you could win the AI playing only 4 or 5 games. You could get a fag at halftime and a pint before the game to settle your nerves. And most importantly you rejoined your club between intercounty games to play club championships. With the demand for more and more intercounty games, backdoor since 97, round robins since 2018 etc etc, and increasingly professional levels of commitment time and body wise, the club scene was getting squeezed out altogether.
If we have to have so many intercounty games then finishing them by July is the only option. Otherwise adult football and hurling will die at club level. Over a prolonged period of time having less and less roots will make the whole tree fall down.

Viking66 (Wexford) - Posts: 6074 - 16/07/2022 11:55:28    2432317

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Replying To ExiledInWex:  "I said before when I first moved to Wexford and tried to get to know club scene, there was 2-3 contenders, 7-8 journeymen clubs and 3-4 happy to stay up and get hammered.
I don't think that is the same now a days. In fact, you could make an argument for 8-10 of the 12 teams as contenders.
I am not saying it is definite that they won't be whipping boys, but I don't believe the gap between Rapps and Bunclody or Fethard is as big as the gap between Oulart and Marshelstown back in the day. Do you?
With regard to the structure, the GAA like to play "whack a mole" with everything and every Tom Dick and Harry has an opinion. I never remember (as a daily Independent reader and some podcast listener) ONCE any of these geniuses raising issues with any change when it is at proposal stage. They all come out of the wood work once it is agreed. If they have the answers, go on the GAA committees who decide these things.
I know one thing, the All-Ireland in September was a disaster for the club player and I don't give a hoot who thinks the All-Ireland has nostalgia with children going back to school, the hurling ball was always white, or whatever the latest GAA moan is."
I'm as traditional as they come. conservative with a small c. But you make fair points. The most important of which is about the clubs. Back in the day you could win the AI playing only 4 or 5 games. You could get a fag at halftime and a pint before the game to settle your nerves. And most importantly you rejoined your club between intercounty games to play club championships. With the demand for more and more intercounty games, backdoor since 97, round robins since 2018 etc etc, and increasingly professional levels of commitment time and body wise, the club scene was getting squeezed out altogether.
If we have to have so many intercounty games then finishing them by July is the only option. Otherwise adult football and hurling will die at club level. Over a prolonged period of time having less and less roots will make the whole tree fall down.

Viking66 (Wexford) - Posts: 6074 - 16/07/2022 11:56:00    2432318

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Replying To ExiledInWex:  "I said before when I first moved to Wexford and tried to get to know club scene, there was 2-3 contenders, 7-8 journeymen clubs and 3-4 happy to stay up and get hammered.
I don't think that is the same now a days. In fact, you could make an argument for 8-10 of the 12 teams as contenders.
I am not saying it is definite that they won't be whipping boys, but I don't believe the gap between Rapps and Bunclody or Fethard is as big as the gap between Oulart and Marshelstown back in the day. Do you?
With regard to the structure, the GAA like to play "whack a mole" with everything and every Tom Dick and Harry has an opinion. I never remember (as a daily Independent reader and some podcast listener) ONCE any of these geniuses raising issues with any change when it is at proposal stage. They all come out of the wood work once it is agreed. If they have the answers, go on the GAA committees who decide these things.
I know one thing, the All-Ireland in September was a disaster for the club player and I don't give a hoot who thinks the All-Ireland has nostalgia with children going back to school, the hurling ball was always white, or whatever the latest GAA moan is."
I believe the gap might be even wider.

As I said, if it went back to 16 it wouldn't be unrealistic that both Oulart and Taghmon would be part of the top 16 in the next year or two.

Look at the scoreline that Oulart beat Taghmon by.

And Oulart would only be a mid table senior team if they returned there. I do believe they are better than Rathnure, Harriers, Cloughbawn, Crossabeg and Oylegate. So imagine what the likes of the Rapps would do to a Taghmon or a Gusserane or an Askamore etc.

It was the same as what an Oulart or Rathnure were doing to Marshalstown or whoever back in the noughties.

Onfor15 (Wexford) - Posts: 459 - 16/07/2022 12:03:40    2432320

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Replying To Onfor15:  "I believe the gap might be even wider.

As I said, if it went back to 16 it wouldn't be unrealistic that both Oulart and Taghmon would be part of the top 16 in the next year or two.

Look at the scoreline that Oulart beat Taghmon by.

And Oulart would only be a mid table senior team if they returned there. I do believe they are better than Rathnure, Harriers, Cloughbawn, Crossabeg and Oylegate. So imagine what the likes of the Rapps would do to a Taghmon or a Gusserane or an Askamore etc.

It was the same as what an Oulart or Rathnure were doing to Marshalstown or whoever back in the noughties."
The Taghmon lads never got going in that game. Conceded soft goals and the game got away from them even before the sending off. It was a bad day at the office. If they played 10 more times the next 10 weekends the margin won't be that in any of them. Sure Oulart beat Ballygarrett by 25 odd points and Taghmon beat them by 20 odd points. And Ballygarret beat Buffers Alley in between. There's no point looking at one off results.
Yes Oulart have some very good players, they look fitter and sharper than last year, they look very motivated and would be competitive at Senior this year or next, while Taghmon would get the odd bad beating if part of a 16 club senior championship right now. But they would learn from these especially the younger lads. There's nothing like playing directly on a better opponent to improve your reading of a game. And 80 odd hurlers would have to get better at hurling just by hurling at a higher level against better opponents. Some of these might turn out to be very good intercounty players in time.

Viking66 (Wexford) - Posts: 6074 - 16/07/2022 13:21:58    2432333

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I'm not trying to pick on Taghmon I actually think they are quite a decent team but the fact that they could be beaten by 36 points by what would be a middle of the road senior team just illustrates how big the gaps are.

Someone suggested to me the other day that adult grades should be 10 teams, with 2 groups of 5. It would take the same number of weeks to play but would mean that each team would get a week off in the group stages.

Onfor15 (Wexford) - Posts: 459 - 16/07/2022 13:52:50    2432339

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You would think looking at Oulart so far if they got out of Wexford, they would surely give the Intermediate All Ireland a serious serious rattle.

Past hurler (None) - Posts: 456 - 16/07/2022 17:57:12    2432374

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Get in there.

WEX98 (Wexford) - Posts: 347 - 16/07/2022 18:00:31    2432376

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When I first moved to Wexford, the nationwide famed clubs were Rathnure, Buffers Alley and Oulart-The Ballagh.
Is it possible that all 3 could be hurling intermediate next year? Is it possible Buffers Alley might be hurling Intermediate A?

ExiledInWex (Dublin) - Posts: 440 - 17/07/2022 12:51:48    2432457

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Replying To ExiledInWex:  "When I first moved to Wexford, the nationwide famed clubs were Rathnure, Buffers Alley and Oulart-The Ballagh.
Is it possible that all 3 could be hurling intermediate next year? Is it possible Buffers Alley might be hurling Intermediate A?"
Probably all the football they're playing holding them back!!

tearintom (Wexford) - Posts: 1044 - 17/07/2022 14:24:51    2432478

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Replying To ExiledInWex:  "When I first moved to Wexford, the nationwide famed clubs were Rathnure, Buffers Alley and Oulart-The Ballagh.
Is it possible that all 3 could be hurling intermediate next year? Is it possible Buffers Alley might be hurling Intermediate A?"
I think the most likely possibility Rathnure and they could be in a battle with the other famed club the Harriers, big game for them today. Nothing decided yet in either group bar Rathnure will come bottom of B

zinny (Wexford) - Posts: 1502 - 17/07/2022 14:25:23    2432479

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Replying To ExiledInWex:  "When I first moved to Wexford, the nationwide famed clubs were Rathnure, Buffers Alley and Oulart-The Ballagh.
Is it possible that all 3 could be hurling intermediate next year? Is it possible Buffers Alley might be hurling Intermediate A?"
I think likely be Rathnure and Oulart will be Senior. Buffers Alley might be in the relegation playoff but only losing by 1 to Oulart should give them hope.

Viking66 (Wexford) - Posts: 6074 - 17/07/2022 14:39:19    2432480

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Replying To Onfor15:  "I'm not trying to pick on Taghmon I actually think they are quite a decent team but the fact that they could be beaten by 36 points by what would be a middle of the road senior team just illustrates how big the gaps are.

Someone suggested to me the other day that adult grades should be 10 teams, with 2 groups of 5. It would take the same number of weeks to play but would mean that each team would get a week off in the group stages."
You are sounding like those lads from Barcelona, Real Madrid etc that wanted to form a European super league. How do 10 team grades improve the general standard of hurling in the county and the fortunes of the county teams?

Viking66 (Wexford) - Posts: 6074 - 17/07/2022 14:45:04    2432482

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Just back from New Ross. Only caught the last 10 minutes of Fethards win over Gusserane but they looked very sharp. Maybe they are timing their peak form for the knockout stages of the Championship.
Taghmon got what I was told was their first ever win over St James in the Championship. At least in living memory. It was a good competitive game but Taghmon should probably have won by more. Shot some bad wides after doing the hard work well in creating the chances. Especially in the 1st half although maybe the diagonal breeze into that end didn't help as Jimmy's shot more wides in the 2nd half than the 1st too. Good to be qualified for the QF with a game to spare.

Viking66 (Wexford) - Posts: 6074 - 17/07/2022 14:54:14    2432483

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Replying To Onfor15:  "In no particular order:

Gorey
Rapps
Shels
St Martin's
Glynn
Ferns
St Anne's
Rathnure

Harriers
Crossabeg
Cloughbawn
Oylegate"
This weekend Crossabeg beat Gorey by 6 points. Cloughbawn beat Glynn by 4 points and Oylegate beat Rathnure by 8 points. Harriers just beat Annes by a point. Still feel 8 teams are better than the next 4?

Viking66 (Wexford) - Posts: 6074 - 17/07/2022 19:52:26    2432554

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Replying To WEX98:  "I'm always in good form Viking.

They took my advice, Podge was 14, 15, 12, 11, 10 and 13.

Shane Reck being back was massive, if we had of hurled like that against Ferns we'd be sitting on 4 points now.

Still improvements to be made in the fowards, Casey and Jack Reck yet to fire.

Goal keeper and back solid, Damo flying."
Should be over the moon now Wex98!

Viking66 (Wexford) - Posts: 6074 - 17/07/2022 19:53:29    2432556

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Replying To Onfor15:  "You can't just base it on one weekend or one shortened season.

Yes Oylegate got the better of the Shels yesterday, but that doesn't mean they automatically become a top 8 team.

Yes last year St Martin's were in a relegation final (after a poorly designed championship). Their opponents last year in the championship were Ferns, Glynn and Gorey. They lost to Ferns by a point and drew with Gorey. That is easily top 8 form.

In the last 5 seasons the Harriers have only 1 win against any of the teams I've listed in the top 8. Just because they made a quarter final does not mean they are better than a team who didn't. They are consistently in the weakest 4 senior teams over the last 4/5 years and yeaterday's result is more evidence of that."
The "consistently 4 weakest senior teams" all won today. Rathnure are in the relegation match. Anne's or Glynn could join them. And that's over 5 games so the odd shock result shouldn't have as big an influence.

Viking66 (Wexford) - Posts: 6074 - 17/07/2022 19:59:56    2432561

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