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2022 All-Ireland Hurling Championship thread

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Replying To clooney:  "Well here we go again using phrases like "diggin" & "hatchetmen" dosent say much about you only ignorant comments I honestly don't know why an amateur player who put their lives on hold for nothing only abuse like this.
I don't condone what they did but ONE incident in their careers & they get subjected to this rubbish.

Shame on those comment"
Shame on the truth your saying is it?

countyman2022 (Wexford) - Posts: 216 - 08/06/2022 12:58:09    2423328

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Replying To Canuck:  "Look my guess of this technology is it is probably outdated as the penny farthing bike. I have been involved with similar types of imaging and sensing. It is out dated the day you are installing it. Never mind years later."
If it was the GAA that owned and ran the product I would agree with you however its not and from everything I seen the company that owns and runs it continue to be at the top end in terms of technology in this area.
There are two potential reasons for the issue last Sunday, hardware or software. As much as some companies like to tout their software, it still depend and being plugged in! For CP there are 8 cameras that are used for the purpose of creating the flight of the ball, so perhaps one was not working, maybe a bird **** on it, who knows, anyway it meant they couldn't determine with the degree of certainty they want what happened.
If they cannot determine the flight of the ball then their is nothing to show. If kawkeye cannot determine it, then it's back to the umpires decision. I am sure there was a full incident report on the matter which was discussed within the GAA. Will they make that public, I doubt it as by running it again they are saying they have confidence it's ok. The backup is the umpire and for most of the year that's what we have anyway.

zinny (Wexford) - Posts: 1432 - 08/06/2022 12:58:37    2423329

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Replying To tiobraid:  "The current system has unquestionably help those teams progress. People should relsih these games regardless if theyre a Munster final or are the few great weekends of All Ireland semi's we had a few years back. Theres a number of Wexford posters on here that critise the Munster cship whether the games are good or bad. Its very strange."
The current system hasn't really helped those teams progress when you think about it though. Laois won the Joe Mc, beat Dublin, ran Tipp close. But they came up in to the Leinster Championship and have been relegated and that is the ramp over which all these counties will struggle to get.
I don't think anybody criticises the Munster championship, I think what people see is the silence after a bad game (which I don't think you'd dispute has been most of the games this year) and then the utter hysteria when there's a good game.
Like the game on Sunday was being compared on Twitter as the best one since 2004. 18 years? Does that not say something?
I will also add, that I remember maybe 12-15 years of hurling and the most memorable games in that time were all All-Ireland Semi Finals and Finals, up until Sunday and the 2019 Leinster Final I don't think there were that many games which stick in the memory in the provincial championships. And I've been to a few Tipp ones in the last few years by the way!

StoreysTash (Wexford) - Posts: 1610 - 08/06/2022 14:46:20    2423362

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Did they not try turning it off and turning it back on again?
I often wondered what would happen if a seagull flew close to the ball in flight. Would the graphic not be generated?

StoreysTash (Wexford) - Posts: 1610 - 08/06/2022 14:48:39    2423364

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Replying To StoreysTash:  "The current system hasn't really helped those teams progress when you think about it though. Laois won the Joe Mc, beat Dublin, ran Tipp close. But they came up in to the Leinster Championship and have been relegated and that is the ramp over which all these counties will struggle to get.
I don't think anybody criticises the Munster championship, I think what people see is the silence after a bad game (which I don't think you'd dispute has been most of the games this year) and then the utter hysteria when there's a good game.
Like the game on Sunday was being compared on Twitter as the best one since 2004. 18 years? Does that not say something?
I will also add, that I remember maybe 12-15 years of hurling and the most memorable games in that time were all All-Ireland Semi Finals and Finals, up until Sunday and the 2019 Leinster Final I don't think there were that many games which stick in the memory in the provincial championships. And I've been to a few Tipp ones in the last few years by the way!"
I know this post will most likely not be popular with fans of the current Munster championship.... but

I think if the GAA are serious about developing so called weaker counties the MacCarthy Cup needs to be expanded and made an open draw. It could be expanded to 15 teams drawn in 3 groups of 5 (as an example - not trying to start a debate on format) with the top 2 in each group and the 2 best placed third sides making the quarter finals. That would give each team a similar opportunity and would hopefully avoid meaningless round robin games at the end of the group.

One team up and down each year and review expansion of the tournament every 2 seasons.

Just my 2C on this.

slayer (Limerick) - Posts: 6323 - 08/06/2022 15:00:23    2423374

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Replying To tiobraid:  "The current system has unquestionably help those teams progress. People should relsih these games regardless if theyre a Munster final or are the few great weekends of All Ireland semi's we had a few years back. Theres a number of Wexford posters on here that critise the Munster cship whether the games are good or bad. Its very strange."
I don't think you are right there Tiobraid. A better way to put it is there are a number of Wexford posters who are sick of Munster posters building up the Munster Championship to be better than it is. I think its a good competition. I've followed Limerick in it since the 90s. I've seen some great games in it. But equally I've seen some very poor games. And most years there are at least 1 or 2 teams well off the pace. OK so the 1 or 2 teams has varied more in Munster than Leinster but it still doesn't change the fact.

Viking66 (Wexford) - Posts: 5275 - 08/06/2022 15:05:33    2423379

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Why was Hawkeye not available on Sunday

Newyorkkat (Kilkenny) - Posts: 54 - 08/06/2022 15:07:26    2423381

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Replying To tiobraid:  "I dont live or work in Munster currently yet all the talk in the office yesterday was about the Munster final - many by non hurling people which is great for the game. By saying that I mean any great hurling match regardless of who. Growing up I probably disliked Clare and Limerick more than anyone else but at my age now I can appreciate a good game.
Growing up I heard a lot about the Dublin-Meath rivarly and how "you wouldnt understand" and I didnt to be honest. The atmosphere is a massive part of it and a full Semple stadium like Sunday is hard beaten in my biased opinion. Theres just something special about it. Why take from it by running down the cship or suggesting it be scrapped, particualrly when any of the 5 could reach the Munster final next year."
I agree 140% that the provincial championships in hurling shouldn't be scrapped. Most hurling supporters I know in Wexford would agree with me.

Viking66 (Wexford) - Posts: 5275 - 08/06/2022 15:08:38    2423383

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Replying To StoreysTash:  "The current system hasn't really helped those teams progress when you think about it though. Laois won the Joe Mc, beat Dublin, ran Tipp close. But they came up in to the Leinster Championship and have been relegated and that is the ramp over which all these counties will struggle to get.
I don't think anybody criticises the Munster championship, I think what people see is the silence after a bad game (which I don't think you'd dispute has been most of the games this year) and then the utter hysteria when there's a good game.
Like the game on Sunday was being compared on Twitter as the best one since 2004. 18 years? Does that not say something?
I will also add, that I remember maybe 12-15 years of hurling and the most memorable games in that time were all All-Ireland Semi Finals and Finals, up until Sunday and the 2019 Leinster Final I don't think there were that many games which stick in the memory in the provincial championships. And I've been to a few Tipp ones in the last few years by the way!"
Laois have been missing alot of lads through injury every year since then. Its disingenuous of you to blame the senior intercounty structures for the lack of progress in the 2nd tier counties now, when I know from some very good posts you have put up over the last year or 2 that you know deep down that these counties need to get better from the grassroots up. For these counties to get truly competitive they need to-
1- increase playing numbers from underage upwards through participation initiatives aimed at parents.
2- improve coaching in schools and clubs and encourage them to encourage more young people to take up and stick with hurling.
3- improve infrastructure and facilities for the elite hurlers at all age groups in these counties.
4- improve top level coaching and backroom staff.
5- raise and spend the money to finance 1 to 4.
Then in time they will naturally get more competitive and will be able to sustain it.

Viking66 (Wexford) - Posts: 5275 - 08/06/2022 15:19:24    2423386

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Replying To StoreysTash:  "The current system hasn't really helped those teams progress when you think about it though. Laois won the Joe Mc, beat Dublin, ran Tipp close. But they came up in to the Leinster Championship and have been relegated and that is the ramp over which all these counties will struggle to get.
I don't think anybody criticises the Munster championship, I think what people see is the silence after a bad game (which I don't think you'd dispute has been most of the games this year) and then the utter hysteria when there's a good game.
Like the game on Sunday was being compared on Twitter as the best one since 2004. 18 years? Does that not say something?
I will also add, that I remember maybe 12-15 years of hurling and the most memorable games in that time were all All-Ireland Semi Finals and Finals, up until Sunday and the 2019 Leinster Final I don't think there were that many games which stick in the memory in the provincial championships. And I've been to a few Tipp ones in the last few years by the way!"
2017 Leinster semifinal against Kilkenny? 2018 heartbreak in Nowlan Park? 2019 draw in Wexford Park? And that's just over the last 5 years between 2 teams. If you want to go back to the early noughties Mick Jacobs goal in 2004? I agree after that for a few years it became a succession of trips up to Croker only to be heading back down with our tails between our legs. Followed by a few years where we didn't even make it there.
But then maybe that's why we value a Leinster championship so highly. In my time since the early 90s we have only won 4.

Viking66 (Wexford) - Posts: 5275 - 08/06/2022 15:26:53    2423391

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Replying To StoreysTash:  "The current system hasn't really helped those teams progress when you think about it though. Laois won the Joe Mc, beat Dublin, ran Tipp close. But they came up in to the Leinster Championship and have been relegated and that is the ramp over which all these counties will struggle to get.
I don't think anybody criticises the Munster championship, I think what people see is the silence after a bad game (which I don't think you'd dispute has been most of the games this year) and then the utter hysteria when there's a good game.
Like the game on Sunday was being compared on Twitter as the best one since 2004. 18 years? Does that not say something?
I will also add, that I remember maybe 12-15 years of hurling and the most memorable games in that time were all All-Ireland Semi Finals and Finals, up until Sunday and the 2019 Leinster Final I don't think there were that many games which stick in the memory in the provincial championships. And I've been to a few Tipp ones in the last few years by the way!"
Many people say the best game of hurling was the 2009 All Ireland - what does that say since it was 13 years ago? Not much in my opinion. The most talked about game last year by a distance was also the Munster final and for different reasons but still generated by far the most debate and discussions for a whole variety of reasons. Arguably both Tipp's and Limericks finest 35 mins of hurling. The big story for a chunk of 2019 was Wexford and if they could win the All Ireland and the level of hurling they were playing.

replying to the other poster: Expanding the Liam McCarthy or lumping the 11 teams into a CL format or two groups - what does it give you? Basically two groups similiar to what we already have with only one piece of silverware. Do people really think that leaving Offaly (for example0 in the Leinster cship for the last number of years would see them develop. if you were an Offaly hurler would you bother togging out to receive hammerings? I've experienced this as a player at club level and it does nothing for a club. Getting relegated was far better and getting a few years at a lower grade left us in a better position. Tullaroan in KK are a perfect example of this. Going up and down is not the answer I agree but if a team is getting beaten out the gate every year then the players will drop out and the supporters wont have much to shout about either.
Would my local club be better off playing Limerick every year or a grade they are suitable for? Which would they improve more by playing? I'm struggling to see how people cant understand the logic. It would be different if we had teams 10-15 being equal to teams 5-9 but currently they are simply no where near that.

tiobraid (Tipperary) - Posts: 3486 - 08/06/2022 15:40:49    2423397

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Replying To tiobraid:  "Many people say the best game of hurling was the 2009 All Ireland - what does that say since it was 13 years ago? Not much in my opinion. The most talked about game last year by a distance was also the Munster final and for different reasons but still generated by far the most debate and discussions for a whole variety of reasons. Arguably both Tipp's and Limericks finest 35 mins of hurling. The big story for a chunk of 2019 was Wexford and if they could win the All Ireland and the level of hurling they were playing.

replying to the other poster: Expanding the Liam McCarthy or lumping the 11 teams into a CL format or two groups - what does it give you? Basically two groups similiar to what we already have with only one piece of silverware. Do people really think that leaving Offaly (for example0 in the Leinster cship for the last number of years would see them develop. if you were an Offaly hurler would you bother togging out to receive hammerings? I've experienced this as a player at club level and it does nothing for a club. Getting relegated was far better and getting a few years at a lower grade left us in a better position. Tullaroan in KK are a perfect example of this. Going up and down is not the answer I agree but if a team is getting beaten out the gate every year then the players will drop out and the supporters wont have much to shout about either.
Would my local club be better off playing Limerick every year or a grade they are suitable for? Which would they improve more by playing? I'm struggling to see how people cant understand the logic. It would be different if we had teams 10-15 being equal to teams 5-9 but currently they are simply no where near that."
Tiobraid,

Tipperary and Waterford were well beaten on the final day of their season. Both had little or no fear of relegation despite hammerings.

Do you think Kerry/Antrim/Laois/Carlow/Offaly/Westmeath are on a level playing field with Waterford and Tipperary? I'm not asking if these sides are as good as Waterford or Tipp, just asking if they are at a disadvantage year on year compared to the bottom Munster sides?

slayer (Limerick) - Posts: 6323 - 08/06/2022 16:20:04    2423415

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Replying To Viking66:  "I agree 140% that the provincial championships in hurling shouldn't be scrapped. Most hurling supporters I know in Wexford would agree with me."
Has anybody proposed scrapping the provincial championships?
I think what people want is the provincials played first and then a round robin. There was a thread on this very topic AFAIK.
I know I as a Dublin supporter (and I suppose by association at this stage a Wexford #2 supporter) would hate to lose matches v Wexford and Kilkenny. I think Wexford and Kilkenny in Nowlan Park recently was an absolutely cracking evening and great entertainment.
But, I think as storeystash said above nobody remembers who wins provincial championships and if hurling is to extend its reach, everybody needs to be given an equal chance at progress. Promoting the McDonagh cup winners and making them lambs to the slaughter in the provincial championships before patting them on the head and saying "try again" will do nothing for the game in these counties.
There just has to be a more inclusive format if Dublin, Offaly, Laois, Kildare (making great strides in the game) are to be convinced that 10+ years of hard work is to be worth their while.
And I am following Dublin since the 80's and know how hard it is to get players to be convinced "why would I bother playing hurling for Dublin".

ExiledInWex (Dublin) - Posts: 195 - 08/06/2022 17:02:42    2423432

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Replying To zinny:  "If it was the GAA that owned and ran the product I would agree with you however its not and from everything I seen the company that owns and runs it continue to be at the top end in terms of technology in this area.
There are two potential reasons for the issue last Sunday, hardware or software. As much as some companies like to tout their software, it still depend and being plugged in! For CP there are 8 cameras that are used for the purpose of creating the flight of the ball, so perhaps one was not working, maybe a bird **** on it, who knows, anyway it meant they couldn't determine with the degree of certainty they want what happened.
If they cannot determine the flight of the ball then their is nothing to show. If kawkeye cannot determine it, then it's back to the umpires decision. I am sure there was a full incident report on the matter which was discussed within the GAA. Will they make that public, I doubt it as by running it again they are saying they have confidence it's ok. The backup is the umpire and for most of the year that's what we have anyway."
Zinny I honestly don't know what they are using. What I do know and involved with is objects been detected travelling at 1000 per minute and and a hair can be detected from the stored image. That intrusion to the image can be programmed to store a specific object (the ball) and act on it while ignoring every thing else. It just does not make sense to me. You have two fixed object that the ball must pass through. After you get a signal you do any fancy graphics you like with it.

Canuck (Waterford) - Posts: 2104 - 08/06/2022 20:07:04    2423465

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Replying To Viking66:  "I don't think you are right there Tiobraid. A better way to put it is there are a number of Wexford posters who are sick of Munster posters building up the Munster Championship to be better than it is. I think its a good competition. I've followed Limerick in it since the 90s. I've seen some great games in it. But equally I've seen some very poor games. And most years there are at least 1 or 2 teams well off the pace. OK so the 1 or 2 teams has varied more in Munster than Leinster but it still doesn't change the fact."
Sick of not been taken seriously as a hurling county (not the current team) but as a hurling county.

WEX98 (Wexford) - Posts: 326 - 08/06/2022 21:37:55    2423478

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Replying To slayer:  "Tiobraid,

Tipperary and Waterford were well beaten on the final day of their season. Both had little or no fear of relegation despite hammerings.

Do you think Kerry/Antrim/Laois/Carlow/Offaly/Westmeath are on a level playing field with Waterford and Tipperary? I'm not asking if these sides are as good as Waterford or Tipp, just asking if they are at a disadvantage year on year compared to the bottom Munster sides?"
I felt 5 teams in both cships was the correct amount as I felt that the likes of Laois would target only one game - similar to what teams done in the league. However, if the decision was 6 teams for Leinster (as it is) and Kerry won then they should definitely have been brought into the Munster cship next year and should they finish bottom of Munster cship next year then they should face the threat of relegation the same as the bottom team in Leinster. However, if the cship was 5 teams per province then Tipp should have been relegated this year - had Kerry won. I think Tipp had a very real fear of relegation this year. Playing poorly, morale low and players stopped training with many taking a break or playing football. A game against Kerry which nearly occurred was far from a foregone conclusion but Kerry should have refused to play the game regardless in my opinion.

I fully understand your question but there's a strong argument that Kerry and Antrim have a huge advantage over all 5 of the Munster sides also. They played weaker opposition and now find themselves in the latter stages of the All Ireland series. You can't compare Antrims path to the games Cork has played for example. Is that fair? Had Tipp been relegated this year and reached a Joe Mc final next season, there'd be uproar that that they had an "easy" path into the All Ireland series. I agree there's massive flaws in the system but can be argued a number of different ways.

tiobraid (Tipperary) - Posts: 3486 - 09/06/2022 08:49:20    2423490

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Replying To WEX98:  "Sick of not been taken seriously as a hurling county (not the current team) but as a hurling county."
Yes. But in a way its our own fault. Since the mid 90s we have failed to string a few results together. Could be great 1 or maybe 2 games then poor the next time out. And our record against Munster teams is overall pretty poor since the 60s. Some good wins and unlucky draws. But more defeats. But then for alot of that time we haven't been playing whoever were the weakest Munster teams in any given year as they would be eliminated before we got the chance to play them. Most of our defeats to Munster counties came against teams that won or at least got to the AIF. The top Munster teams in any given year.

Viking66 (Wexford) - Posts: 5275 - 09/06/2022 09:21:07    2423496

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tiobraid, I would bet you good money that a Tipp team arriving in a preliminary quarter final after playing Laois, Kerry and Offaly would be so badly undercooked both physically and hurling wise when they came up against battle hardened team from the Leinster or Munster championship that they'd be easy meat for any team.
Obviously we'll most likely never find out but playing in Joe McDonagh, while grand for teams "making progress" is still a mile below the top level. Kerry and Antrim served up a good exciting match but lets be real, the standard of the hurling was still a mile off the Leinster Final, no matter how bad that match was.

ExiledInWex (Dublin) - Posts: 195 - 09/06/2022 09:52:40    2423509

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Replying To tiobraid:  "I felt 5 teams in both cships was the correct amount as I felt that the likes of Laois would target only one game - similar to what teams done in the league. However, if the decision was 6 teams for Leinster (as it is) and Kerry won then they should definitely have been brought into the Munster cship next year and should they finish bottom of Munster cship next year then they should face the threat of relegation the same as the bottom team in Leinster. However, if the cship was 5 teams per province then Tipp should have been relegated this year - had Kerry won. I think Tipp had a very real fear of relegation this year. Playing poorly, morale low and players stopped training with many taking a break or playing football. A game against Kerry which nearly occurred was far from a foregone conclusion but Kerry should have refused to play the game regardless in my opinion.

I fully understand your question but there's a strong argument that Kerry and Antrim have a huge advantage over all 5 of the Munster sides also. They played weaker opposition and now find themselves in the latter stages of the All Ireland series. You can't compare Antrims path to the games Cork has played for example. Is that fair? Had Tipp been relegated this year and reached a Joe Mc final next season, there'd be uproar that that they had an "easy" path into the All Ireland series. I agree there's massive flaws in the system but can be argued a number of different ways."
Yes there are flaws in the current system but overall it ticks most of the boxes it was designed to tick. I think it's working pretty well. None of the teams eliminated can complain. They all lost a minimum of 2 games, Dublin, and a maximum of 4, Tipp. Yes Cork and Kilkenny have lost twice also but they each beat at least 2 of the eliminated teams including Dublin, Tipp and Waterford.

Viking66 (Wexford) - Posts: 5275 - 09/06/2022 09:59:02    2423512

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Replying To Viking66:  "Yes. But in a way its our own fault. Since the mid 90s we have failed to string a few results together. Could be great 1 or maybe 2 games then poor the next time out. And our record against Munster teams is overall pretty poor since the 60s. Some good wins and unlucky draws. But more defeats. But then for alot of that time we haven't been playing whoever were the weakest Munster teams in any given year as they would be eliminated before we got the chance to play them. Most of our defeats to Munster counties came against teams that won or at least got to the AIF. The top Munster teams in any given year."
There was plenty of years we gave Kilkenny their hardest game and they went on to win the All Ireland. We had some bad results against them in the 00s and 10s but who didn't.

WEX98 (Wexford) - Posts: 326 - 09/06/2022 10:35:47    2423531

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