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Who cares
conman1282 (Tyrone) - Posts: 88 - 13/09/2021 00:25:03
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Replying To Young_gael: "Im writing this post in the best of sport and in the spirit of fairplay, and to start I have to congratulate Tyrone on their 4th All-Ireland win. Well
done, and enjoy the celebrations! A great performance. The following pist is meant as a kick start to a topic I think ought to be discussed, and I mean it as a fan first and foremost, and someone with enormous respect for Mayo GAA.
Getting onto the topic of my post, Mayo.....
Its very hard to sum up what Mayo football is about. It has to be one of the most puritanical and fanatic football counties there is. From my experience only Kerry and Cavan supporters generally surpass them in terms of their general interest in the club game and their devotion to the cause of the intercounty teams; football is the opium of the masses in these places, and no other sport is on the same platform. However Mayo have lost 11/12 All-Irelands in thirty years. This is a statistic that is unrivalled in any sport on the planet in any circumstances and quite literally over a period of 6/7 different team rotations over a period of a third of a century, they have lost and lost and lost again when the cup was there to be lifted. Im going to try point out why that is:
1/ they love the journey more than the endgoal. Mayo are happy with token trinkets such as the connacht championship and the odd win over a Kerry or Dublin etc in a knockout game. Theyre happy to
win a league title or reach a league final. Theyre happy with a nice write up in the paper and a few nice comments on the sunday game. They love travelling to games across the country and sharing their colours. Ruthlessness and the doggedness required to be winners at the very top level simply isnt in their DNA. Theyre too nice to put it very mildly and theyre satisfied deep down with the familiarity of the last 30 years.
2/ The next year phenomenon. Next year is another year. We will bounce back. Sure we'll go out and give it a shot. Sure we'll see what happens. Sure today just wasnt our best day. Sure we missed a few chances. The opposition just took their chances. The opposition was better on the day. etc etc ad nauseum to infinity. A huge lack of true self belief and an ability unrivalled in sport to rack up losses and move on as if nothing happened. Mayo always seem to
find some very eccentric pride and defiace and even obstinance in defeat. Theres always next year and every loss just adds to the mounatin of repressed emotions. Mayo for Sam 2022. The broken record keeps on spinning. A sport psychologist's nightmare.
3/ squads full to the brim with good players but who are overyhyped massively and generally reflect the attitude of their fanbase. The nicest people youll ever meet and a good team for any neutral to support, but theyre satisfied with having their photos in the paper or on facebook, and winning a tokenistic title, but never the All-Ireland. Theyre happy being everyone's second favorite team in the country after their own team and theyre happy being local celebrities and the big man about town and filling out their jerseys. Theyre caught up in a system which chews them up and spits them out as the poster boys of the heroic defeat or the pinup boys of the mighty underdog. The irony is that this is misunderstood every time they become competetive as genuine hype. The media will champion them until the very day they go out and win Sam Maguire, then all media interest will vanish into thin air and Mayo will suddenly become villains like many other counties, simply because they go out and win. Mayo's relationship with fame and celebrity and their neverending attitude of eternal nicety is why they are what they are. Their relationship with the Irish media and society is a factor of why they consistently fail." Why have Mayo got to 11 finals and won none?, It's complicated.
Sometimes like yesterday they obviously just didn't perform on the biggest day.
But this was wasn't the case I think in the majority of the 11 finals.
Remember in most of their these 11 finals they played hey were underdogs and some years over achieved getting to the finals. Yesterday was the first time in all of their 11 years of being finalists that they were actually favourites.
I also think they have never really got lucky in the big moments in any of these 11 all Ireland finals, for example to kick off their greatest era Dublin got a free in the last play of the game for nothing in 2011 to win an all Ireland, before this they tended to lose big games. This took a monkey off Dublin teams of that era's back, I can not remember Mayo getting a big break like this in a big moment in any of their 11 finals, it is amazing when you consider they have been in 11 finals.
Also, in the last decade when Mayo have had their best teams of the period of the 11 finals they tended to come up against Dublin in their pomp, an amazing force, this would have been very hard for any team to cope with.
bdbuddah (Meath) - Posts: 1337 - 13/09/2021 00:37:25
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Replying To Cockney_Cat: ""Obviously Mayo have GREAT footballers or they couldn't get to the All Ireland on such a consistent basis but for one reason or another they come up short."
Just like the Galway hurlers?" Not your greatest response. A real stretch at best.
Trump2020 (Galway) - Posts: 2113 - 13/09/2021 00:53:51
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They will win All Irelands, they produce too many good footballers not to. I hope their luck changes because it hasn't looked down too kindly on them in recent times. Great GAA county, great fans. Keep the faith.
Ulsterman (Antrim) - Posts: 9696 - 13/09/2021 03:50:05
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Some of the mayo scores that beat Dublin were wonder points. They look great but often have a low success rate. Mayo tried these against Tyrone in the 2nd half and they didn't come off. You can't be relying on wonder points to being you back into the game. They lacked either a strategy or calmness to work the ball into a better scoring position.
Also it's ridiculous to think the AOS has never scored in one of the 7 finals. Yes he may not be a scoring forward but in over 490 mins of football excluding injury time you think he would have at least 1 point to his name.
TYE08 (Tyrone) - Posts: 93 - 13/09/2021 08:25:35
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Replying To ConnollyDub: "I never understand the mayo fans constantly praising the mayo team for being "gallant losers". "Ah sure it just wasn't our day" bla blah blah... until you lose this attitude you will win nothing. There comes a point where you just have to say ah here lads enough is enough. You should be outraged. Outraged at the team for not giving it their best shot AGAIN. Outraged at management for making poor decisions AGAIN. Outraged that Tyrone looked like the team that wanted it more. Just like the games with Dublin in 16 & 17, when the game was in the melting pot, Dublin refused to be beaten and just wanted it more. How the hell could any team want it more than mayo after all they've been through. I'm sorry lads but the time for taps on the back is over..... it's not good enough. The mayo team has consistently let you lot as fans down. It's time to be outraged. Less praise more outrage. The mayo team has become too comfortable with losing, and the fans congratulating them on losing doesn't help. 11 finals 0 wins in 30 years. There is not another sport in the world you will see a record even remotely close to that." What is fan outrage going to do? Mayo teams thrive off their support.
Gator (Monaghan) - Posts: 238 - 13/09/2021 09:05:58
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Replying To waynoI: "Sick of hearing ..... "next year"
THIS was their year. They dumped us out and Kerry werent in the final either. The two teams who were hotly favoured at the start of the year, gone. The 6 in a row champs outplayed and out fought for large periods and a Kerry team who were to take the mantle. Alas they ended up playing a Tyrone team who themselves hadnt played in a final in years. Mayo had far more experience of all Ireland finals in their ranks than Tyrone. Literally everything in their favour
And yet still, in typical Mayo fashion, they contrived to lose.
I never really want Mayo to win it, but after they beat us I was absolutely comfortable with the fact they will win it, this was their time, even more so when kerry went out.
But you know what, I dont feel sorry for Mayo. They are massive architects of their own downfall. I think they enjoy being bridesmaids. They enjoy the romance of being nearly men and the love in that the country have for them as a result. They all enjoy losing. They live of coming back from amazing failure and morale victories. Look at us, were never down for long arent we a great bunch that we always come back and get to the final.... but when it comes to it, they just dont have the cajones to get it over the line and it's time to admit that they never will. Their fans are brilliant, and they along with the players feel like they probably deserve an all Ireland. But they dont. You'll win one when you deserve to win one. Their mentality is weak. On the biggest of days, they fail again and again.
They'll always bounce back and when it comes to finals of all irelands, they'll always lose" What are you on about? Tyrone were in the final in 2018.
There is no way they enjoy this record or 'being the bridesmaids'.
That game was theirs to lose. They didn't take their chances on the field and didn't make the changes needed on the line. Tyrone did it right and deserved their win.
Mayo need to empty a few more old heads out, shed the baggage.
Gator (Monaghan) - Posts: 238 - 13/09/2021 09:12:06
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Replying To Cockney_Cat: " Replying To WanPintWin: "[quote=Cockney_Cat: ""Obviously Mayo have GREAT footballers or they couldn't get to the All Ireland on such a consistent basis but for one reason or another they come up short."
Just like the Galway hurlers?" Not just like the Galway hurlers, thankfully. It might have escaped you that we won the All-Ireland 4 years ago. We have a terrible record in finals, but at least I have very fresh memories of getting the job done. Your own county's current 'drought' is longer than ours."
In the last 30 years. Kilkenny have won 13 AI, and lost 7. Some 'drought'."]Since Mayo last won an All Ireland Football
Galway have won 5 All Ireland Football titles and 3 All Ireland Hurling titles.
If I was you, I wouldnt be looking back a historical stats.
The_DOC (Galway) - Posts: 705 - 13/09/2021 09:51:17
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In reality when Mayo have been in a position to win finals they have always lost them on the sideline or poor decision making by players at crucial times. Rob Hennelly being selected over David Clarke and dropping a complete howler in 2016. It was inexplicable enough to start Hennelly that day over Clarke and that is backed up by the mistake he made.
Roll on 2017 and Donnie Vaughan is shown a straight red for silly stuff. Again self inflicted blow which had a huge impact on the game.
AOS starting and remaining on the pitch for the entire game in 2021. Slow to make changes and then taking O'Hora off. Again Hennelly has to be questioned for the first goal at least. Caught in no mans land. For the second goal he then comes charging off his line and caught in no mans land again leaving a Tyrone forward inside him.
They are just the recent reasons why Mayo haven't won an All Ireland.
Nothing to do with curses. They literally haven't been good enough. Having the talent and composure to push over the line in the last quarter boils down to more than just being able to kick points etc. Mentality is as important.
daytona11 (Kildare) - Posts: 4012 - 13/09/2021 09:56:30
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I haven't been on here for ages as the quality of 'debate' had just started to depress me. I look in from time to time and it seems it's only getting worse.
Just wanted to drop a quick note to the Mayo posters before I shut my account.
Another tough day for ye but I still think your day will come. Some top class young footballers there.
And huge congrats to Tyrone. Great performance & win. Enjoy it as much as you can !
KildareKelly (Kildare) - Posts: 593 - 13/09/2021 10:00:10
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Maybe the curse is real, if it is real, it makes me wonder what if such a power could be used for positive purposes!!
Curses and mythology aside, I think Mayo's problem is that they haven't really stepped away or taken time away to recoup. They have kept coming back year after year for the last decade and as a result have failed to bring something new or bring the element of surprise, and I think this is as much about mental energy as physical energy.
Mayo are predictable, they might introduce new faces and tweak their system of play, but when they are constantly in All Ireland finals or semi finals year after year, everybody else has them well analyzed and can guess how they will play.
Commodore (Donegal) - Posts: 1106 - 13/09/2021 10:10:26
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Second place in a tournament is a massive achievement. In the Olympics a silver is priceless. Mindset issues here.
Galway Hurlers, Mayo footballers are top class, plenty of golds to come. Disagree with Colm O Rourke when he said that Mayo do not have top class forwards. He is wrong.
suckvalleypaddy (Galway) - Posts: 1667 - 13/09/2021 10:21:30
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Looking at Saturday, i think a big issue for this group is they dont learn from one final to the other, nobody bar maybe ourselves has more experience of finals then Mayo, Horan has had what three now himself. That experience counts for zero as they dont use it to their advantage.
The same depleting aspect work against them year in year out in every final, taking on impossible shots, poor shot selection, both resulting in to many wide's, not taking goals, fluffing key opportunities, you just cant do it in a final, you just cant.
Huge time for Mayo fans, i think everyone wanted to see them win one, but it was incredibly frustrating seeing them on Saturday, making the same mistakes again as in previous finals, there is zero carry over, on that basis i dont think this group will ever win one, based on the above.
TheUsername (Dublin) - Posts: 4445 - 13/09/2021 10:30:13
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Replying To Gator: "What is fan outrage going to do? Mayo teams thrive off their support." Absolutely. Fan outrage is something we are good at in Galway after we lose a big game and it does us damn all good. If anything it's more likely to lead to the opposite. If I was an intercounty player putting in huge hours in training and trying my best on the field but was on the receiving end of widespread and prolonged criticism / verbal abuse from fans I would be more inclined to say: " to hell with this, I don't need all this grief in my life" and walk away from the game entirely.
PoolSturgeon (Galway) - Posts: 1902 - 13/09/2021 10:32:53
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Replying To Gator: "What is fan outrage going to do? Mayo teams thrive off their support." I actually couldn't agree more with your assertion, as I used to do and still do to a point think that losing comes too easily to the likes of the Mayo footballers and the Galway hurlers. I used to despise this mentality that "sure there is always next year" or "we didn't play like we could" excuses after yet another All Ireland defeat, great teams win the big matches, and thrive on the opportunities been put before them. I remember Anthony Daly speaking a few years ago about a west of Ireland culture that just didn't have that winning mentality , and when you look at the All Ireland Final record of both Galway and Mayo, there is definitely something not right. Obviously this thread is about Mayo and their latest car crash in an All Ireland Final, but there is a definite weakness in West of Ireland teams, glad to be there, best supporters in the world, and when the inevitable defeat comes, the usual myriad of excuses will be dragged out, and we'll be back again next year. Next year rarely if ever happens unless you're Dublin or Kilkenny (or Limerick these days), but following on from this latest final collapse, it is actually impossible to see Mayo winning the All Ireland.
gilly1910 (Galway) - Posts: 170 - 13/09/2021 10:37:34
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Replying To Young_gael: "Im writing this post in the best of sport and in the spirit of fairplay, and to start I have to congratulate Tyrone on their 4th All-Ireland win. Well
done, and enjoy the celebrations! A great performance. The following pist is meant as a kick start to a topic I think ought to be discussed, and I mean it as a fan first and foremost, and someone with enormous respect for Mayo GAA.
Getting onto the topic of my post, Mayo.....
Its very hard to sum up what Mayo football is about. It has to be one of the most puritanical and fanatic football counties there is. From my experience only Kerry and Cavan supporters generally surpass them in terms of their general interest in the club game and their devotion to the cause of the intercounty teams; football is the opium of the masses in these places, and no other sport is on the same platform. However Mayo have lost 11/12 All-Irelands in thirty years. This is a statistic that is unrivalled in any sport on the planet in any circumstances and quite literally over a period of 6/7 different team rotations over a period of a third of a century, they have lost and lost and lost again when the cup was there to be lifted. Im going to try point out why that is:
1/ they love the journey more than the endgoal. Mayo are happy with token trinkets such as the connacht championship and the odd win over a Kerry or Dublin etc in a knockout game. Theyre happy to
win a league title or reach a league final. Theyre happy with a nice write up in the paper and a few nice comments on the sunday game. They love travelling to games across the country and sharing their colours. Ruthlessness and the doggedness required to be winners at the very top level simply isnt in their DNA. Theyre too nice to put it very mildly and theyre satisfied deep down with the familiarity of the last 30 years.
2/ The next year phenomenon. Next year is another year. We will bounce back. Sure we'll go out and give it a shot. Sure we'll see what happens. Sure today just wasnt our best day. Sure we missed a few chances. The opposition just took their chances. The opposition was better on the day. etc etc ad nauseum to infinity. A huge lack of true self belief and an ability unrivalled in sport to rack up losses and move on as if nothing happened. Mayo always seem to
find some very eccentric pride and defiace and even obstinance in defeat. Theres always next year and every loss just adds to the mounatin of repressed emotions. Mayo for Sam 2022. The broken record keeps on spinning. A sport psychologist's nightmare.
3/ squads full to the brim with good players but who are overyhyped massively and generally reflect the attitude of their fanbase. The nicest people youll ever meet and a good team for any neutral to support, but theyre satisfied with having their photos in the paper or on facebook, and winning a tokenistic title, but never the All-Ireland. Theyre happy being everyone's second favorite team in the country after their own team and theyre happy being local celebrities and the big man about town and filling out their jerseys. Theyre caught up in a system which chews them up and spits them out as the poster boys of the heroic defeat or the pinup boys of the mighty underdog. The irony is that this is misunderstood every time they become competetive as genuine hype. The media will champion them until the very day they go out and win Sam Maguire, then all media interest will vanish into thin air and Mayo will suddenly become villains like many other counties, simply because they go out and win. Mayo's relationship with fame and celebrity and their neverending attitude of eternal nicety is why they are what they are. Their relationship with the Irish media and society is a factor of why they consistently fail." From start to finish just absolutely ridiculous armchair psychology. What an inflated ego you have, that you are the guy who can put his finger on it and figure it all out. Literally cliche after cliche. And you say it all with "enormous respect for Mayo GAA". Absolutely pathetic stuff.
the_walls (Mayo) - Posts: 495 - 13/09/2021 10:55:08
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Replying To gilly1910: "I actually couldn't agree more with your assertion, as I used to do and still do to a point think that losing comes too easily to the likes of the Mayo footballers and the Galway hurlers. I used to despise this mentality that "sure there is always next year" or "we didn't play like we could" excuses after yet another All Ireland defeat, great teams win the big matches, and thrive on the opportunities been put before them. I remember Anthony Daly speaking a few years ago about a west of Ireland culture that just didn't have that winning mentality , and when you look at the All Ireland Final record of both Galway and Mayo, there is definitely something not right. Obviously this thread is about Mayo and their latest car crash in an All Ireland Final, but there is a definite weakness in West of Ireland teams, glad to be there, best supporters in the world, and when the inevitable defeat comes, the usual myriad of excuses will be dragged out, and we'll be back again next year. Next year rarely if ever happens unless you're Dublin or Kilkenny (or Limerick these days), but following on from this latest final collapse, it is actually impossible to see Mayo winning the All Ireland." It's not impossible mayo will win one when they are good enough, the recent crop of footballers have been brilliant and they rairly capitulated . Yes in the past that might have been the case but they have been the only team recently that have competed with Dublin they were just unlucky that they came up against the best team ever in Dublin and they were never far away. There is no disgrace in that!
ecad123 (Galway) - Posts: 272 - 13/09/2021 10:55:17
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Replying To Galway9801: "Absolutely, more i think of it, James Horan is too good a manager not to have taken him off imo, there must be some serious serious player power there, or something going on behind the scenes anyways." You are literally admitting that you are engaging in pure speculation and don't have a clue what you are talking about but it won't stop you presenting your nonsense as fact.
the_walls (Mayo) - Posts: 495 - 13/09/2021 10:59:46
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Replying To waynoI: "Sick of hearing ..... "next year"
THIS was their year. They dumped us out and Kerry werent in the final either. The two teams who were hotly favoured at the start of the year, gone. The 6 in a row champs outplayed and out fought for large periods and a Kerry team who were to take the mantle. Alas they ended up playing a Tyrone team who themselves hadnt played in a final in years. Mayo had far more experience of all Ireland finals in their ranks than Tyrone. Literally everything in their favour
And yet still, in typical Mayo fashion, they contrived to lose.
I never really want Mayo to win it, but after they beat us I was absolutely comfortable with the fact they will win it, this was their time, even more so when kerry went out.
But you know what, I dont feel sorry for Mayo. They are massive architects of their own downfall. I think they enjoy being bridesmaids. They enjoy the romance of being nearly men and the love in that the country have for them as a result. They all enjoy losing. They live of coming back from amazing failure and morale victories. Look at us, were never down for long arent we a great bunch that we always come back and get to the final.... but when it comes to it, they just dont have the cajones to get it over the line and it's time to admit that they never will. Their fans are brilliant, and they along with the players feel like they probably deserve an all Ireland. But they dont. You'll win one when you deserve to win one. Their mentality is weak. On the biggest of days, they fail again and again.
They'll always bounce back and when it comes to finals of all irelands, they'll always lose" More ridiculous armchair psychology. And seriously, who cares what you are sick of?
the_walls (Mayo) - Posts: 495 - 13/09/2021 11:03:07
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Having Aidan O'Shea as your captain, indeed having him on the team at all is a big factor for me in why they can't win it, no room for passengers in an All Ireland final.
Tirchonaill1 (Donegal) - Posts: 2739 - 13/09/2021 11:12:30
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