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Leinster Football Championship

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Replying To The_Biler:  "Bit pointless all this rubbish talk about the past?? Who cares or remembers how many Leinster finals you were in over the last 10 years when Dublin have been using the Leinster championship as a warm up for the All Ireland?? How many players from 2010 are in your current squad?? Its 2019, Meath are in a better place than they were a few seasons ago, but a long way off the teams of 20 years ago. As for great points to win All Irelands, Steve McDonnell 2002, won ball in front of Moynihan turned without looking at the posts and slotted over. Armagh win my 1."
Oh forgot about that. What a score! Unreal player.

lilylanger (Kildare) - Posts: 444 - 14/04/2019 10:22:02    2178734

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Replying To Furlong1949:  "I will just throw this out there. It will surely annoy the Dubs but sure there is no harm in that. Its more factual commentary really. It depends if u agree or disagree.

This is Dublins most sucess decade ever. This is Meaths worst decade since 1920s. This is kerrys worst decade along with 1990s since 1900s.

Dublin are strong when Meath and kerry are weak ??.

When kerry had great teams in 30s, 1950s, 1970s , 1980s and 00 Dublin were unsucessful.
Kerry won 4 All Irelands in early 1930s. Dublin won 0 All Irelands in 1930s. Kerry won 3 All Irelands in 1950s with their one the first greatest kerry team ever Dublin won All Ireland at end of 1958 , but struggled in most of 1950s.
Kerry were sucessful in late 70s and early 80s. Dublin's All Ireland sucess halted in this period.
Kerry won 5 All Irelands in 00s Dublin won 0 All-Irelands in 00s .
When Meath had great teams in late 40s early 50s mid late 60s late 80s and 90s Dublin were by largely unsucessful.

Between 1947 to 1954 Meath win 2 All Irelands 5 Leinster titles 2 national league title. Dublin win 0 titles.
Meath win 1 All Ireland 4 leinster titles from 1964 to 1971. Dublin win no titles .
Meath win 4 All Irelands 8 leinsters and 3 national league titles Between 1986 to 2001. Dublin win 1 All Ireland in this period.

When Meath and kerry have great teams Dublin struggle. Dublin can never deal.with great Meath and kerry teams. This current decade Meath and kerry have had poor era. Meaths worst since 1920s while Kerry All Ireland win in 2014 is bottom of the table in the last 50 years of kerry 16 All Irelands. There is no way u could place the kerry team of 2014 above kerry teams of 70s 80s and teams of 00s and two in a row kerry team of 1969 1970. If u made a list of All Irelands kerry teams which won All Irelands since 1969 to 2019, 2014 wud come 16th on the list of 16. This is been a very poor decade in kerry terms.

Kerry won 3 All Irelands in 1900s
Kerry won 2 All Irelands in 1910s
kerry won 3 All Irelands in 1920s
Kerry won 5 All Irelands in 1930s
Kerry won 3 All Irelands in 1940s
Kerry won 3 All Irelands in 1950s
Kerry won 3 All Irelands in 1960s
kerry won 4 All Irelands in 1970s
kerry won 5 All Irelands in 1980s
kerry won 1 All Ireland in 1990s
kerry won 5 All Irelands in 2000s
kerry won 1 All Ireland in 2010s

As u can see 1990s and this decade is kerry worst era decade since 1900s. Kerry havent produced a great player in this decade up to Clifford. No kerry player debuted in this era would be an all.time great. Kerry debuted Sean Murphy in 1950s. Kerry debuted Mick O Connell in 1960s. kerry debuted Pat Spillane Paudi O Se in 1970s. kerry debuted Maurice Fitzgerald in 1980s . Kerry debuted D O Se T O Se and S Moyihan in 1990s and kerry debuted M O Se and Cooper in 2000s.. And each of those decades u had other great like Mickey Sheedy Bomber Listen Declan Sullivan Donaghy all debuted in each decade. The poorest decade in pretty much kerry history, no great kerry players debut since 2010 up to Clifford ( and we still neee to see if he can be great ). Kerrys worst All Ireland winning team in 50 years . Kerry are weak Dublin prosper. Dublin cannot handle a great kerry team. And on the horizon there looks like another great kerry team.

Dublin won 0 All Irelands in 1930s. Meath won 0 All Irelands in 1930s.
Dublin won 1 All Ireland in 1940s. Meath won 1 All Ireland in 1940s.
Dublin won 1 All Ireland in 1950s. Meath won 1 All Ireland in 1950s.
Dublin won 1 All Ireland in 1960s. Meath won 1 All in 1960s.
Dublin won 3 All Irelands in 1970s. Meath won 0 All Irelands in 1970s.
Dublin won 1 All Ireland in 1980s..Meath won 2 All Irelands in 1980s.
Dublin won 1 All Ireland in 1990s. Meath won 2 All Irelands in 1990s.
Dublin won 0 All Ireland in 00s. Meath won 0.All in 00s.

So Meath went toe to toe with Dublin for nearly 90 years. But Meath stops going toe to toe with Dublin in this decade look what happens
Dublin wins 6 All Irelands in 2010s. Meath win 0 All Irelands in 2010.

Meath stop putting it up to Dublin and there is no great kerry or Meath team Dublin prosper. Dublin cannot deal with a great Meath or kerry team.

To explain this furher look at the greatest gaa figure in kerry football history Mick Dwyer and greatest gaa figure in Meath football history Sean Boylan record v the Dubs.

In 00s somerhing happens that changes the face of Dublin football for good. No not Cuxtons debut no not Brogans debut no not appointment of Caffrey or Gilroy as Dublin manager. The game changer for Dublin is Boylan and Dwyer retire from leinster championship after 30 years of being Dublins main nemisises.

In the last 45 over 90% of defeats of Dublin in leinster championship are by Dwyer and Boylan teams. In last 45 years since Heffernans Dublin appeared in 1974 and created modern Dublin over 30 % of all defeats Dublin have suffered in All Ireland championship were by Boylan and Dwyer teams.

The managers who defeated Dublin in leinster championship in last 45 years ( There was no managers before 45 years ago so this is a list of all the managers who have ever beaten Dublin in leinster championship )

1 Victory over Dubs for Eamon O Brien Meath manager 2010
1 Victory over Dubs for Paudi O Se Westmeath manager 2003
1 Victory over Dubs for whoever was laois Manager 1981
2 Victories over Dubs for Eugene McGee Offaly Manager 1980 1981
3 Victories and 1 draw over Dubs for Mick Dwyer kildare manager 1998 and 2000 laois 2003. Draw 1998.
8 Victories and 4 draws over Dubs for Sean Boylan Meath manager 1986 1987 1988 1990 1991 1996 1999 2001. Draw 1983 3 draws in 1991.

While if u add Mick Dwyers 5 victories over Dublin in the championship, between them Sean Boylan and Mick Dwyer defeated Dublin 16 times and 5 draws in All Ireland championship in 30 years. Before Dwyer took over kerry Dublin were All Ireland champions., looked like they were going to dominate football for a decade. And when Boylan took over Meath Dublin were just as dominate in leinster as they are now and just as dominate in the whole country as they r now. The only difference they can beat kerry now they couldnt in late 70s and 80s.

So thats the record of how a Mesthman and kerryman teams stopped Dublin dominating football. But Meath and kerry teams were beating Dublin and keeping the Dubs long at bay before Dywer and Boylan. Between 1943 and 2010 Dublin defeated kerry twice in championship in 1976 1977. They defeated kerry in 1942 but that doesn't count as it was country lads playing for Dublin up to mid 40s. kerry played Dublin in All Ireland in 1942 and best kerry footballer on the field was playing for Dublin. And best footballer on the field was longford man playing for Dublin. When Dublin men started playing for Dublin kerry only lost twice in 70 years in the championship v Dublin.

Between 1958 and 1997 every Leinster title was was won by Meath Dublin and Offaly. If it wasnt for Meath and lesser extent Offaly. Dublin would have won nearly 40 leinster titles in a row in 1950s 60s 70s 80s and 90s.

So as I said at the start. When Meath and kerry are weak Dublin prosper. Dublin cannot deal.with great Meath and kerry teams. Dublin have had their greatest decade ever greatest team ever when there is no great kerry or Meath manager and Meath and kerry are having their worst decade in over 100 years pretty much. Is it coincidence or not.The facts tell one story Im sure the Dubs will tell.another story. Me Im saying nothing. I will leave it to u to form ur own opinion."
Meath in the same bracket as Kerry....do me a favour!!

lilylanger (Kildare) - Posts: 444 - 14/04/2019 10:23:02    2178736

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Replying To Furlong1949:  "Just a postscript to my last message

These are top 5 most sucessful managers over Dublin .The football managers who have defeated Dublin most in the All Ireland championship ever

1 Sean Boylan Meath manager 8 victories and 4 draws over Dublin in championship
2 Mick Dwyer kerry / Kildare / laois manager 8 victories and 1 draw over Dublin in championship
3 Mickey Harte Tyrone manager 2 victories and 1 draw over Dublin in championship
4 Joe Kiernan Armagh manager 2 Victories, Eugene McGee two victories over Dublin in championship"
Paidi O'Sé 2 wins and a draw .
Jack O'Connor 2 wins one by 17 points.

KingdomBoy1 (Kerry) - Posts: 10875 - 14/04/2019 10:39:03    2178738

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Furlong.

You really need to get out more honestly.

waynoI (Dublin) - Posts: 13534 - 14/04/2019 10:53:55    2178742

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Replying To royaldunne:  "You mean for second time in 140 years. Yeah right."
Thought this thread was about this years Leinster championship. Didn't realize it was a historical dissertation.

greysoil (Monaghan) - Posts: 762 - 14/04/2019 11:00:44    2178743

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Replying To Furlong1949:  "I will just throw this out there. It will surely annoy the Dubs but sure there is no harm in that. Its more factual commentary really. It depends if u agree or disagree.

This is Dublins most sucess decade ever. This is Meaths worst decade since 1920s. This is kerrys worst decade along with 1990s since 1900s.

Dublin are strong when Meath and kerry are weak ??.

When kerry had great teams in 30s, 1950s, 1970s , 1980s and 00 Dublin were unsucessful.
Kerry won 4 All Irelands in early 1930s. Dublin won 0 All Irelands in 1930s. Kerry won 3 All Irelands in 1950s with their one the first greatest kerry team ever Dublin won All Ireland at end of 1958 , but struggled in most of 1950s.
Kerry were sucessful in late 70s and early 80s. Dublin's All Ireland sucess halted in this period.
Kerry won 5 All Irelands in 00s Dublin won 0 All-Irelands in 00s .
When Meath had great teams in late 40s early 50s mid late 60s late 80s and 90s Dublin were by largely unsucessful.

Between 1947 to 1954 Meath win 2 All Irelands 5 Leinster titles 2 national league title. Dublin win 0 titles.
Meath win 1 All Ireland 4 leinster titles from 1964 to 1971. Dublin win no titles .
Meath win 4 All Irelands 8 leinsters and 3 national league titles Between 1986 to 2001. Dublin win 1 All Ireland in this period.

When Meath and kerry have great teams Dublin struggle. Dublin can never deal.with great Meath and kerry teams. This current decade Meath and kerry have had poor era. Meaths worst since 1920s while Kerry All Ireland win in 2014 is bottom of the table in the last 50 years of kerry 16 All Irelands. There is no way u could place the kerry team of 2014 above kerry teams of 70s 80s and teams of 00s and two in a row kerry team of 1969 1970. If u made a list of All Irelands kerry teams which won All Irelands since 1969 to 2019, 2014 wud come 16th on the list of 16. This is been a very poor decade in kerry terms.

Kerry won 3 All Irelands in 1900s
Kerry won 2 All Irelands in 1910s
kerry won 3 All Irelands in 1920s
Kerry won 5 All Irelands in 1930s
Kerry won 3 All Irelands in 1940s
Kerry won 3 All Irelands in 1950s
Kerry won 3 All Irelands in 1960s
kerry won 4 All Irelands in 1970s
kerry won 5 All Irelands in 1980s
kerry won 1 All Ireland in 1990s
kerry won 5 All Irelands in 2000s
kerry won 1 All Ireland in 2010s

As u can see 1990s and this decade is kerry worst era decade since 1900s. Kerry havent produced a great player in this decade up to Clifford. No kerry player debuted in this era would be an all.time great. Kerry debuted Sean Murphy in 1950s. Kerry debuted Mick O Connell in 1960s. kerry debuted Pat Spillane Paudi O Se in 1970s. kerry debuted Maurice Fitzgerald in 1980s . Kerry debuted D O Se T O Se and S Moyihan in 1990s and kerry debuted M O Se and Cooper in 2000s.. And each of those decades u had other great like Mickey Sheedy Bomber Listen Declan Sullivan Donaghy all debuted in each decade. The poorest decade in pretty much kerry history, no great kerry players debut since 2010 up to Clifford ( and we still neee to see if he can be great ). Kerrys worst All Ireland winning team in 50 years . Kerry are weak Dublin prosper. Dublin cannot handle a great kerry team. And on the horizon there looks like another great kerry team.

Dublin won 0 All Irelands in 1930s. Meath won 0 All Irelands in 1930s.
Dublin won 1 All Ireland in 1940s. Meath won 1 All Ireland in 1940s.
Dublin won 1 All Ireland in 1950s. Meath won 1 All Ireland in 1950s.
Dublin won 1 All Ireland in 1960s. Meath won 1 All in 1960s.
Dublin won 3 All Irelands in 1970s. Meath won 0 All Irelands in 1970s.
Dublin won 1 All Ireland in 1980s..Meath won 2 All Irelands in 1980s.
Dublin won 1 All Ireland in 1990s. Meath won 2 All Irelands in 1990s.
Dublin won 0 All Ireland in 00s. Meath won 0.All in 00s.

So Meath went toe to toe with Dublin for nearly 90 years. But Meath stops going toe to toe with Dublin in this decade look what happens
Dublin wins 6 All Irelands in 2010s. Meath win 0 All Irelands in 2010.

Meath stop putting it up to Dublin and there is no great kerry or Meath team Dublin prosper. Dublin cannot deal with a great Meath or kerry team.

To explain this furher look at the greatest gaa figure in kerry football history Mick Dwyer and greatest gaa figure in Meath football history Sean Boylan record v the Dubs.

In 00s somerhing happens that changes the face of Dublin football for good. No not Cuxtons debut no not Brogans debut no not appointment of Caffrey or Gilroy as Dublin manager. The game changer for Dublin is Boylan and Dwyer retire from leinster championship after 30 years of being Dublins main nemisises.

In the last 45 over 90% of defeats of Dublin in leinster championship are by Dwyer and Boylan teams. In last 45 years since Heffernans Dublin appeared in 1974 and created modern Dublin over 30 % of all defeats Dublin have suffered in All Ireland championship were by Boylan and Dwyer teams.

The managers who defeated Dublin in leinster championship in last 45 years ( There was no managers before 45 years ago so this is a list of all the managers who have ever beaten Dublin in leinster championship )

1 Victory over Dubs for Eamon O Brien Meath manager 2010
1 Victory over Dubs for Paudi O Se Westmeath manager 2003
1 Victory over Dubs for whoever was laois Manager 1981
2 Victories over Dubs for Eugene McGee Offaly Manager 1980 1981
3 Victories and 1 draw over Dubs for Mick Dwyer kildare manager 1998 and 2000 laois 2003. Draw 1998.
8 Victories and 4 draws over Dubs for Sean Boylan Meath manager 1986 1987 1988 1990 1991 1996 1999 2001. Draw 1983 3 draws in 1991.

While if u add Mick Dwyers 5 victories over Dublin in the championship, between them Sean Boylan and Mick Dwyer defeated Dublin 16 times and 5 draws in All Ireland championship in 30 years. Before Dwyer took over kerry Dublin were All Ireland champions., looked like they were going to dominate football for a decade. And when Boylan took over Meath Dublin were just as dominate in leinster as they are now and just as dominate in the whole country as they r now. The only difference they can beat kerry now they couldnt in late 70s and 80s.

So thats the record of how a Mesthman and kerryman teams stopped Dublin dominating football. But Meath and kerry teams were beating Dublin and keeping the Dubs long at bay before Dywer and Boylan. Between 1943 and 2010 Dublin defeated kerry twice in championship in 1976 1977. They defeated kerry in 1942 but that doesn't count as it was country lads playing for Dublin up to mid 40s. kerry played Dublin in All Ireland in 1942 and best kerry footballer on the field was playing for Dublin. And best footballer on the field was longford man playing for Dublin. When Dublin men started playing for Dublin kerry only lost twice in 70 years in the championship v Dublin.

Between 1958 and 1997 every Leinster title was was won by Meath Dublin and Offaly. If it wasnt for Meath and lesser extent Offaly. Dublin would have won nearly 40 leinster titles in a row in 1950s 60s 70s 80s and 90s.

So as I said at the start. When Meath and kerry are weak Dublin prosper. Dublin cannot deal.with great Meath and kerry teams. Dublin have had their greatest decade ever greatest team ever when there is no great kerry or Meath manager and Meath and kerry are having their worst decade in over 100 years pretty much. Is it coincidence or not.The facts tell one story Im sure the Dubs will tell.another story. Me Im saying nothing. I will leave it to u to form ur own opinion."
Im not sure that post is that annoying for Dubs to be honest to be honest Furlong.

Essentially what you are saying is that when Meath and Kerry have better teams then Dublin, they can beat Dublin,. When Dublin have a better team then Meath and Kerry, Dublin can beat Meath and Kerry, that is hardly a shocker in competitive sport.

I think you often talk about football as a static entity its not in my personal opinion. My own personal opinion is that Dublin have historically under achieved ive written a lot about it here over the years. Dublin football in 2019 in the county is a completely different animal to what was it was a decade ago. Essentially in my opinion Dublin always has the capacity to be the top football county and never realized that potential until very recently, a lot of work was done in 00's to unlock that potential and make up of the county wide representation in a modern context is evidence of that. Still we have a way to go and regression will be a feature very shortly in my opinion. But i would be surprised if Dublin went 16 or 13 years again with an all Ireland, seeing the work that goes on up here. You speak in a crystallized manner aboyut football, but football is a dynamic process of development that is subject to change and influence.

I think you perhaps, overstate the Meath impact on Dublin personally, they have certainly been a thorn in the side at times, in the 70s i think some of the hardest games played in the Hefo era were against Meath in Leinster, i think that often goes unsaid or unacknowledged. Meath were very unlucky in the 70's not to come up against a top Dublin team.

They are great interesting statistics, but like i say Dublin have no right, to expect to beat every team every time and if Kerry and Meath have better teams at any one time its hardly earth shattering and vice versa with Dublin.

A couple of things though, i think you slightly over play Meath role in the big scheme of things, i know you have a defense mechanism built in that world is out down play Meath achievements, but the reality is in if Dublin win the All Ireland this year, Dublin will have won as many All Ireland 8 years as Meath in their entire history.

Secondly you mention that Dublin weren't successful in the 70's, i will let that speak for its self.


Thirdly you discount some Dublin All Ireland because they played lads who originally from other counties, does the same rule apply to Meath and Leitrims finest and Colm O Rourkes of this world.

I know you are trying to portray Meath in the same narrative as Dublin and Kerry, its great their seems to be grass shoots in Meath football, but its simply not correct to have Meath in the same narrative as Dublin or ofr that matter Kerry, they just cant compete with that level of success etith er in the past, present and you suspect the future given the former. I mean its just not logical to have Meath in a conversation with Dublin or Kerry when Dubllin are just shy of 30 All Ireland's and Kerry well over the 30 mark. Both counties can turn around and win in one decade what Meath have in their history.

Confidence is a fine thing, hubris is something different and im not sure Meath have ever had the end product, to be trying to be selling what you are.

TheUsername (Dublin) - Posts: 3350 - 14/04/2019 11:21:13    2178747

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Replying To greysoil:  "Thought this thread was about this years Leinster championship. Didn't realize it was a historical dissertation."
Ha ha.

I like you greysoil

You speak sense

waynoI (Dublin) - Posts: 13534 - 14/04/2019 12:41:35    2178755

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When you haven't a whole pile to be selling in the present you sell the past.

catch22 (USA) - Posts: 1361 - 14/04/2019 13:08:29    2178756

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My psychiatrist wants to know who furlong is

realdub (Dublin) - Posts: 7701 - 14/04/2019 13:10:34    2178757

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Replying To royaldunne:  "You mean for second time in 140 years. Yeah right."
It was a nice wee victory in 2015 all the same. One of the best second half resurgences ever.

greysoil (Monaghan) - Posts: 762 - 14/04/2019 13:29:51    2178765

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Replying To greysoil:  "It was a nice wee victory in 2015 all the same. One of the best second half resurgences ever."
Only for a black card that wasn't and ineptitude on sideline afterward it would never have happened.

royaldunne (Meath) - Posts: 16566 - 14/04/2019 16:14:38    2178783

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Replying To TheUsername:  "Im not sure that post is that annoying for Dubs to be honest to be honest Furlong.

Essentially what you are saying is that when Meath and Kerry have better teams then Dublin, they can beat Dublin,. When Dublin have a better team then Meath and Kerry, Dublin can beat Meath and Kerry, that is hardly a shocker in competitive sport.

I think you often talk about football as a static entity its not in my personal opinion. My own personal opinion is that Dublin have historically under achieved ive written a lot about it here over the years. Dublin football in 2019 in the county is a completely different animal to what was it was a decade ago. Essentially in my opinion Dublin always has the capacity to be the top football county and never realized that potential until very recently, a lot of work was done in 00's to unlock that potential and make up of the county wide representation in a modern context is evidence of that. Still we have a way to go and regression will be a feature very shortly in my opinion. But i would be surprised if Dublin went 16 or 13 years again with an all Ireland, seeing the work that goes on up here. You speak in a crystallized manner aboyut football, but football is a dynamic process of development that is subject to change and influence.

I think you perhaps, overstate the Meath impact on Dublin personally, they have certainly been a thorn in the side at times, in the 70s i think some of the hardest games played in the Hefo era were against Meath in Leinster, i think that often goes unsaid or unacknowledged. Meath were very unlucky in the 70's not to come up against a top Dublin team.

They are great interesting statistics, but like i say Dublin have no right, to expect to beat every team every time and if Kerry and Meath have better teams at any one time its hardly earth shattering and vice versa with Dublin.

A couple of things though, i think you slightly over play Meath role in the big scheme of things, i know you have a defense mechanism built in that world is out down play Meath achievements, but the reality is in if Dublin win the All Ireland this year, Dublin will have won as many All Ireland 8 years as Meath in their entire history.

Secondly you mention that Dublin weren't successful in the 70's, i will let that speak for its self.


Thirdly you discount some Dublin All Ireland because they played lads who originally from other counties, does the same rule apply to Meath and Leitrims finest and Colm O Rourkes of this world.

I know you are trying to portray Meath in the same narrative as Dublin and Kerry, its great their seems to be grass shoots in Meath football, but its simply not correct to have Meath in the same narrative as Dublin or ofr that matter Kerry, they just cant compete with that level of success etith er in the past, present and you suspect the future given the former. I mean its just not logical to have Meath in a conversation with Dublin or Kerry when Dubllin are just shy of 30 All Ireland's and Kerry well over the 30 mark. Both counties can turn around and win in one decade what Meath have in their history.

Confidence is a fine thing, hubris is something different and im not sure Meath have ever had the end product, to be trying to be selling what you are."
I have much longer response following Username but I want to draw attention to two facts.

U said Dublin have won nearly more All Irelands in this decade then Meath in our history. But Dublin sucess in this decade makes every county outside kerrry, make every counties past sucess look average , it even makes Dublins own past sucess look very poor.

Between 1930 and 2010 Dublin won 9 All Ireland senior football.titles
Between 2011 and 2019 Dublin could win 7 All Ireland football titles ( if they do 5 in a row this year)

So even Dublin's past sucess looks poor compared to the unprecedented sucess in the current era. Dublin basically have won nearly more All Irelands in this decade then they won in the previous 80 years.

Secondly yes Meath have had a bit of help from outside county with O Rourke from Leitrim. But there is difference in having 1 or 2 players from outside county to having 12 13 or 14 players outside like Dublin did have between 1890s to 1940.

Every hurling and football All Ireland Dublin won was made up of nearly over 90% of players from outside the county prior to 1950s. Dublin have 15 All Irelands with Dublin teams and Dublin players.The rest of the 12 football were made up of country lads. Dublin first All Irelands were won by Longford kerry Mayo players. Very very few Dublin men born and bred in Dublin played on Dublin All Ireland wins between 1890 to early 1940s.

Dublin gaa begind in 1950s. Dublin have won 7 hurling All Irelands. Only 2 men born and bred in Dublin , basically only two Dublin men have won hurling All Ireland medals. In Dublins first 12 All Irelands very very few Dublin men won All Ireland medals. It was basically a 15 All star 32 county team representing Dublin. It was like an all.star team representing Dublin made up of players predominantly from outside the county.

Famously in early 1940s Dublin played kerry in a final with a team of country lads where the best kerry footballer was playing with Dublin and best footballer on the field was a longford playing for Dublin. Theres a massive difference between having 1 or 2 players outside ur county on ur team to having nearly 15 men from outside ur county making up ur team.

Modern Dublin gaa with all .Dublin team, begins in 1950s. U cannot change the past. U might not like it. But that's what happened. Dublin have really won 15 All-Irelands with Dublin teams being made up of majority Dublin players, which makes Kerrys 37 All Irelands all the more incredible , doesnt it.

Furlong1949 (Meath) - Posts: 968 - 14/04/2019 16:40:32    2178786

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Replying To OLLIE:  "As usual I am looking forward to this years Championship. From my own beloved Wee County wee had a good league campaign. Wee were favorites to be relegated and wee just missed out on promotion on the very last day. Louth have Wexford up first in the Leinster Championship down in Wexford Park. The Slaneysiders are a bogey side for Louth. The Wee County have not beaten Wexford in the Championship since 1980 and have lost four of the last five Championship meetings to the south-east men. The winners play the Dubs in the quarter-finals. Here I think is how this years Championship will go:

Preliminary Round:
Louth v Wexford...........Louth
Kildare v Wicklow..........Kildare
Meath v Offaly...............Meath

Quarter-Finals:
Dubs v Louth..................Dubs
Kildare v Longford.........Kildare
Meath v Carlow..............Meath
Westmeath v Laois........Westmeath

Semi-Finals:
Dubs v Kildare.................Dubs
Meath v Westmeath.......Meath

Final:
Dubs v Meath..................Dubs"
Louth will do very well to get out of Wexford Park with a win. Wexford not up to much alright but there more than capable of putting in a performance to beat Louth.

logger (Wexford) - Posts: 253 - 14/04/2019 17:06:36    2178787

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Replying To TheUsername:  "Im not sure that post is that annoying for Dubs to be honest to be honest Furlong.

Essentially what you are saying is that when Meath and Kerry have better teams then Dublin, they can beat Dublin,. When Dublin have a better team then Meath and Kerry, Dublin can beat Meath and Kerry, that is hardly a shocker in competitive sport.

I think you often talk about football as a static entity its not in my personal opinion. My own personal opinion is that Dublin have historically under achieved ive written a lot about it here over the years. Dublin football in 2019 in the county is a completely different animal to what was it was a decade ago. Essentially in my opinion Dublin always has the capacity to be the top football county and never realized that potential until very recently, a lot of work was done in 00's to unlock that potential and make up of the county wide representation in a modern context is evidence of that. Still we have a way to go and regression will be a feature very shortly in my opinion. But i would be surprised if Dublin went 16 or 13 years again with an all Ireland, seeing the work that goes on up here. You speak in a crystallized manner aboyut football, but football is a dynamic process of development that is subject to change and influence.

I think you perhaps, overstate the Meath impact on Dublin personally, they have certainly been a thorn in the side at times, in the 70s i think some of the hardest games played in the Hefo era were against Meath in Leinster, i think that often goes unsaid or unacknowledged. Meath were very unlucky in the 70's not to come up against a top Dublin team.

They are great interesting statistics, but like i say Dublin have no right, to expect to beat every team every time and if Kerry and Meath have better teams at any one time its hardly earth shattering and vice versa with Dublin.

A couple of things though, i think you slightly over play Meath role in the big scheme of things, i know you have a defense mechanism built in that world is out down play Meath achievements, but the reality is in if Dublin win the All Ireland this year, Dublin will have won as many All Ireland 8 years as Meath in their entire history.

Secondly you mention that Dublin weren't successful in the 70's, i will let that speak for its self.


Thirdly you discount some Dublin All Ireland because they played lads who originally from other counties, does the same rule apply to Meath and Leitrims finest and Colm O Rourkes of this world.

I know you are trying to portray Meath in the same narrative as Dublin and Kerry, its great their seems to be grass shoots in Meath football, but its simply not correct to have Meath in the same narrative as Dublin or ofr that matter Kerry, they just cant compete with that level of success etith er in the past, present and you suspect the future given the former. I mean its just not logical to have Meath in a conversation with Dublin or Kerry when Dubllin are just shy of 30 All Ireland's and Kerry well over the 30 mark. Both counties can turn around and win in one decade what Meath have in their history.

Confidence is a fine thing, hubris is something different and im not sure Meath have ever had the end product, to be trying to be selling what you are."
Thanks Username for responding in a very articulate manner. As always I enjoyed reading your commentary. I dont agree with everything u said but thats what is called healthy proper debate. U play the ball never the man. U never engage in insults and nasty comments which I am afraid is a common response from certain people in hogan stand. I can be very Meath biased. But I dont believe in insulting anybody or anybodys county.

1 A couple of points. I am not comparing Meath to kerrry. Ok. Kerry are a genius of a county. Our greatest football.county the brazil of gaelic football.if that doesnt sound to glib. There is no comparsion between Meath and kerry. Kerry are on a different level to Meath.

But we do have three things in common. Meath and kerry have produced more great defenders then any other county. Secondly both counties have overachieved. Kerry on an extraordinary grand scale level. Meath on a much smaller level. Meath have overachieved when u compare to the rest of teams in leinster ( leaving Dublin ) and if u compare it to every county in the country ( outside kerry and Dublin ) , Meath have definitely been one of the high achievers in football. Third thing we have in common with kerry. Both Meath and kerry have the best record in the country over Dublin and have had periods of unprecedented sucess v Dublin. That is a fact. Dubs dont like that fact. But its a fact.

2 Meath have had a massive impact on Dublin and Dublin on Meath. The same way Galway have on Mayo and. vive versa, the same way Tipp have had on kilkenny and vice versa. Dublin and Meath have reacted to each other for generations. Dublin for first time ever start a policy of picking all.Dublin players in 50s . This is response to Meath and louth sucess. Heffernan loses to Meath 5 times in 6 years in championship . Picking best country lads for Dublin is now starting to fail. Meath and louth are dominate teams , winning every leinster title from 1947 to 1954. Heffernan whole career at the start is engaged with legendary battles with Paddy O Brien in Navan and Croke Park , but the game always ends in Meath victory and Dublin are failing badly to keep up with Meath and louth. So in early mid 50s modern Dublin is reborn. And in 1950s ith an All Dublin team backboned by St Vincents players and we have the first proper Dublin gaa team. If Dublin were winning leinster title after leinster title like they did in fron 1890s to 1940s do u think they wud have changed. Meath and louth dominate leinsster, Meath go on an unprecedented run of victories over Dublin . What is Dublins reaction , A Dublin team.with Dublin players. So Dublin as we know is born in response to Meath sucess. And so begins a rivalry where both counties respond to each other.

2 Dublin go up a level in late 50s and early 60s. Winning All Irelands for first time ever with Dublin players. Meath decline. But in response to Dublin sucess. A new generation of Meath footballers become obsessed about knocking Dublin from their perch. And slowly and surely they do that and in 1964 , Dublin the reigning All-Ireland champions are beating in leinster final which signals a period of Meath sucess. Again both counties responding to each other.

3 Heffernan builds the second version of Dublin Dublin of hill 16 fame in mid 70s. Again this is a response to a decade of Meath sucess followed by great Offaly team sucess. Meath go toe to toe with Dublin in 70s beating them in a league final div 1 and should have won v dubs in 76 and especially 77 final.

Dublin are invincible in leinster now. Dublin reach 10 All Ireland finals in 12 years. 10 Leinster titles in 12 years. 7 victories in ten years in championship v Meath. All those victories over Meath , lead to Meath slowly getting their act togther and Meaths response is unprecedented. In 9 championship games v Dublin in 5 years Meath lose once. Dublin in response to Meaths sucess go up a level in terms of fitness and preparation. And by mid 90s Dublin team are considered fitest Dublin team ever and have a few good years in mid 90s, culminating in All.Ireland win in 1995.

4 Dublin are all.Ireland champions and again Meath raise their game in response and topple Dublin and beat Dublin 4 times in 6 years in championship. We now have the most competitive most exciting era in leinster football. Meath are dominate over Dublin anc kildare Laois and Westmeath win leinster. And in response to this Bertie and Bailey get Dublins act together and the Blue wave iniatitive is begun. And Dublin start on an era of unprecedented sucess at all levels in leinster. In response to the late 90s and early 00s era in leinster football where Meath won 2 All Irelands and Meath kildare Offaly laois and Westmeath won leinster.

5 meath and kildare are now starting to have underage sucess. This is totally in response to Dublin sucess. And the cycle continues. So Meath football has had a much more bigger impact on Dublin then u think. Dublin football has had a massive impact on Meath football. Thats what is called a rivarlry.But counties have been driviing forces in both counties. Both counties sucess has had at different times forced both counties in different eras to reorganise and go up a level. Meath have been more then thorn in Dublin side. Meath football has been full frontal.attack on every part of the Dublin gaa nervous system for generations.

Regards Dublin having more All Irelands potentially in.this era then Meath in our history. That is unfair comparsion because u are metropolis u are the most powerful, most wealthiest county in country u sud be having such sucess. Meath is an average midlands county in Irish society in terms of stature.

But outside kerry and Dublin 1 All Ireland title is an incredibly hard thing to do. U have won 6 All-Irelands in this decade. Meaths 7 looks not great beside it. But neitheir does Mayos 3 All Irelands or Donegal 2 All Irelands or Armagh 1 All Ireland or Tyrones 3 All Irelands or Laois 0 All-Irelands or Monaghans 0 All Irelands. Dublin in this decade have won the same amount of All Irelands as Mayo Donegal Monaghan loais and Armagh put together in all their history. These are all great football counties. Many of ur greatest rivals in this era. They are all great strong proud football counties with outstanding traditions, but for a Mayo or a Donegal or a Tyrone or a Meath to win 1 All Ireland is extraordinary achievement. When Dublin gobble up All Irelands in current era in unprecedented manner it makes evey county (outside kerry) , it make evey single of the other 30 counties sucess look poor and average. But you compare Meaths sucess to all other counties outside kerry and Dublin , Meaths sucess means we are one of most sucessful counties in the country. Our sucess is as good as Gakway Down and Cork traditionally. And for 80 years we went toe toe Dublin.

This is very important very important stat Username. This is a very important one. Dublin win 7 title in 9 years this year that is nearly as much as Dublin won in the previous 80 years.

Between 1930 and 2010 Dublin won 9 All Irelands Between 2010 and 2019 Dublin win 7 All Irelands ( If they win this year).
So even this Dublin team make Dublins last 80 years look poor.
Again its worth saying
Between 1930 to 2010 Meath won 7 All Irelands
Between 1939 to 2010 Dublin won 9 All Irelands
Between 2011 to 2019 Dublin could win possible 7 All Irelands.

Even 80 years of Dublin look average compared to this decade of Dublin.

Regards yes O Rourke was from leitrim we had a few from outside the county but we didnt have nearly a full 15 from near outside the county. Dublin have really only won 15 All Irelands. The first 12 or so were won with country lads. From 1890s to early 1940s Dublin won piles of hurling and football All Irelands with more then 90% of the players from outside Dublin. Theres a big difference in having 1 players from outside county to having 12 or 13 players outside ur county.

Meath football begins properly in 1930s..Dublin football begins properly in 1950s. Every All Ireland Dublin won before 1950 in hurling or football was an All star coumtry tram where the whole team was basically made up from Longford Kerry Mayo footballers.

Dublin have won 7 Hurling All Irelands, only 2 men born and bred in Dublin have ever won hurling senior All Ireland medal.

The reason I put up managers who beat Dublin is to emphasis how hard it is and always is to beat Dublin. Especially in leinster. I think people underestimate how hard it always to beat Dublin. If u look.at the teams and players that have beaten Dublin in last 50 years , it usually takes the greatest teams and players and managers that county has ever produced to beat Dublin

Look at all manager whoever defeated Dublin in championship . To beat Dublin twive in the championship, the only managers that ever beaten just twice in the championship are all time great manager.The only managers that have beaten Dublin more then once, are the greatest managers of all time. Thats how bloody hard it always was and and is and always will be to beat Dublin. For any county to beat Dublin in championship in last 50 years u have to had to gave greatest players from that county ever u need a truly great manager, a truly great team and truly great players because the most difficult opponent in gaelic football has always been Dublin the most difficult team to beat in football in last 50 years is Dublin in front of hill 16.

Finally regards comment I need to get out more, that I need to physiatrist. I only come on the forum now and again. I am leaving for a while again. I only like to stay a while on the forum cause a few rows with the Dubs and move on. I rather be viewer of Hogan stand then a partipate. I have two very sick family members so to come on to Hogan Stand for hour to write about 1986 leinster final , kind of takes ones minds of things . So I enjoy always reading peoples messages because when Hogan stand is good it can be really good. And there at times , some class contributers on the forum. I like to come on and rabble on about Meath football now and again. And I know I go on many a nostalgic trip. Maybe it is because Meath last few years have been tough, I would rather talk about past.

Anyway even to the Dubs I dont mean any hard feelings. To give the Dubs credit there players were always tough , alway took and gave it but never complained. And there supporters in general r good supporters.
Anyway no hard feelings Dubs enjoy the rest of the reason because I think this year is going to be greatest gaa year of your lifes when u win 5 in a row.
Peace
Furlong

Furlong1949 (Meath) - Posts: 968 - 14/04/2019 17:26:54    2178791

Link

Replying To TheUsername:  "Im not sure that post is that annoying for Dubs to be honest to be honest Furlong.

Essentially what you are saying is that when Meath and Kerry have better teams then Dublin, they can beat Dublin,. When Dublin have a better team then Meath and Kerry, Dublin can beat Meath and Kerry, that is hardly a shocker in competitive sport.

I think you often talk about football as a static entity its not in my personal opinion. My own personal opinion is that Dublin have historically under achieved ive written a lot about it here over the years. Dublin football in 2019 in the county is a completely different animal to what was it was a decade ago. Essentially in my opinion Dublin always has the capacity to be the top football county and never realized that potential until very recently, a lot of work was done in 00's to unlock that potential and make up of the county wide representation in a modern context is evidence of that. Still we have a way to go and regression will be a feature very shortly in my opinion. But i would be surprised if Dublin went 16 or 13 years again with an all Ireland, seeing the work that goes on up here. You speak in a crystallized manner aboyut football, but football is a dynamic process of development that is subject to change and influence.

I think you perhaps, overstate the Meath impact on Dublin personally, they have certainly been a thorn in the side at times, in the 70s i think some of the hardest games played in the Hefo era were against Meath in Leinster, i think that often goes unsaid or unacknowledged. Meath were very unlucky in the 70's not to come up against a top Dublin team.

They are great interesting statistics, but like i say Dublin have no right, to expect to beat every team every time and if Kerry and Meath have better teams at any one time its hardly earth shattering and vice versa with Dublin.

A couple of things though, i think you slightly over play Meath role in the big scheme of things, i know you have a defense mechanism built in that world is out down play Meath achievements, but the reality is in if Dublin win the All Ireland this year, Dublin will have won as many All Ireland 8 years as Meath in their entire history.

Secondly you mention that Dublin weren't successful in the 70's, i will let that speak for its self.


Thirdly you discount some Dublin All Ireland because they played lads who originally from other counties, does the same rule apply to Meath and Leitrims finest and Colm O Rourkes of this world.

I know you are trying to portray Meath in the same narrative as Dublin and Kerry, its great their seems to be grass shoots in Meath football, but its simply not correct to have Meath in the same narrative as Dublin or ofr that matter Kerry, they just cant compete with that level of success etith er in the past, present and you suspect the future given the former. I mean its just not logical to have Meath in a conversation with Dublin or Kerry when Dubllin are just shy of 30 All Ireland's and Kerry well over the 30 mark. Both counties can turn around and win in one decade what Meath have in their history.

Confidence is a fine thing, hubris is something different and im not sure Meath have ever had the end product, to be trying to be selling what you are."
Thanks Username for responding in a very articulate manner. As always I enjoyed reading your commentary. I dont agree with everything u said but thats what is called healthy proper debate. U play the ball never the man. U never engage in insults and nasty comments which I am afraid is a common response from certain people in hogan stand. I can be very Meath biased. But I dont believe in insulting anybody or anybodys county.

1 A couple of points. I am not comparing Meath to kerrry. Ok. Kerry are a genius of a county. Our greatest football.county the brazil of gaelic football.if that doesnt sound to glib. There is no comparsion between Meath and kerry. Kerry are on a different level to Meath.

But we do have three things in common. Meath and kerry have produced more great defenders then any other county. Secondly both counties have overachieved. Kerry on an extraordinary grand scale level. Meath on a much smaller level. Meath have overachieved when u compare to the rest of teams in leinster ( leaving Dublin ) and if u compare it to every county in the country ( outside kerry and Dublin ) , Meath have definitely been one of the high achievers in football. Third thing we have in common with kerry. Both Meath and kerry have the best record in the country over Dublin and have had periods of unprecedented sucess v Dublin. That is a fact. Dubs dont like that fact. But its a fact.

2 Meath have had a massive impact on Dublin and Dublin on Meath. The same way Galway have on Mayo and. vive versa, the same way Tipp have had on kilkenny and vice versa. Dublin and Meath have reacted to each other for generations. Dublin for first time ever start a policy of picking all.Dublin players in 50s . This is response to Meath and louth sucess. Heffernan loses to Meath 5 times in 6 years in championship . Picking best country lads for Dublin is now starting to fail. Meath and louth are dominate teams , winning every leinster title from 1947 to 1954. Heffernan whole career at the start is engaged with legendary battles with Paddy O Brien in Navan and Croke Park , but the game always ends in Meath victory and Dublin are failing badly to keep up with Meath and louth. So in early mid 50s modern Dublin is reborn. And in 1950s ith an All Dublin team backboned by St Vincents players and we have the first proper Dublin gaa team. If Dublin were winning leinster title after leinster title like they did in fron 1890s to 1940s do u think they wud have changed. Meath and louth dominate leinsster, Meath go on an unprecedented run of victories over Dublin . What is Dublins reaction , A Dublin team.with Dublin players. So Dublin as we know is born in response to Meath sucess. And so begins a rivalry where both counties respond to each other.

2 Dublin go up a level in late 50s and early 60s. Winning All Irelands for first time ever with Dublin players. Meath decline. But in response to Dublin sucess. A new generation of Meath footballers become obsessed about knocking Dublin from their perch. And slowly and surely they do that and in 1964 , Dublin the reigning All-Ireland champions are beating in leinster final which signals a period of Meath sucess. Again both counties responding to each other.

3 Heffernan builds the second version of Dublin Dublin of hill 16 fame in mid 70s. Again this is a response to a decade of Meath sucess followed by great Offaly team sucess. Meath go toe to toe with Dublin in 70s beating them in a league final div 1 and should have won v dubs in 76 and especially 77 final.

Dublin are invincible in leinster now. Dublin reach 10 All Ireland finals in 12 years. 10 Leinster titles in 12 years. 7 victories in ten years in championship v Meath. All those victories over Meath , lead to Meath slowly getting their act togther and Meaths response is unprecedented. In 9 championship games v Dublin in 5 years Meath lose once. Dublin in response to Meaths sucess go up a level in terms of fitness and preparation. And by mid 90s Dublin team are considered fitest Dublin team ever and have a few good years in mid 90s, culminating in All.Ireland win in 1995.

4 Dublin are all.Ireland champions and again Meath raise their game in response and topple Dublin and beat Dublin 4 times in 6 years in championship. We now have the most competitive most exciting era in leinster football. Meath are dominate over Dublin anc kildare Laois and Westmeath win leinster. And in response to this Bertie and Bailey get Dublins act together and the Blue wave iniatitive is begun. And Dublin start on an era of unprecedented sucess at all levels in leinster. In response to the late 90s and early 00s era in leinster football where Meath won 2 All Irelands and Meath kildare Offaly laois and Westmeath won leinster.

5 meath and kildare are now starting to have underage sucess. This is totally in response to Dublin sucess. And the cycle continues. So Meath football has had a much more bigger impact on Dublin then u think. Dublin football has had a massive impact on Meath football. Thats what is called a rivarlry.But counties have been driviing forces in both counties. Both counties sucess has had at different times forced both counties in different eras to reorganise and go up a level. Meath have been more then thorn in Dublin side. Meath football has been full frontal.attack on every part of the Dublin gaa nervous system for generations.

Regards Dublin having more All Irelands potentially in.this era then Meath in our history. That is unfair comparsion because u are metropolis u are the most powerful, most wealthiest county in country u sud be having such sucess. Meath is an average midlands county in Irish society in terms of stature.

But outside kerry and Dublin 1 All Ireland title is an incredibly hard thing to do. U have won 6 All-Irelands in this decade. Meaths 7 looks not great beside it. But neitheir does Mayos 3 All Irelands or Donegal 2 All Irelands or Armagh 1 All Ireland or Tyrones 3 All Irelands or Laois 0 All-Irelands or Monaghans 0 All Irelands. Dublin in this decade have won the same amount of All Irelands as Mayo Donegal Monaghan loais and Armagh put together in all their history. These are all great football counties. Many of ur greatest rivals in this era. They are all great strong proud football counties with outstanding traditions, but for a Mayo or a Donegal or a Tyrone or a Meath to win 1 All Ireland is extraordinary achievement. When Dublin gobble up All Irelands in current era in unprecedented manner it makes evey county (outside kerry) , it make evey single of the other 30 counties sucess look poor and average. But you compare Meaths sucess to all other counties outside kerry and Dublin , Meaths sucess means we are one of most sucessful counties in the country. Our sucess is as good as Gakway Down and Cork traditionally. And for 80 years we went toe toe Dublin.

This is very important very important stat Username. This is a very important one. Dublin win 7 title in 9 years this year that is nearly as much as Dublin won in the previous 80 years.

Between 1930 and 2010 Dublin won 9 All Irelands Between 2010 and 2019 Dublin win 7 All Irelands ( If they win this year).
So even this Dublin team make Dublins last 80 years look poor.
Again its worth saying
Between 1930 to 2010 Meath won 7 All Irelands
Between 1939 to 2010 Dublin won 9 All Irelands
Between 2011 to 2019 Dublin could win possible 7 All Irelands.

Even 80 years of Dublin look average compared to this decade of Dublin.

Regards yes O Rourke was from leitrim we had a few from outside the county but we didnt have nearly a full 15 from near outside the county. Dublin have really only won 15 All Irelands. The first 12 or so were won with country lads. From 1890s to early 1940s Dublin won piles of hurling and football All Irelands with more then 90% of the players from outside Dublin. Theres a big difference in having 1 players from outside county to having 12 or 13 players outside ur county.

Meath football begins properly in 1930s..Dublin football begins properly in 1950s. Every All Ireland Dublin won before 1950 in hurling or football was an All star coumtry tram where the whole team was basically made up from Longford Kerry Mayo footballers.

Dublin have won 7 Hurling All Irelands, only 2 men born and bred in Dublin have ever won hurling senior All Ireland medal.

The reason I put up managers who beat Dublin is to emphasis how hard it is and always is to beat Dublin. Especially in leinster. I think people underestimate how hard it always to beat Dublin. If u look.at the teams and players that have beaten Dublin in last 50 years , it usually takes the greatest teams and players and managers that county has ever produced to beat Dublin

Look at all manager whoever defeated Dublin in championship . To beat Dublin twive in the championship, the only managers that ever beaten just twice in the championship are all time great manager.The only managers that have beaten Dublin more then once, are the greatest managers of all time. Thats how bloody hard it always was and and is and always will be to beat Dublin. For any county to beat Dublin in championship in last 50 years u have to had to gave greatest players from that county ever u need a truly great manager, a truly great team and truly great players because the most difficult opponent in gaelic football has always been Dublin the most difficult team to beat in football in last 50 years is Dublin in front of hill 16.

Finally regards comment I need to get out more, that I need to physiatrist. I only come on the forum now and again. I am leaving for a while again. I only like to stay a while on the forum cause a few rows with the Dubs and move on. I rather be viewer of Hogan stand then a partipate. I have two very sick family members so to come on to Hogan Stand for hour to write about 1986 leinster final , kind of takes ones minds of things . So I enjoy always reading peoples messages because when Hogan stand is good it can be really good. And there at times , some class contributers on the forum. I like to come on and rabble on about Meath football now and again. And I know I go on many a nostalgic trip. Maybe it is because Meath last few years have been tough, I would rather talk about past.

Anyway even to the Dubs I dont mean any hard feelings. To give the Dubs credit there players were always tough , alway took and gave it but never complained. And there supporters in general r good supporters.
Anyway no hard feelings Dubs enjoy the rest of the reason because I think this year is going to be greatest gaa year of your lifes when u win 5 in a row.
Peace
Furlong

Furlong1949 (Meath) - Posts: 968 - 14/04/2019 17:27:01    2178792

Link

You have some very good knowledge and insights there furlong, fair play to you. The main one of course that we can take 12 All Ireland's away from the dubs when they start closing in on our 37:-).

KY4SAM2015 (Kerry) - Posts: 872 - 14/04/2019 18:30:08    2178797

Link

Replying To Furlong1949:  "Thanks Username for responding in a very articulate manner. As always I enjoyed reading your commentary. I dont agree with everything u said but thats what is called healthy proper debate. U play the ball never the man. U never engage in insults and nasty comments which I am afraid is a common response from certain people in hogan stand. I can be very Meath biased. But I dont believe in insulting anybody or anybodys county.

1 A couple of points. I am not comparing Meath to kerrry. Ok. Kerry are a genius of a county. Our greatest football.county the brazil of gaelic football.if that doesnt sound to glib. There is no comparsion between Meath and kerry. Kerry are on a different level to Meath.

But we do have three things in common. Meath and kerry have produced more great defenders then any other county. Secondly both counties have overachieved. Kerry on an extraordinary grand scale level. Meath on a much smaller level. Meath have overachieved when u compare to the rest of teams in leinster ( leaving Dublin ) and if u compare it to every county in the country ( outside kerry and Dublin ) , Meath have definitely been one of the high achievers in football. Third thing we have in common with kerry. Both Meath and kerry have the best record in the country over Dublin and have had periods of unprecedented sucess v Dublin. That is a fact. Dubs dont like that fact. But its a fact.

2 Meath have had a massive impact on Dublin and Dublin on Meath. The same way Galway have on Mayo and. vive versa, the same way Tipp have had on kilkenny and vice versa. Dublin and Meath have reacted to each other for generations. Dublin for first time ever start a policy of picking all.Dublin players in 50s . This is response to Meath and louth sucess. Heffernan loses to Meath 5 times in 6 years in championship . Picking best country lads for Dublin is now starting to fail. Meath and louth are dominate teams , winning every leinster title from 1947 to 1954. Heffernan whole career at the start is engaged with legendary battles with Paddy O Brien in Navan and Croke Park , but the game always ends in Meath victory and Dublin are failing badly to keep up with Meath and louth. So in early mid 50s modern Dublin is reborn. And in 1950s ith an All Dublin team backboned by St Vincents players and we have the first proper Dublin gaa team. If Dublin were winning leinster title after leinster title like they did in fron 1890s to 1940s do u think they wud have changed. Meath and louth dominate leinsster, Meath go on an unprecedented run of victories over Dublin . What is Dublins reaction , A Dublin team.with Dublin players. So Dublin as we know is born in response to Meath sucess. And so begins a rivalry where both counties respond to each other.

2 Dublin go up a level in late 50s and early 60s. Winning All Irelands for first time ever with Dublin players. Meath decline. But in response to Dublin sucess. A new generation of Meath footballers become obsessed about knocking Dublin from their perch. And slowly and surely they do that and in 1964 , Dublin the reigning All-Ireland champions are beating in leinster final which signals a period of Meath sucess. Again both counties responding to each other.

3 Heffernan builds the second version of Dublin Dublin of hill 16 fame in mid 70s. Again this is a response to a decade of Meath sucess followed by great Offaly team sucess. Meath go toe to toe with Dublin in 70s beating them in a league final div 1 and should have won v dubs in 76 and especially 77 final.

Dublin are invincible in leinster now. Dublin reach 10 All Ireland finals in 12 years. 10 Leinster titles in 12 years. 7 victories in ten years in championship v Meath. All those victories over Meath , lead to Meath slowly getting their act togther and Meaths response is unprecedented. In 9 championship games v Dublin in 5 years Meath lose once. Dublin in response to Meaths sucess go up a level in terms of fitness and preparation. And by mid 90s Dublin team are considered fitest Dublin team ever and have a few good years in mid 90s, culminating in All.Ireland win in 1995.

4 Dublin are all.Ireland champions and again Meath raise their game in response and topple Dublin and beat Dublin 4 times in 6 years in championship. We now have the most competitive most exciting era in leinster football. Meath are dominate over Dublin anc kildare Laois and Westmeath win leinster. And in response to this Bertie and Bailey get Dublins act together and the Blue wave iniatitive is begun. And Dublin start on an era of unprecedented sucess at all levels in leinster. In response to the late 90s and early 00s era in leinster football where Meath won 2 All Irelands and Meath kildare Offaly laois and Westmeath won leinster.

5 meath and kildare are now starting to have underage sucess. This is totally in response to Dublin sucess. And the cycle continues. So Meath football has had a much more bigger impact on Dublin then u think. Dublin football has had a massive impact on Meath football. Thats what is called a rivarlry.But counties have been driviing forces in both counties. Both counties sucess has had at different times forced both counties in different eras to reorganise and go up a level. Meath have been more then thorn in Dublin side. Meath football has been full frontal.attack on every part of the Dublin gaa nervous system for generations.

Regards Dublin having more All Irelands potentially in.this era then Meath in our history. That is unfair comparsion because u are metropolis u are the most powerful, most wealthiest county in country u sud be having such sucess. Meath is an average midlands county in Irish society in terms of stature.

But outside kerry and Dublin 1 All Ireland title is an incredibly hard thing to do. U have won 6 All-Irelands in this decade. Meaths 7 looks not great beside it. But neitheir does Mayos 3 All Irelands or Donegal 2 All Irelands or Armagh 1 All Ireland or Tyrones 3 All Irelands or Laois 0 All-Irelands or Monaghans 0 All Irelands. Dublin in this decade have won the same amount of All Irelands as Mayo Donegal Monaghan loais and Armagh put together in all their history. These are all great football counties. Many of ur greatest rivals in this era. They are all great strong proud football counties with outstanding traditions, but for a Mayo or a Donegal or a Tyrone or a Meath to win 1 All Ireland is extraordinary achievement. When Dublin gobble up All Irelands in current era in unprecedented manner it makes evey county (outside kerry) , it make evey single of the other 30 counties sucess look poor and average. But you compare Meaths sucess to all other counties outside kerry and Dublin , Meaths sucess means we are one of most sucessful counties in the country. Our sucess is as good as Gakway Down and Cork traditionally. And for 80 years we went toe toe Dublin.

This is very important very important stat Username. This is a very important one. Dublin win 7 title in 9 years this year that is nearly as much as Dublin won in the previous 80 years.

Between 1930 and 2010 Dublin won 9 All Irelands Between 2010 and 2019 Dublin win 7 All Irelands ( If they win this year).
So even this Dublin team make Dublins last 80 years look poor.
Again its worth saying
Between 1930 to 2010 Meath won 7 All Irelands
Between 1939 to 2010 Dublin won 9 All Irelands
Between 2011 to 2019 Dublin could win possible 7 All Irelands.

Even 80 years of Dublin look average compared to this decade of Dublin.

Regards yes O Rourke was from leitrim we had a few from outside the county but we didnt have nearly a full 15 from near outside the county. Dublin have really only won 15 All Irelands. The first 12 or so were won with country lads. From 1890s to early 1940s Dublin won piles of hurling and football All Irelands with more then 90% of the players from outside Dublin. Theres a big difference in having 1 players from outside county to having 12 or 13 players outside ur county.

Meath football begins properly in 1930s..Dublin football begins properly in 1950s. Every All Ireland Dublin won before 1950 in hurling or football was an All star coumtry tram where the whole team was basically made up from Longford Kerry Mayo footballers.

Dublin have won 7 Hurling All Irelands, only 2 men born and bred in Dublin have ever won hurling senior All Ireland medal.

The reason I put up managers who beat Dublin is to emphasis how hard it is and always is to beat Dublin. Especially in leinster. I think people underestimate how hard it always to beat Dublin. If u look.at the teams and players that have beaten Dublin in last 50 years , it usually takes the greatest teams and players and managers that county has ever produced to beat Dublin

Look at all manager whoever defeated Dublin in championship . To beat Dublin twive in the championship, the only managers that ever beaten just twice in the championship are all time great manager.The only managers that have beaten Dublin more then once, are the greatest managers of all time. Thats how bloody hard it always was and and is and always will be to beat Dublin. For any county to beat Dublin in championship in last 50 years u have to had to gave greatest players from that county ever u need a truly great manager, a truly great team and truly great players because the most difficult opponent in gaelic football has always been Dublin the most difficult team to beat in football in last 50 years is Dublin in front of hill 16.

Finally regards comment I need to get out more, that I need to physiatrist. I only come on the forum now and again. I am leaving for a while again. I only like to stay a while on the forum cause a few rows with the Dubs and move on. I rather be viewer of Hogan stand then a partipate. I have two very sick family members so to come on to Hogan Stand for hour to write about 1986 leinster final , kind of takes ones minds of things . So I enjoy always reading peoples messages because when Hogan stand is good it can be really good. And there at times , some class contributers on the forum. I like to come on and rabble on about Meath football now and again. And I know I go on many a nostalgic trip. Maybe it is because Meath last few years have been tough, I would rather talk about past.

Anyway even to the Dubs I dont mean any hard feelings. To give the Dubs credit there players were always tough , alway took and gave it but never complained. And there supporters in general r good supporters.
Anyway no hard feelings Dubs enjoy the rest of the reason because I think this year is going to be greatest gaa year of your lifes when u win 5 in a row.
Peace
Furlong"
Furlong your stats make our achievements as a county look even more impressive , fair play to you , you know your football history.

KingdomBoy1 (Kerry) - Posts: 10875 - 14/04/2019 18:51:16    2178800

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Replying To KingdomBoy1:  "Furlong your stats make our achievements as a county look even more impressive , fair play to you , you know your football history."
Furlong is a fantastic poster. Honestly , I've said this before on Meath forum, himself and Ollie should get together and write all this down, give me furlong any day over the bs analysis on Sunday game league Sunday. Always fascinating and insightful.

royaldunne (Meath) - Posts: 16566 - 14/04/2019 20:18:28    2178818

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Replying To Furlong1949:  "Thanks Username for responding in a very articulate manner. As always I enjoyed reading your commentary. I dont agree with everything u said but thats what is called healthy proper debate. U play the ball never the man. U never engage in insults and nasty comments which I am afraid is a common response from certain people in hogan stand. I can be very Meath biased. But I dont believe in insulting anybody or anybodys county.

1 A couple of points. I am not comparing Meath to kerrry. Ok. Kerry are a genius of a county. Our greatest football.county the brazil of gaelic football.if that doesnt sound to glib. There is no comparsion between Meath and kerry. Kerry are on a different level to Meath.

But we do have three things in common. Meath and kerry have produced more great defenders then any other county. Secondly both counties have overachieved. Kerry on an extraordinary grand scale level. Meath on a much smaller level. Meath have overachieved when u compare to the rest of teams in leinster ( leaving Dublin ) and if u compare it to every county in the country ( outside kerry and Dublin ) , Meath have definitely been one of the high achievers in football. Third thing we have in common with kerry. Both Meath and kerry have the best record in the country over Dublin and have had periods of unprecedented sucess v Dublin. That is a fact. Dubs dont like that fact. But its a fact.

2 Meath have had a massive impact on Dublin and Dublin on Meath. The same way Galway have on Mayo and. vive versa, the same way Tipp have had on kilkenny and vice versa. Dublin and Meath have reacted to each other for generations. Dublin for first time ever start a policy of picking all.Dublin players in 50s . This is response to Meath and louth sucess. Heffernan loses to Meath 5 times in 6 years in championship . Picking best country lads for Dublin is now starting to fail. Meath and louth are dominate teams , winning every leinster title from 1947 to 1954. Heffernan whole career at the start is engaged with legendary battles with Paddy O Brien in Navan and Croke Park , but the game always ends in Meath victory and Dublin are failing badly to keep up with Meath and louth. So in early mid 50s modern Dublin is reborn. And in 1950s ith an All Dublin team backboned by St Vincents players and we have the first proper Dublin gaa team. If Dublin were winning leinster title after leinster title like they did in fron 1890s to 1940s do u think they wud have changed. Meath and louth dominate leinsster, Meath go on an unprecedented run of victories over Dublin . What is Dublins reaction , A Dublin team.with Dublin players. So Dublin as we know is born in response to Meath sucess. And so begins a rivalry where both counties respond to each other.

2 Dublin go up a level in late 50s and early 60s. Winning All Irelands for first time ever with Dublin players. Meath decline. But in response to Dublin sucess. A new generation of Meath footballers become obsessed about knocking Dublin from their perch. And slowly and surely they do that and in 1964 , Dublin the reigning All-Ireland champions are beating in leinster final which signals a period of Meath sucess. Again both counties responding to each other.

3 Heffernan builds the second version of Dublin Dublin of hill 16 fame in mid 70s. Again this is a response to a decade of Meath sucess followed by great Offaly team sucess. Meath go toe to toe with Dublin in 70s beating them in a league final div 1 and should have won v dubs in 76 and especially 77 final.

Dublin are invincible in leinster now. Dublin reach 10 All Ireland finals in 12 years. 10 Leinster titles in 12 years. 7 victories in ten years in championship v Meath. All those victories over Meath , lead to Meath slowly getting their act togther and Meaths response is unprecedented. In 9 championship games v Dublin in 5 years Meath lose once. Dublin in response to Meaths sucess go up a level in terms of fitness and preparation. And by mid 90s Dublin team are considered fitest Dublin team ever and have a few good years in mid 90s, culminating in All.Ireland win in 1995.

4 Dublin are all.Ireland champions and again Meath raise their game in response and topple Dublin and beat Dublin 4 times in 6 years in championship. We now have the most competitive most exciting era in leinster football. Meath are dominate over Dublin anc kildare Laois and Westmeath win leinster. And in response to this Bertie and Bailey get Dublins act together and the Blue wave iniatitive is begun. And Dublin start on an era of unprecedented sucess at all levels in leinster. In response to the late 90s and early 00s era in leinster football where Meath won 2 All Irelands and Meath kildare Offaly laois and Westmeath won leinster.

5 meath and kildare are now starting to have underage sucess. This is totally in response to Dublin sucess. And the cycle continues. So Meath football has had a much more bigger impact on Dublin then u think. Dublin football has had a massive impact on Meath football. Thats what is called a rivarlry.But counties have been driviing forces in both counties. Both counties sucess has had at different times forced both counties in different eras to reorganise and go up a level. Meath have been more then thorn in Dublin side. Meath football has been full frontal.attack on every part of the Dublin gaa nervous system for generations.

Regards Dublin having more All Irelands potentially in.this era then Meath in our history. That is unfair comparsion because u are metropolis u are the most powerful, most wealthiest county in country u sud be having such sucess. Meath is an average midlands county in Irish society in terms of stature.

But outside kerry and Dublin 1 All Ireland title is an incredibly hard thing to do. U have won 6 All-Irelands in this decade. Meaths 7 looks not great beside it. But neitheir does Mayos 3 All Irelands or Donegal 2 All Irelands or Armagh 1 All Ireland or Tyrones 3 All Irelands or Laois 0 All-Irelands or Monaghans 0 All Irelands. Dublin in this decade have won the same amount of All Irelands as Mayo Donegal Monaghan loais and Armagh put together in all their history. These are all great football counties. Many of ur greatest rivals in this era. They are all great strong proud football counties with outstanding traditions, but for a Mayo or a Donegal or a Tyrone or a Meath to win 1 All Ireland is extraordinary achievement. When Dublin gobble up All Irelands in current era in unprecedented manner it makes evey county (outside kerry) , it make evey single of the other 30 counties sucess look poor and average. But you compare Meaths sucess to all other counties outside kerry and Dublin , Meaths sucess means we are one of most sucessful counties in the country. Our sucess is as good as Gakway Down and Cork traditionally. And for 80 years we went toe toe Dublin.

This is very important very important stat Username. This is a very important one. Dublin win 7 title in 9 years this year that is nearly as much as Dublin won in the previous 80 years.

Between 1930 and 2010 Dublin won 9 All Irelands Between 2010 and 2019 Dublin win 7 All Irelands ( If they win this year).
So even this Dublin team make Dublins last 80 years look poor.
Again its worth saying
Between 1930 to 2010 Meath won 7 All Irelands
Between 1939 to 2010 Dublin won 9 All Irelands
Between 2011 to 2019 Dublin could win possible 7 All Irelands.

Even 80 years of Dublin look average compared to this decade of Dublin.

Regards yes O Rourke was from leitrim we had a few from outside the county but we didnt have nearly a full 15 from near outside the county. Dublin have really only won 15 All Irelands. The first 12 or so were won with country lads. From 1890s to early 1940s Dublin won piles of hurling and football All Irelands with more then 90% of the players from outside Dublin. Theres a big difference in having 1 players from outside county to having 12 or 13 players outside ur county.

Meath football begins properly in 1930s..Dublin football begins properly in 1950s. Every All Ireland Dublin won before 1950 in hurling or football was an All star coumtry tram where the whole team was basically made up from Longford Kerry Mayo footballers.

Dublin have won 7 Hurling All Irelands, only 2 men born and bred in Dublin have ever won hurling senior All Ireland medal.

The reason I put up managers who beat Dublin is to emphasis how hard it is and always is to beat Dublin. Especially in leinster. I think people underestimate how hard it always to beat Dublin. If u look.at the teams and players that have beaten Dublin in last 50 years , it usually takes the greatest teams and players and managers that county has ever produced to beat Dublin

Look at all manager whoever defeated Dublin in championship . To beat Dublin twive in the championship, the only managers that ever beaten just twice in the championship are all time great manager.The only managers that have beaten Dublin more then once, are the greatest managers of all time. Thats how bloody hard it always was and and is and always will be to beat Dublin. For any county to beat Dublin in championship in last 50 years u have to had to gave greatest players from that county ever u need a truly great manager, a truly great team and truly great players because the most difficult opponent in gaelic football has always been Dublin the most difficult team to beat in football in last 50 years is Dublin in front of hill 16.

Finally regards comment I need to get out more, that I need to physiatrist. I only come on the forum now and again. I am leaving for a while again. I only like to stay a while on the forum cause a few rows with the Dubs and move on. I rather be viewer of Hogan stand then a partipate. I have two very sick family members so to come on to Hogan Stand for hour to write about 1986 leinster final , kind of takes ones minds of things . So I enjoy always reading peoples messages because when Hogan stand is good it can be really good. And there at times , some class contributers on the forum. I like to come on and rabble on about Meath football now and again. And I know I go on many a nostalgic trip. Maybe it is because Meath last few years have been tough, I would rather talk about past.

Anyway even to the Dubs I dont mean any hard feelings. To give the Dubs credit there players were always tough , alway took and gave it but never complained. And there supporters in general r good supporters.
Anyway no hard feelings Dubs enjoy the rest of the reason because I think this year is going to be greatest gaa year of your lifes when u win 5 in a row.
Peace
Furlong"
Again interesting post Furlong, like your good self I wouldn't agree with the analysis but as you say it's a debate.

What we have in common though and what I would acknowledge is that Dublin have historically under achieved. There are many reasons for that, it's not long ago that the prevailing mindset of Hill goers, was the "Culchies hate when you beat them at their own game", that shade of association to being a non natural Dublin game, never saw the game take off beyond some very strong north side strong holds. Those strong holds provided the vast majority of intercounty players for 99% of our history up until quite recently, I would argue up to mid 00s. Essentially Dublin have played the game up to this point with one hand tied behind there back. That has completely changed, the panel indicates it. The growth of the game at underage here in participation has been phenomenal and the structures that underpin to harness it for Dublin are razor sharp. We see it now in the Dublin panel, there are players representing Dublin equally for the first time now from clubs North and South of the Liffey and whisper it quietly but West County Dublin clubs are beginning to show players of class who represent Dublin.

The above is why I highlight that football is a dynamic process, open to change and influence rather then noting subjective patterns from the past or viewing those trends in a crystallized manner. Certainly there has been a change in young people's identification in GAA in Dublin and this unrivaled success will do little to stem the tide, seeds are being planted every year for developing children to continue to claim their lived expierence and birthright of Dublin GAA being the best their is. The DNA of the lifecycle of Dublin GAA has changed, certainly in my time and I'm not old and quiet singnificantly I think that change and harvest is still only in its infancy. When this team regresses and it will soon I think it will just be the end of the beginning.

Im not sure how focused we have ever been on Meath as a measure of success or been motivated to improve because of them. I think we have always been focused on the big one and happen that Meath would win it they would be a yard stick, equally Meath dined at the top table for periods during notably the 80s, 90s and early 00s, not sure we put much thought into how we beat Meath rather as an obstacle to the biggest prize. Same with Kildare, Loais and Westmeath different years over that period, it made Leinster very entertainging and maybe an All Ireland within an All Ireland. But I do think Dublin's biggest rivalry and focus was with themselves and getting to the big one. We were in a Mayo type, pressure vacuum to win it. At least that's my lived expierence.

On the heritage issue, I think you are being somewhat unkind to us, off the teams you mention, we both know there was significant Dublin representation on al, the Dublin historical teams. I do however would acknowledge that the GAA was big amongst the early ex pat community in the county and real Dubs found it hard to warm to. Dublin is a fluid and cosmopolitan place always has been always will be. Year after year we take in national and non national migrants, in a way it's fitting that the history of Dublin GAA reflects that diversity as it's reflective of the county. You know we can't point at the same situation in Meath with players born in different counties. Sure I think Jim even went down to see Snitchy Ferguson recently. ;)

I would also take issue with your description of Meath, Meath is one of the most affluent counties in Ireland, it's part of the boon along with Kildare that sees half the country head east and standing in the shadow of Dublin it gets all the associated economic benefits. It has a population of just under 200k. I think it's a bit disengenuious to call it an average midlands county, you can't compare it to the likes of Offaly, Weat Meath, Longford or Carlow. Your right you should be considered in the bracket of success of Galways, Corks and Down given its make up. But we have Donegal, Tyrone and Mayo punching above their weights with lessor resources.

Just to sign off Furlong, sorry to hear about your situation, I'm sure you look after your family with a heart and a half, but it's not an easy statation, I'd have a lot of respect and admiration for anyone holding that space, hopefully we see you in Croker at the end of June for what sounds like a well deserved respite.

Keep posting away a Chara.

TheUsername (Dublin) - Posts: 3350 - 14/04/2019 20:22:52    2178820

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Replying To KingdomBoy1:  "Furlong your stats make our achievements as a county look even more impressive , fair play to you , you know your football history."
Just a couple of stats and facts before I go to back up what I am saying. These are all facts abd stats.

1 Dublin won the All Ireland in 1906 and 1907 with ten different players from 10 different counties.
In those two All Ireland finals in 1906 and 1907 not one Dublin man was on eitheir of those All Ireland Dublin winning teams.

2 When Dublin played Galway in 1942 they won with 2 midfielders for Dublin who were both kerrymen from Dingle. And 4 of the Dublin team that played in that final in total were from Dingle in kerry. The two kerrymen who played at centre field for Dublin were Mick Falvey and Joe Fitzgerald. Mick Falvey was member of civil service team which won Dublin senior club title in 1944. He was a civil servant.

In total when Dublin won the All Ireland v Galway in 1942 there was 6 kerry men playing for Dublin. There was also players from longford Sligo and Cork playing for Dublin. Only 4 of the starting 15 that won that All Ireland for Dublin were from Dublin.

3 Only 1 Dublin man has ever won senior All Ireland medal. Dublin have won 7 titles. The vast majority of Dublin hurling All Ireland winning teams were made up of gardai. Gardai from down the country. Garda Commissoner at the time Eoin Duffy transferred top hurlers from down the country and insisted they play for Dublin.

3 It was not til 1961 that a Dublin hurling team played in hurling All Ireland final and the team was made up of Dublin players. 14 players on that Dublin team in 1961 were from Dublin.

4 The GAA rule in 1930s and 1940s was a gaa player had to declare for the county they lived in. This was a massive advantage for Dublin.

5 In everyone of Dublins first 12 All-Irelands there was players from Wicklow.

6 In 1902 Bray Emmets won the All Ireland. Bray is in Wicklow. But what county did Bray Emmets represent Dublin. So Wicklow have won an All Ireland only their team was considered a Dublin team at time. Dublin team represented by a Bray Gaa club from Wicklow. won All Ireland in 1902.


7 Dublin won 14 All Irelands by 1924. They won 8 All Irelands in the following 80 years. It wasnt until 1903 that kerry won their first All Ireland, at which stage Dublin had 8. It took kerry less then 40 years to catch Dublin. Remwber football in first 40 years when Dublin won 14 All Irelands was influx. The rules were a mess , number of players and value of goal was always changing. And the effects of land War , Parnell Spilt, War of Independence, civil war meant the gaa was not organised well on a national scale.

8 Its not til 30s and 40s we see All-Ireland championship on a national scale similar to now. Up to 2010 Dublin had beaten kerry 6 times in championship ever. 3 of those victories over kerry by Dublin were prior to 1923. Dublin defeated kerry in 1923 the next victory was in 1976.
Dublin team up to 1950 were full of exiles from down the country who lived and worked in Dublin but who would have liked to have play for their own county. But this was possible. So Dublin teams of 1890s 1920s 1930s 1940s were made significantly of exiles from down the country.

9 One examole of many is Murt kelly. Murt kelly was dropped by kerry. A kerryman who moved to Dublin to work as a teacher. In 1934 this kerryman captained Dublin in the All Ireland semi final v his own county kerry. Dublin won. The game was in Tralee. The Kerry crowd were furious after match. The Dublin and Murt kelly left as quick after match as tensions where high with kerry men on the Dublin team and the kerry team. Incredibly kelly returned to kerry and scored a winning point in an All Ireland final v Dublin in 1941.

The modern kerry v Dublin rivalry begins in 1955. In the All Ireland 1955. For first time ever u had All Dublin team backboned by St Vincents team playing an all kerry team . It was a record crowd and such was excitement extra trains were put on throughout the country to see kerry who had won 2 All Irelands in 1952 1953 and lost final to Meath in 1954. But the main reason why was such an interest was , coz this was first Dublin team with majority of player born and bred in Dublin. 1955 Dublin team is the first indigenous Dublin team ever. Every Dublin team before this is residence based. Basically made up of playere residing in Dublin but not actually from Dublin. So 1955 really caught the countries imagination. Because for first time u had culchies v city slickers, Boggers v Jackeens.First time u had county kerry v City Dublin. It was first proper urban v rural All Ireland final.

Furlong1949 (Meath) - Posts: 968 - 14/04/2019 21:17:23    2178833

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