Meath Forum

Meath Vs Mayo

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Replying To Aloblack:  "Yeah the swallowing his pride comment is complete nonsense. What can he do if someone (rooney) says no? Or is someone (lenihan) goes travelling for a year. And all the talk about Paddy O Rourke coming back in is baffling. Paddy O Rourke has made his feelings extremely clear when it comes to committing to inter county football. Besides when he was our starting goalkeeper he wasn't exactly the safe as houses cool head goalkeeper we're looking for. I can remember him being equally as ropey as Colgan."
Agreed, I always find it somewhat humorous when I hear supporters calling for someone to return who they had previously ripped apart when he was there, O'Rourke had certain skills (ones that I thought were better suited outfield at the time) but as you say he was prone to plenty of gaffes and was under as much scrutiny and getting as much stock towards the end as Colgan is now. What we need is an actual natural goalkeeper, something that neither O'Rourke was or Colgan is, the position is so important in the modern game that square pegs in round holes will not work. I'm sure we have options in the county to resolve this issue.

Richieq (Meath) - Posts: 3584 - 22/07/2019 10:43:53    2214553

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Having had time to reflect on yesterdays match and the Donegal one too I've some observations to note

1) Goalkeeper. I've said since last year he's costing us 4-5 points a game. Yesterday it was 2-3/4 at the very least. In the modern game that's catastrophic and jut defies belief. I don't actually blame Colgan for this. Yes he'd a brain fart for the penalty (which was never a penalty at all as he hit him outside the square) but Andy McEntee has continued with him for far too long knowing he was going to costs us. That's 100% at the managers hands.
2) Lavin - what a player he's becoming. For me he's one of the first names on the team sheet. Two great scores yesterday but did his defensive duties extremely well too. He'll be sorely missed if out for the Kerry game. I reckon him v Clifford would've been worth the entry fee
3) Conor McGill. Whilst he's a good full back needs to be a lot more commanding. I know we've been blessed over the years with some of the best full backs to ever grace the game never mind a Meath jersey but McGill was nowhere to be seen for the first goal. Now maybe he went right to help out Gallagher but Lavin had to chase into the middle to cover him off and ended up getting injured trying to help out Colgan. Full backs shouldn't be moving too far from the D and should always be there to protect the keeper. Maybe I'm old school in approach but McGill is too streaky in form during games. Sometimes excellent and sometimes anonymous.
4) Gallagher and Shane McEntee - Shouldn't be starting in a division one team. Unfortunately i don't think either are at the standard required.
5) Half backs - great all year but i think yesterday they tired and showed they can't be the only ones to drive the team on. Lavin did his best to drive forward but injury caught him.
6) Half Forwards - We're in big trouble here. We've no playmaker in this line and they didn't get up and down the pitch enough. James McEntee still seems injured and had little influence on the game. I'd like to see him back in the half back line and attacking ala McCaffrey. Devine will benefit from these games. McMahon is a serviceable player but doesn't do enough around the field. I'd prefer him as an option to come in at corner forward and run at pace at teams.
7) Full forward line. Cillian had one of his head in the sand games and he needs to learn to pass off. Too many times he had the blinkers on and ran into trouble and got turned over. Conlan was similar. He's young and will benefit from these games but he needs to be less rash in his decisions and shot selection.
8) Bench is still a bit weak but we've players coming through and some to come back in. Walsh looks a huge prospect. Apart from him the bench had no impact and that's what we need.

Overall this is a very positive year for us and we'll benefit from it. We need to develop our fitness 20% more and stop the fade outs after 55 minutes. Fitness can't be done overnight and takes years to build but we're closing the gap. Our game management and intelligence needs to be upped 50+%. Too many times v Dublin, Donegal and yesterday we ran into blind alleys, got turned over and muscled off the ball. We are too rash to shoot and need to learn to recycle the ball much faster and get into better scoring positions. We're too easily pushed wide and then bottled up in the middle. Top teams operate far quicker than us and we need to learn to move much faster and not allow teams to be reset. These are things which can and will be worked on.

Andy is the right man for the job but needs to put his pride aside and make some difficult calls. He needs to get Burlingham, Hannigan or Beakey involved from the off next year. Develop a proper kick out strategy. A call to Brian Conlon would not be unwise. I think he and Menton could be a great centre field partnership. Is Ronan Jones also back next year from his studies and available? Those two would vastly improve our midfield options. Half forwards who work up and down the pitch and can turn over ball and use it quickly would be great. If we could get quick ball into Newman and Walsh they could cause trouble with someone fast operating off them.

Finally i think we're long overdue an all star and if Lavin and Keoghan don't go close to getting one i'd be furious but then its a popularity contest so fully expect neither will even get nominated.

brian (Meath) - Posts: 899 - 22/07/2019 11:31:29    2214594

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Don't know where all this POR is coming from, shouldn't be let within an asses roar of a Meath panel again. Colgan's not a natural in the position, but with an average midfield, you're limiting your options and we haven't got the hang of short kick outs or kickout variation, that includes the outfield and management, not just Colgan.
With regard to the team itself, our defence is good, 3 of 6 would walk onto any team in the country. Midfield is average, Menton a class act but needs a natural mobile midfielder with him.
Forwards are a bit of a disaster, Newmans the real deal and the rest are a work in progress. Constantly take too much out of the ball and there seems to be a general reluctance to take on a shot. A lot of times when they do shoot, it tends to be from ridiculous angles or under extreme pressure due to overplaying with the ball in the first place. Shot selection and option taking is what separates the sheep from the goats at this level and ours is dreadful.
Don't know what can be done between now and the Kerry game, but the forwards in particular need to be take a long hard look at some the stuff they did yesterday.

moylagh (Meath) - Posts: 456 - 22/07/2019 11:39:25    2214602

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Well lads, disappointing in the end for you but I really think you have the makings of an excellent team there. Those defenders are something else and I think they will keep you in a lot of games. It's further up the pitch you have issues and I think retaining possession is the big one so your goalkeeper and kickout strategy needs a bit rethink.

Overall though I wanted to pop in to say it's great seeing Meath at the business end of championship again and I think with a few tweaks you'll be in a good position to retain Division 1 status next year.

Hopefully you give Kerry a right old rattle in Páirc Tailteann!

JoeSoap (Donegal) - Posts: 1007 - 22/07/2019 11:53:01    2214609

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i was saying to a few supporters in croker yesterday that if we had an ollie murphy type player yesterday we would of won the game , i find it very frustrating that our keeper costs us 3 or 4 scores in every game , which is shocking stat , that said we will hopefully give kerry a game in two weeks and try another keeper hopefully.

meath1987 (Meath) - Posts: 115 - 22/07/2019 11:56:46    2214615

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Replying To brian:  "Having had time to reflect on yesterdays match and the Donegal one too I've some observations to note

1) Goalkeeper. I've said since last year he's costing us 4-5 points a game. Yesterday it was 2-3/4 at the very least. In the modern game that's catastrophic and jut defies belief. I don't actually blame Colgan for this. Yes he'd a brain fart for the penalty (which was never a penalty at all as he hit him outside the square) but Andy McEntee has continued with him for far too long knowing he was going to costs us. That's 100% at the managers hands.
2) Lavin - what a player he's becoming. For me he's one of the first names on the team sheet. Two great scores yesterday but did his defensive duties extremely well too. He'll be sorely missed if out for the Kerry game. I reckon him v Clifford would've been worth the entry fee
3) Conor McGill. Whilst he's a good full back needs to be a lot more commanding. I know we've been blessed over the years with some of the best full backs to ever grace the game never mind a Meath jersey but McGill was nowhere to be seen for the first goal. Now maybe he went right to help out Gallagher but Lavin had to chase into the middle to cover him off and ended up getting injured trying to help out Colgan. Full backs shouldn't be moving too far from the D and should always be there to protect the keeper. Maybe I'm old school in approach but McGill is too streaky in form during games. Sometimes excellent and sometimes anonymous.
4) Gallagher and Shane McEntee - Shouldn't be starting in a division one team. Unfortunately i don't think either are at the standard required.
5) Half backs - great all year but i think yesterday they tired and showed they can't be the only ones to drive the team on. Lavin did his best to drive forward but injury caught him.
6) Half Forwards - We're in big trouble here. We've no playmaker in this line and they didn't get up and down the pitch enough. James McEntee still seems injured and had little influence on the game. I'd like to see him back in the half back line and attacking ala McCaffrey. Devine will benefit from these games. McMahon is a serviceable player but doesn't do enough around the field. I'd prefer him as an option to come in at corner forward and run at pace at teams.
7) Full forward line. Cillian had one of his head in the sand games and he needs to learn to pass off. Too many times he had the blinkers on and ran into trouble and got turned over. Conlan was similar. He's young and will benefit from these games but he needs to be less rash in his decisions and shot selection.
8) Bench is still a bit weak but we've players coming through and some to come back in. Walsh looks a huge prospect. Apart from him the bench had no impact and that's what we need.

Overall this is a very positive year for us and we'll benefit from it. We need to develop our fitness 20% more and stop the fade outs after 55 minutes. Fitness can't be done overnight and takes years to build but we're closing the gap. Our game management and intelligence needs to be upped 50+%. Too many times v Dublin, Donegal and yesterday we ran into blind alleys, got turned over and muscled off the ball. We are too rash to shoot and need to learn to recycle the ball much faster and get into better scoring positions. We're too easily pushed wide and then bottled up in the middle. Top teams operate far quicker than us and we need to learn to move much faster and not allow teams to be reset. These are things which can and will be worked on.

Andy is the right man for the job but needs to put his pride aside and make some difficult calls. He needs to get Burlingham, Hannigan or Beakey involved from the off next year. Develop a proper kick out strategy. A call to Brian Conlon would not be unwise. I think he and Menton could be a great centre field partnership. Is Ronan Jones also back next year from his studies and available? Those two would vastly improve our midfield options. Half forwards who work up and down the pitch and can turn over ball and use it quickly would be great. If we could get quick ball into Newman and Walsh they could cause trouble with someone fast operating off them.

Finally i think we're long overdue an all star and if Lavin and Keoghan don't go close to getting one i'd be furious but then its a popularity contest so fully expect neither will even get nominated."
Agree with pretty much the majority of your post . Although think your being a bit harsh on Gallagher. Struggled a bit yesterday but I've seen enough good things from him this year to make me belive he has something to offer . Picking up the phone to Brian Conlon again I wouldn't be so sure about. Against donegal 2 years ago in navan I came away thinking we've a real find on our hands here . Since then however I've seen him several times for club and county including 5 or 6 times this year for his club and his performances haven't been up to scratch. Doing ok buy certainly not putting his hand up to be called into the panel for next year.

Aloblack (Meath) - Posts: 265 - 22/07/2019 11:59:47    2214620

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Replying To Jack_Goff:  "That back 6 we have are top class. Lavin had some game today. What age is he?

We need a new keeper, midfield partner for Manton and a heap of forwards. The forwards as a unit is a disaster and I only hope we can improve. As someone else said it must be so frustrating on our 6 excellent backs watching the forwards kick away the game and behind them a keeper who does the same."
Lavin is 24, I would say 4 of our back 6 is top class and would make most teams, in my ideal world the forward line would look something like

10. O'Sullivan
11. Ruairi o'caoilean
12. Mckeever
13. Eamon Wallace
14. Newman
15. Donal lenihan

redser123 (Meath) - Posts: 299 - 22/07/2019 12:03:27    2214623

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A very disappointing defeat yesterday. A similar ending to Ballybofey but what is striking is that we actually had a great chance of winning yesterday. Both teams missed a lot of chances. For me and to put it simply the difference between the teams was the forwards. We had to work so much harder for our scores. Our movement and support in attacking positions was sorely lacking. In contrast Mayo's forwards were making runs everywhere creating space and options. That's experience for you and our lads should learn hugely from this experience.

Our backs again, collectively, stood up to the challenge yesterday. We have a serious platform to build on here. Lavin was excellent, one of the best individual performances I've seen in this year's championship. Keogan tried his best but I thought he looked to be carrying an injury, which may be stemming back to the Clare game, and his marauding attacking game was curtailed a lot.

Our forwards frustrate the life out of me! Plenty of buzz with O'Sullivan and McMahon when they have the ball but they are too prone to losing possession in contact. O'Sullivan has huge potential and great individual skill but he needs to improve his game awareness and know when is the right time to lay it off. He was guilty of some huge individual errors yesterday at important points in the game. Impressed by Devine, he could be a midfield option for us next year. Conlan hasn't had it his own way against better opposition and I expect will be dropped for Kerry (no harm in having an impact option). Again young Walsh showed flashes of great talent and is an exciting prospect. I think the free he dropped short was the turning point in the game, that would have put is a point up at a crucial time. Instead Mayo went up the other end took the lead and never looked back. Newman's absence really hurt is in the second half, that cool hand to steady the ship, as was the case against Clare.

The missed chances in the opening 10-15 minutes were a big downfall. I felt at the time that Meath needed to come out and take the initiative right from the off. We missed some easy scores, including from placed balls, and the goal chance from Keogan/Newman should have been taken. At this level you don't get many golden opportunities and that was one we really regret leaving behind.

While we have made good progress this year, it's become much clearer what is required to move on to the next level. Currently Meath are in that band of counties below the very top. Dublin, Donegal, Kerry, Tyrone, possibly Mayo are out on their own. We're in the mix with the likes of Galway, Monaghan, Roscommon, Armagh, Cavan. To build on 2019 we need to (1) prioritise the goalkeeping position, (2) unearth new forwards and coaching of our attacking play (3) develop a stronger panel. Rome wasn't build in a day and this isn't going to happen overnight. It will take time to get us to where we want to be. That said, we can of course make progress again next year if our key deficiencies are improved.

men_of_49 (Meath) - Posts: 1962 - 22/07/2019 12:19:36    2214631

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Replying To redser123:  "Lavin is 24, I would say 4 of our back 6 is top class and would make most teams, in my ideal world the forward line would look something like

10. O'Sullivan
11. Ruairi o'caoilean
12. Mckeever
13. Eamon Wallace
14. Newman
15. Donal lenihan"
Would replace Wallace with Walsh

Bear10 (Meath) - Posts: 322 - 22/07/2019 12:37:37    2214639

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Replying To redser123:  "Think you fairly nailed it here, ruairi o'caoilean donal lenihan and mckeever would all help this meath team given how desperate we are in the forwards, paddy o'Rourke is a better option than colgan in goals I dont care what anyone says, and if Ronan Jones is available next year he'd compliment mento in midfield, there is not a whole lot I'd change in our full back and half back line"
Ruairí is on the panel but got an injury in April which kept him out for a month or so and got injured in training with the seniors before the Clare game.

jackhackett (Meath) - Posts: 763 - 22/07/2019 12:40:56    2214642

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Replying To thebigjoeshow:  "I did not agree with paddy o Rourke statements in the past but I do think Andy will have to swallow his pride and ask either him robbie burlingham or Jack hannigan back in to asses the goalkeeper situation as I for one believe either of the above would have kept us closer in both games. Colgan has tried his best and fair play to him but under high ball he has been found out a couple of times ie donegal during the league and Clare during the championship.
On the other positions that need improvement midfield has to be fixed Menton has been very good this year at midfield but help is needed for him to operate better. Ronan Jones is probably the best bet here as Rooney has not been particularly good at club level this year another option here which should be even tried for the Kerry game would be to play Harnan or tobin there.
Forwards to be asked into the panel
Alan forde
Lenihan
Wallace
Paraic mc keever.
Our free taking and 45 and 50s have to be seriously looked at also I lost count this year on how many dropped short. When you look at dublin donegal kerry etc this is something that very rarely happens and can be worth 5 to 6 points in games, thought shane Walsh did very well today I know he had one bad one but he is only 19.
I think in terms of team development this has been a great year with all 3 goals achieved but in terms of division one next year and further progression I think Andy will have to bury the hatchet with lads that left the panel previously and blood a couple of the u20s from this year as there is a lot of talent coming through. I am still looking forward to the kerry game as with newman more than likely out and lavin some changes will be made and hopefully the likes of kane walsh mc govern campion tobin can get good game time to reward them for their commitment through the year."
Alan Forde hasn't played championship football for Meath since 2012.

He's spent a lot of time out injured after getting hurt against Fermanagh (I think) when Andy had called him back in while before that he had opted away from the panel.

He's not going to be the saviour.

jackhackett (Meath) - Posts: 763 - 22/07/2019 12:47:04    2214649

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Replying To jackhackett:  "Alan Forde hasn't played championship football for Meath since 2012.

He's spent a lot of time out injured after getting hurt against Fermanagh (I think) when Andy had called him back in while before that he had opted away from the panel.

He's not going to be the saviour."
The Wallaces aren't playing for Ratoath!

ASaminthehand (Meath) - Posts: 283 - 22/07/2019 12:53:38    2214654

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I wouldn't be touching b conlon POR or mckeever with a barge pole, Alan ford is a different kettle of fish and warrants inclusion, I don't know where Wallace was this year but he isn't any better then what's there now imo. Someone said earlier on here that Gallagher and Shane mcentee aren't up to it...... Shane mc isn't an intercounty midfielder but he would be a valuable squad member, but Jesus Christ regards Gallagher, what championship were you watching, he wasn't great yesterday in the 2nd half but I thought had an excellent 1st half, he totally marked Con o Callaghan out of it against dublin, COC scored 1-0 That day, but I think Gallagher might even have been gone off by the time he scored the goal...... he was excellent against Clare and had a brilliant league.....I'm honestly wondering did u type Gallagher by mistake

southmeathgael (Meath) - Posts: 706 - 22/07/2019 13:02:12    2214661

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Replying To southmeathgael:  "I wouldn't be touching b conlon POR or mckeever with a barge pole, Alan ford is a different kettle of fish and warrants inclusion, I don't know where Wallace was this year but he isn't any better then what's there now imo. Someone said earlier on here that Gallagher and Shane mcentee aren't up to it...... Shane mc isn't an intercounty midfielder but he would be a valuable squad member, but Jesus Christ regards Gallagher, what championship were you watching, he wasn't great yesterday in the 2nd half but I thought had an excellent 1st half, he totally marked Con o Callaghan out of it against dublin, COC scored 1-0 That day, but I think Gallagher might even have been gone off by the time he scored the goal...... he was excellent against Clare and had a brilliant league.....I'm honestly wondering did u type Gallagher by mistake"
Correct and Right...

Unsure who thinks Alan Forde may be a player next year dont think he has played with OMahonys in 2/3 years and is retired having suffered injuries. Once he was a great prospect.

Brownepat (Meath) - Posts: 462 - 22/07/2019 13:29:25    2214684

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Replying To ASaminthehand:  "The Wallaces aren't playing for Ratoath!"
Yeah and I never mentioned them.

jackhackett (Meath) - Posts: 763 - 22/07/2019 13:34:26    2214689

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Replying To Aloblack:  "Agree with pretty much the majority of your post . Although think your being a bit harsh on Gallagher. Struggled a bit yesterday but I've seen enough good things from him this year to make me belive he has something to offer . Picking up the phone to Brian Conlon again I wouldn't be so sure about. Against donegal 2 years ago in navan I came away thinking we've a real find on our hands here . Since then however I've seen him several times for club and county including 5 or 6 times this year for his club and his performances haven't been up to scratch. Doing ok buy certainly not putting his hand up to be called into the panel for next year."
Cheers Alo, admit i might be harsh on Shane for sure but I'm not fully convinced. He just seems to give 2/3 yards and the better forwards will thrive in that space. Certainly he's deserving of a place on the panel and could develop further. On Conlon, you again could be right and if Ronan Jones is available he and mento are the pairing i'd go with first but Conlon as another string to that midfield could help. We ideally need finishers coming in which we don't have. At midfield we don't have anyone coming in and closing out the game ala McCauley for Dublin (when he's not starting) who can catch a ball and drive on for scores. Maybe Devine would be an option for there as i don't think he's a half forward. Give him a couple of games at midfield in the league and see how he does.

brian (Meath) - Posts: 899 - 22/07/2019 13:36:56    2214692

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Replying To brian:  "Cheers Alo, admit i might be harsh on Shane for sure but I'm not fully convinced. He just seems to give 2/3 yards and the better forwards will thrive in that space. Certainly he's deserving of a place on the panel and could develop further. On Conlon, you again could be right and if Ronan Jones is available he and mento are the pairing i'd go with first but Conlon as another string to that midfield could help. We ideally need finishers coming in which we don't have. At midfield we don't have anyone coming in and closing out the game ala McCauley for Dublin (when he's not starting) who can catch a ball and drive on for scores. Maybe Devine would be an option for there as i don't think he's a half forward. Give him a couple of games at midfield in the league and see how he does."
Perhaps conlon could be one of those lads that ups his game when he goes up the levels . If he got brought in and was told there's a chance for u here to stake ur claim. There was definitely something there going on some of his performances a couple of years back and still young enough to reach those levels again

Aloblack (Meath) - Posts: 265 - 22/07/2019 13:50:09    2214701

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Replying To brian:  "Cheers Alo, admit i might be harsh on Shane for sure but I'm not fully convinced. He just seems to give 2/3 yards and the better forwards will thrive in that space. Certainly he's deserving of a place on the panel and could develop further. On Conlon, you again could be right and if Ronan Jones is available he and mento are the pairing i'd go with first but Conlon as another string to that midfield could help. We ideally need finishers coming in which we don't have. At midfield we don't have anyone coming in and closing out the game ala McCauley for Dublin (when he's not starting) who can catch a ball and drive on for scores. Maybe Devine would be an option for there as i don't think he's a half forward. Give him a couple of games at midfield in the league and see how he does."
Would agree about Devine . Has not got the pace needed for half forward but could be a very good option for Midfeld going forward

Bear10 (Meath) - Posts: 322 - 22/07/2019 13:50:16    2214702

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Replying To redser123:  "Lavin is 24, I would say 4 of our back 6 is top class and would make most teams, in my ideal world the forward line would look something like

10. O'Sullivan
11. Ruairi o'caoilean
12. Mckeever
13. Eamon Wallace
14. Newman
15. Donal lenihan"
Has Dardis, Campion, Shane Walsh or Thomas O'Reilly got a proper chance to make am impact on this team. Talk of the Wallace's and Alan Forde is ridiculous. Our "system" seems to require our forwards bar one to retreat to our 45 m line and then slowly move up the field via handpassing. Not saying any of the above are the answer but give them a proper chance.

Analyst (Meath) - Posts: 1330 - 22/07/2019 14:26:49    2214732

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Hopefully this year being a success will convince more top club players to accept Andy's invitation to join the setup. We all know how many have refused over the last few years. This year has proved we could compete in Div 1 and with the top teams bar Dublin. It's surely a more attractive proposition now.

Jack_Goff (Meath) - Posts: 2920 - 22/07/2019 14:29:18    2214733

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