National Forum

Dublin v Kerry

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Replying To plike:  "Connolly should have been hauled ashore. Unlike the Gooch, he will sail again when he sorts his rigging out.

As for Geaney, I'm not sure what the deal was. A draw would have been a fair result BUT I think Dublin would have won that anyway.

The fitness levels, speed of movement and (to borrow a phrase) offloading by Kerry just isn't good enough at present. We're not far off though... and all those who talk of Fitz facing a mutiny should be keel hauled, at the very least (ie dragged off to slaughter in Rathkeale)"
Plike, u say Dermo should have been taken off......? Was that before or after he kicked the score of the day off his left in full stride to win the game???

Liamwalkinstown (Dublin) - Posts: 8166 - 29/08/2016 12:34:14    1907507

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Replying To browncows:  "woops (Kerry) -the crucial decision were down to Kerry themselves- in the last 5 minutes Gooch kicked an easy ball into the keepers hand and the corner forward (sub) carried the ball towards the corner flag and gave it away easy- those two incidents lost the match at the end plus a weak performance after half time. Great match to watch and nothing in it at the end and the best of luck going forward to all in the kingdom"
I don't think Kerry would be allowed to call the free on Cowley, that is why the ref is there.

neverright (Roscommon) - Posts: 1648 - 29/08/2016 12:41:20    1907515

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Replying To Liamwalkinstown:  "Plike, u say Dermo should have been taken off......? Was that before or after he kicked the score of the day off his left in full stride to win the game???"
... And played a big part in the build up to Kev Mcs score

Echo's of 2011 when showing the same grit and composure to retain possession and give the right pass to Kev Mc

Hauled off?

jimbodub (Dublin) - Posts: 20763 - 29/08/2016 12:56:29    1907528

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Hey Jimbo....... Wwaahheeyyy!! Yeow!

Liamwalkinstown (Dublin) - Posts: 8166 - 29/08/2016 12:59:10    1907532

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Replying To jimbodub:  "Jackos.Wackos

It was not shoulder to shoulder

I watched it last night and he shouldered him in the fore head

It's as clear as day, it was a frontal challenge and he played the man, making no attempt to play the ball"
I agree, looked a foul as did Kevin Mc on Crowley but the ref only has a split second to make his mind up so unless he's 100% certain can he give the foul? On a side note, I don't think any player lining up a shoulder on a player has any intention of playing the ball. He looking to stop the man first and doesn't have his eyes on the ball.

Mobot (Donegal) - Posts: 459 - 29/08/2016 13:10:37    1907544

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Replying To cavanman47:  "On the recent "things in the gaa that make you cringe", one of mine was this BS people come out with that team X can't blame a refereeing error because they should have been out of sight / were outscored in the 2nd half, etc.

A goal is worth 3 points for a reason. There was a point between the sides when the referee made a critical error in not awarding Kerry a free. They lost. Regardless of what went before, it is absolutely correct to say that the error had a massive impact in the result."
Yes but it's swings and roundabouts I guess. If the umpire had not flagged that goal, if O'Mahony had walked for his shoukder charge to Philly's chin, if Kerry had received two black cards. Lots of decisions influence games but to say that this ref robbed Kerry, as I have heard some say, is downright wrong. If Crowley had got his free and nothing came of it then Dublin would have won anyway. If they had scored then it would have spurred Dublin on more I'm sure and they probably still would have won. It's like that Kerry's own decisions may have cost them more than the referee's. Taking Geaney off, introducing JOD too late, bringing a back on for a forward when the game was there for the taking, leaving Gooch on when he was jaded, failing to maintain a high press. I jest but maybe Kerry supporters should save their bottle throwing for the management team as looks as though they have more questions to answer than the Meath referee.

Joxer (Dublin) - Posts: 4737 - 29/08/2016 13:12:55    1907546

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I really enjoyed that game, it had everything you want with some great play and scores, mistakes and big hits from both teams. I thought the ref done fairly well too. There is always gonna be a few decisions that might annoy supporters from both teams but the ref is human and is going to make 1 or 2 mistakes the same way most of the players did yesterday. Huge credit must be given to Kerry for putting it up to this super Dublin team. I think yesterday really showed how far this Dublin team have come since 2014. When they went from 5 points in front to 5 points behind against Donegal they panicked and started going for goals rather than taking their points and ended up losing but yesterday in a similar position they never panicked and kept on chipping away with the points and grounded out a deserved win. I do believe this Dublin team is now the complete team, nothing seems to phase them anymore. Whats even more remarkable is the fact they are missing their All Star full back and last years FOTY. I actually fancied Kerry coming into the game because I didn't think Dublin were themselves but I was proven well wrong with that. Mayo are next up but I can't see how Mayo can trouble them at all, Mayo haven't been anywhere near as impressive as previous years and now face arguably the best team that's ever been so everything points to a comfortable Dublin win.

Kerry aren't going away anytime soon either judging by their minor team and their previous 2 minor teams. They will have a number of retirements but look as if they have great replacements coming through and will be challenging for honours. And with alot of the Dublin team in the late 20's early 30's things you could have a reverse sort of fixture in 2 or 3 years time.

Mobot (Donegal) - Posts: 459 - 29/08/2016 13:30:50    1907560

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What a wonderful game! It'll stand the test of time as one of the really great games of Gaelic football.

I'd like opinions on a few puzzling tactical decisons made by the Kerry management:
1) The decision to take off a forward (Geaney) and replace him with a back (O Se): to me it looked like a very negative move, and one that ultimately backfired
2) The decision not to contest Dublin kickouts in the second half. Kerry's period of dominance in the first half was based on going "man for man" on Cluxton's kickouts, but this tactic was abandoned after half time.

football first (None) - Posts: 1259 - 29/08/2016 13:31:21    1907563

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What a dismal monday in work for us Kerry folk... yesterday was an enthralling, captivating game of football and both teams should be proud. Massive credit has to go to the dubs players and sideline, losing two all-star quality backs from last year and still they drive on and win from 5 down at half time. A truly remarkable team.

The most disappointing thing for me is we have now lost to Dublin every way possible since 2011, off the cuff approach, defensive approach, attacking approach, wet day, dry day!! Hard to know where else to go. Our own kick-out strategy was a disaster in the first half and that cost us dearly. You can point to reffing decisions, particularly the crowley "shoulder", but in reality we had chances to win the game and we didnt take them.

As a history buff, jaysus I cannot abide seeing those 1916 Dublin jerseys ye have now with "Dublin, the city that fought an empire" emblazoned across the back. Its is really embarrassing to look at .... I mean historically that statement is about as accurate as saying "Maggie Thatcher invented the dummy solo". Yeah it took place in Dublin, but to claim it as a dublin-only event and print it on a jersey, christ on a bike, thats cringe worthy. Anyway, sour-grape-induced rant over.

Good luck to both sides in the final...

Mossycurr (Kerry) - Posts: 8 - 29/08/2016 13:36:02    1907568

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Replying To football first:  "What a wonderful game! It'll stand the test of time as one of the really great games of Gaelic football.

I'd like opinions on a few puzzling tactical decisons made by the Kerry management:
1) The decision to take off a forward (Geaney) and replace him with a back (O Se): to me it looked like a very negative move, and one that ultimately backfired
2) The decision not to contest Dublin kickouts in the second half. Kerry's period of dominance in the first half was based on going "man for man" on Cluxton's kickouts, but this tactic was abandoned after half time."
Absolutely agree, geaney was running on empty after a massive effort but he is a clinical finisher and an absolute nightmare for defenders. Take anyone else off but geaney. He's as slippery as an eel and the man you want a last minute chance to fall to.

Mossycurr (Kerry) - Posts: 8 - 29/08/2016 13:41:42    1907572

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Replying To Joxer:  "Yes but it's swings and roundabouts I guess. If the umpire had not flagged that goal, if O'Mahony had walked for his shoukder charge to Philly's chin, if Kerry had received two black cards. Lots of decisions influence games but to say that this ref robbed Kerry, as I have heard some say, is downright wrong. If Crowley had got his free and nothing came of it then Dublin would have won anyway. If they had scored then it would have spurred Dublin on more I'm sure and they probably still would have won. It's like that Kerry's own decisions may have cost them more than the referee's. Taking Geaney off, introducing JOD too late, bringing a back on for a forward when the game was there for the taking, leaving Gooch on when he was jaded, failing to maintain a high press. I jest but maybe Kerry supporters should save their bottle throwing for the management team as looks as though they have more questions to answer than the Meath referee."
Oh Kerry certainly can't deflect all blame away from themselves, and I agree that matches and decisions of the officials within matches ebb and flow. . . .an early officiating error can often spur on the victimized team and thus hamper the benefactor.

BUT. .

when the game is in the balance and the referee makes a big error, if flat out decides the outcome as the hard-done-by team has no time to respond.

And invariably over the past few seasons in big games, these decisions have gone in Dublin's favour.

cavanman47 (Cavan) - Posts: 5244 - 29/08/2016 13:54:44    1907584

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Replying To Mobot:  "I agree, looked a foul as did Kevin Mc on Crowley but the ref only has a split second to make his mind up so unless he's 100% certain can he give the foul? On a side note, I don't think any player lining up a shoulder on a player has any intention of playing the ball. He looking to stop the man first and doesn't have his eyes on the ball."
We were sitting right in front of it .
Lads even at that late stage the game was moving so quick and it looked like a fair hit from where we were.... and the ball had moved off again so quick u couldn't blame the ref at all the pace of that game was unreal !

rossy15 (Roscommon) - Posts: 643 - 29/08/2016 13:56:19    1907586

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Mossycurr agree with you on those jerseys. A bit much I think. I also agree on those two tactical areas. I was baffled when Kerry sat off the kickouts in the second half. Mind you it's hard work pressing up and then recoiling. It takes huge stamina. I don't get the Geaney move. I was delighted with it as it signaled Kerry's intention to hold on. Introducing JOD so late was also baffling. He's a class act and did damage when he came on. A lot of desperate finger pointing at the ref and the Crowley shoulder but IMO the decisions from the bench cost Kerry much more dearly.

Joxer (Dublin) - Posts: 4737 - 29/08/2016 14:01:59    1907590

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Replying To Joxer:  "Mossycurr agree with you on those jerseys. A bit much I think. I also agree on those two tactical areas. I was baffled when Kerry sat off the kickouts in the second half. Mind you it's hard work pressing up and then recoiling. It takes huge stamina. I don't get the Geaney move. I was delighted with it as it signaled Kerry's intention to hold on. Introducing JOD so late was also baffling. He's a class act and did damage when he came on. A lot of desperate finger pointing at the ref and the Crowley shoulder but IMO the decisions from the bench cost Kerry much more dearly."
Yeah hard to argue with those points, apparently JOD had very little football played and thus wasnt sharp or fit enough to start. Geaney came off in 2015 final aswell which was equally strange.

On the Dublin kickouts, I have to say it was so exciting to watch when kerry did flick the switch with about 8-10 minutes left in the first half. Having sat back for so long, all of a sudden we had 2 outfield players left at home, 2-3 in and around midfield and all other kerry players deep inside the dublin half with both hands up. It must have been a quare sight for cluxtons point of view to try to find a man. It looked so well drilled and organised, hard to understand why we didnt try it again for the first 10 minutes of the second half anyway. Mayo take note!!

Mossycurr (Kerry) - Posts: 8 - 29/08/2016 14:29:31    1907610

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Replying To Joxer:  "Mossycurr agree with you on those jerseys. A bit much I think. I also agree on those two tactical areas. I was baffled when Kerry sat off the kickouts in the second half. Mind you it's hard work pressing up and then recoiling. It takes huge stamina. I don't get the Geaney move. I was delighted with it as it signaled Kerry's intention to hold on. Introducing JOD so late was also baffling. He's a class act and did damage when he came on. A lot of desperate finger pointing at the ref and the Crowley shoulder but IMO the decisions from the bench cost Kerry much more dearly."
Hindsight is 20/20. I don't think it's possible to push up on the kickouts for 70 minutes. Geaney was completely spent when he came off and hadn't touched the ball in 10 minutes. JOD wasn't fit or he'd have started. I wouldn't blame the bench or the ref or the weather or anything else. Fitzmaurice got a lot more right than wrong. It was one of those games that could have fallen either way and Dublin were better when it really counted in that second half.

It gives us huge hope for the future and we look forward to many more battles with the dubs. I think we'll catch up eventually and are the team most likely to overtake Dublin in the next few years.

GeniusGerry (Kerry) - Posts: 2113 - 29/08/2016 14:31:18    1907613

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Replying To Joxer:  "Mossycurr agree with you on those jerseys. A bit much I think. I also agree on those two tactical areas. I was baffled when Kerry sat off the kickouts in the second half. Mind you it's hard work pressing up and then recoiling. It takes huge stamina. I don't get the Geaney move. I was delighted with it as it signaled Kerry's intention to hold on. Introducing JOD so late was also baffling. He's a class act and did damage when he came on. A lot of desperate finger pointing at the ref and the Crowley shoulder but IMO the decisions from the bench cost Kerry much more dearly."
On bringing marc o'sé on, dublin have blitzed us in the last few minutes of previous meetings. Your own reservoir dubs tweeted the stat since AIF 2013, the last 10 minutes of games were 4-10 to 0-4 in favor of the dubs, so i understand why fitzmaurice wanted an extra body back there. I dont think it was to necessarily hold on for a replay, i think the plan was clearly to shore things up at the back and use obrien and JOD to run at dublin defence and kick a score or draw a free. I would have taken off a different forward though!

Mossycurr (Kerry) - Posts: 8 - 29/08/2016 14:42:26    1907624

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Replying To Joxer:  "Mossycurr agree with you on those jerseys. A bit much I think. I also agree on those two tactical areas. I was baffled when Kerry sat off the kickouts in the second half. Mind you it's hard work pressing up and then recoiling. It takes huge stamina. I don't get the Geaney move. I was delighted with it as it signaled Kerry's intention to hold on. Introducing JOD so late was also baffling. He's a class act and did damage when he came on. A lot of desperate finger pointing at the ref and the Crowley shoulder but IMO the decisions from the bench cost Kerry much more dearly."
On bringing marc o'sé on, dublin have blitzed us in the last few minutes of previous meetings. Your own reservoir dubs tweeted the stat since AIF 2013, the last 10 minutes of games were 4-10 to 0-4 in favor of the dubs, so i understand why fitzmaurice wanted an extra body back there. I dont think it was to necessarily hold on for a replay, i think the plan was clearly to shore things up at the back and use obrien and JOD to run at dublin defence and kick a score or draw a free. I would have taken off a different forward though!

Mossycurr (Kerry) - Posts: 8 - 29/08/2016 14:52:44    1907638

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Replying To GeniusGerry:  "Hindsight is 20/20. I don't think it's possible to push up on the kickouts for 70 minutes. Geaney was completely spent when he came off and hadn't touched the ball in 10 minutes. JOD wasn't fit or he'd have started. I wouldn't blame the bench or the ref or the weather or anything else. Fitzmaurice got a lot more right than wrong. It was one of those games that could have fallen either way and Dublin were better when it really counted in that second half.

It gives us huge hope for the future and we look forward to many more battles with the dubs. I think we'll catch up eventually and are the team most likely to overtake Dublin in the next few years."
Hup outta that, thats the kind of positive thinking we need to get through today! Young David Clifford a minor again next year! The future is bright.

Mossycurr (Kerry) - Posts: 8 - 29/08/2016 14:56:22    1907640

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Replying To Liamwalkinstown:  "Hey Jimbo....... Wwaahheeyyy!! Yeow!"
I second those noises

:)

Well said.

jimbodub (Dublin) - Posts: 20763 - 29/08/2016 15:11:11    1907650

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On the hit on Crowley. Was it any different than the hit O'Mahony gave Philly McMahon. I dont think so. Funny as i sat through the game i though the ref did a pretty good job at trying to let the game flow.

I have sat through games this year with a lot of possesion football and you could hear a pin drop in the crowd as the ball is passed over and back. Its turns over like this and quick breaks up the field that get a crowd excited. It needs to come back into the game, maybe not necessarily from big hits but the ability to force a turnover.

ponger (Cavan) - Posts: 547 - 29/08/2016 15:55:13    1907683

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