Apparently the county council want to talk to the three share holders in Clones about including an upgrade in the planned regeneration of Clones town, The refurbishment would be to safeguard the Ulster final in Clones for many years to come. The planned refurbishment would start as soon as possible, the county council realises how important the ground is for the economy of the town. Can't see it going ahead if am honest.

shaggylegend (Monaghan) - Posts: 1940 - 17/01/2015 10:56:26    1684013

Tim_Burr
County: Down
Posts: 369

1683824
I go away for a week and this is still being discussed - the minute I read that Belfast and to a lesser extent Antrim and Gods own county (An Dún) arent really GAA areas and Belfast was similiar to Derry soccer city, then I knew enough was enough!!

"Never argue with a fool, onlookers may not be able to tell the difference."

My statement was that I believe there are more Gael's within 9 county Ulster who reside outside of Antrim and Down, despite the large number of Catholics who reside there.

GaryMc82 (Derry) - Posts: 3017 - 17/01/2015 21:57:32    1684146

I had some figures regarding Club members, however I'm waiting on a few more. I want to produce accurate figures, which will take some time

GaryMc82 (Derry) - Posts: 3017 - 17/01/2015 21:59:07    1684147

Tim_Burr
County: Down
Posts: 369

1683824
I go away for a week and this is still being discussed - the minute I read that Belfast and to a lesser extent Antrim and Gods own county (An Dún) arent really GAA areas and Belfast was similiar to Derry soccer city, then I knew enough was enough!!

"Never argue with a fool, onlookers may not be able to tell the difference."


"When a person cannot factually counter a stronger argument, they attack with Insult to avoid retreat."



1. Within 9 County Ulster, I put forward the argument that there are more GAA Club members, GAA Season ticket holders and larger overall attendance figures outside of County Antrim and County Down than inside those two combined.
I have heard that Donegal/Tyrone have by far the highest Club membership in Ulster, and also the highest attendance figures and Season tickets ( eg. Donegal has 840 season ticket holders in 2014 ). So while you may view your own area as Strong GAA area's, You must also consider that other area's may be just as strong if not stronger. From my Initial figures and discussion with various Gaels so far, I heard Indications that Armagh, Monaghan and Cavan rival Co Down and Co Antrim in these figures too.


2. As for my comparing Belfast to Derry, this was in response to Ulsterman from Co Antrim. He asked on my thoughts on Celtic Park being located in my own backyard, while the majority of Derry support which comes from Co Derry which to travel a great distance to games. Clearly he asked the question already suspecting I would be like the Antrim fans on here and support keeping the GAA County ground in the City. However he was wrong, and the question didn't have the Intended effect.


To find out how strong a GAA County really is, I figured the following 3 questions would give a fairly accurate Indication.
- Senior club membership is a strong Indication of how strong GAA is within any given area.
- Match attendance figures can also aid this, showing a strong passion for the game within a wider region.
- Season tickets are an addtional way of Including those who attend most matches, yet who may not necessarily be a club member.

This survey should give a definitive answer to whether or not Antrim/Down has more Gael's than Donegal, Derry, Tyrone, Fermanagh, Cavan, Monaghan and Armagh.

GaryMc82 (Derry) - Posts: 3017 - 18/01/2015 13:52:30    1684184

GaryMac82: you can claim moral victory with statistics to back up your argument but ultimately Casement Park redevelopment is the "only show in town with no alternative venue". It may not be ideally located but it is what it is

KevHill (Antrim) - Posts: 271 - 19/01/2015 13:53:26    1684509

Fair play to Monaghan, their politicians and locals with influence for not giving up the Ulster final without a fight. I will be interested to see the outcome but at least they are giving it a go rather than just standing idly by or posting on message boards. If anything it put the onus on the Ulster council to explain their reasoning - well it might.

Naysayer (Antrim) - Posts: 2071 - 19/01/2015 14:40:35    1684536

KevHill
County: Antrim
Posts: 270

1684509
GaryMac82: you can claim moral victory with statistics to back up your argument but ultimately Casement Park redevelopment is the "only show in town with no alternative venue". It may not be ideally located but it is what it is

I claimed Moral victory in this argument weeks ago, now at least somebody from Antrim has acknowledged that fact. Whether or not the Stadium goes ahead, I want to highlight the vast contempt for the GAA fans in this situation.

When the Casement Park project was originally announced, I assumed a meticulous study was carried out on choosing the location and the general needs of GAA fans within the province. However the more I looked into this project, the more I found a bad stench. Nothing added up in terms of statistics or logistic's, Yet we have a host of people blindly supporting it.

Then I found out money was subject to "Stadium in Belfast or you get nothing" from the British Government. And that this had become a money grabbing exercise, with no thought for the majority of people who fund the GAA in this Province.

GaryMc82 (Derry) - Posts: 3017 - 19/01/2015 21:38:33    1684668

Wise up Gary Mc. Its a small province, doesn't take too long to get from Belfast from anywhere. Makes sense to have a venue we can show off in the capital. Now been done with this thread

redhanddefender (Tyrone) - Posts: 913 - 20/01/2015 08:23:00    1684674

I claimed Moral victory in this argument weeks ago, now at least somebody from Antrim has acknowledged that fact

Ha, plenty of us acknowledged the fact that you had claimed victory. You may also have noted that a few Antrim posters claimed victory too. But maybe irony isn't your strong point.... ;-)

Offside_Rule (Antrim) - Posts: 4058 - 20/01/2015 08:43:41    1684676

Any luck with those facts Gary? I see your hunting for GAA memebership stats but be careful, are you aware of the amount of GAA clubs that surround the Casement area in comparison to all your 'central' obscure venue ideals?

SaffronDon (Antrim) - Posts: 2488 - 20/01/2015 09:20:41    1684679

GaryMc82 can we leave this statistics talk to one side? We have no consensus on what are even meaningful statistics and we have had no statistics apart from some census figures I qouted and maybe a few other bits and pieces. But the thing with statistics is that they are subjective and often do not tell the full story so should be used with caution and interpreted with even more caution. To claim you have won an argument using potentially shallow statistics that you are withholding is pretty low end stuff.

Naysayer (Antrim) - Posts: 2071 - 20/01/2015 09:30:08    1684682

FOR THE LOVE OF GOD CAN YOU PLEASE GIVE IT A REST GARYMC82..
no matter what you say or point you think you have to prove ...
all your talk is nonsense .

redmick (Antrim) - Posts: 92 - 20/01/2015 10:44:50    1684706

redhanddefender
County: Tyrone
Posts: 592

1684674
Wise up Gary Mc. Its a small province, doesn't take too long to get from Belfast from anywhere. Makes sense to have a venue we can show off in the capital. Now been done with this thread

- Ulster is the 2nd largest Province in Ireland in terms of size, 2nd in terms of population.
- Takes nearly 3 hours from some parts of the Province to Belfast,
- Belfast is no capital.

Think a little before you post telling me to wise up,

GaryMc82 (Derry) - Posts: 3017 - 20/01/2015 13:49:58    1684784

KevHill
County: Antrim
Posts: 270

1684509
GaryMac82: you can claim moral victory with statistics to back up your argument but ultimately Casement Park redevelopment is the "only show in town with no alternative venue". It may not be ideally located but it is what it is

GaryMac82; I only acknowledged that you "can claim moral victory:" I never stated that you actually won: by the way will you apply the same vigour as to why is Brandywell being redeveloped when a more central ground would facilitate all the people of Derry?

KevHill (Antrim) - Posts: 271 - 20/01/2015 14:02:11    1684792

Naysayer
County: Antrim
Posts: 1103

1684682
GaryMc82 can we leave this statistics talk to one side? We have no consensus on what are even meaningful statistics and we have had no statistics apart from some census figures I qouted and maybe a few other bits and pieces. But the thing with statistics is that they are subjective and often do not tell the full story so should be used with caution and interpreted with even more caution. To claim you have won an argument using potentially shallow statistics that you are withholding is pretty low end stuff.

Statistics are everything when it comes to planning any major project, as this often gives a strong Indication of the probable viability of the project.

I think my way of measuring it was both fair and accurate. Club membership per County paints a very strong picture of GAA following within that area, choosing to Ignore this would be foolish as there is no real alternative to measure this.
However, not wanting to exclude Non-Club member fans, I am willing to count a combination of Season ticket holders and/or average attendance figures to Inter county games per year.

I'm a GAA fan from Ulster, who wants a suitable Ulster Provincial GAA Stadium to serve all our needs. And looking at where "We" all are, Is a key way of determining a suitable location. This was never studied, nor was many other things in planning this.

GaryMc82 (Derry) - Posts: 3017 - 20/01/2015 14:06:31    1684794

- Ulster is the 2nd largest Province in Ireland in terms of size, 2nd in terms of population.

2nd largest or 3rd smallest?

MesAmis (Dublin) - Posts: 13777 - 20/01/2015 14:17:08    1684797

Tell me then redhandefender whats the capital of Connacht, surely every province should have one according to you?

brendtheredhand (Tyrone) - Posts: 10897 - 20/01/2015 14:41:51    1684811

2nd largest or 3rd smallest?

lol - deep MesAmis.

Offside_Rule (Antrim) - Posts: 4058 - 20/01/2015 14:53:20    1684815

Statistics are everything when it comes to planning any major project, as this often gives a strong Indication of the probable viability of the project.

Gary I am a big fan of statistics and agree with the above statement.

However my point was that they should be used with caution and be appropriate. Have a leaf through the code of practice for official statistics some time ;)

Naysayer (Antrim) - Posts: 2071 - 20/01/2015 15:08:45    1684823

More importantly, what about Cargin drawing St Galls again lads!

bumpernut (Antrim) - Posts: 1852 - 20/01/2015 15:18:03    1684824