Were any handball courts going be included in this development?
If not, it is a huge oversight, considering there are more handball clubs in Belfast than any other city.

valley84 (Westmeath) - Posts: 1891 - 02/01/2015 12:40:50    1680161

Gary - still don't think you get it and God knows I have tried to educate on this topic so I will let you hold on to this idea of where else this stadium could go ahead. After you have done we can then start discussing other such topics as why the International Airport should have been in Cookstown or how a new Childrens Hospital should be located in Dungannon - somebody please think of the Children!!

Offside_Rule (Antrim) - Posts: 4058 - 02/01/2015 17:15:22    1680193

Offside_Rule
County: Antrim
Posts: 1853

1680193
Gary - still don't think you get it and God knows I have tried to educate on this topic so I will let you hold on to this idea of where else this stadium could go ahead. After you have done we can then start discussing other such topics as why the International Airport should have been in Cookstown or how a new Childrens Hospital should be located in Dungannon - somebody please think of the Children!!


Perhap's the education would be better served a little closer to home

I can understand a large International airport been located in a large city, as International commuters have many amenities in one central location to assist with the wide variety of reasons they are here.

Likewise Specialist hospital's are located in major Cities, as these are only attended in special cases which a regional general hospital can't be of service.

But an Ulster GAA Stadium of which main purpose will be to host all Important Ulster GAA matches from the 9 Counties of Ulster, that doesn't need to be in Belfast. Why? Because the vast majority of people visiting the Stadium will travel to it from their homes the morning of the match, and travel home that evening after the match.

In all the games attended in Casement over the past 20 years, I don't know many who have stayed overnight before or after the match. I also don't recall any shopping taking place before or after the game. Especially not on a Sunday in Belfast.
So whatever benefits Belfast have to offer to GAA fans on matchday, certainly haven't been relevant in the recent past.

GaryMc82 (Derry) - Posts: 3017 - 03/01/2015 13:32:16    1680250

Tim_Burr
County: Down
Posts: 363

1680159
All this nonsense re Clones, A5 link road,gaels from far flungs parts of ulster etc.. are all irrelevant as this stadium is for Belfast and Belfast only and anyone who thinks differently is just deluded.

Ask yourselves how many local politicians,MLAs, MPs, Euro MPs and county boards in the West of the Bann have come out supporting a move


Yes of course the British want the money to stay in Belfast, but they will still need to commit the funds regardless of where the Stadium is located. Why? Because they already gave a similar amount to both Rugby and Soccer Stadiums, and will need to give the Nationalist sports something similar.

Its a matter of fighting for it, and there was no fight from the Ulster GAA council.

Whats the arguments for the Stadium? It has to be in a Belfast City, because other major things are in Belfast, like the Specialist Children's hospital or an International Airport or the Titanic Quarters!!!!. The British told dictated to them, and proved money buys you power over the GAA.

Argument against the Stadium? The remedy to years of long trek to Clones for fans all over Ulster, Is to put a new Stadium in the extreme east of the province. Equally long trek for many, but sure at least the roads are better and Belfast has loads to do.....err on a Sunday evening

GaryMc82 (Derry) - Posts: 3017 - 03/01/2015 13:47:15    1680255

Get rid of the chip Gary and embrace your countries second City.

Offside_Rule (Antrim) - Posts: 4058 - 03/01/2015 19:35:59    1680300

Judging by the latest few posts directed at GaryMc82, it looks like the Antrim boys have hit a brick wall in terms of their flimsy defence of pumping £80M into a lost entity. It has to be a Tyrone venue now or no change, as the Belfast application is fundamentally flawed on several fronts as pointed out by the judge. And believe me, there was a lot at stake here and the judge didn't run a bus through the application just for the craic of it. This is a lot more than just a few minor tweaks that some on here are attempting to present it as.

drumlinbelt (Monaghan) - Posts: 179 - 04/01/2015 12:15:17    1680337

Time to start reading posts drumlinbelt. At the moment the only show in town is Casement and from my reading and sources it will go ahead as per last plans submitted. Now, nothing in the North is ever certain and if for some reason it doesn't go ahead in Casement then I will happily engage in further debate as to where a new stadium goes. Until it is announced its not going ahead in Antrim then there is no point playing what ifs.

Offside_Rule (Antrim) - Posts: 4058 - 04/01/2015 19:48:57    1680456

Offside_Rule
County: Antrim
Posts: 1855

1680456
Time to start reading posts drumlinbelt. At the moment the only show in town is Casement and from my reading and sources it will go ahead as per last plans submitted. Now, nothing in the North is ever certain and if for some reason it doesn't go ahead in Casement then I will happily engage in further debate as to where a new stadium goes. Until it is announced its not going ahead in Antrim then there is no point playing what ifs.

Well at the moment Casement isn't going ahead as of the last hearing, currently the only show in town is Clones.

Regardless of whether any future planning bid's to develop Casement Park succeed, at least this debate has highlighted the entire project process was flawed and clearly manipulated to serve a non-GAA agenda.

The main reason for locating Ulster's Premier Provincial GAA Stadium in Belfast? It will be Ideally located for the Rugby World Cup's International fans flying in.........Fact.

GaryMc82 (Derry) - Posts: 3017 - 04/01/2015 20:51:51    1680485

Offside_Rule
County: Antrim
Posts: 1855

1680300
Get rid of the chip Gary and embrace your countries second City.

Time to abandon your parochial selfishness, and think of the other 8 Counties in Ulster like I have.

If we are expected still travel for 2 hours after the £70 million is forked out on a new Stadium, then I would be happy enough sticking with Clones.
At least while travelling to Clones, me and the family can stop for Selfies and sandwiches with the fallen Wind turbine outside Fintona ( Future landmark and tourist attraction )

GaryMc82 (Derry) - Posts: 3017 - 04/01/2015 21:09:42    1680490

The entire project wasn't flawed. The traffic management side of it posed problems as there wasn't clarity on the information provided and how it was presented left the Judge with no option but to ask for the whole thing to be resubmitted. The stadium part of the plans had already been gone through and no issue raised. Plans will be resubmitted in 5months or so. Fact.

Offside_Rule (Antrim) - Posts: 4058 - 04/01/2015 21:35:46    1680494

FFS Gary change the record, you dont like casement or Belfast and you love Mid Ulster as its.... well in the middle!!

And believe me Casement is the only show in town and WILL go ahead.

bumpernut (Antrim) - Posts: 1852 - 05/01/2015 13:02:29    1680589

Offside_Rule
County: Antrim
Posts: 1856

1680494
The entire project wasn't flawed. The traffic management side of it posed problems as there wasn't clarity on the information provided and how it was presented left the Judge with no option but to ask for the whole thing to be resubmitted. The stadium part of the plans had already been gone through and no issue raised. Plans will be resubmitted in 5months or so. Fact.


Yes the entire project is seriously flawed, as this Bristish funding was sold to the Ulster GAA with "Spend the money in Belfast, or else you won't get any" tag line attached.
So with their eyes glazed and mouths watering by the sheer amount of cash in front of them, the Ulster council or Croke Park bent over without so much as a wimper.

When a £70 million project needs to be re-submitted due to poor presentation and lack of clarity, It would suggest the whole thing was rushed through and not well thought out. But why would such a major and Important project be rushed through. This proves the project is flawed, and hasn't received the meticulous thought and attention such a project should be given.

I think the Ulster Council owes it to the 9 counties they represent, to put deep thought and consideration into a decision that has a long term Impact to the people they represent. I would be confident a proper in-depth study would favour a green field site to build a new Stadium, and I reckon that Stadium would be somewhere in Co Tyrone. I also reckon the bulk of Ulster would back this over Casement if the option was presented to them.

GaryMc82 (Derry) - Posts: 3017 - 05/01/2015 13:27:09    1680602

Gary do you still not understand that every point you make is irrelevant? This has nothing to do with the Ulster council its a Government project and they want Belfast, deal with that fact please.

After 11 pages of recycling your anti Belfast views, hows about packing it in? new year new start, eh? all this resentment cant be good for your health

SaffronDon (Antrim) - Posts: 2487 - 05/01/2015 13:44:04    1680611

bumpernut
County: Antrim
Posts: 724

1680589
FFS Gary change the record, you dont like casement or Belfast and you love Mid Ulster as its.... well in the middle!!

And believe me Casement is the only show in town and WILL go ahead.

No I've always been clear, I don't mind Casement getting a facelift or Antrim GAA getting millions of funding.

My problem is that the Stadium is also earmarked to be Ulster GAA's premier showpiece Stadium, and It simply isn't the best option for that specific purpose.

Yourself and Offside_rule etc have continuously proved on this thread and previous threads that there no decent argument to make Casement Ulster's main Stadium.

While logic would tells us the main purpose of a Provincial GAA Stadium is to serve the needs of the Provincial GAA Counties, yet there are some who believe otherwise mostly due to parochial bias rather than any logical argument.

We have 9 counties in Ulster, and Tyrone is the most central on the map. My argument are based around the logic that the primary function of a Provincial Stadium is to serve the whole Province and not International and Non-GAA needs.

Whats yours?

GaryMc82 (Derry) - Posts: 3017 - 05/01/2015 14:10:27    1680630

Yes the entire project is seriously flawed, as this Bristish funding was sold to the Ulster GAA with "Spend the money in Belfast, or else you won't get any" tag line attached.
So with their eyes glazed and mouths watering by the sheer amount of cash in front of them, the Ulster council or Croke Park bent over without so much as a wimper.

Right - now we are getting places. So its not necessary the Plans which were submitted which you are saying was completely flawed but the whole idea of accepting money with preconditions of having it in Belfast. Money was only offered for developing Casement so if its not Casement then the only development to any grounds will be done at the cost of the GAA or in other words, not at all. Maybe those in Ulster GAA are more rational in their thinking and realised that an alternative to Clones was required and that the only sensible option was Belfast so thought their Lottery numbers had come up when they were getting £60m odd offered. I am sure they were quite happy to Pipe whatever tunes those who were paying were calling.

But maybe you are right. Maybe we should turn down this offer of money to have a modern stadium and instead invest in plasters to cover up the cuts on our knuckles.

Offside_Rule (Antrim) - Posts: 4058 - 05/01/2015 14:13:42    1680632

SaffronDon
County: Antrim
Posts: 83

1680611
Gary do you still not understand that every point you make is irrelevant? This has nothing to do with the Ulster council its a Government project and they want Belfast, deal with that fact please.

After 11 pages of recycling your anti Belfast views, hows about packing it in? new year new start, eh? all this resentment cant be good for your health

If my points are so Irrelevant, why do you oppose them so strongly? Why do some Antrim posters use more than one Profile to get their point across.
EXAMPLE: Do you ever notice patterns in how some people word things, I noted recently a strong similarity between an Antrim poster here on this thread and another Infamous Antrim poster on a different main topic thread. Subtle things like spelling and order of wording give this away.

Perhaps if you review the 11 pages, you will note one common theme. Not one genuine or logical argument has been put forward in favour of Casement, which refutes the Anti-Belfast notion.

GaryMc82 (Derry) - Posts: 3017 - 05/01/2015 14:25:15    1680638

Yourself and Offside_rule etc have continuously proved on this thread and previous threads that there no decent argument to make Casement Ulster's main Stadium.

Gary I have given manys a decent arguement for Casement/Belfast and to be honest haven't had any decent arguements back to make me change my mind. Instead we get ill thought out suggestions of green field sites or provincial towns which have their own traffic problems etc on normal days and which would costs millions more than the cost of a stadium to remedy. If someone can provide a proposal which addresses all these, includes costs and where the money is going to come from then I am all ears.

Offside_Rule (Antrim) - Posts: 4058 - 05/01/2015 14:30:13    1680641

Oh and a sustainability plan for said stadium in said location so that the upkeep of it can be maintained.

Offside_Rule (Antrim) - Posts: 4058 - 05/01/2015 14:34:23    1680642

Who do you think is using more than one login by the way Gary and what logins are they using?

Offside_Rule (Antrim) - Posts: 4058 - 05/01/2015 14:42:59    1680648

When choosing the location of a stadium centrality etc is not a consideration, population base, access etc are much more important because the investment in a stadium requires that it be filled on multiple occasions. As examples the following stadia are nowhere near the centre of their respective locales and it doesn't cause too many issues, some other sports have been used.

Croke Park, central east
Wembly stadium South East
Hampden, South East
Millenium Stadium, South Central
Stade de france, North central.

The common thing with all these, large population centers, not ideally situated but stand a chance of being filled. By the logic being used here Croke Park should have been left to rack and ruin and a new stadium been built in Athlone, Mullingar or Tullamore, much more central locations. Would it be nice if a stadium could be built which was central, of course, is it going to happen, not unless a few hundred thousand people suddenly decide to move to cookstown.

duckula20 (Antrim) - Posts: 175 - 05/01/2015 15:28:05    1680662