I don't always agree with McHugh but I think he is 100% right in this, we need to end the backdoor: http://hoganstand.com/ArticleForm.aspx?ID=194718

I've hated it from day one and we were one of the counties who benefited most as we usually got dumped out of Ulster but get a few big days out and would turn up in the All-Ireland quarter finals.

- It devalues the provincial championsip as teams can throw in the towel and know they have the qualifiers.
- It devalues the national league. If there was no backdoor there is no way McGuinness would have had such a relaxed attitude to the league with Tyrone in the first round.
- It ruins club football with counties tied up all summer with no realistic chance of winning Sam.

SeanieSense (Donegal) - Posts: 328 - 18/06/2013 17:25:18    1410087

I think he needs a reality check, back to the days when Kerry or Cork could win the AI after playing three games? smaller counties and their loyal supporters get one day a year to look at their team? I don't think so. What is wrong with six big counties? that is progression from the days when Kerry or Dublin won every year. Its a naïve valuation of the current championship, I admit things could improve but going back to the old set up would be ridiculous. When was the national league ever valued? He may not want to watch the first round of qualifiers this year but I bet he was on the edge of his seat in 09 and 10 waiting to see who Donegal got.

Topa_the_left (Antrim) - Posts: 250 - 18/06/2013 17:57:28    1410124

Did you read all he had to say though? He was in favour of a champions league format for a 2 year trial - 8 groups of 4 teams. While I think this is a good idea, surely it throws up exactly the same problems you mention in your post that the current system has.

benjyyy (Donegal) - Posts: 1450 - 18/06/2013 18:00:01    1410130

https://soundcloud.com/rtesport/now-is-the-time-for-change-i

There's the link to what he had to say.

I don't agree with this champions league seeded type format. Some of the 3rd and 4th games would be meaningless if one county has already qualified and the other county, who they are due to play, has no hope of qualifying. It still throws up problems, and I just can't see it working. You could have Derry playing away to Carlow, Donegal away to Tipperary etc etc, the attendances would be poor with a lot of one sided boring games.

MourneArmy (Down) - Posts: 1787 - 18/06/2013 18:14:43    1410146

Is there anything to be said for saying another mass?

emmomac (UK) - Posts: 273 - 18/06/2013 18:24:50    1410154

The Louth v Wexford game was a good game.

Didn't think the Cavan v Armagh game was a bad game.

THE_SNAPPER (Louth) - Posts: 2019 - 18/06/2013 18:31:40    1410160

Topa_the_left
County: Antrim
Posts: 161

1410124
I think he needs a reality check, back to the days when Kerry or Cork could win the AI after playing three games?

Cork and Kerry were never in a position to win an All-Ireland after just three games. Four was the least number of games they needed. 1. Munster semi-final. 2. Munster Final. 3. All-Ireland semi-final. 4. All Ireland final.

Midleton (Cork) - Posts: 646 - 18/06/2013 18:43:28    1410170

Well they do say paper never refused ink.
What utter utter tripe. And people give out about Spillane, O'Rourke etc. Why is mchugh even allowed to write this same nonsense. He was a better football player. Than pundit. He's just looking for headlines to massage his ego.

Tripe utter tripe.

royaldunne (Meath) - Posts: 19449 - 18/06/2013 18:44:16    1410171

Add him to the list!

TheGateKeeper (Tyrone) - Posts: 2843 - 18/06/2013 19:06:04    1410198

I wonder was he thinking that before 2011?
A bit of success goes to old heads same as young. And he does like to hear himself talk.

derryman (Derry) - Posts: 3246 - 18/06/2013 19:09:10    1410204

There was nothing wrong with the traditional knock-out format, backdoor was just introduced as another money making exercise. In most counties all it resulted in was a back log of club fixtures being played in rain soaked pitches in October without a ball being kicked in the summer months as clubs would refuse to play league fixtures without their county players.

The GAA places a greater importance on making money in an amatuer game than protecting it's clubs.

SeanieSense (Donegal) - Posts: 328 - 18/06/2013 19:09:26    1410206

this guy must be badly in need of money to be trying to make a name for himself as a GAA analyst. utter nonsense that is been peddled by lots of commentators. tell me exactly when it was more competitive, when were there realistically 6 teams who could win it in any given year. will people stop all this rubbish talk about the great divide. It was always there . Do the GAA keep records of every championship match played in the last 20 years. If so then lets see them all , from first round to final . lets see if there is any discernable pattern or trend that indicates a widening discrenency. We need hard facts on this issue otherwise it's just people with short memories or lack of knowledge. for instance what was all the championship scores in 1980 from round 1 to the final. lets have them.

s goldrick (Cavan) - Posts: 5524 - 18/06/2013 19:11:14    1410209

One sided boring games you say MourneArmy!

brendtheredhand (Tyrone) - Posts: 10897 - 18/06/2013 19:17:21    1410213

If he said that then it is absolute nonsense.

A sport where half the teams only get 2 or 3 matches in the top competition and his solution...to reduce it further so that half the teams get only one match.

Lets say you are from Louth and they play one match in the summer against Dublin and lose. Are you going to support Louth or Man Utd/Liverpool?

tyroneed (Tyrone) - Posts: 753 - 18/06/2013 19:39:29    1410228

Midleton
County: Cork
Posts: 219

maybe 4 on paper, but a maximum of three as far as competitiveness ever went

Topa_the_left (Antrim) - Posts: 250 - 18/06/2013 19:40:01    1410229

most of the minnows would prefer to be out and not prolong the agony.at least 20 teams would get hammered by any of the top 5.so its to their detriment really.take clare for instance.a good honest div4 team.they lost a munster semi to cork last sunday.they have to wait to play in the 2nd phase of the qualifers.the chance of them winning is remote.if they were out they could run off the club championship in the best of the summer weather.instead we have a situation where the first round of the club championship isnt til early august.so the back door has stopped club players playing in the summer months.im sure its the same in most other countys.if the league and mcgrath cups etc were taken more seriously the county teams would get at least 15 games a year..?

kavvie (Clare) - Posts: 506 - 18/06/2013 19:55:18    1410251

why cant Clare play their club championship every weekend except the weekend their county plays?

emmomac (UK) - Posts: 273 - 18/06/2013 19:59:58    1410256

dunno really. theres hurlers involved also so the county managers must have requested it.look at recent injurys to key players in leading countys?that the way they do it in clare so thats the situation right or wrong.not fair on club players,plying meaningless games waiting til august

kavvie (Clare) - Posts: 506 - 18/06/2013 20:06:18    1410259

18/06/2013 17:25:18
SeanieSense
I don't always agree with McHugh but I think he is 100% right in this,
we need to end the backdoor: http://hoganstand.com/ArticleForm.aspx?ID=194718

I've hated it from day one and we were one of the counties who benefited most as we usually got
dumped out of Ulster but get a few big days out and would turn up in the All-Ireland quarter finals.
- It devalues the provincial championsip as teams can throw in the towel and know they have the qualifiers.
- It devalues the national league. If there was no backdoor there is no way McGuinness would have had such
a relaxed attitude to the league with Tyrone in the first round.
- It ruins club football with counties tied up all summer with no realistic chance of winning Sam.
Totally disagree.
Backdoor has meant countys get more than 1 game in main competition of the year.
Doesn't devalue provincial championships. Look at how countys that don't win many provincial titles treat their provincial competition. When have you seen countys throw in towel in provincial championship games??
National league isn't devalued but more should be done to link both competitons.
Club football is not ruined because of the qualifiers. Better management and organising of club games is needed and club players should not be left go any more than 3 weeks without championship games in summer.
Proper season structure should be set out at start of every year and changes only allowed in extreme circumstances
18/06/2013 18:00:01
benjyyy
Did you read all he had to say though? He was in favour of a champions league format for a 2 year trial -
8 groups of 4 teams. While I think this is a good idea, surely it throws up exactly the same problems you
mention in your post that the current system has.
8 groups of 4 would be great and if things done properly the provincial championships could still be kept - no replays at any stage, extra time to decide games.
18/06/2013 18:14:43
MourneArmy
https://soundcloud.com/rtesport/now-is-the-time-for-change-i
There's the link to what he had to say.
I don't agree with this champions league seeded type format. Some of the 3rd and 4th games would be meaningless
if one county has already qualified and the other county, who they are due to play, has no hope of qualifying.
It still throws up problems, and I just can't see it working. You could have Derry playing away to Carlow,
Donegal away to Tipperary etc etc, the attendances would be poor with a lot of one sided boring games.
Any competition with group stage does run risk of having a small few games with nothing to play for but surely its better than the current system?
All championship structures have issues and have to be worked around with.
You cant say for definite that attendances would be poor and how can you say there would be a lot of "boring games"?

ormondbannerman (Clare) - Posts: 13473 - 18/06/2013 20:26:38    1410273

18/06/2013 19:09:26
SeanieSense
There was nothing wrong with the traditional knock-out format, backdoor was just introduced as another money making exercise.
In most counties all it resulted in was a back log of club fixtures being played in rain soaked pitches in October without a ball being kicked in the summer months as clubs would refuse to play league fixtures without their county players.
The GAA places a greater importance on making money in an amatuer game than protecting it's clubs.
There was sh*t loads wrong with traditional knockout as 20+ countys only played 1 or 2 games in their main competition each summer. How is that good idea to go back to that?
Backlog of club fixtures because clubs refuse to play games is not the fault of the intercounty structure.
Proper season management by clubs in conjunction with the county boards should allow a proper season structure that would allow club players play plenty of games throughout the summer

ormondbannerman (Clare) - Posts: 13473 - 18/06/2013 20:32:56    1410278