AA route finder says it takes 44 minutes for the normal drive from Omagh to Enniskillen but add in match day traffic and close to an hour seems reasonable, anyone who travels early to Clones and comes back the normal time after a match will tell you how driving times are affected by match day traffic. As I posted earlier, the Stadium is planned to maximize its use during non match days, its about making it pay for its own upkeep and you have more chance of that with the bigger population and corporate sector in Belfast.

lufty (Antrim) - Posts: 77 - 18/10/2012 11:46:00    1284841

It's as if some of the posters on here seem to think that the GAA and local politicians have made the decision overnight to redevelop Casement Park as the home of Ulster Gaelic Games. Think about it, we have all been avid spectators to the 2 ring circus that is local politics and have witnessed the hurdles and obstacles that had to be negotiated to secure government investment to the tune of £61.4m in the first place. Knowing the brinkmanship that is all to prevalent in Stormont, added to the bureaucracy of government, we can understand the agonisingly long process which has to be entered into to get public servants to get even the smallest decision ratified and passed, let alone such significant investment. I would hate to put a figure on the figure for consultancy fees etc. which would have went before the decision and announcement.

As stated by numerous people, every eventuality would have been looked at from location, infrastructure, logistics, access, egress, health and safety, medical facilities, fire services, potential, profit etc etc. etc., and yes, even travel distances, believe it or not. If some on here are running down Antrim attendances and bragging about their own counties superb following then why are the same people complaining about having to drive for an hour to a game? Surely the self proclaimed "best county supporters in the country" on here have no problem going to the ends of the earth to show their loyalty never mind a short trip to Belfast!! Do the same people have a problem going to Dublin if their county is lucky enough to reach the later stages of the AI Championships?

It is getting boring listening to the same arguments being rehashed. The deal is done, The new provincial stadium is going to be in Belfast. Get over it!!

GlensMan89 (Antrim) - Posts: 54 - 18/10/2012 11:51:47    1284845

For me home to Omagh is 1 3/4hrs and thats on a normal day (and trust me I drive via Omagh a lot as the wife is from the Whest). Add in match traffic and that would be well above the 2 hr mark - I could do Croke Park in near the same time. From a logistical point Belfast does make sense given the infrastructure which allows quick access in and out for the majority of people.

Offside_Rule (Antrim) - Posts: 4058 - 18/10/2012 12:46:25    1284888

To any Antrim posters are on here trying to justify travel distances here are the facts.

Taking into account the main town in each county in Ulster. The shorter distance is highlighted.

Letterkenny to Omagh 36 Belfast 95miles
Derry to Omagh 34 Belfast 72miles
Monaghan to Omagh 32 Belfast 58miles
Cavan to Omagh 61 Belfast 87miles
Armagh to Omagh 35 Belfast 40miles
Enniskillen to Omagh 28 Belfast 83miles
Newry to Omagh 53 Belfast 38miles
Belfast to Omagh 68

With the exception of Newry its clear that as regards fairness to of travel distances Omagh wins by a long way.

Before any Antrim people get defensive here I am not here to have a go at Belfast but purely to outline that IMO I think that this was a decision made on political terms and nothing to do with the location to hospitals, motorways etc. Like with ourselves in the south if a big investment is to be made by the government you can be assures it won't be going to the North West, West or South East but more likely to the Pale!! Another poster made a silly remark "why not move Croke Park to the midlands". Croke park is the home of the GAA for a long established time and therefore was the only place that investment was going to happen.

I know that when this development in Casement is complete it will be fantastic to be sitting there, hopefully cheering on Donegal on Ulster Final day, the atmosphere at the game will be great, the facilities in the grounds for players and spectators will be top notch and the pitch will be immaculate. IMO It's the occasion of Ulster Final day that will be the biggest loss. The atmosphere in the town of Clones can't and won't be replicated in Belfast, the crowd gathers in the streets and mingle together with the usual banter for a few hours prior to throw in and for a short time post match. The crowd for Casement won't do this in the vicinity of the ground and will more likely just arrive and enter the grounds prior to throw in.

Can you imagine the uproar in Munster if they decided that Semple Stadium would no longer house the Munster Hurling Final, there would be uproar!!

Tir Conaill Abu (Donegal) - Posts: 1677 - 18/10/2012 15:13:13    1285021

One slight flaw in your stats there Tir Conaill Abu - you haven't taken in to account the roads which link each. Distance between two places means nothing if you don't factor in if you are on an ordinary 'A' road, a dual carriageway or a motorway. I mean, Belfast is twice the distance from home for me as say, Ballycastle, but still it takes me near the same time to get to both as heading to Belfast is either dual carriageway or motorway for a lot of the journey whereas Ballycastle is a mixture of A, B and C class roads.

Offside_Rule (Antrim) - Posts: 4058 - 18/10/2012 15:50:43    1285043

Tir Conaill: you've obviously never been to Pairc Ui Caoimh on Munster Hurling Final day then: many people seem to forget that Casement was the home of Ulster Finals in the 50's and 60's and only stopped becoming so because of the the Troubles: many Ulster Championship matches were conveniently staged at Clones because of VAT reasons with little or no consideration given to fans from Eastern counties: have been to Clones on many an Ulster Final day from 80s onwards as a neutral and the traffic to and from has consistently been a nightmare: with the forthcoming upgrades in the road network surely it will be cutting commute times from the West to Belfast: remember there is a large dispora of Tyrone/ Derry/Fermangh people living and working in Belfast who would swell the attendance of so called neutrals in major matches at Casement: the infrastructure in and around the new Stadium will also been improved and fine tuned; as previously stated I would not have any issue with Omagh being selected and in an ideal world it has compelling arguments but the relaity is that Casement has been chosen and no amount of debate will change that

KevHill (Antrim) - Posts: 271 - 18/10/2012 15:59:16    1285047

Offside_Rule
County: Antrim
Posts: 582

Just to confirm that the distance is comparable to travel times and keep you happy. These are the time estimated by the AA and so on an even keel. I know some will disagree with these times but are all estimated on the same principles.

Letterkenny to Omagh 58mins Belfast 2hrs15mins
Derry to Omagh 56mins Belfast 1hr41mins
Monaghan to Omagh 47mins Belfast 1hr28mins
Cavan to Omagh 1hr30mins Belfast 2hrs11mins
Armagh to Omagh 52mins Belfast 1hr
Enniskillen to Omagh 44mins Belfast 1hr49mins
Newry to Omagh 1hr22mins Belfast 1hr
Belfast to Omagh 1hr28mins

Tir Conaill Abu (Donegal) - Posts: 1677 - 18/10/2012 16:06:12    1285056

As an employee of the ambulance service and speaking just from that perspective, I'd have to say Belfast would be a far safer option in terms of accesibility to major trauma centres, not to mention the cardiology department in the City hospital. In the event of a major incident, the RVH, Mater, Ulster and Lagan Valley casualty departments are within an easy distance. Should things escalate then Downpatrick, Craigavon and Antrim area hospitals are reasonably close to accomodate an overflow of patients too great for the Belfast hospitals to cope with. The RVH has one of the best nuero surgical departments in Europe and most people suffering from nuerological trauma no matter where they live in the 6 counties invariably get transferred there anyway, plus, like all other hospitals in the North, is used to dealing with major incidents going back to the 'troubles.' Omagh or Dungannon, although geographically a far more appealing option to Belfast are a lot poorer off in terms of proximity to major trauma centres. Omagh is 40 minutes from Altnagelvin in Derry, At best, 1/2 an hour from the South West acute in Enniskillen and further again from Craigavon area. Dungannon although not terribly far from Craigavon is in a similar predicament.

dubupnorth (Dublin) - Posts: 1897 - 18/10/2012 16:21:17    1285068

Build it, and they will come.

OffalyBigBall (Offaly) - Posts: 635 - 18/10/2012 16:30:25    1285075

You'd swear from some posters here that the games in the new Casement are going to end up in all out war with multiples having to enter A&E. How have we coped so far in having Ulsters major games in the quaint wee town of Clones!!

Tir Conaill Abu (Donegal) - Posts: 1677 - 18/10/2012 16:32:35    1285077

Tir Conaill Abu
County: Donegal
Posts: 446

1285077 You'd swear from some posters here that the games in the new Casement are going to end up in all out war with multiples having to enter A&E. How have we coped so far in having Ulsters major games in the quaint wee town of Clones!!

In fairness it's the antrim ones that are talking about hospitals etc and they seem to savour unsavoury incidents if you know what i mean.

No major event or fixture is determined by its proximity to a hospital and to suggest otherwise is a nonsense. The stadium should not be built in Belfast, it should be built in an area where gaelic games will be welcomed by all and where patrons can enjoy their day out in peace.

Clones abú

Tom1916 (Armagh) - Posts: 2001 - 18/10/2012 17:04:39    1285098

Ha - fair play Tir Conaill Abu. One thing about AA route planner is that their times per journey can be way off - says home to Cork 5hr 41 mins yet I did it in just over 4 not too long ago. On the other hand maybe I should stick to speed limits!

Offside_Rule (Antrim) - Posts: 4058 - 18/10/2012 17:05:45    1285100

Yeah.. It's settled, Dungannon it is. No one I know likes travelling to Omagh for a game. Healy Park has no atmosphere and has a poor surface. The town is a nightmare to get around too. Casement Park is a good ground as it is and is easily accessible but there is poor parking, a lot of thieves and all the pubs are miles away.

Dungannon, served by good roads, has good GAA bars in the town. Not a massive town so it's easily got around and in and out of. It is the true county ground of Tyrone but having been ousted because of financial difficulties in the St Enda's club in Omagh and the weight of the county board being west Tyrone folk, O'Neill Park was passed up for redevelopment/relocation and has since deteriorated and could do with a much needed facelift and purpose!

wise_guy (Tyrone) - Posts: 1584 - 18/10/2012 17:06:01    1285101

In fairness it's the antrim ones that are talking about hospitals etc and they seem to savour unsavoury incidents if you know what i mean.

Thats fighting talk Tom! ;-)

Offside_Rule (Antrim) - Posts: 4058 - 18/10/2012 17:12:56    1285111

lufty
County: Antrim
Posts: 69

1284841 AA route finder says it takes 44 minutes for the normal drive from Omagh to Enniskillen but add in match day traffic and close to an hour seems reasonable, anyone who travels early to Clones and comes back the normal time after a match will tell you how driving times are affected by match day traffic. As I posted earlier, the Stadium is planned to maximize its use during non match days, its about making it pay for its own upkeep and you have more chance of that with the bigger population and corporate sector in Belfast.

Well under current circumstances I would agree that travel times may be increased on match day. That is unless an incident happens during the game itself, when the crowd are still present inside the ground, in which case normal times travel times apply.

The major factor that is missing about Omagh, Is the fact a brand new dual carriageway is currently under construction. Work had started on this at several locations along the old A5. This road will run from Derry to the Monaghan border, linking up with the Enniskillen rd and the Belfast motorway at Ballygawley.
This will mean even shorter travel times from Derry, Letterkenny, Strabane, Monaghan, Enniskillen, Armagh, Cavan and Belfast. Derry to Monaghan is expected to be 20 mins shorter travel time.

Rather than develope Healy park, possibly look at building a brand new ground alongside the new dual carriageway. With Omagh bypassed, traffic in the town should dilute slightly. By locating it along the dual carriageway, this would make access and exiting very easy. The eventual plan is to upgrade the dual carriageway to a motorway, and this has been allowed for in the design.

GaryMc82 (Derry) - Posts: 3026 - 18/10/2012 17:32:19    1285132

Your some craic Tom1916.

The key point here is that this is possibly the most pointless thread on this forum, and there has been some pointless threads to challenge it over the years. You lads may all stock up on red diesel and hang sangers because the deal is done, funding is secured, the design team are drawing up the plans and its going to be built in the second city. See ya'll on the Andytown in a few years time (assuming Armagh can find a few players who can get the ball to Clarke Tom1916)... and before the Armagh backlash, I'm aware of Antrim's footballing limitations and that it could well be another 31 years before I'll be watching Antrim in an Ulster Final.

Oclan (Antrim) - Posts: 2 - 18/10/2012 18:00:44    1285158

benjyyy
County: Donegal
Posts: 628

1284783
Since when is enniskillen an hours drive from omagh?

Depends who's driving!

Samsforthehills (Donegal) - Posts: 1075 - 18/10/2012 18:03:16    1285163

GlensMan89
County: Antrim
Posts: 24

1284845


Did they really look at logistics and all those other facilities and services? I would think not. In my opinion, this was balance money. Rugby was getting money, Soccer was getting money, so best give GAA money to keep all sides balanced. When giving all sides roughly equal amounts of money, the politicians and senior civil servants no longer take that long to make descisions.
As for the GAA thinking long and hard about which ground to develope, that is not likely to be true. They likely got a call from stormont or some other governent office saying "You will receive approx £60million to redevelope a GAA ground which must be in Belfast, do you want it?". Thats how long and hard they thought about it.

We have already been using Clones to stage matches of approx 33-35,000 capacity for years now. That in itself shows that big cities are not essential to holding big games. After this years Ulster final I was out of the ground and on the road in great time, were after matches in Croke park it takes an hour to get out of the city again. GAA games tend to be on Sundays, and at 5pm in all large cities you will see the roads being mad busy on a normal day.
People away for the weekend return to the city, people visiting for the weekend leave for home.

As for Irelands greatest fans travelling to Croker, Good loyal fans do travel anywhere after their team. But thats not to say they do so without questioning the logic of were the GAA is holding games. I mean travelling costs money, diesel fuel prices are constantly going up.
I'm not made of money, and a round trip to Dublin costs a nice wee chunk of money for fuel, food, More expensive tickets for the All Ireland series also.
The GAA fans collectively in Ulster have likely contributed more to the GAA over 10 years than any grant. So maybe they should think of those patrons a little more carefully when planning a new stadium.

GaryMc82 (Derry) - Posts: 3026 - 18/10/2012 18:09:24    1285167

I wouldnt rule out Dungannon either. Very good location, but im not familiar with the access routes to it and whether they could carry large volumes.
But also worth considering as a location.

GaryMc82 (Derry) - Posts: 3026 - 18/10/2012 18:13:54    1285175

If you build it on the outskirts of the New Dual carriageway then you take the crowds away from the center of Omagh, which will be good for parking and access. Where then are all the places that are going to provide the prematch entertainment close to the ground if you are parked on the outskirts, this was one of the major drawbacks of the Maze Stadium plans as you needed to build bars and restaurants as well as a stadium.

lufty (Antrim) - Posts: 77 - 18/10/2012 18:15:36    1285177