890202
County: Wexford
Posts: 331

I would suggest that you have never seen any of these things occuring because they are all against the rules. A ref cannot award penalty for a techinal foul (not retreating quickly enough is a technical foul) or dissent. If the defenders on the goal line move off the line to approach the kicker again that are as you say in breach of the 13 metre rule but the punishment for this is not to award a penalty but to award a free kick closer by 13 metre to the opponents goal up to the 13 metre line. A penalty cannot be awarded for these infringements

890202 - In football, a technical fould committed within the small rectangle is indeed a penalty. A free kick from the 13 metre line directly in front of the goals, goalkeeper or defenders stand nearer than the goaline, within the small rectangle then the ref can award a penalty. It's actually the same principle as the rule that allows the ref award another penalty, if the keeper moves off his line when a penalty is taken.

Another one for you, an assessor from Wexford came up to us to do our in-service training for Leinster Council, the rule has changed for leaving the pitch to gain an advantage (used to be a booking, it's now a free). If a defender does this (in football) when a ball is dropping in and chooses to enter the field again (after leaving to gain an advantage) in the small rectangle, the result is a penalty.

CarryOnHurling (Meath) - Posts: 169 - 29/07/2011 15:54:12    998326

Sorry i omitted the bit about the small rectangle but i wasnt aware that a penalty could be awarded if players moved off the goal line. Surely most of the instances inside the square where a player leaves the field to gain an advantage would lead to awful confusion as how can a penalty be awarded if a player leaves the field? Is the foul considered to have been committed at the point on the boundary line where the player leaves the field of play or is the foul committed where the player returns to the field of play?

890202 (Wexford) - Posts: 1278 - 29/07/2011 16:30:53    998353

http://www.gaa.ie/content/documents/publications/official_guides/Official_Guide_2011_Part_2.pdf

Page 61
2.3 A penalty kick shall be taken from the ground at a point 11m from the centre of the goalline, and only the defending goalkeeper may stand on the goal-line. All other players, with the exception of the player taking the kick, shall be outside the 20m line and the arc, be at least 13m from the ball, and shall not cross the 20m line or the arc until the ball has been kicked. The goalkeeper may move along his line, but may not advance from the goal-line until the ball has been kicked. If a defending player fouls before the ball is kicked and a goal does not result, the referee shall allow the penalty kick to be retaken.

Page 69
4.15 When within own small rectangle to be less than 13m from the ball for opponents' free kick.
PENALTY - Penalty kick.

Page 72
4.34 To deliberatley go outside the boundary lines to gain an advantage except as provided in Rule 1.9.
PENALTY - Free kick from where the foul occurred.

CarryOnHurling (Meath) - Posts: 169 - 29/07/2011 16:32:34    998356

Yes but for the last one where does the foul occur? The player obviously has to leave the field and return in order to gain an advantage so if a player leaves the field lets say on the sideline at the 20 metre line and returns to the pitch on the 13 metre line does the referee award a 20 metre free or a 13 metre free?

890202 (Wexford) - Posts: 1278 - 29/07/2011 16:37:34    998357

890202
County: Wexford
Posts: 332

998353 Sorry i omitted the bit about the small rectangle but i wasnt aware that a penalty could be awarded if players moved off the goal line. Surely most of the instances inside the square where a player leaves the field to gain an advantage would lead to awful confusion as how can a penalty be awarded if a player leaves the field? Is the foul considered to have been committed at the point on the boundary line where the player leaves the field of play or is the foul committed where the player returns to the field of play?

The rule states it's a free kick from where the foul occurred. We were instructed that is was from where the player returns to the field. This bring ups another dirty word in the world of refereeing, that is the directive from Croke Park. A directive is an un-documented communication to referees on how rule should be implemented. A similar directive from Croke Park is that a "45" or "65" cannot be moved forward for dissent or delaying it being taken (not retreating etc.).

CarryOnHurling (Meath) - Posts: 169 - 29/07/2011 16:40:46    998359

There is yet another grey area uncovered in the rules. There are far to many of them. So am i correct in saying that if a player is on a solo run up the field and has to dodge another player by stepping out over the line (but at the same time keeping the ball in play) then this is a free? You hear it said nearly every day at matches when a line ball is disputed 'I was out but the ball wasn't ref' is this bolded statement is a break of the rule?

890202 (Wexford) - Posts: 1278 - 29/07/2011 16:49:19    998363

I'm not going to disagree over the grey areas being too many.....

4.34 To deliberately go outside the boundary lines to gain an advantage except as provided in Rule 1.9.
PENALTY - Free kick from where the foul occurred.

I think deliberately is key. Momentum, avoiding a foul (charging) or injury would not constitute a deliberate action so I would let that go TBH.
Knocking a ball over a guy's head, running outside the boundary line and back in to retrieve the ball would constitute a deliberate action. Taking a run from behind the boundary line to jump higher than an opponent would also constitute a deliberate action. In those cases I would award the free.

CarryOnHurling (Meath) - Posts: 169 - 29/07/2011 17:08:25    998380

If a ball is dropping into the box and the keeper retreats into the net to get a run up for the catch, is that technically a penalty?

laoistownie (Laois) - Posts: 409 - 29/07/2011 17:52:26    998409

This was a few years ago in u Junior match but one of the funniest and strangest refereeing decision I have heard. I dont know what way the game finished so I cant say if it had any bearing on the result but a team were given a penalty in a Junior football match and the team that conceded the penalty convinced the referee that they were allowed put 2 defenders on the line along with the goalie like you can in Hurling!! Clearly the penalty was saved and they went ballistic! True story and if you know anyone from Laois I could bet that they have heard this aswel :)

waterboy1 (Laois) - Posts: 100 - 29/07/2011 21:12:30    998529

Haven't read all the posts so apologies if this was asked before. A few months ago I was at a juvenile match when a player went down injured (accidental no free). As it was a head injury the ref however blew up to get medical attention on. To restart the game he then gave an indirect free to the team who had possession at the time. I though it was a very common sense approach but totally outside the rules, I had never heard of an indirect free in hurling. Talking to people after though they told me the ref was correct as per recent updates to rules. Anyone know what is the rule here?

onlyhurling (Galway) - Posts: 800 - 29/07/2011 21:38:08    998545

laoistownie
County: Laois
Posts: 404

998409 If a ball is dropping into the box and the keeper retreats into the net to get a run up for the catch, is that technically a penalty?

Yes it would have to be because the goalkeeper left the field of play to gain an advantage. Same would be if a keeper saved a shot whilst standing behind the goal line.

Only hurling the referee in that instance is right as the rule was amended to that effect.

890202 (Wexford) - Posts: 1278 - 30/07/2011 11:48:09    998638

onlyhurling
County: Galway
Posts: 311

998545 Haven't read all the posts so apologies if this was asked before. A few months ago I was at a juvenile match when a player went down injured (accidental no free). As it was a head injury the ref however blew up to get medical attention on. To restart the game he then gave an indirect free to the team who had possession at the time. I though it was a very common sense approach but totally outside the rules, I had never heard of an indirect free in hurling. Talking to people after though they told me the ref was correct as per recent updates to rules. Anyone know what is the rule here?

Rule 2 - Set Play - Hurling
A New Section numbered as 2.9 (with existing 2.9 becoming 2.10 andreads:
"2.9 - If in exceptional circumstances play is stopped by the Referee to enable a seriously injured player to be treated on the field or removed from the field of play, play shall resume in one of the following manners:-
(i) If a Team is in possession when the play is stopped, the play shall resume with a free puck to that Team from the position at which the play was stopped, unless the play was stopped inside the opponents 20m line in which case the free shall be awarded from the 20m line opposite the point where the play was stopped. A score may not be made directly from such free.
(ii) If neither Team is in possession when the play is stopped, a throwin shall be made from the position where the play was stopped, subject to the provisions in Exceptions (v) and (vi) of Rule 2.2.

Rule 2 - Set Play - Football
A New Section numbered as 2.10 (with existing 2.10 becoming 2.11) reads:
"2.10 - If in exceptional circumstances play is stopped by the Referee to enable a seriously injured player to be treated on the field or removed from the field of play, play shall resume in one of the following manners:-
(iii) If a Team is in possession when the play is stopped, the play shall resume with a free kick to that Team from the position at which the play was stopped, unless the play was stopped inside the opponents 13m line in which case the free shall be awarded from the 13m line opposite the point where the play was stopped. A score may not be made directly from such free.
(iv) If neither Team is in possession when the play is stopped, a throwin shall be made from the position where the play was stopped, subject to the provisions in Exceptions (v) and (vi) of Rule 2.2.

Penalty (in both Codes) - for "scoring" from such a free
(i) Cancel free kick/puck
(ii) Throw-in ball where the foul occurred, except as provided for under Exception (v)* of Rule 2.2
* (The New Section (v) re throw-ins being made 13m infield is referred to elsewhere).

Change:
(i) Previously play would have re-started with a throw in, now a free kick/puck for the team in possession.
(ii) When neither team is "in possession", play shall re-start with a throw in.
(iii) If the free kick/puck results directly in a score then the score shall be disallowed and play restarted by a thrown in at the place from where the free kick/puck was taken.

CarryOnHurling (Meath) - Posts: 169 - 01/08/2011 18:18:07    1000874

Any more stories - quite a funny little forum topic!

Kerryman (UK) - Posts: 403 - 04/08/2011 16:21:15    1003545

Junior cship game in Tyrone last week- 2 footballs on the pitch so a player kicks the ball off but hits umpire on back of the head. Umpire turns round and tells ref that the player standing closest to him deliberately hit him with the ball. Referee promptly sends the lad off. Turns out it was the defender who was actually the culprit. The team with 14 men went on to lose the game by 2 points!!

GrizzlyAdams (Tyrone) - Posts: 576 - 04/08/2011 19:21:03    1003719

was at a game recently where a player ran out on the field with no shorts on. Referee sent him off immediately for breaking the law.

bananarama (Longford) - Posts: 354 - 04/08/2011 19:56:58    1003740

Referee was incorrect. He should have moved the ball to the centre of the line. If the verbals persisted he should have issued a yellow card and if further persistence took place a red card and a thirteen metre FREE should have ensued ???????

lisnaboley (Galway) - Posts: 25 - 04/08/2011 21:09:59    1003804

Just reading through these hilarious stories. Was playing a junior football match years ago. Ball was thrown in and our midfielder tapped it down to our centre back who was still smoking a fag that he lit up at half time. Ref awarded a free against us for smoking on the pitch!

liam500 (Wicklow) - Posts: 203 - 07/09/2017 15:43:46    2043870

carlovia (None) - Posts: 1537 - 07/09/2017 15:56:02    2043874

2011 AI final

Joe McQullian spots a Kerry player handle the ball on the ground in his own small square in front of Hill 16

Joe whistles for a penalty offence.. Which it 100% is.. yet forgets the actual rule and awards a free in instead

jimbodub (Dublin) - Posts: 20763 - 07/09/2017 15:57:20    2043875

GeniusGerry (Kerry) - Posts: 2113 - 07/09/2017 16:54:47    2043893