bosch
County: Derry
Posts: 648

898341 Up here in the north i find the speed vans are just not in the right places.
This just infuriates drivers as it just reeks of a money making scam and not a safety initiative.

I could do 90mph down a backroad and never see a peeler or a peeler van but the moment i break 60mph on a road that has an overtaking lane i get done, it just doesnt make sense.

If the peelers/ garda/ govts were really serious about reducing road deaths they would have more patrol cars on the roads catching the actual dangerous driving ie stupid overtaking, pulling out of junctions into traffic, tailgating,etc.

Speed doesnt kill, yes, it is a factor in collisions but the majority of accidents are caused by those incidents ive mentioned above, speed just increases the likelihood of a death. To say that if everyone stuck to the speed limits there would be less deaths is wrong (and that is what they imply by having speed camera vans).

I believe speed camera vans to be a lazy, cheap and ineffective way of tackling road deaths. It is done to make a govt look like they are trying to reduce deaths when in reality it is an empty gesture.
____________________________________
Dont agree bosch.

Why oh why should we be depending on the authorities to educate and take the correct action to reduce road deaths caused by frankly irresponsible drivers and road users. We all have a personal responsibilty when we get behind the wheel of a car, a responsibility for the safety of other road users, for your passengers which could be your wife and children and for you yourself. No amount of government sponsored commercials and campaigns, including speed cameras, can instill that sense into a driver, you should possess it yourself regardless. Sadly the author of this thread was more concerned about how he could avoid being penalised rather than the dangers he posed whilst speeding, unfortunately you cant legislate for that mindset.

brendtheredhand (Tyrone) - Posts: 10897 - 29/03/2011 11:15:33    898379

I agree with a lot of what bosch posted. The RSA/Gardai aren't interested in making the roads safer, just purely in revenue generation.

I drive from Dublin to Sligo, and back again, pretty much every weekend. There's a 10-15 mile section of the N4 between Castlebaldwin and Cloonamahon that has averaged one death a year over the past 20 years. It's narrow, undulating, and has numourous dangerous curves. The speed limit on this stretch of road is 100kmph, the same as the dual carriageway bypasses of Dromod and Mullingar!

In 5 years of travelling this road regularly, I have yet to encounter a speed trap (van or garda car) between Cloonamahon and Castlebaldwin. Strangely though, there are often speed camera vans parked on the Boyle side of Castlebaldwin (the relatively new Curlew bypass), where the road widens considerably, straightens up, and is a hell of a lot safer (no fatalities or serious accidents since the bypass opened over 10 years ago).

black&white (Sligo) - Posts: 1628 - 29/03/2011 12:33:46    898437

irish people simply dont listen to anyone telling them to slow down as simply put the irish person couldnt give a dam about anything bar themselves- therefore gardai themselves should have the power to put people off the road- if caught speeding its a one year mandatory loss of licience. believe me the paddy wouldnt be long stopping then- putting ads on tv is as much a waste of time as having pictures on the news, if someone does not have an inate sense of responsibility you should definately not have to remind them all you do is punish them hard and do not even acknowledge their complaints. the paddy has never reacted to a corrot so we should now try the stick

liathroidboy (Mayo) - Posts: 4921 - 29/03/2011 12:55:25    898460

black&white
County: Sligo
Posts: 1296

898437 I agree with a lot of what bosch posted. The RSA/Gardai aren't interested in making the roads safer, just purely in revenue generation.

I drive from Dublin to Sligo, and back again, pretty much every weekend. There's a 10-15 mile section of the N4 between Castlebaldwin and Cloonamahon that has averaged one death a year over the past 20 years. It's narrow, undulating, and has numourous dangerous curves. The speed limit on this stretch of road is 100kmph, the same as the dual carriageway bypasses of Dromod and Mullingar!

In 5 years of travelling this road regularly, I have yet to encounter a speed trap (van or garda car) between Cloonamahon and Castlebaldwin. Strangely though, there are often speed camera vans parked on the Boyle side of Castlebaldwin (the relatively new Curlew bypass), where the road widens considerably, straightens up, and is a hell of a lot safer (no fatalities or serious accidents since the bypass opened over 10 years ago).
________________________________
Note, its not the Gardai or the PSNI that are are behind the wheel of these cars that are driving like maniacs on dangerous stretches of roads!

brendtheredhand (Tyrone) - Posts: 10897 - 29/03/2011 13:21:28    898489

liathroidboy
County: Mayo
Posts: 2323

898460 irish people simply dont listen to anyone telling them to slow down as simply put the irish person couldnt give a dam about anything bar themselves- therefore gardai themselves should have the power to put people off the road- if caught speeding its a one year mandatory loss of licience. believe me the paddy wouldnt be long stopping then- putting ads on tv is as much a waste of time as having pictures on the news, if someone does not have an inate sense of responsibility you should definately not have to remind them all you do is punish them hard and do not even acknowledge their complaints. the paddy has never reacted to a corrot so we should now try the stick

Even if this was the case ^^^^ there would NOT be a massive fall in road deaths. Speeding is not the cause of most accidents, it does not help the situation but it is not the primary cause in most instances.

bosch (Derry) - Posts: 873 - 29/03/2011 13:55:38    898526

brendtheredhand
County: Tyrone
Posts: 3540

Dont agree bosch.

Why oh why should we be depending on the authorities to educate and take the correct action to reduce road deaths caused by frankly irresponsible drivers and road users. We all have a personal responsibilty when we get behind the wheel of a car, a responsibility for the safety of other road users, for your passengers which could be your wife and children and for you yourself. No amount of government sponsored commercials and campaigns, including speed cameras, can instill that sense into a driver, you should possess it yourself regardless. Sadly the author of this thread was more concerned about how he could avoid being penalised rather than the dangers he posed whilst speeding, unfortunately you cant legislate for that mindset.

Brend - Speed does not automatically equal accident/ road death. (This Speed=Accident by both govts seems to be the line pushed out when it is just not as simple as that)

If i was doing 80mph down the M2 at 2.00am i am speeding, and if a cameravan was on the flyover id be done.
What great danger do i pose to myself and others in that situation, limited danger to both myself, passengers or other road users.

If i was doing 50mph down a 60mph limit back lane i would pose more of a risk, however in the latter situation im not speeding.

The mindset of everyone has to change, govts, peelers, garda, public.
Peelers/ Gards on the roads is the only way we will reduce road deaths regardless of personal responsibility instead of this mindset that "Stop speeding and we will cut road deaths".

bosch (Derry) - Posts: 873 - 29/03/2011 14:06:24    898532

brendtheredhand, will ye calm down for a minute. The person who instigated this thread was barely over the speed limit ffs. I don't picture the person as a speedster on the road, I picture the person as someone who abides by the speed limits most of the time which is a hard enough thing to do but like many of us does go over the limits very marginally now and then. The person is concerned they may get points on their licence, I know the feeling myself as I've been there. The fact they are worried says it all for me, it's the people who don't worry about accumlating penalty points I'd be more concerned about and not the individual who's dreading a possible 20% increase in their insurance premium for being barely over the limit. I think the person has got the message now, lesson learned in other words without you rubbing their nose in it.

BallsMcQ (USA) - Posts: 941 - 29/03/2011 14:58:49    898574

BallsMcQ
County: USA
Posts: 819

____________________
Then my work here is done!

brendtheredhand (Tyrone) - Posts: 10897 - 29/03/2011 15:07:15    898580

brendtheredhand

Note, its not the Gardai or the PSNI that are are behind the wheel of these cars that are driving like maniacs on dangerous stretches of roads!

True, but it is the Gardaí who seem to think it's not worth enforcing the speed limits on the dangerous stretches of road.

black&white (Sligo) - Posts: 1628 - 29/03/2011 15:29:46    898604

Even if this was the case ^^^^ there would NOT be a massive fall in road deaths. Speeding is not the cause of most accidents, it does not help the situation but it is not the primary cause in most instances.

SPEEDING is the main cause of road deaths.

yew_tree (Mayo) - Posts: 11679 - 29/03/2011 16:43:51    898698

yew_tree

SPEEDING is the main cause of road deaths.

Speed alone is not the main cause.

Speed is a factor in more road deaths than any other factor, but it's usually speed in combination with some other act of dangerous driving.
For example, if somebody overtakes into oncoming traffic, it's dairly likely that they were speeding as well. Was it the speeding or the overtaking that caused the accident?
Speed will still be recorded as a factor in the accident, even though it wasn't the primary cause.

Currently the focus of road safety campaigns are speed, and driving under the influence. The reason for this is that it's much easier (and cheaper) to stick up speed cameras, or drink check-points, than it is to have more members of the traffic corps on the road, policing the countless other instances of dangerous driving on our roads.

black&white (Sligo) - Posts: 1628 - 29/03/2011 17:21:06    898735

29/03/2011 14:58:49
BallsMcQ
County: USA
Posts: 820

898574 brendtheredhand, will ye calm down for a minute. The person who instigated this thread was barely over the speed limit ffs. I don't picture the person as a speedster on the road, I picture the person as someone who abides by the speed limits most of the time which is a hard enough thing to do but like many of us does go over the limits very marginally now and then. The person is concerned they may get points on their licence, I know the feeling myself as I've been there. The fact they are worried says it all for me, it's the people who don't worry about accumlating penalty points I'd be more concerned about and not the individual who's dreading a possible 20% increase in their insurance premium for being barely over the limit. I think the person has got the message now, lesson learned in other words without you rubbing their nose in it.

Great post.

RMDrive (Donegal) - Posts: 2202 - 29/03/2011 17:48:13    898754

Look at the number of one car accidents in rural areas late at night. In the absence of ice on the road speed must be the cause. I know that you can blame bad roads but they are a fact of life until tehy get repaired. If the road is in bad condition you should adjust your speed accordingly. I am not sure if the vans will cover every square foot in the country. You can't legislate for stupidity and bravado.

N16Calling (UK) - Posts: 260 - 30/03/2011 10:17:58    899048

Why do people used speed as an excuse for people dying?? It has nothing to do with speed, its people smoking, eating txting etc. and simply not taking due care at the right times, its people doing 40 miles in a 60 zone are a bigger problem. FInally i drive alot with my Business and the standard of driving is scary, awfull really.

freetaker1 (Limerick) - Posts: 758 - 30/03/2011 11:15:45    899098

N16Calling
County: UK
Posts: 121

899048 Look at the number of one car accidents in rural areas late at night. In the absence of ice on the road speed must be the cause. I know that you can blame bad roads but they are a fact of life until tehy get repaired. If the road is in bad condition you should adjust your speed accordingly. I am not sure if the vans will cover every square foot in the country. You can't legislate for stupidity and bravado.

Great Post.

brendtheredhand (Tyrone) - Posts: 10897 - 30/03/2011 11:19:22    899102

things like the gaybo programme last night are a waste of time completely- until people start walking into the pub and telling thei mates that they lost their licience for 5 years because they were doing 95 in a 80 zone nothing will change. or that someone is doing a year in jail for drink driving then nothing will change. the irish by nature are a stupid race of people and will do nothing for their own good unless forced to do so. and lets not make a biog deal of it all and have loads of costs- simply put the cop on the side of the road has full authority to put speeders off the road with no recourse- a simple scale would suffice 1 year for ever 5k over the limit- a few would be made example of and the rest would quickly learn- no exceptions no excuses accepted = problem solved

liathroidboy (Mayo) - Posts: 4921 - 30/03/2011 11:50:15    899129

N16Calling
County: UK
Posts: 121

899048 Look at the number of one car accidents in rural areas late at night. In the absence of ice on the road speed must be the cause. I know that you can blame bad roads but they are a fact of life until tehy get repaired. If the road is in bad condition you should adjust your speed accordingly. I am not sure if the vans will cover every square foot in the country. You can't legislate for stupidity and bravado.
_________________________

Speeding may be a factor in some rural late night accidents but there are many other factors you choose to ignore. Drink for one, fatigue is another as is the failure to were seat belts. Not wearing a seat belt is probably the single most factor of death occurring in an accident. Many rural area motorist fail to put on their seat belt when they are only going up the road hence the reason many people die in a car accident within 1km radius of there home.

BallsMcQ (USA) - Posts: 941 - 30/03/2011 16:19:08    899385

brendtheredhand
County: Tyrone
Posts: 3547

Why oh why should we be depending on the authorities to educate and take the correct action to reduce road deaths caused by frankly irresponsible drivers and road users. We all have a personal responsibilty when we get behind the wheel of a car, a responsibility for the safety of other road users, for your passengers which could be your wife and children and for you yourself. No amount of government sponsored commercials and campaigns, including speed cameras, can instill that sense into a driver, you should possess it yourself regardless. Sadly the author of this thread was more concerned about how he could avoid being penalised rather than the dangers he posed whilst speeding, unfortunately you cant legislate for that mindset.

Excellent post man.

Always people look for excuses when caught speeding.

Its very simple to avoid being done for speeding lads.

MesAmis (Dublin) - Posts: 13833 - 30/03/2011 16:34:00    899399

N16Calling
County: UK
Posts: 121

899048
Look at the number of one car accidents in rural areas late at night. In the absence of ice on the road speed must be the cause


A Garda told me that many of these single-car accidents on straight roads are suspected suicides. Like hitting the only tree or stone wall on a straight road !! I suspect that Insurance Companies don't pay up on Life Insurance policies if suicide occurs but i am not sure !! God love them anyway !!

Cavan_Slasher (Cavan) - Posts: 10253 - 30/03/2011 16:54:16    899419

Cavan_Slasher I'd well believe that suicide accounts for many of the deaths on our roads. I heard a story of that lately, the person didn't die in the accident however but died a week later by another means of suicide.

BallsMcQ (USA) - Posts: 941 - 30/03/2011 17:26:32    899454