31/08/2010 10:53:35
JJ1
County: Kildare
Posts: 401

761016 Cork for me. Kildare played poorly on Sunday and still should have won

JJ1 who are you trying to kid??
Kildare arent of 'Sam material' but Down are!!

WestRules (Galway) - Posts: 271 - 31/08/2010 21:59:54    762063

rebeltrev
County: Cork
Posts: 216


I really dont know which one of you boys are more stupid. I said Cork are like Barcelona cause it doesnt matter how much the oppisition score. we will score more :)

As for your kerryman thinking that Cork people reckon we will run away with the final. You really dont have a clue. No one on this from Cork has suggested anything of the sort. I reckon the red of Cork makes your blood boil. You seem to have alot of issues man with us. Did a woman from Cork break your heart or maybe a man :)

Fair enough, I might be guilty of a little hyperbole, but you start comparing yourself to Barcelona in anyway (no matter how trivial) you risk getting the p*** taken. Do Cork make my blood boild? Of course they do, Im from Kerry. I'd expect nothing less from your good self. Thats the beauty of GAA rivalries. Sure it would be no fun without the banter.
Luckily no man from Cork has broken my heart since Larry Tompkins though I bet you couldnt say the same about the Gooch!!!

Corrxxx (Kerry) - Posts: 584 - 01/09/2010 08:46:55    762092

Your agenda ain't half obvious is it?

Grow up and have a bit of respect. We've lost a semi-final in the last few days and its devastating. Last thing we want to hear is know-it-alls like yourself throwing in your hourly dig at Kildare football. Stop acting like a young teenager.

sedico (Kildare) - Posts: 1682 - 01/09/2010 09:11:34    762109

So we're talking around 90% of posters here tipping Down over roughly 10% Cork. Kinda tells it's own story that about the knowledge of posters on this site. The bookies could do with having a read of this I'd say.

This game is Cork's to lose, no doubt about it. If both teams come and play as they are capable, Down will be beaten by 5-7 points easy. If Down come and go toe to toe with Cork, without using the blanket defence that the Dubs used, then they'll be beaten by 10 plus. Their only chance is to play exactly like the Dubs, it'll take some effort still though.

bishopbrennan (UK) - Posts: 26 - 01/09/2010 09:27:32    762118

Barcelona didn't win the big one last season Rebeltrev,they were outfoxed by a cuter team and manager just like ye will be.

Barnowl94 (Galway) - Posts: 3150 - 01/09/2010 10:15:17    762167

i think this topic name should be changed to who you would LIkE to win Sam?

Bishopbrennan has a point, 90% of people here going for down!

My heart says down too, but my head says Cork.......

bealatha (Limerick) - Posts: 21 - 01/09/2010 10:51:57    762214

By any rational analysis, it's difficult to see how people's tips here are so heavily leaning towards Down.

Looking at the semi-finals on their own, I think it's fair to say Cork had a very tight win (1 point) over a Dublin side who played pretty well for most of the game, while Down had a very tight win (2 points, but would have been 1 if Kildare took the Bernard Brogan option and kicked their last chance over the bar) over a Kildare team who played pretty poorly for most of the game.
Had a look at the highlights again last night, and Down were opened up twice at the back before they got their goal and Kildare also had a few wides, including the disputed one in the same period - if Kildare had a bit of luck (which they didn't have all day) or a bit more killer instinct, Down could have found themselves in the same position they had Kerry in after 10-12 minutes. It's also important to note that Down started and ended the game playing below par - doubtful that they'd get away with doing so again.

Looking at formlines throughout the year is inconclusive in my opinion - sure Down handily beat a depleted Kerry team who, at full strength, had beaten Cork by a point in a replay (the drawn game being decided by a dodgy free), but Cork beat Dublin who beat Tyrone who beat Down handily in Ulster.

Looking at the talent throughout the teams themselves, it's hard to ignore the quality Down have in the forwards and how settled their team looks now. They still seem to be a very confidence-based outfit playing the top teams though, which is fine when you get a start like they got against Kerry or an early goal against the run of play like against Kildare, but if they don't get those early goals or have a few wides and fall behind when the game is tight (as they did against Tyrone), they haven't proven that they can pull a game out of the fire.

If Down's main strength is their forwards, then Cork's main strength is probably their midfield where they have so much depth it's become a bit of a headache. No doubt Down bested Kildare in this area on Sunday alright, but it's worth wondering if Dermot Earley had been playing what the story would have been. If Down could only beat Kildare by the skin of their teeth while dominating midfield, you would have to wonder how they'd cope if it's even 50/50 in this area, as it's more likely, at best, to be against Cork.

Looking at recent history and the glaring point has to be that Cork have lost to no-one but Kerry since 2004 and have been in five semi-finals and this is their third final in the time since. This has to count for more than the 'tradition' of Down winning every final that they've been in, as the last of these was 1994 when most of the present team were in national school. This guff about 'swagger' and 'pedigree' didn't seem to count for much in the last 16 years counting since they last won Ulster.

All in all, I reckon the bookies have it about right (4/7 Cork, 15/8 Down on PP) and that most of the opinion on here that says otherwise is based on various biases.
I'd be hoping like hell that Tipp beat KK in the final on Sunday, but looking at the odds with an unbiased eye, I'd have to say they're fairly close to what I'd think is correct (KK 2/5, Tipp 9/4 - I'd probably have Tipp 2/1).

hurling_lad (Cork) - Posts: 69 - 01/09/2010 10:59:07    762228

Thats a fairly spot on analysis hurlinglad.
If both teams play to potential, Cork to win a classic. Though its hard to remember when that last happened.
The main reason everyone is punting for Down is the fragility of Cork in AI football finals. The record is poor and the expectation is high.
If Down lose it will be a disappointment after a great year. If Cork lose it'll be the end of the world. Thats pressure.

Corrxxx (Kerry) - Posts: 584 - 01/09/2010 11:48:10    762267

question

whens was the last time dats cork played well?

The_Lug_Coa (Fermanagh) - Posts: 406 - 01/09/2010 12:58:23    762332

WestRules
County: Galway
Posts: 128

762063 31/08/2010 10:53:35
JJ1
County: Kildare
Posts: 401

761016 Cork for me. Kildare played poorly on Sunday and still should have won

JJ1 who are you trying to kid??
Kildare arent of 'Sam material' but Down are!!

Take off the blinkers and look at the game again without being so bitter. Kildare did play poorly enough and yes they would have won with a bit of luck. Best of luck to Down but I think Cork will win

JJ1 (Kildare) - Posts: 547 - 01/09/2010 13:30:45    762377

hurling_lad
County: Cork
Posts: 28

Good analyses. Their is allot of pressure on Cork but they have got back into another final so it shows allot about their character. This year it seems all about winning. In fairness the ref gave Kerry the Draw in Killarney. I was chatting to a good few Kerry boys after and they agreed that the ref gave the Gouch 2 frees for diving. Anyway thats history now and maybe the ref has helped us cause losing munster was probably the best thing that ever happened. I think where the best team in Ireland and we will show it on the 19th.

rebeltrev (Cork) - Posts: 344 - 01/09/2010 14:46:56    762492

rebeltrev
County: Cork
Posts: 222

762492 hurling_lad
County: Cork
Posts: 28

I was chatting to a good few Kerry boys after and they agreed that the ref gave the Gouch 2 frees for diving. Anyway thats history now and maybe the ref has helped us cause losing munster was probably the best thing that ever happened. I think where the best team in Ireland and we will show it on the 19th.

You'd give our arm and leg for the Gooch on your team on the 19th, cause of ye had him it would be a forgone conclusion, so quit giving out.

Corrxxx (Kerry) - Posts: 584 - 01/09/2010 16:24:19    762655

I think Cork need a Paul Galvin more than a Gooch.
If we had Paul Galvin, we'd have 2-3 AIs in the bag in the last few years.

hurling_lad (Cork) - Posts: 69 - 01/09/2010 16:35:02    762672

You'd give our arm and leg for the Gooch on your team on the 19th, cause of ye had him it would be a forgone conclusion, so quit giving out.

They have a "Gooch" (as in a gravity challenged forward who might score heavily) in Colm O Neill!

bishopbrennan (UK) - Posts: 26 - 01/09/2010 16:39:05    762675

Whilst I have the utmost respect for Cork football , I want Down to win this one. I usually like to see class outdo muscle. Normally prefer slickness to outfox athleticism ( except of course in the case of the Republic's footballers , when I want them to win against all the odds!!) I concede the game could go either way , but i think a Down win would keep the record of classy teams winning Sam over the last decade.

gaelantrim (Antrim) - Posts: 1616 - 01/09/2010 16:45:29    762682

hurling_lad
County: Cork
Posts: 30

762672 I think Cork need a Paul Galvin more than a Gooch.
If we had Paul Galvin, we'd have 2-3 AIs in the bag in the last few years.

To be fair if ye had a Galvin probably, but its a man in the full forward line to put it between the sticks on the biggest day of all that ye need the most. Gooch does that better than Galvin.
Anyway I thought all Cork people hated Paul Galvin!

Corrxxx (Kerry) - Posts: 584 - 01/09/2010 16:48:11    762684

bishopbrennan
County: UK
Posts: 20

762675 You'd give our arm and leg for the Gooch on your team on the 19th, cause of ye had him it would be a forgone conclusion, so quit giving out.

They have a "Gooch" (as in a gravity challenged forward who might score heavily) in Colm O Neill!

Is that the same Colm O Neill who went missing after 5mins of action in last years final. Im talking about THE BIG DAY performer. Cork had one of those in James Masters aswell, he never showed up on the big day either.

Corrxxx (Kerry) - Posts: 584 - 01/09/2010 16:51:42    762688

Corrxxx the only thing most people in Cork hate about Paul Galvin is that he plays for Kerry - more than anyone else playing the game at present, he has the ability to turn a big game single-handedly.
It's just a pity he lets himself down from time to time with indiscipline.

hurling_lad (Cork) - Posts: 69 - 01/09/2010 17:11:13    762733

01/09/2010 12:58:23
The_Lug_Coa
County: Fermanagh
Posts: 213

762332 question

whens was the last time dats cork played well?

--------------------------------------------

Well Lug, I can see why you might ask. Cork are not quite sure themselves and the rest of the country finds it hard to remember when they last played well.

It comes as no surprise to read that people are now questioning the ability of the Munster red rebels as there sudden rise to the headlines for championship news rather than the stricking players or dirty hurling incidents, makes one wonder if the standard of the All Ireland Championship has dimished?

I remember Pat Spillane once summing up Cork so well saying that they were a load of chancers lacking in skill but blessed with luck. I feel that the latter statement is so relevant today as the rebels progression has been largely down to luck and not on any kind of outstanding memorable performances.

So Lug, you were quite right to ask the question as it puzzles so many in GAA circles!

lrvinestownGael (Fermanagh) - Posts: 847 - 02/09/2010 10:19:34    763118

To respond to Lug's post, Cork last played well in the last 20 minutes of the semi-flnal, scoring 1-08.

To respond to IrvinestownGael's post would be beneath me and, I hope, most other posters here.

hurling_lad (Cork) - Posts: 69 - 02/09/2010 11:23:42    763171