With the rumours persisting that Trap is going to go out and make use of the infamous "Granny rule"... with the likes of O'Hara, Nolan and Naughton (Spurs) the likely targets. I'm wondering what the views are on this??

I am aware this has been happening since Big Jack days but 'aware' would be as far as it goes as I was only a toddler during the late '80's when the likes of Cascarino, Townsend, Houghton etc were drafted in. So you could say that I wouldn't know what public opinion was like around then to such moves from the Irish camp.

20 odd yrs later it looks like a 2nd wave is about to happen and I, for one, have mixed feelings on this...

Firstly, I have no qualms with someone like Kevin Kilbane declaring for Ireland.. I remember reading how he grew up in an Irish community (in Preston?) with the Irish jersey glued to his back. I could see a similar scenario developing if the likes of Roy Keane, Staunton, Dunne, Given etc children were to grow up to be become good sports ppl... Id say they'd be Irish ones too regardless of birth certificate.

But.. thats where it ends.. Im not fully gone on getting in someone like Nolan who refused the Irish invitation once, is now resigned to the fact that the England call aint gonna come and now appears to be reconsidering the Irish invitation. It now also transpires that he is not entitled to an Irish passport without his Granny getting one first...... I dunno.. something doesnt seem right with that.

I should point out that someone like Dave Kitson should be commended on refusing an Irish call up a few yrs ago stating that he would rather support England at a World Cup than play for Ireland in one. Nothing wrong with that as it shows his heart wouldnt be in it. I'm nearly certain that there are players who have played (past and presently) to their fullest but.. havent done it with an 'Irish desire'. Does that make sense to anyone? Hell.. it should be noted that we have Irish born and bred players that have felt like that.

Bit cliche but think we should stick to what we got.. Trap wants O'Hara, a creative flair player... Andy who again? There are also young players we could look at.

As it is I find it hard to support the Irish soccer team in the way I support Rugby and I feel a team of St. Ledger, Folan, Best, O'Hara, Nolan, Naughton would only compound this. Give me a team of Garvan, Coleman, McShane, McCann, Long, O'Dea, Sheridan, Stokes bursting a gut and I'd likely feel a hell of a lot different..

Any taughts??

(Made the cardinal sin of HS by originally posting this on National forum)

BigSam (Kildare) - Posts: 266 - 08/12/2009 13:48:52    507123

As long as the Irish link isn't too tenuos I have no problem with it. Like most of you here I have cousins who we're born abroad. They have a very strong sense of their Irishness and the majority would support Ireland over the country they were born in , especially my Scottish born cousins!! If they limit the acceptence rule to grandparents then I have no problem with that.

dubupnorth (Dublin) - Posts: 1897 - 08/12/2009 14:57:16    507221

Good post.

I agree with a lot of what you are saying. I'd persist with what we've got but at the same time the players mentioned would be better than the likes of Joe Lapira.

I am against it because the u-21 U-19 etc squads are already such a shambles, the talented players who have been dragged through this set up do not need even more barriers to their progression to international football.

You'd have to wonder what the likes of Chris McCann would feel like if they spent their international underage soccer years being snubbed for various less-experienced players (and granny rulers) yet despite this ploughing ahead and making a name for himself and being a premiership regular and then for Kevin Nolan to be picked ahead of him when he eventually decides he can be bothered with international football.

Breffni40 (Cavan) - Posts: 12291 - 08/12/2009 15:15:43    507250

St. Ledger, Folan, Best...

I'd have any of those three ahead of Stephen Ireland, St. Ledger in particular has grown on me. But yeah I don't want Kevin Nolan either, O Hara I'm not so sure about what kinda noises has made about playing for Ireland?

At the end of the day it comes down to attitude.A guy like Clinton Morrison, Tony Cascarino, Leon Best, no matter how limited they are or how tenous their Irish connections are worth more to us then a born and bred Irishman like Stephen Ireland, who has turned his back on his homeland.

roundball (Tipperary) - Posts: 2514 - 08/12/2009 15:29:28    507275

I'd change it from the current "granny rule" to the "mammy rule" - if one parent is was raised in this country then let them play (but only if they've been brought up supporting Ireland, not because they aren't good enough to represent another country). Rare exceptions could be made for second generation Irish where there is clear evidence that the player wants to represent us and feels Irish. The unique situation regarding Northern Irish players should be left the same.

I don't ever want to see the likes of Kevin Nolan, Zat Knight etc. wearing the Green. Found it hard to shout for Folan, who I think used Ireland to help his career - "international" players can command bigger contracts.

nocky (Wexford) - Posts: 2059 - 08/12/2009 16:03:24    507323

Agree with ya bigsam.
id rather us be Ireland & not Engerland B.
think the Zat Knight situation sums it up - "I'll play for Ireland if I don't make it with England". Thank God Brian Kerr told him where to go

mac21 (Leitrim) - Posts: 677 - 08/12/2009 16:08:09    507332

BigSam
County: Kildare
Posts: 175

Could you name one of our past players you wouldnt have had playing for Republic under the granny rule..O r were the any less Irish..

tomaoo7 (Dublin) - Posts: 5896 - 08/12/2009 22:42:15    507886

Phil Babb was a shocker, was it via the granny rule for him. Got to be one of the worst I've seen in an Ireland shirt.

Mancirish (UK) - Posts: 2200 - 09/12/2009 00:21:00    508059

tomaoo7 County: Dublin Posts: 4933 507886 BigSam County: Kildare Posts: 175 Could you name one of our past players you wouldnt have had playing for Republic under the granny rule..O r were the any less Irish.. Im sure there were some who feel/felt like Nolan, Knight, Kitson and just didn't say anything... "Less Irish"...? I know if the lads were playing tomorrow and one midfield spot was to come free.. Out of AReid/Nolan/SIreland, I know who I'd pick. I think its a question of the head and heart of the player. I think its important to point out that I'm not raging about this... its not like I going to start a picket outside FAI headquarters if Nolan, O'Hara were to declare. What I'm trying to get at is best summed up in the opinion of Mac21 who said id rather us be Ireland & not Engerland B. I just find the situation quite sad and would prefer to see Irish lads out there playing for their country. It'd be the same if someone like.. Mafi was to declare for the rugby lads. Would not like it in the slightest. Nocky.. completely agree with you on Northern Irish situation.

BigSam (Kildare) - Posts: 266 - 09/12/2009 10:04:31    508128

tomaoo7
County: Dublin
Posts: 4933

507886 BigSam
County: Kildare
Posts: 175

Could you name one of our past players you wouldnt have had playing for Republic under the granny rule..O r were the any less Irish..

Joe Lapira.

Don't try and twist this into something that makes you feel superior. You ruin enough threads as it is.

Breffni40 (Cavan) - Posts: 12291 - 09/12/2009 10:25:04    508145

Maybe an Irish immigrant should come on and explain what it would mean for his son to play for the Republic...Probably explain why they had to leave home according to some posters on this site their children have no rights to play for Republic..

tomaoo7 (Dublin) - Posts: 5896 - 09/12/2009 14:37:11    508395

Maybe an Irish immigrant should come on and explain what it would mean for his son to play for the Republic...Probably explain why they had to leave home according to some posters on this site their children have no rights to play for Republic..Some of the rubbish on this site about Irish immigrants is sicking...I hope to God they don't read any of it......

tomaoo7 (Dublin) - Posts: 5896 - 09/12/2009 14:40:30    508399

I should have envisaged this...... Tomato man -your ridiculous. Plain as.

BigSam (Kildare) - Posts: 266 - 09/12/2009 15:03:31    508432

My other half's nephew was born in Derry and is now 15. Her brother (his Dad) is a Derryman and the lad's mother is from Moville in Donegal , they live in the Culmore area of Derry , 1/2 mile from the border. He's just signed for a prominent club from Yorkshire and had been asked to play For the North. He refused as he has no affinity to them , he's always supported the Republic . They are totally pestering his parents to get him to change his mind but they're fighting a losing battle. The Republic haven't come in for him yet and but that may be because of his age and where he played his junior football. I know if he was asked to tog out for the Republic you wouldn't have to ask twice. I'm personally glad to see lads from the North who are from a nationalist background having the choice but wouldn't be too fussed on the IFA tactics of trying to pressurise parents of lads who opt for the Republic , he qualifies for the Republic through his Mum anyway. Hopefully we can unearth more Darron Gibsons or better still , have an all Ireland team like rugby and other sports.

dubupnorth (Dublin) - Posts: 1897 - 09/12/2009 15:22:03    508454

tomaoo7
County: Dublin
Posts: 4936

508399 Maybe an Irish immigrant should come on and explain what it would mean for his son to play for the Republic...Probably explain why they had to leave home according to some posters on this site their children have no rights to play for Republic..Some of the rubbish on this site about Irish immigrants is sicking...I hope to God they don't read any of it......

Great post, unfortunately it couldn't be any less relevant to this thread. It has been expressly stated in the opening post that that is not the intention.

Breffni40 (Cavan) - Posts: 12291 - 09/12/2009 15:29:13    508463

Breffni39
County: Cavan
Posts: 1625

508463 tomaoo7
County: Dublin
Posts: 4936

508399 Maybe an Irish immigrant should come on and explain what it would mean for his son to play for the Republic...Probably explain why they had to leave home according to some posters on this site their children have no rights to play for Republic..Some of the rubbish on this site about Irish immigrants is sicking...I hope to God they don't read any of it......

Great post, unfortunately it couldn't be any less relevant to this thread. It has been expressly stated in the opening post that that is not the intention.

I agree... Tomo should prob re-post this to the racist thread thats going or something.

BigSam (Kildare) - Posts: 266 - 09/12/2009 16:16:33    508514

He's just signed for a prominent club from Yorkshire

Leeds United?


nocky... I included Folan as a player that I don't mind playing for the Republic but I probably should have thought it over first as I see your point about him furthering his career although I wouldn't be quite as cynical. Liam Lawrence is another one who ran his socks off for us v Italy and France.

roundball (Tipperary) - Posts: 2514 - 09/12/2009 17:57:57    508661

I mean no offence to any poster on this thread...

tomaoo7 (Dublin) - Posts: 5896 - 09/12/2009 17:59:12    508667

tomaoo7
County: Dublin
Posts: 4951

508667 I mean no offence to any poster on this thread...

Well you should prob think more carefully before you manipulate posts to suit your own ego... or better still.. maybe you should read all posts first..

BigSam (Kildare) - Posts: 266 - 10/12/2009 12:00:22    509519

BigSam
County: Kildare
Posts: 188


Maybe you should accept a man's apology... it's rare around here.

jimbodub (Dublin) - Posts: 20763 - 10/12/2009 13:22:27    509612