These lists died the day DJ wasn't picked for the team of the millennium!

realdub (Dublin) - Posts: 8729 - 21/11/2013 18:42:53    1516271

Apart from a class player like Padraig Joyce being placed only at 54 after being the key man in winning 2 AI's, there is no sign of the likes of Michael Donnellan, Ja Fallon, Sean Og De Paor or Kevin Walsh in the top 125 which is a travesty IMO. Who makes up these lists?

tommy k (Galway) - Posts: 3470 - 22/11/2013 08:30:51    1516393

Lads the lists are ridiculous really- as its been said its impossible to compare players of different era's. Its one persons opinion against anothers. Tomas O'Se at 34ish?? thats a joke. The man was a machine, easily should be in the top ten.

sam09 (Tyrone) - Posts: 339 - 22/11/2013 09:07:19    1516401

I agree sam09 it's not great in fairness.

KingdomBoy1 (Kerry) - Posts: 14092 - 22/11/2013 10:30:42    1516434

Any list that doesn't have The Gooch at number 1 as the greatest is a joke. 1.The Gooch 2. Peter The Great 3.The Roc.

clondalkindub (Dublin) - Posts: 9926 - 22/11/2013 11:08:30    1516466

To say that Tomas O'Se should 'easily be in the top 10', or that Ja Fallon, Kevin Walsh, Sean go de Paor and Michael Donnellan should all be there, is to underestimate the number of great footballers that there have been in the last 125 years.

Regarding the Galway players, I wouldn't dispute that any of those you mentioned were brilliant players, and among the best of their era. However, an average of 10 players per decade made this list, and it is very difficult to argue that all of those were among the top 10 in their own era. Galway had an impressive 8 representatives on the football selection - would you have been dropping any of those to accommodate Donnellan? Or would it be players from other counties who would make way?

Similarly with Tomas O'Se, being called the 39th best player of all-time is a great compliment. Sam09 says that he should easily be inside the top 10, and I concede that I would have him higher than 39th on my list, but the obvious question to ask is whose place he would take? All the names on the list were outstanding footballers, and those at the very top are the absolute legends of the game. It is easy to say someone should be higher, but then you have to justify dropping someone else in their place.

These lists are just personal opinions and really designed to start a debate rather than settle it. For example, I'd see the likes of Seamus Moynihan (10), Graham Geraghty (49) and Brian Dooher (58) all as being too high, while older posters may consider that greats like Padraig Carney (61), Packy McGarty (75) and Larry Stanley (86) are all too low. There have been so many outstanding players over the last 100+ years, and I think that this list tries to recognise most of them. Such things will never be perfect but, in my opinion, this one is a reasonable effort.

Thomas Clarke (Tyrone) - Posts: 1002 - 22/11/2013 11:39:33    1516483

has anyone told RoyalDunne the the great Graham "Biggy" Reilly is not on this list.

Have to agree with the majority of posters, these lists are a joke and waste of time...Colm O'Rourke, highedst placed meath man but not even close to the greatest Meath player of all time...O'Connell, Lyons, O'Brien McDermott all ahead of him

And LOL at Clondalkin Dub....the ROC....always at no3 eh....

brian (Meath) - Posts: 1981 - 22/11/2013 13:23:38    1516540

Hahaha just seeing would Moomoo bite Briano, Colm O Rourke for me is Meath's greatest ever footballer.

clondalkindub (Dublin) - Posts: 9926 - 22/11/2013 15:10:27    1516605

For me the only way I can judge a great player to be ahead of another great player is in terms of all-round ability. This is why, of those I have seen alot of playing, Jacko is number 1. Amongst others I would have in my top ten of players I've seen would be Sean Cavanagh, Paul Curran, Mullins, Geeser, Tomás OSé, Darragh OSé and one or two others that I can't think off the top of my head.

Capitalist (Dublin) - Posts: 47 - 06/01/2014 14:50:29    1528176

Capitalist,

God help you if you cannot think of some of the greatest players to ever play the game "off the top off your head"!!!! Too much to drink over the festive period perhaps :-)

As you seem to only include players from the 70s onwards, I'll jog your memory a little by suggesting Peter Canavan, Maurice Fitzgerald, Seamus Moynihan, Pauric Joyce, Frank McGuigan, Mike Sheehy, Pat Spillane, Anton O'Toole among others! Not sure I would include the likes of Sean Cavanagh, McGeeney or Curran, despite being brilliant players I don't think they qualify in the "GREAT" category.

Salmanneile (Longford) - Posts: 113 - 06/01/2014 16:04:07    1528228

where is the list. I missed this first time round. the old Railway cups were a great barometer especially for those players from weaker cointies, you don't really get that much exposure nowadays if you play for a weaker county. I think for the millenium there were some lists compiled by former railway cup managers. these would be interesting.

s goldrick (Cavan) - Posts: 5520 - 07/01/2014 14:30:53    1528544

Quote:
Salmanneile
County: Longford
Posts: 91

1528228 Capitalist,

God help you if you cannot think of some of the greatest players to ever play the game "off the top off your head"!!!! Too much to drink over the festive period perhaps :-)

As you seem to only include players from the 70s onwards, I'll jog your memory a little by suggesting Peter Canavan, Maurice Fitzgerald, Seamus Moynihan, Pauric Joyce, Frank McGuigan, Mike Sheehy, Pat Spillane, Anton O'Toole among others! Not sure I would include the likes of Sean Cavanagh, McGeeney or Curran, despite being brilliant players I don't think they qualify in the "GREAT" category.
Quote.


Salmann (German name?), it was a momentary thing, a mere blip in an otherwise lava flow of neuron activity. I did however define that the players I see as the 'very' best (many other 'great' players of course) in my time of watching are the most "all-round" gifted/effective etc. So I don't quite include PTG in that, he was a mixture of forward and play-maker, but not a player who could operate fully in the middle area and certainly not really in the backs. He didn't have the physique for an all-round role in the middle, especially the way the game was still played in his day.

Maurice Fitz, Joyce, McGuigan, Sheehy, Spillane, O'Toole likewise to a similar extent as Canavan, more or less. O'Toole would actually be a candidate for the middle in the modern game, as he was quite big, very strong, had great pace and stamina, and linked the play very well. But in his time he was really a forward only, as midfielders were giants generally and forwards roles were pretty tightly defined, as well as the way the ball was delived from goalies.
Maurice Fitz 'could' have played midfield but at senior level his role was generally forward. Great playmaker of course. As is Colm Cooper, now that he's given the chance. By the way, apart from The Pony, you only seem to think that forwards have been "great" players?
With Seamus Moynihan in mind, this was a player, like Brian Dooher, who could roam the park. However, in his time he would have done very little in terms of receiving possession from long ball around the middle. Simply because he wasn't big enough. That's why I would rate Tomás OSé slightly above him, though Tomás tended to stick to his backs role alot, he was capable of all facets of the game. Similarly Geeser & Curran.

All of those lads could have been excellent midfielders on the current Dublin and recent Tyrone teams for example. Dooher indeed must be close to my definition of true greatness, given that he operated half-back to half-forward a good bit of the time, and the way Tyrone used the ball he was as much a midfielder at times as he qwas either of the other two roles. That said, he would have been incapable of winning almost any challenged high ball as he is shorter than many other players at that level.

John McDermott of Meath would be another possibly in this category, not sure if he's quite at the level of those mentioned though. Graham Geraghty in this era could have been a great midfielder. Neither of them had the chance or the ability to show any top ability as a back though.
Very few players can excel at 3 roles. Mullins never got the chance but I'd bet he'd have been a very good roving half-back. He was certainly very effective in the attacking aspect of his game and was well able to mark a player and tackle.

Capitalist (Dublin) - Posts: 47 - 07/01/2014 16:45:24    1528633

Whatever!

Salmanneile (Longford) - Posts: 113 - 07/01/2014 17:04:58    1528645

Salmanneile
County: Longford
Posts: 93

1528645
Whatever!



Lol

realdub (Dublin) - Posts: 8729 - 08/01/2014 12:18:01    1528886

These best of lists should be retitled Best Of Successful Counties List. In both hurling and football there are players who we never go to see or hear much of simply because they played division 4 in the league or were gone before the championship really got going. I'm sure we could all come up with one player like that who deserves to be on any best of list.

For example, in Darragh O Se's book he mentions John Quane as his toughest opponent and yet I would say the vast majority of people here never even heard of Quane until he was nearly finished, if at all. As Darragh put it, Quane may not have been the best midfielder around in the 90's, but there were none better.

mike03 (Limerick) - Posts: 2000 - 08/01/2014 12:36:53    1528904

Not simplistic enough for you Salmann & "real"dub?

Capitalist (Dublin) - Posts: 47 - 08/01/2014 16:54:46    1529088

Who the hell cares whether the likes of Canavan could play as a midfielder. You might as well say "no small player can be a great footballer"

MichaelO (Tyrone) - Posts: 820 - 08/01/2014 18:23:55    1529152

Capitalist
County: Dublin
Posts: 40

1529088
Not simplistic enough for you Salmann & "real"dub?


I think you might be confusing me finding what someone said to be funny with me having a below par IQ, and what's with the inverted commas?

realdub (Dublin) - Posts: 8729 - 09/01/2014 10:44:54    1529361

realdub

I think you might just be wasting your time responding!

Salmanneile (Longford) - Posts: 113 - 09/01/2014 12:18:11    1529392

Another repeated nonsensical thread for the after-Christmas blues crowd on HS. Had the Indo not
caused this stir.. some other "winder-upper" would have started the "this player was better than that player"
thread....happens every year. For example, comparing Ring & Sheflin is like comparing Alex Higgins with
Batt Masterson....who had the the best shot! Both marksmen BUT of different era's. (my choice Batt as he
was clinical with a Derringer! lol). Does'nt seem too long since posters here were on the DJ bandwagon
making the "best player ever" claims and the "better than" claims. For any discussion that compares modern day
players (lets say over last 20 yrs) to players of 40 yrs plus ago than when commenting STATE YOUR AGE as
if you were not born and going to games to see the likes of Ring, Mackey and all the other greats of that
era...then your "better than" "best of all time" comment is to say the least suspect, if not down right ridiculous.
I'm 60 yrs and watched Ring play club & county and I consider him remarkable player for a very long "ERA". I have
seen many remarkable players since right up to the 2013 Championship. Remember, state your age to add credibility
to you comment.

eaglehaslanded (Cork) - Posts: 135 - 09/01/2014 13:10:20    1529423