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Can Jack O'connor Over Take Jim Gavin?

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Replying To CiarraiMick:  "Beat post of the day.Yeab you are correct about that muppet he has Kerry Cork and Limerick usernames and a Walter Mitty gambler."
Jack is staying on. Great news. Kerry will do the 7in a row. AI title 40 incoming next year.

KerryAllIrelandChampions2025 (Kerry) - Posts: 16 - 20/08/2025 21:55:53    2632887

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Jack might be able to overtake him in terms of net All Ireland's won, but Jim Gavin is just on a different level. That Dublin team from 2015 - 2019 were the best Gaelic Footballing team I have ever seen, the closest to perfection that I have ever seen. Yes they had a lot generational talent at the one time, but it takes a special manager to keep that train going year after year.

Jim Gavin is a manager I greatly admire and respect, its not about the number of All Ireland's won, it was the dominant fashion in how those All Ireland's were won, they systems he had in place, just different gravy.

Commodore (Donegal) - Posts: 1459 - 21/08/2025 09:25:20    2632908

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I think there are many factors involved in this debate. It makes the all star selection look easy. Gavin did inherit an All Ireland winning team and there was exceptional players on it and the backbone of it remained right through but that is not taking away from any of his achievements as there was an incredible never say die attitude about them. O Connor won it in 3 different stints though 06 & 09 were similar teams. What does impress me about OConnor is the gap between title no. 3 (2009) and no. 4 (2022) and finally this year. Football changed so much in those years. The change in the last 12 months was challenging with the new rules and he is the first manager to win under them but in the 10 or so years he was away from the senior team was that he went back into the underage setup and won 2 minor all irelands and also took the U21s. Winning All-Irelands 18 years apart is very impressive especially with the change in the game and times. Im not going to call any of the managers the greatest as it is subjective under so many factors but they have all made our games great and none of them will be forgotten.

Dothesimplethingswell (Sligo) - Posts: 25 - 21/08/2025 09:59:55    2632915

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Replying To Dothesimplethingswell:  "I think there are many factors involved in this debate. It makes the all star selection look easy. Gavin did inherit an All Ireland winning team and there was exceptional players on it and the backbone of it remained right through but that is not taking away from any of his achievements as there was an incredible never say die attitude about them. O Connor won it in 3 different stints though 06 & 09 were similar teams. What does impress me about OConnor is the gap between title no. 3 (2009) and no. 4 (2022) and finally this year. Football changed so much in those years. The change in the last 12 months was challenging with the new rules and he is the first manager to win under them but in the 10 or so years he was away from the senior team was that he went back into the underage setup and won 2 minor all irelands and also took the U21s. Winning All-Irelands 18 years apart is very impressive especially with the change in the game and times. Im not going to call any of the managers the greatest as it is subjective under so many factors but they have all made our games great and none of them will be forgotten."
Ill add to that to correct myself!! O Connor won All-Irelands that were 21 years apart his first in 2004 and his latest in 2025. Theres something to be said for that especially with the change in times and football. In one of his first league games in charge Kerry were beaten by Longford of all teams!! He described the journey home that Sunday evening as one of the longest of his life. Let us not forget great men like Liam Kearns & John o Mahony both deceased now who brought counties to great heights over the years.

Dothesimplethingswell (Sligo) - Posts: 25 - 22/08/2025 10:48:25    2633092

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Replying To Commodore:  "Jack might be able to overtake him in terms of net All Ireland's won, but Jim Gavin is just on a different level. That Dublin team from 2015 - 2019 were the best Gaelic Footballing team I have ever seen, the closest to perfection that I have ever seen. Yes they had a lot generational talent at the one time, but it takes a special manager to keep that train going year after year.

Jim Gavin is a manager I greatly admire and respect, its not about the number of All Ireland's won, it was the dominant fashion in how those All Ireland's were won, they systems he had in place, just different gravy."
Both great no? Of course donegal man a sour ine wouldn't give jack any credit as if t wins and did it st every key level u21s minor too . Both legends But of course you lost him recently so can't credit him. Anyway even you don't agree surely agree he is in conversation though

Gaaforlife2023 (Longford) - Posts: 954 - 22/08/2025 11:25:05    2633103

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Replying To Dothesimplethingswell:  "I think there are many factors involved in this debate. It makes the all star selection look easy. Gavin did inherit an All Ireland winning team and there was exceptional players on it and the backbone of it remained right through but that is not taking away from any of his achievements as there was an incredible never say die attitude about them. O Connor won it in 3 different stints though 06 & 09 were similar teams. What does impress me about OConnor is the gap between title no. 3 (2009) and no. 4 (2022) and finally this year. Football changed so much in those years. The change in the last 12 months was challenging with the new rules and he is the first manager to win under them but in the 10 or so years he was away from the senior team was that he went back into the underage setup and won 2 minor all irelands and also took the U21s. Winning All-Irelands 18 years apart is very impressive especially with the change in the game and times. Im not going to call any of the managers the greatest as it is subjective under so many factors but they have all made our games great and none of them will be forgotten."
O'Connor's longevity is impressive. What's also impressive is his strike rate of 5 senior All Irelands from 11 attempts with Kerry, 45% success rate. It pales big time however compared to Gavins 6 from 7, 86% success.
Gavin's starting 15 in 2019 showed 9 changes from 2013, so quite a different team.

sligo joe (Dublin) - Posts: 1008 - 22/08/2025 13:06:56    2633116

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When you look at O Connors and Jim
Gavin's stats it really hits home how ridiculously good of a manager Brian Cody really was.

Cody was in a league of his own, 11 All Irelands.

His first All Ireland in 2000, 4 in a row from 06 to 09 and then his final All Ireland in 2015.

Past hurler (None) - Posts: 978 - 22/08/2025 14:32:06    2633123

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Replying To Past hurler:  "When you look at O Connors and Jim
Gavin's stats it really hits home how ridiculously good of a manager Brian Cody really was.

Cody was in a league of his own, 11 All Irelands.

His first All Ireland in 2000, 4 in a row from 06 to 09 and then his final All Ireland in 2015."
We all look through the prism that suits us, O' Connor, Gavin, Cody? Yes Cody won 11 to Gavin's 6, but and there's always a but, Brian failed to win the McCarthy Cup in 13 of his management years, Jim only missed out once.

sligo joe (Dublin) - Posts: 1008 - 22/08/2025 20:53:26    2633161

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Replying To Past hurler:  "When you look at O Connors and Jim
Gavin's stats it really hits home how ridiculously good of a manager Brian Cody really was.

Cody was in a league of his own, 11 All Irelands.

His first All Ireland in 2000, 4 in a row from 06 to 09 and then his final All Ireland in 2015."
I didnt realise Cody won 11 All Irelands. He's surely way out in front in both hurling & football so.. I believe he reffed all the training games and not even sure if he ever blew the whistle!! Incredible to think of the size of backroom teams nowadays needed to achieve much less .

Dothesimplethingswell (Sligo) - Posts: 25 - 22/08/2025 22:53:58    2633168

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Replying To sligo joe:  "We all look through the prism that suits us, O' Connor, Gavin, Cody? Yes Cody won 11 to Gavin's 6, but and there's always a but, Brian failed to win the McCarthy Cup in 13 of his management years, Jim only missed out once."
Cody was phenomenal, but he did also have a group of legendary players who came through together and played for over a decade. When most of that team finished up, he didn't win an All-Ireland in his last 7 years. The likes of Shefflin, JJ Delaney, Tommy Walsh, Eddie Brennan etc, we're generational players. Shefflin up there with the best to ever do it.
Still extraordinary for Cody to be able to do it for so long, at the highest level.

WanPintWin (Galway) - Posts: 2492 - 23/08/2025 00:03:30    2633173

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Teams of players win All Irelands.
A good manager helps.

Seanfan (Roscommon) - Posts: 87 - 23/08/2025 09:30:47    2633185

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Replying To WanPintWin:  "Cody was phenomenal, but he did also have a group of legendary players who came through together and played for over a decade. When most of that team finished up, he didn't win an All-Ireland in his last 7 years. The likes of Shefflin, JJ Delaney, Tommy Walsh, Eddie Brennan etc, we're generational players. Shefflin up there with the best to ever do it.
Still extraordinary for Cody to be able to do it for so long, at the highest level."
Cody was a great manager but Kilkenny are just hurling and dont play football so no competition.Dublin have had loads of hurlers that would win Leinsters and maybe an All Ireland only they played football.

brayballer (Wicklow) - Posts: 307 - 23/08/2025 12:15:46    2633199

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Replying To sligo joe:  "O'Connor's longevity is impressive. What's also impressive is his strike rate of 5 senior All Irelands from 11 attempts with Kerry, 45% success rate. It pales big time however compared to Gavins 6 from 7, 86% success.
Gavin's starting 15 in 2019 showed 9 changes from 2013, so quite a different team."
Jim did a great job but it was Gilroy that started the journey.The team that started in 19 might have had nine changes but the subs he brougth on were all there in 13 too so he still had 9 0r 1o players from 2013. Jim was great but he had a great backroom team and people dont seem to give Gilroy the credit for starting the run of the greatest team ever and not forgetting Dessie who won two All Ireland s with a dying horse. But the goat was Heffo.

brayballer (Wicklow) - Posts: 307 - 23/08/2025 12:24:42    2633201

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Replying To sligo joe:  "We all look through the prism that suits us, O' Connor, Gavin, Cody? Yes Cody won 11 to Gavin's 6, but and there's always a but, Brian failed to win the McCarthy Cup in 13 of his management years, Jim only missed out once."
Its a bit harsh to say Cody failed to win an AI for 13 of his seasons in charge because he definitely had them at the top table for almost all of that time and winning 11 titles puts him way out in front in them regards. The vast majority of managers fail the vast majority of the time if we look at it through that lens. If Gavin had spent 24 years with Dublin would he have rebuilt teams 3 or 4 or maybe 5 times and still won titles and got to All Ireland finals for most of that time? Its unlikely. O Connor won All irelands 22 years apart and like Cody that shows serious adaptability and longevity. Gavin has certainly given us our game back with these new rules. Football is now watchable.

Dothesimplethingswell (Sligo) - Posts: 25 - 23/08/2025 16:25:13    2633225

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Can Jack O'connor Over Take Jim Gavin?

Not a hope!

Jim's a "Mikoyan MiG-31" type a guy, whereas Jacks more a "Massy Ferguson 6480" type of dude!

Onion_Sack (Dublin) - Posts: 373 - 23/08/2025 18:28:04    2633237

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Replying To Seanfan:  "Teams of players win All Irelands.
A good manager helps."
Exactly, jack O'connor wasn't too clever with Kildare

totalrecall (Leitrim) - Posts: 1156 - 23/08/2025 21:53:42    2633270

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Replying To Dothesimplethingswell:  "Its a bit harsh to say Cody failed to win an AI for 13 of his seasons in charge because he definitely had them at the top table for almost all of that time and winning 11 titles puts him way out in front in them regards. The vast majority of managers fail the vast majority of the time if we look at it through that lens. If Gavin had spent 24 years with Dublin would he have rebuilt teams 3 or 4 or maybe 5 times and still won titles and got to All Ireland finals for most of that time? Its unlikely. O Connor won All irelands 22 years apart and like Cody that shows serious adaptability and longevity. Gavin has certainly given us our game back with these new rules. Football is now watchable."
Gavin is also the only "multiple" winning manager who has almost never failed, "only once"

sligo joe (Dublin) - Posts: 1008 - 24/08/2025 00:25:00    2633302

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Replying To totalrecall:  "Exactly, jack O'connor wasn't too clever with Kildare"
Brought them to a Leinster final and to division one. Haven't been there since

bláthach (Leitrim) - Posts: 231 - 24/08/2025 11:03:57    2633313

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Replying To bláthach:  "Brought them to a Leinster final and to division one. Haven't been there since"
It looks like Jack is staying around. If Kerry win next yrs All Ireland it'll be his first back to back AI but it will also be Kerrys 40th All Ireland. Surely Kerrys greatest manager since Micko

Dothesimplethingswell (Sligo) - Posts: 25 - 24/08/2025 19:38:18    2633371

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Not unless he wins 5 in a row. Jim gavin stands above them all . Whether people like that or not.

Barrowsider (Carlow) - Posts: 1714 - 24/08/2025 19:49:54    2633374

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