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Parish Rule - Dublin

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The GAA club is based on parish boundaries in most of Ireland. It's a great thing as it keeps things quite fair and even. You play for where you're from. Some don't like it, most do, but I don't want to debate that right now. What I'm wondering is if there is any parish rule in Dublin for GAA clubs? Clubs like Cuala and Kilmacud Crokes (just an example) seem to have a catchment area running from Bray to Donnybrook,. There must be hundreds of thousands of people in that area. Yet there are other clubs in the area like Geraldine Morans, Naomh Olaf, Shankill, St John's Ballinteer, Clanna Gael, Portobello, Ranelagh Gaels. Ballyboden St Enda's where is the Ballyboden St Enda's boundary with Ballinteer St Johns or Thomas Davis? How does it work? People just play for whoever they want? Or there is some boundaries there? icehonesty (Wexford) - Posts: 2566 - 27/01/2025 13:36:15 2587899 Link
Replying To icehonesty: "The GAA club is based on parish boundaries in most of Ireland. It's a great thing as it keeps things quite fair and even. You play for where you're from. Some don't like it, most do, but I don't want to debate that right now. What I'm wondering is if there is any parish rule in Dublin for GAA clubs? Clubs like Cuala and Kilmacud Crokes (just an example) seem to have a catchment area running from Bray to Donnybrook,. There must be hundreds of thousands of people in that area. Yet there are other clubs in the area like Geraldine Morans, Naomh Olaf, Shankill, St John's Ballinteer, Clanna Gael, Portobello, Ranelagh Gaels. Ballyboden St Enda's where is the Ballyboden St Enda's boundary with Ballinteer St Johns or Thomas Davis? How does it work? People just play for whoever they want? Or there is some boundaries there?" There is no parish rule in Dublin. Who even knows what their parish is in anyways? And plenty of parishes with no GAA clubs and some with more than one. Various reasons why people end up members of their clubs though. 1. Proximity - most people still end up at their closest club. Some might go to a club that's technically not the closest but that the club trains underage in a park/school close to their house etc. 2. Family link. People who have moved area, but haven't move that far away will tend to bring their kids to their "home" club eg someone who moves from Ballymun to Glasnevin may bring their kids back to Kickhams rather than to Na Fianna for example. On the other hand, if someone has moved from Stillorgan to Blanch, they're unlikely to go back to their "home" club. 3. Schools. Often certain clubs have links to certain schools in an area. One kid goes to one school and another kid from the same street/estate goes to another school, they could end up going to different GAA clubs. 4. Friends - you move to a new area, and know people in a local GAA club, but maybe not the exact closest club, you'll probably go to the club where you know people. There are probably plenty of other reasons too. Where I grew up, there was no immediately "local" GAA club. On our street, 60 houses or so, there were 4 families involved in GAA clubs, 4 different clubs. MesAmis (Dublin) - Posts: 13787 - 27/01/2025 15:30:08 2587955 Link
Very interesting. In what way is that a fair system? Both within Dublin, and then looking at Leinster and All-Ireland club levels? icehonesty (Wexford) - Posts: 2566 - 27/01/2025 17:01:16 2587992 Link
There's no Parish Rule in Westmeath either. You could also say there's no Parish Rule in Wexford town. There are two parishes there (and three if you count Clonard), but the parish boundaries have no effect on choosing your first club, and are not considered in any transfer application to move between clubs there. Pikeman96 (Wexford) - Posts: 2668 - 27/01/2025 17:37:13 2588001 Link
Think most cities are the same..no parish rule in limerick city,it's just something we are used to.. CTGAA10 (Limerick) - Posts: 2434 - 27/01/2025 17:42:44 2588005 Link
Replying To Pikeman96: "There's no Parish Rule in Westmeath either. You could also say there's no Parish Rule in Wexford town. There are two parishes there (and three if you count Clonard), but the parish boundaries have no effect on choosing your first club, and are not considered in any transfer application to move between clubs there." Yeah, Dublin not unique in having no parish rule. MesAmis (Dublin) - Posts: 13787 - 27/01/2025 18:05:29 2588011 Link
Replying To icehonesty: "Very interesting. In what way is that a fair system? Both within Dublin, and then looking at Leinster and All-Ireland club levels?" I don't know about it being unfair or fair, but it's the system we've got. Plenty of parishes have no club. A quick Google, suggests there are 200 parishes in Dublin, and less than 100 GAA clubs. A "parish" rule would be of no benefit to the GAA in Dublin imo. MesAmis (Dublin) - Posts: 13787 - 27/01/2025 18:23:07 2588015 Link
Replying To icehonesty: "Very interesting. In what way is that a fair system? Both within Dublin, and then looking at Leinster and All-Ireland club levels?" Clubs like my own small one have attempted from time to time to introduce some rule around schools but never got far. I was delegate to one county convention where Brian Mullins made it very clear that Vinnies were not going to tolerate any change. Ironically the famous Joeys school in Fairview where Foleys, Heffo, Keaveney et al came from was strictly speaking in the Joeys and O'Tooles catchment. It was makings of Vinnies in 50s. BarneyGrant (Dublin) - Posts: 3331 - 27/01/2025 19:05:49 2588031 Link
Replying To Pikeman96: "There's no Parish Rule in Westmeath either. You could also say there's no Parish Rule in Wexford town. There are two parishes there (and three if you count Clonard), but the parish boundaries have no effect on choosing your first club, and are not considered in any transfer application to move between clubs there." No parish rule in Gorey either. And a very blurred one in Enniscorthy! Viking66 (Wexford) - Posts: 14421 - 27/01/2025 20:17:27 2588049 Link
A parish rule wouldnt work as most parishes do not have a club, in fact lots of big areas in South Dublin do not have a club - Dun Laoghaire, Ballsbridge, Dundrum, Blackrock, Milltown, Monkstown..etc you would have to travel outside your area to play GAA bad.monkey (USA) - Posts: 4645 - 27/01/2025 21:27:40 2588058 Link
Replying To bad.monkey: "A parish rule wouldnt work as most parishes do not have a club, in fact lots of big areas in South Dublin do not have a club - Dun Laoghaire, Ballsbridge, Dundrum, Blackrock, Milltown, Monkstown..etc you would have to travel outside your area to play GAA" But some or even many parishes not having a club doesn't mean that there couldn't be a parish rule for the ones who do. People from an area that doesn't have a club of its own could play for another club under whatever version of the "isolated player" rule the county puts in place in its by-laws. Could be restricted to a choice of a club in a neighbouring area, or one which you can demonstrate an "other relevant connection" to. As I understand it, Dublin has no version of the parish rule at all (by the way, would be more properly called "defined club catchment areas"). Instead, you've a wide open choice of which club to join. You could live in Shankill and play for Skerries, or live in Ballyfermot and play for Balbriggan. Pikeman96 (Wexford) - Posts: 2668 - 28/01/2025 12:41:09 2588158 Link
Replying To Viking66: "No parish rule in Gorey either. And a very blurred one in Enniscorthy!" Is there none in Gorey? Enniscorthy I thought west side of the river was Rapps and Templeshannon/Drumgoold side was Shamrocks? Wexford town seems to be a free for all, is it? St Martins parish seems to have grown a lot in area. Parish boundary around New Ross well respected I believe but only I assume because it only borders Rosbercon on one side and Rathgarogue on the other side. icehonesty (Wexford) - Posts: 2566 - 28/01/2025 13:41:27 2588166 Link
Replying To BarneyGrant: "Clubs like my own small one have attempted from time to time to introduce some rule around schools but never got far. I was delegate to one county convention where Brian Mullins made it very clear that Vinnies were not going to tolerate any change. Ironically the famous Joeys school in Fairview where Foleys, Heffo, Keaveney et al came from was strictly speaking in the Joeys and O'Tooles catchment. It was makings of Vinnies in 50s." Must be very hard in small clubs having players stolen by big clubs, then going on to play for the super clubs 3rd team at minor level, when they'd be a stalwart for your small club? I understand what people are saying about parishes in Dublin. But still a free for all doesn't seem right either. Rather than a total free for all, why doesn't the GAA draw up some boundaries for Dublin? Loosely based on parishes and give proper catchment areas. Give smaller clubs a chance? icehonesty (Wexford) - Posts: 2566 - 28/01/2025 13:44:31 2588168 Link
Replying To icehonesty: "Must be very hard in small clubs having players stolen by big clubs, then going on to play for the super clubs 3rd team at minor level, when they'd be a stalwart for your small club? I understand what people are saying about parishes in Dublin. But still a free for all doesn't seem right either. Rather than a total free for all, why doesn't the GAA draw up some boundaries for Dublin? Loosely based on parishes and give proper catchment areas. Give smaller clubs a chance?" I don't know if forcing people into playing for a certain club would work in a Dublin GAA context, though I see your point. Potentially you could lose a lot of people to the GAA if they were forced to not go to their club of choice, particularly one that is still relatively local to them, and that they have family connections with. From a more rural point of view, would the relaxation of the 'parish' rule help more rural clubs. In that if a someone ends up moving into their local county town, for example, from a rural area not that far away. Should they have the choice of bringing their kids to either the local Town GAA club or back to their 'home' club? Or is this being done already? I'm sure it's not a panacea for the decline in numbers in rural clubs, but it could maybe help with the fielding of teams, particularly at underage level. MesAmis (Dublin) - Posts: 13787 - 28/01/2025 14:11:36 2588173 Link
Replying To icehonesty: "Must be very hard in small clubs having players stolen by big clubs, then going on to play for the super clubs 3rd team at minor level, when they'd be a stalwart for your small club? I understand what people are saying about parishes in Dublin. But still a free for all doesn't seem right either. Rather than a total free for all, why doesn't the GAA draw up some boundaries for Dublin? Loosely based on parishes and give proper catchment areas. Give smaller clubs a chance?" Smaller clubs like my own have also suffered due to demographics. We found it impossible to sustain underage teams into older age groups so kids in local schools who wanted to keep playing join other clubs. Our bad. Minimal interest at school level. We had one great Kerrywoman who trained the lads and tied in with us. We had a principal, now moved on to higher things, who had no interest whatsover, Doesn't stop him turning up at Parnell when chasing votes of course... BarneyGrant (Dublin) - Posts: 3331 - 28/01/2025 15:28:07 2588203 Link
Replying To icehonesty: "Is there none in Gorey? Enniscorthy I thought west side of the river was Rapps and Templeshannon/Drumgoold side was Shamrocks? Wexford town seems to be a free for all, is it? St Martins parish seems to have grown a lot in area. Parish boundary around New Ross well respected I believe but only I assume because it only borders Rosbercon on one side and Rathgarogue on the other side." Same schools for Naobh Eanna and Tara Rocks. Lads from the Shannon playing for the Rapps. Some Ross lads playing for Cushinstown. Viking66 (Wexford) - Posts: 14421 - 28/01/2025 15:35:01 2588206 Link
Replying To icehonesty: "Is there none in Gorey? Enniscorthy I thought west side of the river was Rapps and Templeshannon/Drumgoold side was Shamrocks? Wexford town seems to be a free for all, is it? St Martins parish seems to have grown a lot in area. Parish boundary around New Ross well respected I believe but only I assume because it only borders Rosbercon on one side and Rathgarogue on the other side." Same schools for Naobh Eanna and Tara Rocks. Lads from the Shannon playing for the Rapps. Some Ross lads playing for Cushinstown. Think the National school you go to makes a difference. Viking66 (Wexford) - Posts: 14421 - 28/01/2025 15:36:36 2588207 Link
Replying To icehonesty: "Is there none in Gorey? Enniscorthy I thought west side of the river was Rapps and Templeshannon/Drumgoold side was Shamrocks? Wexford town seems to be a free for all, is it? St Martins parish seems to have grown a lot in area. Parish boundary around New Ross well respected I believe but only I assume because it only borders Rosbercon on one side and Rathgarogue on the other side." Looks like this could become as much about Wexford as it is about Dublin! The parish rule applies in Gorey all right. But where it becomes murky is how people in Gorey parish have the choice of two clubs within that parish (Naomh Eanna & Tara Rocks). And it becomes murkier again then through the arrangement that somebody with Tara Rocks can transfer to the next parish (Kilanerin) to play football, and somebody in Kilanerin can transfer into a Gorey parish club (Tara Rocks) to play hurling. Basically, anybody at all in Gorey could end up legally playing football for Kilanerin, even if they've never set foot in the place other than for training and matches. Strictly speaking, the rule also applies in Enniscorthy, but as Viking says, it's a little "blurred". People in St. Aidan's parish are supposed to be with Rapparees/Starlights, and people in Templeshannon parish are supposed to be with Shamrocks. In practice though, Shamrocks normally don't even operate at the younger age groups (i.e. Go Games and U12), so kids at that end of town go to Rapps/Stars and often end up staying there. And for adults wanting to move from one club to the other, it's relatively easy to get "proof" of address that you're living at the other side of the bridge to where you really do live. Pikeman96 (Wexford) - Posts: 2668 - 28/01/2025 15:45:48 2588210 Link
Replying To Viking66: "Same schools for Naobh Eanna and Tara Rocks. Lads from the Shannon playing for the Rapps. Some Ross lads playing for Cushinstown. Think the National school you go to makes a difference." The Gorey/Castletown border is another one, if you consider Tara Hill National School (not be confused with Tara Rocks - it's a good six or eight miles from 'The Rock' area where that club is based). Tara Hill N.S. is in Gorey parish, despite being only a short walk from the Castletown pitch. People at that end of Gorey parish who send their children there are under the impression that this entitles them to play for Castletown/Liam Mellows, instead of bringing them "all the way into town". However, it doesn't. They're residents of an urban parish (Gorey), attending an urban parish school (Tara Hill). There's no provision in rule or by-law for them to join a neighbouring rural club like Castletown, no matter how close to the school it might be. But there's been a blind eye turned to it for years, and it'll probably always be that way. Pikeman96 (Wexford) - Posts: 2668 - 28/01/2025 15:53:38 2588212 Link
It's getting harder for Dublin people who grew up in a certain area, to actually then be lucky enough to buy a home in the area they grew up in. You go where you can afford I think that plays a part in all this too, you may have to move from an area but that doesn't mean you're still not from there, you still have that connection and if you are still within a reasonable distance, you'll definitely go to effort of getting your kids playing for the same club that you did. jimbodub (Dublin) - Posts: 20740 - 28/01/2025 16:16:11 2588215 Link