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Experimental Railway Cup

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Replying To Saynothing:  "Leave the game alone { except for getting rid of Mark and black card} and get county refs and officials to use the same rule book. Every game is different and teams are scoring as much now as 20/ 30 years ago. Shaving foam to stop cheating while taking frees is a big yes, yes."
There was only a handful of good games in the All Ireland series

FoolsGold (Cavan) - Posts: 2835 - 11/10/2024 15:10:43    2574211

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Replying To wicklowsupport:  "The All-Star awards were originally devised to recognise outstanding individual players. About 10-15 years ago, the award was turned into a team award because a significant part of the criteria is based upon your team playing in an All Ireland final which moves it from being an individual award to a team award. This change in criteria eliminates 90pc of the playing population regardless of individual talent. To compound the problem, they began awarding players awards for different positions i.e. a midfielder given a full forward award. I wouldn't know who received an award last year as I've no interest in seeing the awards being shared amongst the same counties year after year. If the GAA dedicated some time to thinking about the awards, they'd revert back to the original concept and give the awards to the best player in a specific position based upon their individual brilliance."
Exactly. The gloss has long gone off these awards. I don't like seeing our players get them as next year they go in the tank. I think it goes to their heads.

Canuck (Waterford) - Posts: 2886 - 11/10/2024 17:51:42    2574244

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Replying To GreenandRed:  "Let them try these new rules first and judge them then. Some sound a bit daft, some hard to understand, some sound hard to referee, some sound great in theory. Will need more consistent refereeing with inputs from other officials and hopefully let the games flow a bit more. We won't know until we see them in practice in games where the results matter."
If most of these ridiculous rule changes get as far as games where the results really matter as you say then the game is finished for good… What are these clowns playing at…? Where on earth are they going to get referees to officiate games at lower club level…? As I have pointed out before these geniuses change rules year after year as if every game is taking place in Croke Park when they should be thinking the opposite way about it and think of the poor referee who has to turn up at a junior b game on his own without an army of helpers and then try and referee a game and implement all these ridiculous rules.. They are already at their wits end with the current rule book… It's more help referees want from the GAA , not hinder.. I can see lots of referees packing it in and then the GAA big wigs will have real problems….

ForeverBlue2 (Cavan) - Posts: 3091 - 12/10/2024 08:46:03    2574293

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Replying To GreenandRed:  "Let them try these new rules first and judge them then. Some sound a bit daft, some hard to understand, some sound hard to referee, some sound great in theory. Will need more consistent refereeing with inputs from other officials and hopefully let the games flow a bit more. We won't know until we see them in practice in games where the results matter."
If most of these ridiculous rule changes get as far as games where the results really matter as you say then the game is finished for good… What are these clowns playing at…? Where on earth are they going to get referees to officiate games at lower club level…? As I have pointed out before these geniuses change rules year after year as if every game is taking place in Croke Park when they should be thinking the opposite way about it and think of the poor referee who has to turn up at a junior b game on his own without an army of helpers and then try and referee a game and implement all these ridiculous rules.. They are already at their wits end with the current rule book… It's more help referees want from the GAA , not hinder.. I can see lots of referees packing it in and then the GAA big wigs will have real problems….

ForeverBlue2 (Cavan) - Posts: 3091 - 12/10/2024 08:46:17    2574294

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Replying To legendzxix:  "Are the 7 core rules changes that complicated?
1. 1v1 throw-in to start the game
2. 40 metre scoring arc and new scoring system
3. Kick-outs from the 20 having to go beyond the 40 arc.
4. 'Solo and Go'
5. Advanced mark changes for kicks outside the 45 fielded inside the 20, and an advantage being allowed which should create goal opportunities.
6. Limits on passing to the goalkeeper. Player and keeper must both be on the large rectangle, or the keeper has advanced beyond the 65 yard line.
7. 3/3 Up/Back. Supposedly this might change to a new halfway line. By that extension, possibly the passing to the keeper in point 6 might also apply when the keeper advances beyond halfway.

1, 2, 3 and 4 seem very straightforward. 5 seems an improvement on the current advance mark and should be a smooth change.
6. New but should be very manageable.
7. Again a new one. A bit tricky for one official but the feedback is that it is generally self policed. Players won't be long drawing refs attention to players straying out of bounds."
This is a good post explaining the rules.
I guess the 1v1 throw up is a bit like afl but it's much more important there given number of throw in balls they have. They have some huge men playing ruck man. It should be good to see the natural leaping ability of players going directly head to head.

A torture to me is the lack of meaningful kick passing in the game. Someone else posted about being the number of handpass to kick ratio being 3.5 to 1 and not directly addressing this problem head on. Whatever the ratio is it is there's not enough meaningful kick passing and that's being a scurge on the game. While there is no direct rule to address it you'd hope the 40 m arc score and mandating keeping players up the field makes the kick pass in a more viable option. I also think the 40 metre arc will surprise people. When allowing for the angle it won't be as far out as you might think.

The keeper coming up the pitch is a new fad. I am not sure i would not have complicated the rule change by allowing him to join the attack but we'll see. Tyrone could really benefit from it while Morgan is still about.

The mark wasn't really a factor in the game so should even be less now. Though arc rule may creat more space on the inside though for the mark

Solo and go is a hockey rule and absolutely worth a go. It should reduce the impact of cynical fouling. I would though say refs have to get stricter on steps. Players are often fouled after the overcarry.

I'm looking forward to seeing how it goes.

Ulsterchamps_32 (Donegal) - Posts: 780 - 12/10/2024 09:53:03    2574297

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Replying To ForeverBlue2:  "If most of these ridiculous rule changes get as far as games where the results really matter as you say then the game is finished for good… What are these clowns playing at…? Where on earth are they going to get referees to officiate games at lower club level…? As I have pointed out before these geniuses change rules year after year as if every game is taking place in Croke Park when they should be thinking the opposite way about it and think of the poor referee who has to turn up at a junior b game on his own without an army of helpers and then try and referee a game and implement all these ridiculous rules.. They are already at their wits end with the current rule book… It's more help referees want from the GAA , not hinder.. I can see lots of referees packing it in and then the GAA big wigs will have real problems…."
I don't always agree with you but the rules changes represent not the development of Gaelic football as it is, but the invention of a new game.

BarneyGrant (Dublin) - Posts: 3204 - 12/10/2024 10:27:27    2574305

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Replying To ForeverBlue2:  "If most of these ridiculous rule changes get as far as games where the results really matter as you say then the game is finished for good… What are these clowns playing at…? Where on earth are they going to get referees to officiate games at lower club level…? As I have pointed out before these geniuses change rules year after year as if every game is taking place in Croke Park when they should be thinking the opposite way about it and think of the poor referee who has to turn up at a junior b game on his own without an army of helpers and then try and referee a game and implement all these ridiculous rules.. They are already at their wits end with the current rule book… It's more help referees want from the GAA , not hinder.. I can see lots of referees packing it in and then the GAA big wigs will have real problems…."
Jim Gavin a clown ?
Michael Murphy a clown?
Eamonn Fitz Maurice a clown?
James Horan a Clown?
Colm Collins a clown?
Malachy O Rourke a clown ?

Fairly ignorant comment about the cream of the Gaa. Why not wait to see the game in action before you start mouthing off.

eoinog (Sligo) - Posts: 1976 - 12/10/2024 10:28:51    2574306

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I think with these new rules it will mean goalie woukd just be kicking ball out not allowed receive a pass back is thar correct ?? I know lots give out about teams holding possession of ball for long periods but in reality that the opposition who are letting them the game is 15 v 15 so it's not as if one team has a few extra players it's the coaches that are the problem and trust me they will find away around these rules also don't agree with 2 points for a score outside the new arc or 4 for a goal at club matches it's almost impossible get umpires how will that rule work at club level even county level it's only a matter of tome before GAA bring in VAR. they have lost the plot with all these changes the new advantage rule as well 10 seconds madness or ref descrision now that be fun with no player allowed play ball from kicitout instead 45 meter line it actually takes away from players having to actually think what keeper going do everyone now knows he can't kick it short it' madness all these changes 1v 1 for thrown in can't see much logic there either the gaa in my opinion have actually contributed big time to the demise of not just football but Gaelic sports in general change rules change way competition are run the calendar get games out way as quickly as possible for concert and rugby deciding games with penalties give it few years and the number playing will fall big time referees will go as well

Kickitout (Galway) - Posts: 959 - 12/10/2024 11:56:04    2574321

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Replying To eoinog:  "Jim Gavin a clown ?
Michael Murphy a clown?
Eamonn Fitz Maurice a clown?
James Horan a Clown?
Colm Collins a clown?
Malachy O Rourke a clown ?

Fairly ignorant comment about the cream of the Gaa. Why not wait to see the game in action before you start mouthing off."
All serious accomplished football men.
I think the 40m arc and the 3 up/3 back will be a nightmare for club game refs.

While the new rules could be a resounding success next weekend we have to realise it's 80 elite players in 4 tournament games in a Stadium with all modern stuff and 8 match officials of the highest grade.
Now about the u14 or Junior B....
The various dissent proposals are long overdue.

But

Nothing about the elephant in the room....orgies of handpassing.

Seanfanbocht (Roscommon) - Posts: 1994 - 12/10/2024 11:57:35    2574322

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I'd agree with some of the above. I don't see any of the rule changes doing much to improve the game.

Surely the biggest problem with inter county football at the moment is how easy it is to keep possession?
7-10 steps permitted and very difficult for opposition to tackle without fouling

97Cavans (Cavan) - Posts: 379 - 12/10/2024 12:29:11    2574329

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Replying To 97Cavans:  "I'd agree with some of the above. I don't see any of the rule changes doing much to improve the game.

Surely the biggest problem with inter county football at the moment is how easy it is to keep possession?
7-10 steps permitted and very difficult for opposition to tackle without fouling"
Passing back to the keeper is a lot time wasted. Teams were kicking it back 40 yards and.moving the ball at snails pace. At least with it gone its one less slow tactic

FoolsGold (Cavan) - Posts: 2835 - 12/10/2024 13:14:10    2574334

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Give it a year, probably a lot of new changes won't be popular but some might be. James Horan's thoughts on the sandbox games and the proposed changes:

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GreenandRed (Mayo) - Posts: 7693 - 12/10/2024 13:33:51    2574335

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The three players in your own half does this include the goalkeeper ??. What will the new goalkeeper role look like , an extra player who can show up anyplace in the pitch.

jacktheboy (Donegal) - Posts: 450 - 12/10/2024 14:03:07    2574340

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RTE have gone into good detail on the 7 core enhancements as they are being called. There is a strong argument for all.
1. 1 v 1 throw in seeing less fouling.
2. Quicker kick outs.
3. No more piggy in the middle. Example of Cork letting the Tyrone goalkeeper waltz up the field with no effort to win back possession.
4. Good argument for 2 pointer. Increase in goal value understandable.
5. 3 up/back. Should be a long kick option.
6. Solo and go keeps momentum with the attack.
7. Big improvement in the attacking mark.

legendzxix (Kerry) - Posts: 8357 - 12/10/2024 14:19:47    2574344

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Replying To legendzxix:  "RTE have gone into good detail on the 7 core enhancements as they are being called. There is a strong argument for all.
1. 1 v 1 throw in seeing less fouling.
2. Quicker kick outs.
3. No more piggy in the middle. Example of Cork letting the Tyrone goalkeeper waltz up the field with no effort to win back possession.
4. Good argument for 2 pointer. Increase in goal value understandable.
5. 3 up/back. Should be a long kick option.
6. Solo and go keeps momentum with the attack.
7. Big improvement in the attacking mark."
Who keeps an eye on the 3 players in the half, and what's the punishment if you cross the line ? Very very difficult to watch that. No 13 and no 14 could be on the 20 meters line but 10 and 12 could be crossing over and back the half way line. You might be watching no 10 and say oh he's the wrong side of the line but no 12 could strategically be on the correct side even though he is 40 meters away

eoinog (Sligo) - Posts: 1976 - 12/10/2024 14:53:24    2574350

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Replying To eoinog:  "Who keeps an eye on the 3 players in the half, and what's the punishment if you cross the line ? Very very difficult to watch that. No 13 and no 14 could be on the 20 meters line but 10 and 12 could be crossing over and back the half way line. You might be watching no 10 and say oh he's the wrong side of the line but no 12 could strategically be on the correct side even though he is 40 meters away"
The linesmen should watch them, in communication with the referee. That's according to David Coldrick, who refereed some sandbox games, when he was on Smaller Fish on September 18th. But he also said it's one of the more difficult rules to officiate. For the reasons you gave there Eoinóg, you can see it's harder to watch that rule.

GreenandRed (Mayo) - Posts: 7693 - 12/10/2024 15:26:03    2574355

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Replying To eoinog:  "Who keeps an eye on the 3 players in the half, and what's the punishment if you cross the line ? Very very difficult to watch that. No 13 and no 14 could be on the 20 meters line but 10 and 12 could be crossing over and back the half way line. You might be watching no 10 and say oh he's the wrong side of the line but no 12 could strategically be on the correct side even though he is 40 meters away"
That keeping players up has always been the simplistic answer to how do you combat the blanket defence.
But how can it work in practice?
Say I score a point from round the 20 is it disallowed if only one colleague in the opponents half?
Does the goalie count as one of the 3 back or is it 3 plus goalie?

Seanfanbocht (Roscommon) - Posts: 1994 - 12/10/2024 15:40:28    2574357

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I presume there is a time limit for the "tap and go"?

97Cavans (Cavan) - Posts: 379 - 12/10/2024 16:17:01    2574360

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Replying To eoinog:  "Who keeps an eye on the 3 players in the half, and what's the punishment if you cross the line ? Very very difficult to watch that. No 13 and no 14 could be on the 20 meters line but 10 and 12 could be crossing over and back the half way line. You might be watching no 10 and say oh he's the wrong side of the line but no 12 could strategically be on the correct side even though he is 40 meters away"
I suppose it's down to the spirit in how the games are played. Will players be encouraged to push the boundaries a bit on numbers. A more elegant question is the one on sanction what is the penalty for not having 3 back ?

Freethinker (Wicklow) - Posts: 1291 - 12/10/2024 16:37:23    2574362

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Replying To eoinog:  "Jim Gavin a clown ?
Michael Murphy a clown?
Eamonn Fitz Maurice a clown?
James Horan a Clown?
Colm Collins a clown?
Malachy O Rourke a clown ?

Fairly ignorant comment about the cream of the Gaa. Why not wait to see the game in action before you start mouthing off."
Well said

Freethinker (Wicklow) - Posts: 1291 - 12/10/2024 16:38:44    2574363

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