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Wexford Club Hurling Championship.

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Am I right in saying the winners of both 5v6 games tomorrow will play the Annes and the Shels? With the Harriers playing Gorey and the winners of Ferns vs Oylegate playing the Martins?

OpenStandWall (Wexford) - Posts: 138 - 21/09/2024 11:47:41    2571127

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If we were going to copy any other county's format I'm still convinced we should've went with a Senior A and B format as done in Limerick. If this year is anything to go by there is a clear gulf starting to appear point differential of +38 and +39 between 3rd and 4th in both groups.

OpenStandWall (Wexford) - Posts: 138 - 21/09/2024 11:58:00    2571128

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Replying To OpenStandWall:  "Am I right in saying the winners of both 5v6 games tomorrow will play the Annes and the Shels? With the Harriers playing Gorey and the winners of Ferns vs Oylegate playing the Martins?"
If Oylegate win then there will be a draw to see who plays Martins or Gorey, as they and the Harriers have both played the Martins already.

Viking66 (Wexford) - Posts: 13441 - 21/09/2024 12:51:36    2571143

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Replying To OpenStandWall:  "Am I right in saying the winners of both 5v6 games tomorrow will play the Annes and the Shels? With the Harriers playing Gorey and the winners of Ferns vs Oylegate playing the Martins?"
Yes

zinny (Wexford) - Posts: 1880 - 21/09/2024 12:53:58    2571144

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Replying To OpenStandWall:  "If we were going to copy any other county's format I'm still convinced we should've went with a Senior A and B format as done in Limerick. If this year is anything to go by there is a clear gulf starting to appear point differential of +38 and +39 between 3rd and 4th in both groups."
That would be a fair point if it was the same 6 teams well clear last year and the previousfew years. But it wasn't. Last year Oylegate made the final but aren't in this year's top 6, while the Harriers are this year and didn't even make the last 8 last year. Also both Rapps and Crossabeg finished in the top 3 of their Group last year. We don't have a definite top 6 in this county.
In Limerick there's a top 4 in recent years, with 2 other clubs making up the numbers in A and trying not to get relegated.

Viking66 (Wexford) - Posts: 13441 - 21/09/2024 12:59:35    2571145

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Replying To Viking66:  "We should've kept the split season. It was inevitable the standard would worsen at dual clubs when their players had to keep jumping from football to hurling and back again. The 2 sports have completely different skillsets, even if they are both 15 a side and played on the same pitches."
You're responding to a post about Glynn Bar town and somehow implementing that getting rid kf the split season has made it worse.

Glynn Barntown had a single drawn game as their most positive result in the group stages in 2023, 1 point. This year they have 4 points and 2 wins! So how has it gotten worse for them?

Glynns biggest problem goes beyond structures etc.

tearintom (Wexford) - Posts: 1408 - 21/09/2024 18:13:36    2571192

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Better game in the Park this evening anyway, even if it was mainly due to the expert free-taking of Ian Byrne in the shite conditions, and the resilience Ferns' showed to respond to the goal. Thought the ref was too fussy and could have been a belter if let flow a bit more.

Its mad how Ferns haven't introduced any new blood to the playing numbers that won in 2022 (Conor Scallan and Gavin Bailey didn't play the final due to suspension and injury but surely would have started if available) yet still have the quality to get it done. Oylegate are the opposite, obviously regressed since last year, but have a younger age profile and look to have a real talent in Sean Rowley. Young Jack Hennessy is a hardy bit of stuff as well.

Byrne was clearly the difference maker, but thought Ferns collectively defended better than Oylegate too. Morris started on fire but was quiet for most of the game thereafter and CBD didn't have as many moments as you'd expect. Shane Reck really carried the fight for Oylegate (his vision and decision-making for the goal was top class), thought Damien didn't exert his influence enough for his stature and it was a bad challenge at the very end. Seemed to be a conditioning issue as well- too many lads leaving with cramp (not exactly the most taxing of championship schedules).

beano (Wexford) - Posts: 1445 - 21/09/2024 20:45:38    2571207

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Gearoid hates blowing the whistle doesnt he.

countyman2022 (Wexford) - Posts: 690 - 22/09/2024 08:55:50    2571241

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Replying To zinny:  "The reward for coming first is in theory you play the second weakest of the six teams in the QF whereas in prior years it was the the 4th. The team in 2nd make really no difference as they would have played the 3rd anyway.
The team that comes 5th could benefit as they get another chance to play in the QF but they also could get relegated. The 6th team could get to a QF.

All said and done there are two winners in the above compared to last year. 1st and 6th. The team in 5th may think they now still have a chance at a QF but they also could get relegated - how may of the 5th place teams would role the dice if given that choice now."
Got two bad rolls then.

zinny (Wexford) - Posts: 1880 - 22/09/2024 21:11:36    2571319

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Replying To zinny:  "Got two bad rolls then."
It's a crazy structure.

The championship started over what, 11 weeeks ago and only now do we actually have teams gone out of the championship.

We have 2 teams who have literally won 1 game in 6 championship matches in that time sitting in quarter final spots. 2 teams that won none of their group games, zero, one of them actually finished the group phase with a -55point score difference!

Meanwhile we have what 4 teams who actually won 2 group games and are our of the championship, 2 of them facing a relegation final!

2 wins out of 5 championship group games and find yourself in relegation. Zero wins in 5 group games but pull off one win and youre in a quarter final!!

Make its make sense!

tearintom (Wexford) - Posts: 1408 - 22/09/2024 23:21:35    2571339

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Replying To tearintom:  "You're responding to a post about Glynn Bar town and somehow implementing that getting rid kf the split season has made it worse.

Glynn Barntown had a single drawn game as their most positive result in the group stages in 2023, 1 point. This year they have 4 points and 2 wins! So how has it gotten worse for them?

Glynns biggest problem goes beyond structures etc."
That post wasn't specifically about Glynn. Although it might have affected them also. Crossabeg finished alot lower in the hurling this year than last year, but have done better in Football. St James and Bunclody have done better in hurling and worse in football. Gusserane have done worse in hurling. St Annes have done worse in Football. Kilanerin/Tara Rocks had done alot worse in hurling until this weekend. Most of the clubs that have mainly the same lads playing football and hurling seem to have done better at one code than the other relative to last year, except us, and there are other reasons for us going so badly, injuries and lads away.

Viking66 (Wexford) - Posts: 13441 - 23/09/2024 07:00:46    2571349

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Went to 3 games of hurling yesterday and all 3 teams I wanted to win lost. Glad I didn't back any horses!
1st up was Kennedy Park, and while some of our lads did well, collectively as a team we played as poorly as I ever saw any team play. The referee was whistle happy also, and this contributed to the game being as bad a game as I've seen all year. Parker was excellent for Horeswood is he still u20 next year? If not hopefully he's on Keith's radar to bring in around the Senior panel to get some exposure/experience/development.
The 2nd game was the best by far. Crossabeg and Cloughbawn traded blows in what was a very close game that went to ET. Cloughbawn now find themselves in the same unfortunate position as they were in 2 years ago, in a relegation final despite getting 4 points in the group stage.
The 3rd game was alot poorer, although in fairness the weather was poor, with a misty rain taking conditions greasy and tricky, and the first games ET disrupting the warm up, as Mick Jacob Senior predicted would be the case before the ball was even thrown in. Oulart looked nervous and sat too far offrheir men, playing with little intensity and no rhythm. At the time Kevin Foley score his decisive wonder goal I wondered out loud should he have been taken down out the field, but after seeing it back this morning there were plenty of defenders back, and if someone took him down further out resulting in an easy free they would likely have been ate by management. Just a superb goal!
From the county point of view Paudie Foley was excellent for Crossabeg, as was Oisin Foley to a lesser extent, while Mark Byrne did better in midfield than I was expecting him too, while was his usual excellent self from placed balls. Squidgy Kehoe, Dara Kehoe, and Paidi Cullen were all solid for Cloughbawn, though Conall Flood was badly missed.
Billy Dunne was Oularts best player, though Simon Roche didn't do too badly playing out of position at 11, though he's still u20 next year anyway. Kevin Foley drifted out of the game almost entirely for the 2nd half until he popped up with that goal, while Dara and Oisin Pepper looked lively, and it was worrying to see Jippo having to go off so early. Will he ever be fully fit again? Such an important player.
In the earlier game apart from the aforementioned Parker, Conor Foley was solid, and a half injured Cathal Doyle scored 3 from play before having to go off early.

Viking66 (Wexford) - Posts: 13441 - 23/09/2024 08:05:20    2571355

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The fixtures for the QF's and relegation finals were released last night. Does anyone know the reason for the senior and intermediate relegation not being played until the 18th/19th of October? It's a big break for the clubs involved and also doesn't make sense that it's not a consistent approach to be fixtures, all the other relegation matches are the same weekend as the quarter finals

JT22 (Wexford) - Posts: 39 - 23/09/2024 08:36:38    2571362

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Replying To tearintom:  "It's a crazy structure.

The championship started over what, 11 weeeks ago and only now do we actually have teams gone out of the championship.

We have 2 teams who have literally won 1 game in 6 championship matches in that time sitting in quarter final spots. 2 teams that won none of their group games, zero, one of them actually finished the group phase with a -55point score difference!

Meanwhile we have what 4 teams who actually won 2 group games and are our of the championship, 2 of them facing a relegation final!

2 wins out of 5 championship group games and find yourself in relegation. Zero wins in 5 group games but pull off one win and youre in a quarter final!!

Make its make sense!"
Overall, five teams who didn't win a single group game between them are now through to quarter-finals.

Five teams who finished with 6 points and two teams who finished with 5 points are out.

It was said a few pages back that it was the under-performers and basically the "bad" teams who stood to gain most from this system. I think we have proof of that now.

Pikeman96 (Wexford) - Posts: 2503 - 23/09/2024 08:42:34    2571364

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Wexford GAA website is tough to read so for anyone who's looking:

Harriers 5-25 Barntown 1-7

Ferns 1-24 Oylegate 1-21

Crossabeg 1-25 cloughbawn 0-27

Oulart 2-13 Rapps 4-15


Shells vs crossabeg 5th October 5pm

Martin's vs ferns 6th October 2pm

Harriers vs gorey 6th October 4pm

I don't see it online yet but that leaves Anne's and Rapps for the 5th at 3pm probably.

Doylerwex (Wexford) - Posts: 3064 - 23/09/2024 09:23:27    2571373

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Replying To Pikeman96:  "Overall, five teams who didn't win a single group game between them are now through to quarter-finals.

Five teams who finished with 6 points and two teams who finished with 5 points are out.

It was said a few pages back that it was the under-performers and basically the "bad" teams who stood to gain most from this system. I think we have proof of that now."
100%

We have a situation where a team can lose more games than they win and go on to win a county championship. Play 9 championship games, lose 5 in a row, win your next 4 and you're county champions.

On the flip side, you have another team who could play 8 championship games, lose 1 of those 8 and not win the championship.

It's not a slight on the teams that have benefited from this situation, best of good luck to them, I actually would love to see one or more of them go on to win their respective championships so that it might just put this structure to bed altogether

tearintom (Wexford) - Posts: 1408 - 23/09/2024 09:55:51    2571386

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Replying To JT22:  "The fixtures for the QF's and relegation finals were released last night. Does anyone know the reason for the senior and intermediate relegation not being played until the 18th/19th of October? It's a big break for the clubs involved and also doesn't make sense that it's not a consistent approach to be fixtures, all the other relegation matches are the same weekend as the quarter finals"
I notice there are no floodlit fixtures for quarter-finals weekend, apart from maybe the one in Wexford Park at 5pm on the Sunday. All the matches are fixed for the Saturday & Sunday afternoon. So just a guess here, but might be related to the number of match officials available.

Obviously every match needs a referee but crucial at this stage that every match has two official linesmen as well. There's a fourth official needed in Wexford Park too. So might just be a case of not being sure enough that there'd be enough officials available if those other two matches were fixed for the same Saturday & Sunday, especially if there's to be a number of underage semi-finals and/or finals to be played on those days as well.

But as I said, am just guessing.

Pikeman96 (Wexford) - Posts: 2503 - 23/09/2024 10:03:42    2571392

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Replying To Viking66:  "Went to 3 games of hurling yesterday and all 3 teams I wanted to win lost. Glad I didn't back any horses!
1st up was Kennedy Park, and while some of our lads did well, collectively as a team we played as poorly as I ever saw any team play. The referee was whistle happy also, and this contributed to the game being as bad a game as I've seen all year. Parker was excellent for Horeswood is he still u20 next year? If not hopefully he's on Keith's radar to bring in around the Senior panel to get some exposure/experience/development.
The 2nd game was the best by far. Crossabeg and Cloughbawn traded blows in what was a very close game that went to ET. Cloughbawn now find themselves in the same unfortunate position as they were in 2 years ago, in a relegation final despite getting 4 points in the group stage.
The 3rd game was alot poorer, although in fairness the weather was poor, with a misty rain taking conditions greasy and tricky, and the first games ET disrupting the warm up, as Mick Jacob Senior predicted would be the case before the ball was even thrown in. Oulart looked nervous and sat too far offrheir men, playing with little intensity and no rhythm. At the time Kevin Foley score his decisive wonder goal I wondered out loud should he have been taken down out the field, but after seeing it back this morning there were plenty of defenders back, and if someone took him down further out resulting in an easy free they would likely have been ate by management. Just a superb goal!
From the county point of view Paudie Foley was excellent for Crossabeg, as was Oisin Foley to a lesser extent, while Mark Byrne did better in midfield than I was expecting him too, while was his usual excellent self from placed balls. Squidgy Kehoe, Dara Kehoe, and Paidi Cullen were all solid for Cloughbawn, though Conall Flood was badly missed.
Billy Dunne was Oularts best player, though Simon Roche didn't do too badly playing out of position at 11, though he's still u20 next year anyway. Kevin Foley drifted out of the game almost entirely for the 2nd half until he popped up with that goal, while Dara and Oisin Pepper looked lively, and it was worrying to see Jippo having to go off so early. Will he ever be fully fit again? Such an important player.
In the earlier game apart from the aforementioned Parker, Conor Foley was solid, and a half injured Cathal Doyle scored 3 from play before having to go off early."
Thought Cathal Doyle went off with around 10 mins left in match, keeper looked to pick up a nasty injury with nobody near him, 3 sent off, taghmon need lads back from Aus very soon if thats a possibility,

lefty (Wexford) - Posts: 212 - 23/09/2024 10:15:08    2571400

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Replying To JT22:  "The fixtures for the QF's and relegation finals were released last night. Does anyone know the reason for the senior and intermediate relegation not being played until the 18th/19th of October? It's a big break for the clubs involved and also doesn't make sense that it's not a consistent approach to be fixtures, all the other relegation matches are the same weekend as the quarter finals"
Maybe teams involved wanted to extend their seasons in senior /intermediate as now 2 will be playing a lesser grade next year.
Maybe get players back from injury .
But suspect pitches availability plus with adequate lights for hurling and raft of1/4 finals on might be the case add in underage fixtures too
Would say both oulart and cloughbawn would welcome extra prep time to get lads back from injury and lick their wounds .
will they vote in favour of same format next year ? .

Still say finish 6th out and in relegation battle
thats no reflection on teams that finished 6th they took their chances in prelims
see on rapps Facebook out of relegation . In their heads are they done .
Will they be up for the 1/4 final
I d argue fir 4th place teams mainly oygate as glynn were terrible ( how can u you have such little regard for reaching that stage and show nothing . Any of the 3 teams that exited championship leave with knowing they gave it all .)
Would clughbawn have lost if conal flood played .
I hear others say how unlucky their team was with injuries through the year how unlucky were they in fairness . New format very cruel on them . But we voted it in
The biggest game of the year and without one of ur best forwards . Hope both teams in relegation final get everyone back and may the best team win .
Keep thinking back to cbeg v oulart would it have been better if loser was in relegation battle after that game and would it have been as loose at the end if stakes were higher .
Winner into preliminary1/4 final loser in relegation final if 6th
whilst 4th v 5th into preliminary 1/4 final . 113 1/4 final proper would surely make last few rounds of round Robin more exciting with more at stake

Formertownie (Wexford) - Posts: 282 - 23/09/2024 10:33:48    2571408

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Just to add to post above - weekend of October 5th & 6th has a stack of camogie matches too, e.g. senior final, intermediate semi-finals, four quarter-finals in one of the junior grades, and semi-finals in another two junior grades.

They draw from largely the same pool of match officials, so that might be having an effect too.

Pikeman96 (Wexford) - Posts: 2503 - 23/09/2024 10:34:01    2571410

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