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McDonagh Cup Link To All-Ireland To Be Removed?

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I enjoyed the occasion of Wexford visiting Tralee for a preliminary quarter final, despite the result. The travelling Wexicans brought great colour. Division 1B is now the fair place for these encounters.

legendzxix (Kerry) - Posts: 9579 - 26/02/2026 23:16:32    2658826

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Replying To Pikeman96:  "Knew it'd only be a matter of time before that Laois victory over Dublin back in 2019 was brought up!!!

But as I pointed out all the way back on page 9 of this thread (in April of last year), if you leave that one sole solitary shock result aside:
- average winning margin of McCarthy Cup side over Joe McDonagh winners = 13.5 points
- average winning margin of McCarthy Cup side over Joe McDonagh runners-up = 20 points

Then last year, McDonagh Cup winners were beaten by 21 points. McDonagh Cup runners-up were beaten by 23 points.

It really is time this mismatches were brought to an end. And I for one am glad to see it's one of the McDonagh Cup counties themselves bringing the motion to do that."
I for one hope it's not done away with. I'm surprised Wexford posters are so worried about it as ye are not a Mcdonagh team & ye havent finished in the top 3 recently so don't have to worry about playing a preliminary q/t final. Playing these games is a big reward after winning Mcdonagh & with nothing to lose really. As I previously stated just give teams the 2 weeks to prepare. If it's only the 6 days they might as well get rid of it

carlo (Carlow) - Posts: 319 - 27/02/2026 00:03:01    2658830

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Replying To carlo:  "I for one hope it's not done away with. I'm surprised Wexford posters are so worried about it as ye are not a Mcdonagh team & ye havent finished in the top 3 recently so don't have to worry about playing a preliminary q/t final. Playing these games is a big reward after winning Mcdonagh & with nothing to lose really. As I previously stated just give teams the 2 weeks to prepare. If it's only the 6 days they might as well get rid of it"
We have finished in the top 3 more often than Dublin, and the same amount of times as Galway. We only missed out on top 3 last year on head to head with Dublin.

Viking66 (Wexford) - Posts: 18913 - 27/02/2026 10:26:37    2658849

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The motion makes sense. It is time for change.

As far as I'm aware, the provincial runners up will have home advantage against the 3rd placed team from the other province in the All Ireland quarter finals. Makes sense.

Similarly, the McDonagh group runners up will have home advantage against the 3rd placed team in the McDonagh semi final.

legendzxix (Kerry) - Posts: 9579 - 27/02/2026 11:21:35    2658860

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Replying To legendzxix:  "The motion makes sense. It is time for change.

As far as I'm aware, the provincial runners up will have home advantage against the 3rd placed team from the other province in the All Ireland quarter finals. Makes sense.

Similarly, the McDonagh group runners up will have home advantage against the 3rd placed team in the McDonagh semi final."
I broadly agree with you that the motion makes sense with one caveat.
The reason for the preliminary quarter final is to leave the door open to more teams competing for and, potentially, winning Liam. Thats the theory anyway. What it did achieve was allow teams and players to compete in All ireland Series/mccarthy Cup that would never have done under this proposal. Thats prohibitive to the expansion of the game theoretically. There are a whole generation of hurlers out there who have McCarthy cup appearances on their cv without ever winning the Joe or Christy cups. That means a lot to them and the young hurlers coming behind them. That will be lost.
On a practical level the preliminary quarter finals are a wasted weekend but in an ideological one they serve a purpose. Are we ready to close the door on that idea?

Tadhg2020 (Limerick) - Posts: 120 - 27/02/2026 12:00:17    2658867

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Replying To carlo:  "I for one hope it's not done away with. I'm surprised Wexford posters are so worried about it as ye are not a Mcdonagh team & ye havent finished in the top 3 recently so don't have to worry about playing a preliminary q/t final. Playing these games is a big reward after winning Mcdonagh & with nothing to lose really. As I previously stated just give teams the 2 weeks to prepare. If it's only the 6 days they might as well get rid of it"
As regards your quip about Wexford posters being "worried", or why should we even have an opinion on it -

Some of us can look outside our own little bubble and consider what's best overall, rather than fixating just on ourselves.

And by the way, the big reward for winning McDonagh is getting to play in the top tier championship the following year. As I've also pointed out previously on this thread, I don't think there are any other examples in sport where winners of a lower tier competition go straight into a higher tier one in the same year.

- Tailteann Cup winners don't go straight into that year's Sam Maguire Cup.
- In soccer, Europa League winners don't go straight into end stages of that year's Champions League.
- In rugby, Challenge Cup winners don't go straight into end stages of the Champions Cup.
- And back to GAA, Carlow (or Wexford, or any other county) Intermediate champions don't go straight into end stages of that year's Senior championship.

If you can think of an example to show somewhere this kind of thing happens after all, I'd genuinely love to hear it.

Pikeman96 (Wexford) - Posts: 3434 - 27/02/2026 14:20:22    2658896

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Replying To Pikeman96:  "As regards your quip about Wexford posters being "worried", or why should we even have an opinion on it -

Some of us can look outside our own little bubble and consider what's best overall, rather than fixating just on ourselves.

And by the way, the big reward for winning McDonagh is getting to play in the top tier championship the following year. As I've also pointed out previously on this thread, I don't think there are any other examples in sport where winners of a lower tier competition go straight into a higher tier one in the same year.

- Tailteann Cup winners don't go straight into that year's Sam Maguire Cup.
- In soccer, Europa League winners don't go straight into end stages of that year's Champions League.
- In rugby, Challenge Cup winners don't go straight into end stages of the Champions Cup.
- And back to GAA, Carlow (or Wexford, or any other county) Intermediate champions don't go straight into end stages of that year's Senior championship.

If you can think of an example to show somewhere this kind of thing happens after all, I'd genuinely love to hear it."
I think iv made my Personal opinion on this fairly clear. I would like to see it retained but like I said its just my opinion.
Your right it doesn't happen anywhere else but guess what? It has happened in the Gaa since 2018 or thereabouts & I would like to see it continue. It probably won't be retained & we will accept that & move on. Hurling is totally different to Football & the more teams we have trying to get up to the top level the better. God forbid a "weaker" county might get to play a traditional county in a meaningful Championship game. Not 1b of the league but a knockout championship game. Pull up the trapdoor after ye lads.

carlo (Carlow) - Posts: 319 - 27/02/2026 22:24:57    2658953

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Replying To carlo:  "I think iv made my Personal opinion on this fairly clear. I would like to see it retained but like I said its just my opinion.
Your right it doesn't happen anywhere else but guess what? It has happened in the Gaa since 2018 or thereabouts & I would like to see it continue. It probably won't be retained & we will accept that & move on. Hurling is totally different to Football & the more teams we have trying to get up to the top level the better. God forbid a "weaker" county might get to play a traditional county in a meaningful Championship game. Not 1b of the league but a knockout championship game. Pull up the trapdoor after ye lads."
Win the McDonagh Cup as a "weaker" county, and you get to play a "stronger" county in five meaningful championship games the following year.

Anyway, if you're so concerned about giving McDonagh winners an immediate crack at a team from the level above:
- surely you should be equally keen to see Christy Ring Cup winners get an immediate crack at a McDonagh team?
- And the Nickey Rackard Cup winners should go straight into that year's Christy Ring Cup playoffs?
- After the Lory Meagher Cup winners have already been involved in the tail end of the Nickey Rackard Cup?

Or are you just picking and choosing the thing you think might suit Carlow best? i.e. looking just at your own bubble, instead of considering what makes sense and doesn't make sense across the board?

Pikeman96 (Wexford) - Posts: 3434 - 28/02/2026 10:59:55    2658997

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"Laois motion passes (94.1%). All-Ireland senior hurling preliminary quarter-finals disbanded from this year. Joe McDonagh semi-final will come into effect from 2027. All-Ireland quarter-finals set to be played at home venues of Munster and Leinster finalists this year." John Fogarty.

Phase 1 complete.

Phase 2: A Leinster matter but Carlow, Laois and Westmeath should lobby for expanding Leinster championship to 8 teams.

legendzxix (Kerry) - Posts: 9579 - 28/02/2026 11:17:17    2659000

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Replying To legendzxix:  ""Laois motion passes (94.1%). All-Ireland senior hurling preliminary quarter-finals disbanded from this year. Joe McDonagh semi-final will come into effect from 2027. All-Ireland quarter-finals set to be played at home venues of Munster and Leinster finalists this year." John Fogarty.

Phase 1 complete.

Phase 2: A Leinster matter but Carlow, Laois and Westmeath should lobby for expanding Leinster championship to 8 teams."
Why? Its easy enough for Kilkenny as it is without giving them less games to play. There isnt enough room in the calender for 7 rounds and a final

Tadhg2020 (Limerick) - Posts: 120 - 28/02/2026 12:01:43    2659006

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Replying To Tadhg2020:  "Why? Its easy enough for Kilkenny as it is without giving them less games to play. There isnt enough room in the calender for 7 rounds and a final"
Not suggesting 7 rounds. 8 teams can complete 5 rounds and a Leinster final. The format would obviously be a Leinster matter.

Currently the top 4 in any year play 3 others in the top 4. It is possible in an 8 team format to still play 3 others in the top 4 before a final. Again, the format would obviously be a Leinster matter.

legendzxix (Kerry) - Posts: 9579 - 28/02/2026 12:50:04    2659014

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Replying To legendzxix:  ""Laois motion passes (94.1%). All-Ireland senior hurling preliminary quarter-finals disbanded from this year. Joe McDonagh semi-final will come into effect from 2027. All-Ireland quarter-finals set to be played at home venues of Munster and Leinster finalists this year." John Fogarty.

Phase 1 complete.

Phase 2: A Leinster matter but Carlow, Laois and Westmeath should lobby for expanding Leinster championship to 8 teams."
All Leinster counties who want to enter it should be able to. But being realistic there are Problems with that. Main one being then the Joe Mac would become irrelevant. Could put Galway, Antrim and Kerry in Munster, even up the numbers a bit. 8 counties in both provinces then. But there'd be alot of lopsided results.

Viking66 (Wexford) - Posts: 18913 - 28/02/2026 12:58:15    2659017

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It is funny that despite "But but but Laois beat Dublin once!" being 90% of the argument for keeping the preliminary QFs, the motion to abolish them came from Laois.

CastleBravo (Meath) - Posts: 1726 - 28/02/2026 13:19:43    2659025

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Replying To legendzxix:  ""Laois motion passes (94.1%). All-Ireland senior hurling preliminary quarter-finals disbanded from this year. Joe McDonagh semi-final will come into effect from 2027. All-Ireland quarter-finals set to be played at home venues of Munster and Leinster finalists this year." John Fogarty.

Phase 1 complete.

Phase 2: A Leinster matter but Carlow, Laois and Westmeath should lobby for expanding Leinster championship to 8 teams."
Re phase 2 why?

That would destroy the McDonagh Cup, one of the best competitions the GAA has. None of the three would have any chance of winning it for the foreseeable future. If those three went into Leinster you may as well go back to the old way and get rid of McDonagh and make Christy Ring the genuine second tier competition.

As it happens I think there are too many tiers anyway and Lory Meagher should never have been introduced but was at the sole behest of a certain former GAA president who wanted a hurling cup named after a Kilkenny man and creating the competition had nothing whatsoever to do with hurling development. The lowest level should be Nicky Rackard and counties not up to being in with a shout in that need to get their house in order hurling wise and not have a national championship with a Croke Park final gift wrapped for them so they can continue to do little more to develop hurling than Kilkenny do to develop football. Rant over.

Onion Breath (Carlow) - Posts: 1806 - 28/02/2026 13:59:15    2659038

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Replying To Viking66:  "All Leinster counties who want to enter it should be able to. But being realistic there are Problems with that. Main one being then the Joe Mac would become irrelevant. Could put Galway, Antrim and Kerry in Munster, even up the numbers a bit. 8 counties in both provinces then. But there'd be alot of lopsided results."
Carlow, Laois and Westmeath have all competed in the Leinster championship with distinction and honour. The impact on the Joe Mac should be irrelevant. Joe Mac counties facilitated the current provincial group stage with the sweetener of preliminary quarter finals. With access to the preliminary quarter finals rightly removed, expanding Leinster to 8 should be strongly requested by Carlow, Laois and Westmeath.

legendzxix (Kerry) - Posts: 9579 - 28/02/2026 14:11:30    2659043

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Replying To Onion Breath:  "Re phase 2 why?

That would destroy the McDonagh Cup, one of the best competitions the GAA has. None of the three would have any chance of winning it for the foreseeable future. If those three went into Leinster you may as well go back to the old way and get rid of McDonagh and make Christy Ring the genuine second tier competition.

As it happens I think there are too many tiers anyway and Lory Meagher should never have been introduced but was at the sole behest of a certain former GAA president who wanted a hurling cup named after a Kilkenny man and creating the competition had nothing whatsoever to do with hurling development. The lowest level should be Nicky Rackard and counties not up to being in with a shout in that need to get their house in order hurling wise and not have a national championship with a Croke Park final gift wrapped for them so they can continue to do little more to develop hurling than Kilkenny do to develop football. Rant over."
As I say, it is a Leinster matter. From what I've seen of Carlow, Westmeath and Laois competing in Leinster - they should be included now access to the preliminary quarter finals has rightly been removed.
I don't want to get into format as that is a Leinster matter. Loosely - 8 teams can play teams from 4 seeded brackets. 2 home games. 2 away games. Top 4 into semi finals. Bottom 4 in relegation semi finals. That all equates to 5 rounds and final, similar to the current format.

legendzxix (Kerry) - Posts: 9579 - 28/02/2026 14:23:50    2659047

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Replying To legendzxix:  "As I say, it is a Leinster matter. From what I've seen of Carlow, Westmeath and Laois competing in Leinster - they should be included now access to the preliminary quarter finals has rightly been removed.
I don't want to get into format as that is a Leinster matter. Loosely - 8 teams can play teams from 4 seeded brackets. 2 home games. 2 away games. Top 4 into semi finals. Bottom 4 in relegation semi finals. That all equates to 5 rounds and final, similar to the current format."
Why don't Kerry play in the MHC too? Would really enhance the sporting landscape.

Pope_Benedict (Galway) - Posts: 4624 - 28/02/2026 14:56:07    2659051

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Replying To legendzxix:  "As I say, it is a Leinster matter. From what I've seen of Carlow, Westmeath and Laois competing in Leinster - they should be included now access to the preliminary quarter finals has rightly been removed.
I don't want to get into format as that is a Leinster matter. Loosely - 8 teams can play teams from 4 seeded brackets. 2 home games. 2 away games. Top 4 into semi finals. Bottom 4 in relegation semi finals. That all equates to 5 rounds and final, similar to the current format."
Agreed. Leinster has enough counties to make up its own Championship, so the Connacht and Ulster counties should play in the Munster Championship, as should the other Munster county.......... ;-)

Viking66 (Wexford) - Posts: 18913 - 28/02/2026 15:14:31    2659054

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Replying To legendzxix:  ""Laois motion passes (94.1%). All-Ireland senior hurling preliminary quarter-finals disbanded from this year. Joe McDonagh semi-final will come into effect from 2027. All-Ireland quarter-finals set to be played at home venues of Munster and Leinster finalists this year." John Fogarty.

Phase 1 complete.

Phase 2: A Leinster matter but Carlow, Laois and Westmeath should lobby for expanding Leinster championship to 8 teams."
I agree about the last bit but that'd mean you'd have to do away with one of the Joe McDonagh/Christy Ring/Nicky Rackard/Lory Meagher

ElGranSenor (Wexford) - Posts: 1007 - 28/02/2026 15:38:38    2659056

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Replying To legendzxix:  "Not suggesting 7 rounds. 8 teams can complete 5 rounds and a Leinster final. The format would obviously be a Leinster matter.

Currently the top 4 in any year play 3 others in the top 4. It is possible in an 8 team format to still play 3 others in the top 4 before a final. Again, the format would obviously be a Leinster matter."
Adding a 6th team watered down an already weaker leinster championship. Adding 2 more would make a mockery of it altogether. The integrity of the All Ireland Hurling Championship as a competition is at stake.
You cannot have one side being cut throat and the other a walk in the park. If your proposal becomes a reality we may as well bring Kilkenny and Galway into Munster and be done with it.

Tadhg2020 (Limerick) - Posts: 120 - 28/02/2026 16:50:17    2659062

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