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Tailteann Cup 2023

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Replying To Crinigan:  "What's the view of Andy McEntee's work in Antrim? Will he be kept on for another year?"
Well with players saying they love him, the cb saying they got a magnificent successful manager and they all delighted with him I'd say it's a good bet he will be there next year which is year 2 of his 3 year contract. So put the pen down. No need to write to his house. Again :)

royaldunne (Meath) - Posts: 19449 - 25/06/2023 22:28:46    2489327

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I can see nothing but a Down victory in the Taltainn Cup final… they are a great Croke park team and will suffocate the life out of Meath… Their forwards are very slick and Meath's defence give up too many chances… Down -2 at 11/10 is the play for me…

ForeverBlue2 (Cavan) - Posts: 1948 - 25/06/2023 22:33:39    2489328

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Replying To CARPS:  "Hard luck to Leix today, and especially to the two Carlowmen who started. Outscored Down by 2-4 to 1-3 in the last fifteen minutes, when the game was in the melting pot. It's just a shame that they made such a slow start. But in that last quarter(-ish), Down weren't able for them. Positive signs there. They can build on them."
Was the game in the melting pot in the last 15 mins

germac (Down) - Posts: 535 - 25/06/2023 22:53:47    2489333

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Replying To Ulsterman:  "We were very, very unlucky today. A wee lack of composure and belief cost us. We were just as good as Meath and had countless chances to win that game. Laois are very poor, the seagulls in Croker are giving Down a tougher game."
If the seagulls were from Carlow, Leix would try to poach them.

CARPS (Carlow) - Posts: 601 - 25/06/2023 23:38:27    2489343

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Laois utterly destroyed yesterday. No doubt they're a better team than what we seen. Always fancied Meath to beat Antrim so the final is what was expected. Down have a good chance if we can keep our shooting boots on, 17 wides last time out against Meath was just ridiculous.

artisan (Down) - Posts: 1794 - 26/06/2023 07:51:15    2489357

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Replying To royaldunne:  "Well with players saying they love him, the cb saying they got a magnificent successful manager and they all delighted with him I'd say it's a good bet he will be there next year which is year 2 of his 3 year contract. So put the pen down. No need to write to his house. Again :)"
Yes I think there's a real optimism there.

It'll be interesting to see how the league goes next year, that will be a big test of us still. You'd hope we'd be more settled now with a manager that's had a bit of time with the team.

4 wins and an ok showing against a team a division above us more than met expectations. It's a young team that hopefully grows with one another.

Yesterday did show there was a lot of work to be done still and overall our League and Tailteann performance would suggest we are somewhere around the 20th best team. I'd hope we'd have potential to raise that.

We'd need to tighten up in defence. There was a bit of naïveté in terms of tracking runners, in terms of having to track runners because we'd too few behind the ball. Meath tightened themselves up and we ran out of ideas and probably played into their hands at the start of the second half. We got the first point of the second half and were 2 up before the conceding 1-7 without reply. A bad 1-7 and without working many openings ourselves.

You know what though, this is what graded championship is all about. We got the chance to play a team a bit ahead of us, just a little bit too good but it was still a real game where we can actually see where we are at and what needs work. You get a lot more out of that than a no contest against a Derry, Armagh or Tyrone.

This is the time to play football, not February or March.

Whammo86 (Antrim) - Posts: 4240 - 26/06/2023 09:30:42    2489378

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Replying To ForeverBlue2:  "I can see nothing but a Down victory in the Taltainn Cup final… they are a great Croke park team and will suffocate the life out of Meath… Their forwards are very slick and Meath's defence give up too many chances… Down -2 at 11/10 is the play for me…"
Refreshing to see open football with the ball moved forward at pace in both games.
Hopefully more managers including our own will realise the ball moves faster than any player.

Breffni1969 (Cavan) - Posts: 510 - 26/06/2023 10:41:00    2489427

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I think if Down come out and play that open expansive football we saw yesterday, they'll be hard to beat, a good side on the up. But it's far from a foregone conclusion. Laois were absolutely shocking yesterday, Dublin did something similar to them in Leinster so there has to be serious problems there. Down did what Laois allowed them to.

However, I see Down reverting to that more defensive style we saw in the group game between the two teams which probably plays into Meath's hands a bit. Meath are vulnerable when you run at them but they're likely to set up a more defensively too, and I do think Meath have the tools to hurt Down on the counter attack. We did it in the first game and had a couple of more goal chances too. Although I do accept Down were shocking in front of goal kicking the guts of 20 wides, doubt they'll do that again.

But ultimately the two best teams in the tournament have made the final and it's an interesting game, was fearful we'd end up with some kind of one sided final if the bigger teams met before the final but not the case. Down justifiable favourites but there won't be much in it either way.

hyperache (Meath) - Posts: 208 - 26/06/2023 11:56:19    2489473

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Replying To hyperache:  "I think if Down come out and play that open expansive football we saw yesterday, they'll be hard to beat, a good side on the up. But it's far from a foregone conclusion. Laois were absolutely shocking yesterday, Dublin did something similar to them in Leinster so there has to be serious problems there. Down did what Laois allowed them to.

However, I see Down reverting to that more defensive style we saw in the group game between the two teams which probably plays into Meath's hands a bit. Meath are vulnerable when you run at them but they're likely to set up a more defensively too, and I do think Meath have the tools to hurt Down on the counter attack. We did it in the first game and had a couple of more goal chances too. Although I do accept Down were shocking in front of goal kicking the guts of 20 wides, doubt they'll do that again.

But ultimately the two best teams in the tournament have made the final and it's an interesting game, was fearful we'd end up with some kind of one sided final if the bigger teams met before the final but not the case. Down justifiable favourites but there won't be much in it either way."
Hard to judge yesterday because as you say Laois were woeful.
Antrim to their credit put up a great performance although never looking like winning it despite the score line they have shown they are a very much improved side under McEntee.
I'd call the final 50/50. 1or 2 points either way and no real surprise whoever wins it.
Great to see the ball doing the work and yesterdays games proved the defensive and good fast attacking football can be mixed evenly and both used correctly not just for the sake of it.

Breffni1969 (Cavan) - Posts: 510 - 26/06/2023 12:12:11    2489488

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Hard to call it. Neighbors to the south or to the north. Close either way. Would the Kilcoo Down lads bring a slight advantage with having played in a recent final in Croke Park? Should be a good football contest.

Shearer (Louth) - Posts: 830 - 26/06/2023 13:37:30    2489555

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Replying To Breffni1969:  "Hard to judge yesterday because as you say Laois were woeful.
Antrim to their credit put up a great performance although never looking like winning it despite the score line they have shown they are a very much improved side under McEntee.
I'd call the final 50/50. 1or 2 points either way and no real surprise whoever wins it.
Great to see the ball doing the work and yesterdays games proved the defensive and good fast attacking football can be mixed evenly and both used correctly not just for the sake of it."
We're making really good progress under Andy and the coaching staff. Antrim can be very parochial and club orientated and he has got the players playing for the jersey. We have some very capable footballers in Antrim but need the discipline, consistency and composure to take it on. You could see yesterday our guys were very comfortable on the ball and like to play football but the marking at times was slack and we left too much space which Meath exposed. I'm sure the fellas know that but they're up for listening and learning. We've some good young players coming through too.

Ulsterman (Antrim) - Posts: 9706 - 26/06/2023 15:51:00    2489663

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Replying To Whammo86:  "Yes I think there's a real optimism there.

It'll be interesting to see how the league goes next year, that will be a big test of us still. You'd hope we'd be more settled now with a manager that's had a bit of time with the team.

4 wins and an ok showing against a team a division above us more than met expectations. It's a young team that hopefully grows with one another.

Yesterday did show there was a lot of work to be done still and overall our League and Tailteann performance would suggest we are somewhere around the 20th best team. I'd hope we'd have potential to raise that.

We'd need to tighten up in defence. There was a bit of naïveté in terms of tracking runners, in terms of having to track runners because we'd too few behind the ball. Meath tightened themselves up and we ran out of ideas and probably played into their hands at the start of the second half. We got the first point of the second half and were 2 up before the conceding 1-7 without reply. A bad 1-7 and without working many openings ourselves.

You know what though, this is what graded championship is all about. We got the chance to play a team a bit ahead of us, just a little bit too good but it was still a real game where we can actually see where we are at and what needs work. You get a lot more out of that than a no contest against a Derry, Armagh or Tyrone.

This is the time to play football, not February or March."
Ahh yeah. Look I'm like a lot of Meath people. I'm not happy we are in this, but we have no one to blame but ourselves. I do think this is an excellent competition for the likes of a Antrim etc. and I'm not been condescending in saying that or snobby. Best of luck for next year. Andy won a club all ire with the 4th ranked team in Dublin. Not only did he win dubs one he went on to win Leinster and all ire. So there's huge talent there and he will Inspire your players. Best of luck for next year

royaldunne (Meath) - Posts: 19449 - 26/06/2023 18:09:18    2489747

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Replying To Ulsterman:  "We're making really good progress under Andy and the coaching staff. Antrim can be very parochial and club orientated and he has got the players playing for the jersey. We have some very capable footballers in Antrim but need the discipline, consistency and composure to take it on. You could see yesterday our guys were very comfortable on the ball and like to play football but the marking at times was slack and we left too much space which Meath exposed. I'm sure the fellas know that but they're up for listening and learning. We've some good young players coming through too."
Often disagree with you but you have a very good players that I had never seen before yesterday and a manager who I know yesterday wasn't an easy day for. But remained professional and did his upmost for Antrim. Best of luck for next year.

royaldunne (Meath) - Posts: 19449 - 26/06/2023 18:18:50    2489750

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Down are step up from everything in the competition but I think Laois froze on the day .

Hard to come back after conceding the 4 goals in 15 minutes.

Down by 5/6 in the final

Sidelinefoot (USA) - Posts: 10 - 26/06/2023 20:58:32    2489803

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Replying To royaldunne:  "Ahh yeah. Look I'm like a lot of Meath people. I'm not happy we are in this, but we have no one to blame but ourselves. I do think this is an excellent competition for the likes of a Antrim etc. and I'm not been condescending in saying that or snobby. Best of luck for next year. Andy won a club all ire with the 4th ranked team in Dublin. Not only did he win dubs one he went on to win Leinster and all ire. So there's huge talent there and he will Inspire your players. Best of luck for next year"
"Excellent competition for the likes of Antrim" and then you say you're not being condescending!!!

Meath were one kick of the ball away from losing yesterday and from the previous week in Belfast I know Antrim are far from a top side so Meath are where they deserve to be. So you should be seeing this as an excellent competition for the likes of Meath because it's probably the only one ye're capable of winning so embrace it rather than looking down on it as if he belong somewhere else.

In my opinion Meath are now closer to teams at the bottom of division 4 than to the teams who'll be in contention to win Sam. That may well change in the coming years but that's where Meath are now.

Onion Breath (Carlow) - Posts: 1412 - 26/06/2023 22:35:11    2489821

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Replying To Onion Breath:  ""Excellent competition for the likes of Antrim" and then you say you're not being condescending!!!

Meath were one kick of the ball away from losing yesterday and from the previous week in Belfast I know Antrim are far from a top side so Meath are where they deserve to be. So you should be seeing this as an excellent competition for the likes of Meath because it's probably the only one ye're capable of winning so embrace it rather than looking down on it as if he belong somewhere else.

In my opinion Meath are now closer to teams at the bottom of division 4 than to the teams who'll be in contention to win Sam. That may well change in the coming years but that's where Meath are now."
Carlow finished in the bottom half of Division Four. Antrim beat us by four points (in Belfast!). And went on to lose by two to Meath.

Obviously, this isn't scientific, but that's a six point spread.

What would Kerry or Dublin beat Meath by? In a championship knockout game, with the gloves off?

CARPS (Carlow) - Posts: 601 - 27/06/2023 09:28:07    2489861

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Replying To CARPS:  "
Replying To Onion Breath:  ""Excellent competition for the likes of Antrim" and then you say you're not being condescending!!!

Meath were one kick of the ball away from losing yesterday and from the previous week in Belfast I know Antrim are far from a top side so Meath are where they deserve to be. So you should be seeing this as an excellent competition for the likes of Meath because it's probably the only one ye're capable of winning so embrace it rather than looking down on it as if he belong somewhere else.

In my opinion Meath are now closer to teams at the bottom of division 4 than to the teams who'll be in contention to win Sam. That may well change in the coming years but that's where Meath are now."
Carlow finished in the bottom half of Division Four. Antrim beat us by four points (in Belfast!). And went on to lose by two to Meath.

Obviously, this isn't scientific, but that's a six point spread.

What would Kerry or Dublin beat Meath by? In a championship knockout game, with the gloves off?"
Well going by your logic Meath beat Cork by 4 points down in Cork , kerry beat Cork by 2 points down in Cork, so that's a 2 point win for Meath over Kerry.

Royal.Legend (Meath) - Posts: 666 - 27/06/2023 10:50:30    2489917

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Replying To CARPS:  "
Replying To Onion Breath:  ""Excellent competition for the likes of Antrim" and then you say you're not being condescending!!!

Meath were one kick of the ball away from losing yesterday and from the previous week in Belfast I know Antrim are far from a top side so Meath are where they deserve to be. So you should be seeing this as an excellent competition for the likes of Meath because it's probably the only one ye're capable of winning so embrace it rather than looking down on it as if he belong somewhere else.

In my opinion Meath are now closer to teams at the bottom of division 4 than to the teams who'll be in contention to win Sam. That may well change in the coming years but that's where Meath are now."
Carlow finished in the bottom half of Division Four. Antrim beat us by four points (in Belfast!). And went on to lose by two to Meath.

Obviously, this isn't scientific, but that's a six point spread.

What would Kerry or Dublin beat Meath by? In a championship knockout game, with the gloves off?"
Yeah I don't think that's how sport works. Every game is different. I mean Carlow lost to Laois in the league by 6 points at home, and Laois lost to Down by 24 points or so, and Down lost to Meath by 2 points earlier in the TC, so I assume that means Meath should beat Carlow by 26? It doesn't work like that.

I think everyone knows the top 4/5 teams are comfortable clear of the rest, so Kerry or Dublin on their day would beat most counties in 3rd gear with the gloves off. That's why we have a 2nd tier competition, now it's still flawed in the sense there are teams not in it that should be given the way the provincial final is a free pass to Sam Maguire - but it works. And an argument could even be made for a third tier. About 60% of the teams in the Sam Maguire had absolutely no chance from the outset.

Where else would the likes of Carlow or Antrim have gotten 4/5 championship games? It serves different purposes for different teams. I don't get why people love coming out and pointing out how bad other teams are, if you're in the Tailteann Cup - you know where you're at and you are there for a reason.

hyperache (Meath) - Posts: 208 - 27/06/2023 12:19:16    2489990

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Replying To hyperache:  "
Replying To CARPS:  "[quote=Onion Breath:  ""Excellent competition for the likes of Antrim" and then you say you're not being condescending!!!

Meath were one kick of the ball away from losing yesterday and from the previous week in Belfast I know Antrim are far from a top side so Meath are where they deserve to be. So you should be seeing this as an excellent competition for the likes of Meath because it's probably the only one ye're capable of winning so embrace it rather than looking down on it as if he belong somewhere else.

In my opinion Meath are now closer to teams at the bottom of division 4 than to the teams who'll be in contention to win Sam. That may well change in the coming years but that's where Meath are now."
Carlow finished in the bottom half of Division Four. Antrim beat us by four points (in Belfast!). And went on to lose by two to Meath.

Obviously, this isn't scientific, but that's a six point spread.

What would Kerry or Dublin beat Meath by? In a championship knockout game, with the gloves off?"
Yeah I don't think that's how sport works. Every game is different. I mean Carlow lost to Laois in the league by 6 points at home, and Laois lost to Down by 24 points or so, and Down lost to Meath by 2 points earlier in the TC, so I assume that means Meath should beat Carlow by 26? It doesn't work like that.

I think everyone knows the top 4/5 teams are comfortable clear of the rest, so Kerry or Dublin on their day would beat most counties in 3rd gear with the gloves off. That's why we have a 2nd tier competition, now it's still flawed in the sense there are teams not in it that should be given the way the provincial final is a free pass to Sam Maguire - but it works. And an argument could even be made for a third tier. About 60% of the teams in the Sam Maguire had absolutely no chance from the outset.

Where else would the likes of Carlow or Antrim have gotten 4/5 championship games? It serves different purposes for different teams. I don't get why people love coming out and pointing out how bad other teams are, if you're in the Tailteann Cup - you know where you're at and you are there for a reason."]Carlow got five championship games under the old format, a few years ago. So maybe quit with the condescending attitude.

Meath are exactly where you deserve to be. You are much closer to Carlow than to Dublin.

CARPS (Carlow) - Posts: 601 - 27/06/2023 13:32:58    2490049

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Replying To Royal.Legend:  "
Replying To CARPS:  "[quote=Onion Breath:  ""Excellent competition for the likes of Antrim" and then you say you're not being condescending!!!

Meath were one kick of the ball away from losing yesterday and from the previous week in Belfast I know Antrim are far from a top side so Meath are where they deserve to be. So you should be seeing this as an excellent competition for the likes of Meath because it's probably the only one ye're capable of winning so embrace it rather than looking down on it as if he belong somewhere else.

In my opinion Meath are now closer to teams at the bottom of division 4 than to the teams who'll be in contention to win Sam. That may well change in the coming years but that's where Meath are now."
Carlow finished in the bottom half of Division Four. Antrim beat us by four points (in Belfast!). And went on to lose by two to Meath.

Obviously, this isn't scientific, but that's a six point spread.

What would Kerry or Dublin beat Meath by? In a championship knockout game, with the gloves off?"
Well going by your logic Meath beat Cork by 4 points down in Cork , kerry beat Cork by 2 points down in Cork, so that's a 2 point win for Meath over Kerry."]I said it wasn't scientific.

Fwiw, I think Meath would currently beat Carlow by 3-8 points, in a championship game. Dublin, however, would probably beat you by 20, or more.

That said, we have only 60,000 people, and are senior in hurling, intermediate in football. Meath has over THREE TIMES that population, but is intermediate in both codes.

CARPS (Carlow) - Posts: 601 - 27/06/2023 13:42:38    2490055

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