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Kerry GAA Thread

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Disappointing day in Croker yesterday. The Kerry support was abysmal, outnumbered by Armagh probably 4-1, worst I have ever seen. The scenes at the end with the huge Armagh crowd singing at the tops of their voices was terrific and I was genuinely happy for them Armagh no doubt the better team and deserve to go through. Kerry didn't have the legs to match them late in the game and in ET which must be a big question for Jack O'Connor and his backroom team Some talk above re Clifford, no doubt he will be disappointed with his year. This slow game plan that Kerry are employing completely nullifies all the things DC is good at and isn't helping him in any way. He will beat most backs in the country if he gets decent ball in early where he can take the mark or just get it in space and take his man on to work the score. Kerry aren't breaking quickly now and are by the time he gets his hands on the ball the opponents has everyone back and there is no space to work in. From Kerry's POV too many unforced turnovers, and the mistake for the Armagh goal was a huge turning point that opened the door for them. They played all the football after that. I expect we have seen the last of Paul Geaney and possibly one or two others The day belongs to Armagh however and they will have a right crack at Sam no doubt GeniusGerry (Kerry) - Posts: 2113 - 14/07/2024 09:58:06 2558902 Link
Some talk on the Kerry forum last week that it "won't feel like a proper All Ireland" because somebody else took Dublin out. The fact also that Derry were so poor in the QF probably contributed to some element of complacency among supporters. However, the reality is that Kerry while being a very good team, are not the supreme outfit that media have tried to portray in recent years. The need to have a 2 horse race not a Dublin monopoly drove that thinking. Clifford winning POTY last year a case in point. While it almost heresy to suggest it, it may be that the hype doesn't match the reality for the young man. That's not his fault of course. And if the forward mark is abolished, his lack of pace will become a weakness. Eddie the Exile (Monaghan) - Posts: 1121 - 14/07/2024 10:01:33 2558903 Link
Replying To Pope_Benedict: "'Golden Generation', get a grip. It's more like a David Clifford +1, maybe 2." I suppose Kerry winning 5 minor All Irelands in a row from 2014 on ( they hadn't won a minor for 20 years before that) did lead to expectations of senior success beyond one senior victory. There was a view that if Dublin fell away, Kerry would dominate but that doesn't seem likely now. Whoever wins today and in 2 weeks, 2025 will be a very open championship with no strong favourite and a number of counties fancying it. endgame (Roscommon) - Posts: 2300 - 14/07/2024 10:19:59 2558905 Link
Replying To oneoff: ""He's yet to justify the hype" explain that one to us? For a second I thought you were talking about Shane Walsh because everything there pretty much sums him up." What's to explain? I don't think he's as good as he's being made out to be, although in fairness to the lad I'm not sure if it's possible to be as good as he's being made out to be. And I agree with you re Walsh,, a very hit and miss player. Galway9801 (Galway) - Posts: 1942 - 14/07/2024 10:28:18 2558907 Link
Replying To BarneyGrant: "The hype has nothing to do with him in fairness. Nor is it an exaggeration to say he is one of the best players in country and has been since a minor. No one player out of 40 who play a part in any big game is going to be decisive or even on top form every day. Media driven adulation is very superficial and fickle. Many of those who engage in it are the first to stick the knife in when it suits. One in particular has been notorious, and notoriously nasty in this way for a long time." Totally agree with all of that. I'm genuinely not trying to stick the boot in, he's a fantastic player and seems like a great lad,, he's a long time to go and will hopefully achieve alot more in the game, but as of right now would I put him up there with, say, Peter Canavan? Not a Hope. Galway9801 (Galway) - Posts: 1942 - 14/07/2024 10:31:04 2558908 Link
Replying To GeniusGerry: "Disappointing day in Croker yesterday. The Kerry support was abysmal, outnumbered by Armagh probably 4-1, worst I have ever seen. The scenes at the end with the huge Armagh crowd singing at the tops of their voices was terrific and I was genuinely happy for them Armagh no doubt the better team and deserve to go through. Kerry didn't have the legs to match them late in the game and in ET which must be a big question for Jack O'Connor and his backroom team Some talk above re Clifford, no doubt he will be disappointed with his year. This slow game plan that Kerry are employing completely nullifies all the things DC is good at and isn't helping him in any way. He will beat most backs in the country if he gets decent ball in early where he can take the mark or just get it in space and take his man on to work the score. Kerry aren't breaking quickly now and are by the time he gets his hands on the ball the opponents has everyone back and there is no space to work in. From Kerry's POV too many unforced turnovers, and the mistake for the Armagh goal was a huge turning point that opened the door for them. They played all the football after that. I expect we have seen the last of Paul Geaney and possibly one or two others The day belongs to Armagh however and they will have a right crack at Sam no doubt" Hard to know what has gone wrong for ye. D Clifford again coming out to the 45 for spells which isn't ideal. When ye did break with pace ye created the likes of the two Tom O'Sulivan goal chances, was it the case that the wrong man got the final ball? I don't think ye were helped by the group ye were in either. At least Mayo gave ye a wake up call last year. This year ye snoozed through to the QF which was against an out of sorts Derry and then straight into a semi with an extremely fit and battle hardened Armagh. MachaireConnacht (Roscommon) - Posts: 999 - 14/07/2024 10:45:19 2558913 Link
Replying To Galway9801: "What's to explain? I don't think he's as good as he's being made out to be, although in fairness to the lad I'm not sure if it's possible to be as good as he's being made out to be. And I agree with you re Walsh,, a very hit and miss player." You said he hadn't justify the hype. Explain what exactly is needed to back it up? Is back to back POTY not enough? Or 5 All Stars? Or are you going to be one who says those awards don't matter? oneoff (UK) - Posts: 1472 - 14/07/2024 11:09:26 2558921 Link
Replying To MachaireConnacht: "Hard to know what has gone wrong for ye. D Clifford again coming out to the 45 for spells which isn't ideal. When ye did break with pace ye created the likes of the two Tom O'Sulivan goal chances, was it the case that the wrong man got the final ball? I don't think ye were helped by the group ye were in either. At least Mayo gave ye a wake up call last year. This year ye snoozed through to the QF which was against an out of sorts Derry and then straight into a semi with an extremely fit and battle hardened Armagh." I have been saying all along that this is an ordinary enough team, particularly around the middle of the field and they had no right to go in to yesterday expecting to cruise through. I need to watch the full game back but from the stands there were a lot of unforced errors, you can't do that at this level as we all know. They need a more varied game plan, Mcgeeney will have been delighted with the way Kerry set out. Clifford coming out to the middle I expect was partly pure frustration on his part as they are just not kicking the ball in to him the way they used to. Jack is so afraid of losing possession that he is not using his best weapon. Clifford will beat any inter county back, but like any inside forward he needs the right ball in. I don't know if the group helped or hindered Kerry but on yesterday's evidence they have a lot of questions to ask themselves over the winter. The players have delivered an All Ireland and don't owe anybody anything but I do wonder if they are getting the most out of what they have. GeniusGerry (Kerry) - Posts: 2113 - 14/07/2024 11:19:32 2558924 Link
Replying To LimerickForLiam24: "Cork to win Liam McCarthy next Sunday." Well Nostrodamus, I'll be lumping on Clare based on your incredibly accurate predictions so far. avonali (Dublin) - Posts: 1990 - 14/07/2024 12:05:59 2558935 Link
I don't go in criticising players and management. All I'll try and say is that one All-Ireland from six between 2019 and 2024 is a poor return for this group of players. Even two from six would have been below par. There was a lack of hunger 13 years ago in the final quarter of 2011 All-Ireland to close it out. It was similarly there in last year's All-Ireland and again yesterday against Armagh. It is like there is a level of complacency, mixed with playing not to lose, as opposed to grabbing a game by the scruff of the neck and delivering. legendzxix (Kerry) - Posts: 8293 - 14/07/2024 12:06:48 2558937 Link
Replying To Galway9801: "Totally agree with all of that. I'm genuinely not trying to stick the boot in, he's a fantastic player and seems like a great lad,, he's a long time to go and will hopefully achieve alot more in the game, but as of right now would I put him up there with, say, Peter Canavan? Not a Hope." Leaving DC aside I think it will be hard for any player to hit those kind of heights again with the way the game has evolved in to a systems based arm wrestle rather than a primarily skills based game. Today's players just don't have the space and it is much harder to play as a forward especially IMO. There are conspicuously fewer standout forwards in todays game vs the time when Canavan, Maurice Fitz and others players. Even counties like Tipp had Declan Browne and Wexford had Mattie Forde, phenomenal players that racked up big scores regularly. You don't see that any more. GeniusGerry (Kerry) - Posts: 2113 - 14/07/2024 12:25:18 2558939 Link
Fitness the key difference, both Armagh and Donegal have trained harder and longer that other teams, jacktheboy (Donegal) - Posts: 448 - 14/07/2024 12:52:47 2558941 Link
Is GAA football the only sport in which a team can be beaten but whose supporters can repeatedly claim their team has "the best natural footballers" and their victors are merely highly trained athletes ? It's as if the latest coaching strategies and the actual rules of the game are denying them what's rightfully theirs and their victors are mere journeymen who lack God given natural talent. But it's more complicated than that. When this sort of thinking becomes part of the culture it becomes a serious part of the problem. Talent alone doesn't cut it in the modern GAA game. Setting up a team in which truly natural talents like DC , PC and SO'S are not properly supported - and arguably inhibited- with cohesive forward play is a recipe for disappointment. Very often DC is isolated and teams now have figured out how to neutralise him when management persist in encouraging patterns of play that don't capitalise on his talents. People will say he had a poor game but a lot of thought and resources have been expended on neutralising him. Hard graft, selfless running off the ball and fitness-which this Kerry team seemed to lack coming toward the end of 70 minutes and ET- are needed if Kerry are to get the best out of the likes of DC. Rarely do you see Kerry forwards making decoy runs in order to leave DC isolated on his marker, a situation in which he thrives. Kerry do not have an efficient cohesive forward unit. They would well to consider getting Donaghy onto their coaching staff. He had the talent but he also worked very well with his fellow forwards and I believe he knew exactly how to curtail DC; also, he would have huge insight into Jack O C's approach, which is quite regressive and demands too much from his star players. I believe KD contributed significantly to Armagh's success yesterday. Anyway, commiseration Kerry and congrats Armagh. I hope ye go on and finish the job now. avonali (Dublin) - Posts: 1990 - 14/07/2024 13:06:37 2558943 Link
Replying To waynoI: "Ticket prices and travel expenses, in a cost of living crisis. You're being very harsh" Absolutely nothing to do with it. Kerry 'supporters' have been at this for years. Just rocking up to the final. Well the days of them being guaranteed a place in it are long gone thankfully. peiledoir20 (Donegal) - Posts: 1036 - 14/07/2024 13:18:05 2558945 Link
I think O Connor has done Kerry a Great disservice by implementing a defensive system that is totally At odds with what people would see as the natural way Kerry have always played the game… The sight of every Kerry player scurrying back into their own defence when possession was lost was baffling to witness… This sort of play takes away from players like David Clifford and tends to show him and his like up in the wrong light… Kerry got spooked by Derry and implemented tactics to stifle them but like yesterday they only succeeded in keeping the opposition in the game…. Time for Kerry ( whoever is managing them ) to get back to basics and ditch this slow defensive setup that has taken away so much from what was always a flamboyant team to watch playing football… ForeverBlue2 (Cavan) - Posts: 3029 - 14/07/2024 13:20:49 2558946 Link
When it comes down to it Kerry don't have the mettle and stomach for the fight in tight games particularly against Ulster teams. Brolly called them out years ago on this. Ulsterman (Antrim) - Posts: 9785 - 14/07/2024 13:26:49 2558949 Link
Replying To jacktheboy: "Fitness the key difference, both Armagh and Donegal have trained harder and longer that other teams," How have Dublin won so much so. endgame (Roscommon) - Posts: 2300 - 14/07/2024 13:45:32 2558955 Link
Replying To Tir Conaill Abu: "Not that it was his fault for the defeat today but what had happened to David Clifford since the final in 22. Seemed totally off against Derry and Armagh. Add in last years All Ireland Final and its hard to know if he'll fulfill his potential as a great. Great players perform on big days. He has all the cards but won't play the hand. Seems low in confidence and belief. Would a new manager or coach pull it out of him?" Its easy to play well when playing in Munster. Not as easy against Ulster teams as he found out against Derry & Armagh. He's had a poor year 2024. Scenicparish (Donegal) - Posts: 408 - 14/07/2024 13:51:22 2558957 Link
Replying To Ulsterman: "When it comes down to it Kerry don't have the mettle and stomach for the fight in tight games particularly against Ulster teams. Brolly called them out years ago on this." Despite the fact they beat two Ulster teams this year another classic from you... oneoff (UK) - Posts: 1472 - 14/07/2024 14:05:02 2558959 Link
Replying To avonali: "Is GAA football the only sport in which a team can be beaten but whose supporters can repeatedly claim their team has "the best natural footballers" and their victors are merely highly trained athletes ? It's as if the latest coaching strategies and the actual rules of the game are denying them what's rightfully theirs and their victors are mere journeymen who lack God given natural talent. But it's more complicated than that. When this sort of thinking becomes part of the culture it becomes a serious part of the problem. Talent alone doesn't cut it in the modern GAA game. Setting up a team in which truly natural talents like DC , PC and SO'S are not properly supported - and arguably inhibited- with cohesive forward play is a recipe for disappointment. Very often DC is isolated and teams now have figured out how to neutralise him when management persist in encouraging patterns of play that don't capitalise on his talents. People will say he had a poor game but a lot of thought and resources have been expended on neutralising him. Hard graft, selfless running off the ball and fitness-which this Kerry team seemed to lack coming toward the end of 70 minutes and ET- are needed if Kerry are to get the best out of the likes of DC. Rarely do you see Kerry forwards making decoy runs in order to leave DC isolated on his marker, a situation in which he thrives. Kerry do not have an efficient cohesive forward unit. They would well to consider getting Donaghy onto their coaching staff. He had the talent but he also worked very well with his fellow forwards and I believe he knew exactly how to curtail DC; also, he would have huge insight into Jack O C's approach, which is quite regressive and demands too much from his star players. I believe KD contributed significantly to Armagh's success yesterday. Anyway, commiseration Kerry and congrats Armagh. I hope ye go on and finish the job now." isolated and outnumbered rather being in a one on one against a defender avonali (Dublin)* - Posts: 1990 - 14/07/2024 14:18:20 2558967 Link