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Not a bad idea, clubs might put more of an effort in of there was seeding at place or some sort of tie in with the championship. I suppose the football not being on for 9 weeks after league finishes dosen't help either. One of the negatives of the current championship structure.
alwaysasub (Wexford) - Posts: 444 - 13/02/2023 13:09:08
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hear leighton glynn is training his namesake club this year
Stmunnsriver (Wexford) - Posts: 2891 - 15/02/2023 12:08:27
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Replying To hurlorhurley: "The league in Wexford are glorified practise matches with little or no interest in them.
Are clubs allowed to charge on the gate for league games? A nominal fee of €5 per adult, it might encourage teams to enter 100 people paying into a league game is a handy €500 for the host club.
I'd love a league that has some influence on seeding for the championship draws." Do Kilkenny run their league in this format?
Your place in the league seeds you in hurling championship.
I could be wrong.
Past hurler (None) - Posts: 806 - 15/02/2023 12:20:48
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Just looked it up in Kilkenny a team's finishing position in the Kilkenny Hurling League determines at what stage they enter the championship.
Past hurler (None) - Posts: 806 - 15/02/2023 12:24:14
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In Kilkenny what is our group stage is called the league. They play 2 groups of 6 like us.
Then 1st in each group play league final both teams qualify for QF regardless of result
2nd in each play shield final (glorified challenge match) both teams qualify for QF regardless of result
3rd in 1 group plays 4th in the other in a preliminary QF which is knockout. 2 winners advance to QF, 2 losers are finished for the year
5th in 1 group plays 6th in the other, 2 winners advances to QF, 2 losers play relegation play off final, Ballyhale finished 5th in their group about 4 or 5 years ago and ended up winning the All Ireland,
TerribleFootwork (Wexford) - Posts: 1760 - 15/02/2023 12:50:05
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Replying To TerribleFootwork: "In Kilkenny what is our group stage is called the league. They play 2 groups of 6 like us.
Then 1st in each group play league final both teams qualify for QF regardless of result
2nd in each play shield final (glorified challenge match) both teams qualify for QF regardless of result
3rd in 1 group plays 4th in the other in a preliminary QF which is knockout. 2 winners advance to QF, 2 losers are finished for the year
5th in 1 group plays 6th in the other, 2 winners advances to QF, 2 losers play relegation play off final, Ballyhale finished 5th in their group about 4 or 5 years ago and ended up winning the All Ireland," Thanks for clearing that up, I wonder how competitive their all county league is so
Past hurler (None) - Posts: 806 - 15/02/2023 13:13:23
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I'm just wondering has anyone heard of Wexford county board are going to reconsider the vote held before Christmas on the ruling that up to age u18s can't play adult. I've seen recently that the GAA have introduced a 3rd option which I don't think was an option in Wexford which changes to allow an up to age u18 play Mens after March 1st with written consent from their parents (Cahair o'Kane on Twitter covers the topic very well on counties in the North)
In my opinion this is logical, fair and the best way to approach the season ahead. 18 year olds should not be stopped from playing adult hurling/football. Young lads at 15/16 can play men's soccer, a 16 year old played for PSG last night for gods sake.
I am really hoping Wexford reconsider and allow another vote to go ahead. My impression from the last vote held was in order to change from u17 to u18 clubs had to agree to not let up to the age u18s play men, but this 3rd option from the GAA should allow us to change to u18 and allow them to play men. It wasn't to long ago you could play mens at u17 with many making their debuts at 16 (too young I agree) . Preventing u18s play men will 100% cause us to lose players, think of those involved with small clubs, who during the week will be going to training in the summer with 6/7 lads there as they'll have no u16s who will have their own game, and 3/4 will be away with holidays and work. I'm curious to see what other people think of this scenario?
Wally2496 (Wexford) - Posts: 46 - 15/02/2023 20:34:12
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Replying To Wally2496: "I'm just wondering has anyone heard of Wexford county board are going to reconsider the vote held before Christmas on the ruling that up to age u18s can't play adult. I've seen recently that the GAA have introduced a 3rd option which I don't think was an option in Wexford which changes to allow an up to age u18 play Mens after March 1st with written consent from their parents (Cahair o'Kane on Twitter covers the topic very well on counties in the North)
In my opinion this is logical, fair and the best way to approach the season ahead. 18 year olds should not be stopped from playing adult hurling/football. Young lads at 15/16 can play men's soccer, a 16 year old played for PSG last night for gods sake.
I am really hoping Wexford reconsider and allow another vote to go ahead. My impression from the last vote held was in order to change from u17 to u18 clubs had to agree to not let up to the age u18s play men, but this 3rd option from the GAA should allow us to change to u18 and allow them to play men. It wasn't to long ago you could play mens at u17 with many making their debuts at 16 (too young I agree) . Preventing u18s play men will 100% cause us to lose players, think of those involved with small clubs, who during the week will be going to training in the summer with 6/7 lads there as they'll have no u16s who will have their own game, and 3/4 will be away with holidays and work. I'm curious to see what other people think of this scenario?" There would have to be some sort of rule that u18s couldn't play minor and u21 and adult in some sort of time period. As in couldn't play a minor game on Wednesday then an adult or u21 game the following weekend or previous weekend. Something like that.
Viking66 (Wexford) - Posts: 13867 - 16/02/2023 10:21:27
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Replying To Wally2496: "I'm just wondering has anyone heard of Wexford county board are going to reconsider the vote held before Christmas on the ruling that up to age u18s can't play adult. I've seen recently that the GAA have introduced a 3rd option which I don't think was an option in Wexford which changes to allow an up to age u18 play Mens after March 1st with written consent from their parents (Cahair o'Kane on Twitter covers the topic very well on counties in the North)
In my opinion this is logical, fair and the best way to approach the season ahead. 18 year olds should not be stopped from playing adult hurling/football. Young lads at 15/16 can play men's soccer, a 16 year old played for PSG last night for gods sake.
I am really hoping Wexford reconsider and allow another vote to go ahead. My impression from the last vote held was in order to change from u17 to u18 clubs had to agree to not let up to the age u18s play men, but this 3rd option from the GAA should allow us to change to u18 and allow them to play men. It wasn't to long ago you could play mens at u17 with many making their debuts at 16 (too young I agree) . Preventing u18s play men will 100% cause us to lose players, think of those involved with small clubs, who during the week will be going to training in the summer with 6/7 lads there as they'll have no u16s who will have their own game, and 3/4 will be away with holidays and work. I'm curious to see what other people think of this scenario?" I'd be off the same opinion as you and voiced it here before, I think fixtures congestion was the priority in this vote rather than player welfare.
TerribleFootwork (Wexford) - Posts: 1760 - 16/02/2023 11:02:16
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Replying To hurlorhurley: "The league in Wexford are glorified practise matches with little or no interest in them.
Are clubs allowed to charge on the gate for league games? A nominal fee of €5 per adult, it might encourage teams to enter 100 people paying into a league game is a handy €500 for the host club.
I'd love a league that has some influence on seeding for the championship draws." You can't tie All County League positions to the championships for as long as clubs have to play the Leagues without their county players. For instance, Gorey would be down three regular starting inter-county forwards for all their League matches (Dunbar, McGuckin, McDonald). Ferns would be down three or four players (James Lawlor, Corey Byrne Dunbar, Niall Murphy, and probably/possibly Eoin Murphy too). Oylegate-Glenbrien would be minus the two Recks.
That'd be a big handicap for any of those teams against a club with nobody or maybe only one player in the county squad, and wouldn't be fair for results to have a bearing on the championship if all sides couldn't play with a full hand.
Pikeman96 (Wexford) - Posts: 2621 - 16/02/2023 15:02:08
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Replying To Pikeman96: "You can't tie All County League positions to the championships for as long as clubs have to play the Leagues without their county players. For instance, Gorey would be down three regular starting inter-county forwards for all their League matches (Dunbar, McGuckin, McDonald). Ferns would be down three or four players (James Lawlor, Corey Byrne Dunbar, Niall Murphy, and probably/possibly Eoin Murphy too). Oylegate-Glenbrien would be minus the two Recks.
That'd be a big handicap for any of those teams against a club with nobody or maybe only one player in the county squad, and wouldn't be fair for results to have a bearing on the championship if all sides couldn't play with a full hand." Harriers would be down Chin, Scallan, Lawlor, Shiel and maybe Clancy. Martins would also be down 5 lads. Anne's would be down Dee and Mogie. Rapps Pepper, Ryan and Foley. Shels Donohue and Hearne. Only Oulart wouldn't be down anyone. Agree though that League shouldn't affect Championship.
Viking66 (Wexford) - Posts: 13867 - 16/02/2023 15:41:12
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Replying To Pikeman96: "You can't tie All County League positions to the championships for as long as clubs have to play the Leagues without their county players. For instance, Gorey would be down three regular starting inter-county forwards for all their League matches (Dunbar, McGuckin, McDonald). Ferns would be down three or four players (James Lawlor, Corey Byrne Dunbar, Niall Murphy, and probably/possibly Eoin Murphy too). Oylegate-Glenbrien would be minus the two Recks.
That'd be a big handicap for any of those teams against a club with nobody or maybe only one player in the county squad, and wouldn't be fair for results to have a bearing on the championship if all sides couldn't play with a full hand." Agree would be completely unworkable, if a club gets to county final both codes, Castletown and Horeswood did last year that's 16 weekends if championship action plus a potential Leinster campaign so there's plenty there anyway I don't think the importance of all county league needs to be ramped up.
TerribleFootwork (Wexford) - Posts: 1760 - 16/02/2023 15:57:18
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One thing I do think they should implement as a county board mandate is that if a player is part of the wider county panel, but either didn't make the matchday squad in the immediate game prior to the club league round of matches, or maybe didn't get a cumulative certain amount of minutes agreed beforehand, then he is obligated to line out for his club in the league, injury-permitting of course.
No point having a fella wearing no. 24/25/26 on the county panel, maybe getting a token couple of minutes or no action at all, not at least keeping the eye in for his club. Let them train with the county all they want. We are told it's games lads want after all.
beano (Wexford) - Posts: 1455 - 16/02/2023 16:34:33
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Replying To Pikeman96: "You can't tie All County League positions to the championships for as long as clubs have to play the Leagues without their county players. For instance, Gorey would be down three regular starting inter-county forwards for all their League matches (Dunbar, McGuckin, McDonald). Ferns would be down three or four players (James Lawlor, Corey Byrne Dunbar, Niall Murphy, and probably/possibly Eoin Murphy too). Oylegate-Glenbrien would be minus the two Recks.
That'd be a big handicap for any of those teams against a club with nobody or maybe only one player in the county squad, and wouldn't be fair for results to have a bearing on the championship if all sides couldn't play with a full hand." Every team has five matches in the group stages of the championships, so lets say the winners of the league get a home fixture for round one of the championship and the home team get to keep the gate from the fixture. That would be a great reward for winning the league.
hurlorhurley (Wexford) - Posts: 1660 - 16/02/2023 16:53:16
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Replying To beano: "One thing I do think they should implement as a county board mandate is that if a player is part of the wider county panel, but either didn't make the matchday squad in the immediate game prior to the club league round of matches, or maybe didn't get a cumulative certain amount of minutes agreed beforehand, then he is obligated to line out for his club in the league, injury-permitting of course.
No point having a fella wearing no. 24/25/26 on the county panel, maybe getting a token couple of minutes or no action at all, not at least keeping the eye in for his club. Let them train with the county all they want. We are told it's games lads want after all." I do think this is the case to be fair, I was at a Glynn league game in March or April last year and David Clarke played the full game when he was part of the county panel.
TerribleFootwork (Wexford) - Posts: 1760 - 16/02/2023 17:38:31
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Replying To hurlorhurley: "Every team has five matches in the group stages of the championships, so lets say the winners of the league get a home fixture for round one of the championship and the home team get to keep the gate from the fixture. That would be a great reward for winning the league." Winners of each division? Might work!
Viking66 (Wexford) - Posts: 13867 - 16/02/2023 18:18:07
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Replying To Viking66: "There would have to be some sort of rule that u18s couldn't play minor and u21 and adult in some sort of time period. As in couldn't play a minor game on Wednesday then an adult or u21 game the following weekend or previous weekend. Something like that." Definitely couldn't play 3 games in a week but I don't think playing a minor during the week and a men's match at the weekend would be a major issue. Minor matches midweek with an adult game at the weekend is fine imo, they are young lads after all. I'm sure in this day and age they wouldnt be dogged club training etc but I suppose that is the risk with some managers. I know some people will beat the burn out drum but two matches a week and a training session is fine imo, as majority won't play 60mins for their men's team at a weekend anyway. Many of these lads during March and April will be going Gaa training, playing gaa matches, going soccer training/playing games and doing Pe during the week in schools to, and a lot of the Soccer and Pe is finished by the end of May.
As an aside point on the league structure in Wexford, I think personally it is a waste of time. I'm surprised this year they have teams playing each other in the league who are in the same championship group, last year you played for the teams in the opposite side of your draw which made sense at least. Now they've made the groups locally which has resulted in a number of teams having their championship opponents in their league games. I know it could be 2/3 months in the difference when you play a team in the league to the championship but are teams really going to be trying 100% to win them games? Or try new things out etc. I also think having groups locally is another disadvantage as teams know each other so well they know exactly what they'll be up against etc.
I've seen bunclody haven't entered the league (I don't no why) but one can see their is benefits to nearly not entering it this year, you can organise games against teams from other counties who you are not familiar with (In Bunclodys case they have Carlow/Laois/Wicklow/Kilkenny all within an hours drive) and when you know you'll have a decent squad etc. instead of going across to play local rivals Askamore with 1/2 a team who they play every year, and who they'll have play in the summer in a championship match. I find it baffling really the logic behind the league this year.
Wally2496 (Wexford) - Posts: 46 - 16/02/2023 19:43:13
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Replying To Wally2496: "Definitely couldn't play 3 games in a week but I don't think playing a minor during the week and a men's match at the weekend would be a major issue. Minor matches midweek with an adult game at the weekend is fine imo, they are young lads after all. I'm sure in this day and age they wouldnt be dogged club training etc but I suppose that is the risk with some managers. I know some people will beat the burn out drum but two matches a week and a training session is fine imo, as majority won't play 60mins for their men's team at a weekend anyway. Many of these lads during March and April will be going Gaa training, playing gaa matches, going soccer training/playing games and doing Pe during the week in schools to, and a lot of the Soccer and Pe is finished by the end of May.
As an aside point on the league structure in Wexford, I think personally it is a waste of time. I'm surprised this year they have teams playing each other in the league who are in the same championship group, last year you played for the teams in the opposite side of your draw which made sense at least. Now they've made the groups locally which has resulted in a number of teams having their championship opponents in their league games. I know it could be 2/3 months in the difference when you play a team in the league to the championship but are teams really going to be trying 100% to win them games? Or try new things out etc. I also think having groups locally is another disadvantage as teams know each other so well they know exactly what they'll be up against etc.
I've seen bunclody haven't entered the league (I don't no why) but one can see their is benefits to nearly not entering it this year, you can organise games against teams from other counties who you are not familiar with (In Bunclodys case they have Carlow/Laois/Wicklow/Kilkenny all within an hours drive) and when you know you'll have a decent squad etc. instead of going across to play local rivals Askamore with 1/2 a team who they play every year, and who they'll have play in the summer in a championship match. I find it baffling really the logic behind the league this year." I think HurlorHurley was right there needs to be some sort of incentive to win your division, that doesn't involve points that directly influence the championship.
And I agree with you. The Leagues should be standalone with promotion and relegation, and not arranged on championship placings. 2 years ago our club played the Martins and a good few other Senior clubs in the League which was good for the players and as you say allowed for trying new ideas etc as we weren't going to play the same teams in the summer. I think Cushinstown was the only other Intermediate team in the division from memory.
Viking66 (Wexford) - Posts: 13867 - 17/02/2023 08:33:43
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Replying To Wally2496: "Definitely couldn't play 3 games in a week but I don't think playing a minor during the week and a men's match at the weekend would be a major issue. Minor matches midweek with an adult game at the weekend is fine imo, they are young lads after all. I'm sure in this day and age they wouldnt be dogged club training etc but I suppose that is the risk with some managers. I know some people will beat the burn out drum but two matches a week and a training session is fine imo, as majority won't play 60mins for their men's team at a weekend anyway. Many of these lads during March and April will be going Gaa training, playing gaa matches, going soccer training/playing games and doing Pe during the week in schools to, and a lot of the Soccer and Pe is finished by the end of May.
As an aside point on the league structure in Wexford, I think personally it is a waste of time. I'm surprised this year they have teams playing each other in the league who are in the same championship group, last year you played for the teams in the opposite side of your draw which made sense at least. Now they've made the groups locally which has resulted in a number of teams having their championship opponents in their league games. I know it could be 2/3 months in the difference when you play a team in the league to the championship but are teams really going to be trying 100% to win them games? Or try new things out etc. I also think having groups locally is another disadvantage as teams know each other so well they know exactly what they'll be up against etc.
I've seen bunclody haven't entered the league (I don't no why) but one can see their is benefits to nearly not entering it this year, you can organise games against teams from other counties who you are not familiar with (In Bunclodys case they have Carlow/Laois/Wicklow/Kilkenny all within an hours drive) and when you know you'll have a decent squad etc. instead of going across to play local rivals Askamore with 1/2 a team who they play every year, and who they'll have play in the summer in a championship match. I find it baffling really the logic behind the league this year." As I've just pointed out over on the other thread, it was the clubs themselves who voted in favour of the new League structure, with geographical groups and promotion/relegation.
Would assume the geographical thing was mainly with the lower divisions in mind. You'd have a fairly decent chance of getting lads to travel (for example) from Kilanerin to St. James's for a senior/Division 1 match, but you could be struggling for numbers if you're looking for enough of a crowd to make that sort of a trip for a Junior 'A'/Division 5 match.
Have to say I'm not fond of the new structure myself. Wouldn't surprise me if clubs vote to change it back to the other way in as little as two or three years' time.
Pikeman96 (Wexford) - Posts: 2621 - 17/02/2023 21:09:16
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Replying To Pikeman96: "As I've just pointed out over on the other thread, it was the clubs themselves who voted in favour of the new League structure, with geographical groups and promotion/relegation.
Would assume the geographical thing was mainly with the lower divisions in mind. You'd have a fairly decent chance of getting lads to travel (for example) from Kilanerin to St. James's for a senior/Division 1 match, but you could be struggling for numbers if you're looking for enough of a crowd to make that sort of a trip for a Junior 'A'/Division 5 match.
Have to say I'm not fond of the new structure myself. Wouldn't surprise me if clubs vote to change it back to the other way in as little as two or three years' time." Is there promotion and relegation between all the divisions Pikeman?
Viking66 (Wexford) - Posts: 13867 - 18/02/2023 07:10:07
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