|
Replying To Pikeman96: "Am only now catching up on the pages and pages of hand-wringing after yesterday's result (and yes, it was disastrous), but have to roll my eyes when I see somebody claiming that the split season is partly to blame.
If there was no split season and we still ran things as hurling one week and football the next, then two-thirds of all club hurlers (i.e. anyone who didn't make their county semi-final) still wouldn't have a had a club hurling match since the middle of last September. Only the county finalists would have had a club match since the end of September.
I just don't believe that the fact that most club hurlers were finished by early August last year instead of the middle of September (i.e. a six-week difference, more than five months ago) is making any concrete difference to what's happening at the moment.
On another note, one or two have claimed stuff along the lines of "not even Kilkenny in their prime gave us a tanking like that".
Gives me no pleasure whatsoever to type out the following scoreline, but there's the result of a League match played in Nowlan Park back in 2005:
Kilkenny 3-26, Wexford 0-5." There is no link I can see between the club championships being done in August and a performance of the county team the following March.
I think the split season results in Wexford clubs playing football when they otherwise would not care for it. I mean, didn't Buffers Alley get to a football final last year or am I wrong? Oulart and Rathnure both fielded.
What would happen with 2 weeks x 2 weeks is the 2 x weeks of football become recovery weeks for hurling. Which benefits the big dual clubs (like the Martin's, Rapps, etc) who have the numbers.
I would also riddle that Wexford clubs have been poor in Leinster as long as I can remember with the exception of a great Oulart team and if you go back much further to Rathnure and the great Buffers Alley teams in the 80's.
Lastly, when I hear complaints about county board I laugh. Your club has a county board rep, take any issue up with him, no? You talk about county boards like they are some hokum in some mythical organisation. They are on your doorstep.
ExiledInWex (Dublin) - Posts: 1452 - 27/02/2023 16:15:17
2460742
Link
0
|
|
Kilkenny 3-26, Wexford 0-5.
Pikeman96 (Wexford) - Posts: 1292 - 27/02/2023 15:58:21 2460730
How many of those 5 were from play and who scored them? I moved to Wexford around then.
ExiledInWex (Dublin) - Posts: 1452 - 27/02/2023 16:16:19
2460743
Link
0
|
|
Replying To Pikeman96: "Am only now catching up on the pages and pages of hand-wringing after yesterday's result (and yes, it was disastrous), but have to roll my eyes when I see somebody claiming that the split season is partly to blame.
If there was no split season and we still ran things as hurling one week and football the next, then two-thirds of all club hurlers (i.e. anyone who didn't make their county semi-final) still wouldn't have a had a club hurling match since the middle of last September. Only the county finalists would have had a club match since the end of September.
I just don't believe that the fact that most club hurlers were finished by early August last year instead of the middle of September (i.e. a six-week difference, more than five months ago) is making any concrete difference to what's happening at the moment.
On another note, one or two have claimed stuff along the lines of "not even Kilkenny in their prime gave us a tanking like that".
Gives me no pleasure whatsoever to type out the following scoreline, but there's the result of a League match played in Nowlan Park back in 2005:
Kilkenny 3-26, Wexford 0-5." I don't think the club split season has had any major impact either way on county teams I'm just thinking in terms of club players, football club league games on this weekend nearly 6 months before championship, I don't remember any big complaints pre covid of the then status quo but open to correction.
TerribleFootwork (Wexford) - Posts: 1760 - 27/02/2023 16:34:52
2460755
Link
0
|
|
Replying To HurlingBuzz: "I just think yesterday was a perfect storm from a Wexford perspective
1. Management trying to give new guys an opportunity which I agree with, but the problem is so many of our core team aren't available at the moment. Look at how limerick are introducing new players to inter county: they are surrounded by around 10 regulars and that's a perfect environment for them to play in. Plenty of experience to help them settle in.
2. Clare got mauled by limerick 2 weeks ago. Lohan wasn't going to accept another performance like that and went close to full strength as a result and I'd imagine their ears were still ringing from the limerick game so Clare's attitude yesterday shouldn't surprise anyone.
As to where we go from here, the likes of chinner, Rory, ohanlon, Oisin foley have to start getting game time. If not it's hard to see how they'll have the match sharpness to thrive in championship.
We need to see a big response from the team akin to Clare yesterday against Limerick and cork. If we don't we'll ship another couple of heavy losses which would do nothing for confidence heading into salthill" Couldn't agree more with this.
TerribleFootwork (Wexford) - Posts: 1760 - 27/02/2023 16:40:26
2460757
Link
0
|
|
Replying To Finchfurlong996: "That's not fair at all. I've come on here plenty and praised the teams after a good result. One of the first to come on here after the Kilkenny game last year. Praised the effort after the Clare game. What irks me is listening to officials on podcasts and radio telling us everything is fine. It's ether lies or delusion. I've been consistent on this for ages as well. One solution I would have is to scrap this split season at club nonsense. Go back to pre-covid because it worked. Not perfect but I think it worked better than the current system. Is it a coincidence that our football champions have been performing better in their provincial championships while our senior champions at least, have really struggled coming out of the county." god it sure worked, wexford were tired winning pre-covid
Stmunnsriver (Wexford) - Posts: 3003 - 27/02/2023 16:40:42
2460758
Link
0
|
|
Replying To Finchfurlong996: "That's not fair at all. I've come on here plenty and praised the teams after a good result. One of the first to come on here after the Kilkenny game last year. Praised the effort after the Clare game. What irks me is listening to officials on podcasts and radio telling us everything is fine. It's ether lies or delusion. I've been consistent on this for ages as well. One solution I would have is to scrap this split season at club nonsense. Go back to pre-covid because it worked. Not perfect but I think it worked better than the current system. Is it a coincidence that our football champions have been performing better in their provincial championships while our senior champions at least, have really struggled coming out of the county." The football champions were performing better in junior and intermediate pre covid too. Thats all down to the fact we are sending the 13th and 25th best teams into competitions and not the 17th and 33rd teams as in the past.
hurlorhurley (Wexford) - Posts: 1660 - 27/02/2023 17:00:34
2460766
Link
0
|
|
Replying To TerribleFootwork: "I don't think the club split season has had any major impact either way on county teams I'm just thinking in terms of club players, football club league games on this weekend nearly 6 months before championship, I don't remember any big complaints pre covid of the then status quo but open to correction." The difference pre-covid was that there was always a round or two of championship played around Easter (can't quite remember when it reverted to starting after county), so lads getting ready for the league starting, which it is in the football this weekend, were by extension prepping for the championship too given the time-frame. Too spread out now.
beano (Wexford) - Posts: 1503 - 27/02/2023 17:05:36
2460768
Link
0
|
|
Replying To ExiledInWex: "Kilkenny 3-26, Wexford 0-5.
Pikeman96 (Wexford) - Posts: 1292 - 27/02/2023 15:58:21 2460730
How many of those 5 were from play and who scored them? I moved to Wexford around then." Wasn't at it but my only memories of that game are that it was on at something like 6.15 on a Sunday evening as Wexford were playing Tyrone at 2 in Portlaoise in football league semi final in absolutely horrendous weather, Red Barry came on as a sub in hurling after playing the full football game, imagine the backlash these days for that, we actually ran Kilkenny to 3 points later that year in a brillant Leinster final.
TerribleFootwork (Wexford) - Posts: 1760 - 27/02/2023 17:09:33
2460769
Link
0
|
|
Replying To TerribleFootwork: "Well I remember reading you losing your mind here after Laois beat us in minor last year and barely a word after really good displays from the u20s in leinster semi final and final a week or 2 later, that's the lack of balance I'm talking about. I agree with you on split season but I would put this at the foot of the clubs, they had the power to change things but voted to keep the status quo, county chairman actually said in an interview last year alternate weekends akin to pre covid was his personal preference." That Laois team were not anything special as it turns out. Got beaten by a very good Offaly team in the final in fairness after beating Kilkenny. I'd imagine questions were asked in Kilkenny afterwards. I think it was Jackie Tyrell on an interview I seen questioning the development squad system in Kilkenny and saying how it isn't working there. They've won an all Ireland U21 and plenty of Leinster minors over the last few years and their still not happy. While in Wexford it's "oh aren't Laois making great strides". That's the difference. We accept being mediocre in this county and our fanbase who are the best in the country, don't deserve that. Also, I have said that the U20 side were good enough to win the AI last year. Lacking a bit in the forwards to get us over the line. Apart from that crop it's not been good. That's reality.
I get that the club ls should have a say obviously, but if it comes at the cost of your county teams well you got to make a decision that may make people unhappy. All the financial success that the county has achieved is coming off a good decade for the most part from the hurlers and Wexford park has seen some massive crowds and just general buzz has been up. If that starts to dwindle, the finances could suffer also if your not getting large crowds or the sponsorship deals that come with success. In fairness, that's the one thing that Wexford are doing very well at.
Finchfurlong996 (Wexford) - Posts: 255 - 27/02/2023 17:10:13
2460770
Link
0
|
|
Replying To HurlingBuzz: "I just think yesterday was a perfect storm from a Wexford perspective
1. Management trying to give new guys an opportunity which I agree with, but the problem is so many of our core team aren't available at the moment. Look at how limerick are introducing new players to inter county: they are surrounded by around 10 regulars and that's a perfect environment for them to play in. Plenty of experience to help them settle in.
2. Clare got mauled by limerick 2 weeks ago. Lohan wasn't going to accept another performance like that and went close to full strength as a result and I'd imagine their ears were still ringing from the limerick game so Clare's attitude yesterday shouldn't surprise anyone.
As to where we go from here, the likes of chinner, Rory, ohanlon, Oisin foley have to start getting game time. If not it's hard to see how they'll have the match sharpness to thrive in championship.
We need to see a big response from the team akin to Clare yesterday against Limerick and cork. If we don't we'll ship another couple of heavy losses which would do nothing for confidence heading into salthill" Good post . The next game is a big one for our season in my opinion . Not for the result in particular but we need to integrate some of our senior players again and develop our way of playing. We can't just rock up to Salthill with lads who haven't played together all year . We didn't seem to have any way of playing yesterday I don't know what our tactics were atall. Of the injured lads who are absent who is likely to miss out for Cork apart from Jippo and Richie Lawlor ?
Afinestick (Wexford) - Posts: 999 - 27/02/2023 17:19:38
2460775
Link
0
|
|
Replying To ExiledInWex: "There is no link I can see between the club championships being done in August and a performance of the county team the following March.
I think the split season results in Wexford clubs playing football when they otherwise would not care for it. I mean, didn't Buffers Alley get to a football final last year or am I wrong? Oulart and Rathnure both fielded.
What would happen with 2 weeks x 2 weeks is the 2 x weeks of football become recovery weeks for hurling. Which benefits the big dual clubs (like the Martin's, Rapps, etc) who have the numbers.
I would also riddle that Wexford clubs have been poor in Leinster as long as I can remember with the exception of a great Oulart team and if you go back much further to Rathnure and the great Buffers Alley teams in the 80's.
Lastly, when I hear complaints about county board I laugh. Your club has a county board rep, take any issue up with him, no? You talk about county boards like they are some hokum in some mythical organisation. They are on your doorstep." Oulart won a football final last year.
Viking66 (Wexford) - Posts: 16764 - 27/02/2023 17:37:06
2460783
Link
0
|
|
Replying To TerribleFootwork: "If Richie Lawlor could get back to play a part against Cork or Limerick that would be great but I suspect that's too tight a timeframe." Not a hope according to a Harriers man
Viking66 (Wexford) - Posts: 16764 - 27/02/2023 17:39:27
2460784
Link
0
|
|
Replying To TerribleFootwork: "Wasn't at it but my only memories of that game are that it was on at something like 6.15 on a Sunday evening as Wexford were playing Tyrone at 2 in Portlaoise in football league semi final in absolutely horrendous weather, Red Barry came on as a sub in hurling after playing the full football game, imagine the backlash these days for that, we actually ran Kilkenny to 3 points later that year in a brillant Leinster final." We were current Leinster champions when that game was played.
Viking66 (Wexford) - Posts: 16764 - 27/02/2023 17:41:18
2460785
Link
0
|
|
Replying To beano: "The difference pre-covid was that there was always a round or two of championship played around Easter (can't quite remember when it reverted to starting after county), so lads getting ready for the league starting, which it is in the football this weekend, were by extension prepping for the championship too given the time-frame. Too spread out now." Yeah, there used to be two rounds of both hurling & football championships played around April all right, when it was deemed "club month" by Croke Park.
2019 was the last year it operated that way. Obviously Covid then changed a lot of things, and then the "real" split season was introduced (i.e. the county/club split that operates nationally, rather than the hurling/football split we have in Wexford).
The split season heralded the end of the April "Club Month" as inter-county competitions now run during that time, instead of it being kept free for club competitions.
Incidentally, people may give out about the All County Leagues (and particularly the football league) starting around now, but many other counties don't use this time for secondary club competitions there at all. So it could be said that even in a mainly or wholly football county that adopts that approach, club footballers get a much rawer deal than they do here, since they don't get any club match at all until after the county team is finished.
Pikeman96 (Wexford) - Posts: 3003 - 27/02/2023 17:46:21
2460789
Link
0
|
|
Replying To Finchfurlong996: "That Laois team were not anything special as it turns out. Got beaten by a very good Offaly team in the final in fairness after beating Kilkenny. I'd imagine questions were asked in Kilkenny afterwards. I think it was Jackie Tyrell on an interview I seen questioning the development squad system in Kilkenny and saying how it isn't working there. They've won an all Ireland U21 and plenty of Leinster minors over the last few years and their still not happy. While in Wexford it's "oh aren't Laois making great strides". That's the difference. We accept being mediocre in this county and our fanbase who are the best in the country, don't deserve that. Also, I have said that the U20 side were good enough to win the AI last year. Lacking a bit in the forwards to get us over the line. Apart from that crop it's not been good. That's reality.
I get that the club ls should have a say obviously, but if it comes at the cost of your county teams well you got to make a decision that may make people unhappy. All the financial success that the county has achieved is coming off a good decade for the most part from the hurlers and Wexford park has seen some massive crowds and just general buzz has been up. If that starts to dwindle, the finances could suffer also if your not getting large crowds or the sponsorship deals that come with success. In fairness, that's the one thing that Wexford are doing very well at." So what's your answer? More questions from you as usual. I posted yesterday what I thought might help our underage structures at the grassroots. The clubs. Some proper professional coaching a couple of times per summer for all the u10, u12 and u14 age groups in every club in the county shouldn't cost too much. But it has to be by proper professional coaches and overseen by someone on the Board. Coaching the boys and their coaches.
The way it has gone with Second level education Peter's and GC are no longer pulling in all the best hurlers. I'm not sure what you can do about that . People are being encouraged to send their kids to the nearest school. Otherwise it gets very expensive to get them there.
Viking66 (Wexford) - Posts: 16764 - 27/02/2023 17:48:03
2460791
Link
0
|
|
Replying To TerribleFootwork: "Wasn't at it but my only memories of that game are that it was on at something like 6.15 on a Sunday evening as Wexford were playing Tyrone at 2 in Portlaoise in football league semi final in absolutely horrendous weather, Red Barry came on as a sub in hurling after playing the full football game, imagine the backlash these days for that, we actually ran Kilkenny to 3 points later that year in a brillant Leinster final." Yeah, I wasn't at it either. Or the football. I was actually on holiday in Vietnam at the time. :)
As a result, can't answer the question from somebody else about how many scores from play, or who got them.
Pikeman96 (Wexford) - Posts: 3003 - 27/02/2023 17:48:51
2460792
Link
0
|
|
Replying To beano: "The difference pre-covid was that there was always a round or two of championship played around Easter (can't quite remember when it reverted to starting after county), so lads getting ready for the league starting, which it is in the football this weekend, were by extension prepping for the championship too given the time-frame. Too spread out now." Last year was the 1st proper season of that, 2020 was a bit a mis mash with Covid lockdowns and in 2021 the 1st 4 months of the year nothing went on so everything was at a break neck speed from May onwards.
TerribleFootwork (Wexford) - Posts: 1760 - 27/02/2023 17:57:46
2460798
Link
0
|
|
Replying To Finchfurlong996: "That Laois team were not anything special as it turns out. Got beaten by a very good Offaly team in the final in fairness after beating Kilkenny. I'd imagine questions were asked in Kilkenny afterwards. I think it was Jackie Tyrell on an interview I seen questioning the development squad system in Kilkenny and saying how it isn't working there. They've won an all Ireland U21 and plenty of Leinster minors over the last few years and their still not happy. While in Wexford it's "oh aren't Laois making great strides". That's the difference. We accept being mediocre in this county and our fanbase who are the best in the country, don't deserve that. Also, I have said that the U20 side were good enough to win the AI last year. Lacking a bit in the forwards to get us over the line. Apart from that crop it's not been good. That's reality.
I get that the club ls should have a say obviously, but if it comes at the cost of your county teams well you got to make a decision that may make people unhappy. All the financial success that the county has achieved is coming off a good decade for the most part from the hurlers and Wexford park has seen some massive crowds and just general buzz has been up. If that starts to dwindle, the finances could suffer also if your not getting large crowds or the sponsorship deals that come with success. In fairness, that's the one thing that Wexford are doing very well at." Please give me this evidence of accepting mediocrity? I'd like to think everyone is striving to do better year on year in terms of providing our underage players with the best environment to prosper, I'm not saying everything is rosy or that was an outstanding Laois team but they were competitive with Galway and Clare too after the Leinster final too, I think that day you called them an embarrassment I think you presumably in your 30s or so was the true embarrassment going 2 footed on 15,16 & 17 year olds, another poster made a valid point, if you've such as issue with the county board go to your club rep rather being a hurler on the ditch spouting to other hurlers on the ditch like myself, you'd swear the way you talk about the county board there like the stonecutters out of The Simpsons.
TerribleFootwork (Wexford) - Posts: 1760 - 27/02/2023 18:08:05
2460801
Link
0
|
|
So much heated talk on here about Wexford under-age hurling being a disaster so it only makes sense to look at the crops of lads to have played Senior hurling for Wexford in either the League or the Championship (Although I may have left some out by accident):
1990: Paul Morris//Shaun Murphy/Eoin Moore/James Breen/Harry Kehoe/Shane Tomkins/Podge Doran
1991: Matthew O'Hanlon/Willie Devereux/Mark Fanning/Liam Óg
1992: Lee Chin/Ian Byrne/Dee O'Keeffe
1993: Aidan Nolan/Jack Guiney
1994: Jack O'Connor/Andrew Kenny/Eoin Conroy/David Dunne
1995: Conor Mc/Paudie Foley/Kevin Foley/Simon Donohoe/Liam Ryan/Conor Devitt/Gavin Bailey/Oliver O'Leary
1996: Cathal Dunbar
1997: Oisín Foley/Shane Reck/Joe O'Connor/Ian Carthy/Aaron Maddock/Seamus Casey/David Clarke
1998: Rory O'Connor/Damien Reck/Conor Firman/Conor Hearne/Mikie Dwyer/Connal Flood/Rory Higgins/Darren Byrne
1999: Charlie McGuckin/Eoin Murphy
2000: Ross Banville/James Lawlor/Niall Murphy
2001: Jack Doran
2002: Richie Lawlor
2003: Oisín Pepper/Corey Byrne-Dunbar/Conor Foley
Some years were very strong (1990, 1991, 1992, 1995, and 1998), some were ok (1993, 1994, and 1997), and some were very weak (1996, 1999, 2000, and 2001). I think we're really feeling the pinch from the lack of quality between the 1999, 2000, and 2001 crops right now as they are aged 22, 23, and 24 right now so should be breaking through. I wouldn't take that as evidence we're failing at under-age level though. Like we should in theory have at the very least three very promising hurlers from the 2002 crop right now; the issue is that one is currently injured and the other two are off the panel for reasons unbeknownst to me. Personally, I think Cian Molloy, AJ Redmond, and Richie Lawlor were all in with a great chance of breaking through this season and starting come Championship time. Plus the 2003 crop looks very promising too so I don't think the underage set-up here is bleak, we just had a few fallow years (At a not particularly good time considering the 1995s should be close to the end of their primes and the 1998s are right in the middle of it).
ElGranSenor (Wexford) - Posts: 616 - 27/02/2023 18:19:50
2460802
Link
0
|
|
The main problem in my opinion is lack of strength and power. Most county sides are composed of tall strong forceful hurlers. It's okay to have a few smaller fast wingers but the likes of Kilkenny, Clare, Waterford,Tiipperary, Galway and of course Limerick are top heavy with that type of player.
We on the other hand have too many average height lads. We do have some players capable of mixing it with the best, such as OHanlon, Chin, Mac and jippo but beyond that we fall far short of the required standard.
Yesterday's game put that into perspective. We were pushed around like an underage team. Unable to clear the ball as Clare bossed us physically and skilfully. No good of course having big strong lads if they lack the skills of the game.
I suppose if we haven't got that type of player coming through there's nothing we can do .
Maybe with further strength and conditioning we can improve our standing in the hurling world.
.
Magpie2 (Wexford) - Posts: 544 - 27/02/2023 19:57:45
2460823
Link
0
|