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Replying To Lockjaw:  "Champagne Football is an excellent read. It is a microcosm of Irish life. Shady transparency, cronyism and corruption abound. And as you quite rightly pointed out - zero culpability and accountability.

The likes of you and I would find ourselves in court eventually for not paying car tax and insurance. Or if we spent beyond our means the bailiffs would be at our doors. But for a certain cohort in Ireland the rules are seemingly different.

Anyway. I like the fact that we're at least trying to play a bit of football now. The last two performances offered some hope. What we're really lacking is a bit of genuine quality in the final third. Obafemi has potential but would need to be playing regular Premier League football to improve. In international football one or two players of real class makes a huge difference.

Look at Wales for instance. Taking Bale, and to a lesser extent Ramsey, out of the equation - pound for pound I don't think they're any better than us. If you threw a peak Robbie Keane and Damien Duff into our current eleven I don't think we'd be too far away from qualification for big tournaments."
True, in Ireland the scales of justice are fairly uneven. Reminds me of an auld maxim about financial institutions and debt: "If you owe them ten grand, it's your problem. If you owe them ten million, it's their problem".

Wales are lovely to watch and I was happy to see them qualify at last, think it's 1958 since they were last in it. Granted, Bale and Ramsey probably add a lot to their team, but for Ireland, the question should be: why aren't we producing those sorts of players any more? Even relatively poor Irish sides produced very good quality players like John Giles, Liam Brady, Peter Farrell, Jackie Carey, Tony Dunne, Charlie Hurley etc. We don't seem to produce anyone near that quality any more, possibly because of the globalization of the Premier League. But I think we need to go with the times and try to offer a better quality of football at home, or if not, get young players deals in other European leagues.

Gleebo (Mayo) - Posts: 2138 - 25/06/2022 17:37:27    2427434

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How much of a joke have Manchester United become?

johnocarroll17 (Limerick) - Posts: 408 - 25/06/2022 19:55:18    2427477

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Replying To johnocarroll17:  "How much of a joke have Manchester United become?"
Utd seem to be more content to be a "content" generator and measure success by number of clicks rather than titles these days. They really need to get back to basics at that club big time.

Lockjaw (Donegal) - Posts: 7969 - 26/06/2022 09:32:53    2427526

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New manager has a huge task on his hands… Glazers lining their pockets with huge sums of cash each month while the stadium and training ground is crumbling to pieces… Fans go out protesting yet fill the stadium every home game… what idiots

ForeverBlue2 (Cavan) - Posts: 988 - 26/06/2022 10:26:10    2427537

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New manager has a huge task on his hands… Glazers lining their pockets with huge sums of cash each month while the stadium and training ground is crumbling to pieces… Fans go out protesting yet fill the stadium every home game… what idiots

ForeverBlue2 (Cavan) - Posts: 988 - 26/06/2022 10:30:33    2427539

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Replying To Lockjaw:  "Yeah that Yugoslavia team was class. They won the 1987 u20 World Cup and were well on their way to becoming a very serious international force up until the Balkan War and the fall of the country. Red Star Belgrade won the European Cup in 91 and I reckon they probably would have won Euro 92 if they had not been expelled due to the war. The 1994 World Cup would not have been beyond them either in my opinion. Their attacking talent was ridiculous - Suker, Pancev, Boksic, Savicevic...and then you had a midfield containing the likes of Boban, Prosinecki, Jugovic, Stojkovic, Asanovic...

If you're interested, there is a fantastic documentary on the FIFA website about that the great Croatia team of the mid to late 90s and how it developed from the old Yugoslavian team - https://www.fifa.com/fifaplus/en/home"
Thanks Lockjaw. Will check it out. Have you listened to the "Italia 90 one day at a time" podcast"? It's brilliant stuff.

Malonemagic (Laois) - Posts: 712 - 26/06/2022 10:31:41    2427540

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Replying To Lockjaw:  "Utd seem to be more content to be a "content" generator and measure success by number of clicks rather than titles these days. They really need to get back to basics at that club big time."
They are being run into the ground by mercantile capitalists, who couldn't care less whether they win another trophy or not. That the roofs at Old Trafford are leaking and the gates rusting is symbolic of how they do things.

A lot of people will compare them to the oligarch owners at Chelsea and Manchester City, who are also undoubtedly ruthless businessmen. But rightly or wrongly, those regimes demand success and dispense with those who fail to deliver it. Compare that with United, who persisted with the likes of Solskjaer for three years when it was obvious from early on that he was way off the standards set by Guardiola and Klopp.

The recruitment has also been pathetic, the likes of Sanchez, Pogba, Matic, Maguire etc. have all been major flops. The Super League fiasco was the cherry on top of the cake.

Gleebo (Mayo) - Posts: 2138 - 26/06/2022 11:06:01    2427545

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Replying To Gleebo:  "True, in Ireland the scales of justice are fairly uneven. Reminds me of an auld maxim about financial institutions and debt: "If you owe them ten grand, it's your problem. If you owe them ten million, it's their problem".

Wales are lovely to watch and I was happy to see them qualify at last, think it's 1958 since they were last in it. Granted, Bale and Ramsey probably add a lot to their team, but for Ireland, the question should be: why aren't we producing those sorts of players any more? Even relatively poor Irish sides produced very good quality players like John Giles, Liam Brady, Peter Farrell, Jackie Carey, Tony Dunne, Charlie Hurley etc. We don't seem to produce anyone near that quality any more, possibly because of the globalization of the Premier League. But I think we need to go with the times and try to offer a better quality of football at home, or if not, get young players deals in other European leagues."
Yeah it's a big problem that we haven't any players operating in the upper ranked PL teams. Matt Doherty was looking like he might be establishing himself as Conte's first choice right-wing back until his injury. It'll be interesting to see if he if can re-establish himself when he's fit again. But other than him I don't think there's anyone close. As you say it would be better for our lads to try their hand in other European Leagues and establish themselves as first team players rather than a succession of loan spells around England. It would take a bit of bravery though in terms of new culture, language, climate etc.

Lockjaw (Donegal) - Posts: 7969 - 27/06/2022 12:21:11    2427945

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Replying To Gleebo:  "They are being run into the ground by mercantile capitalists, who couldn't care less whether they win another trophy or not. That the roofs at Old Trafford are leaking and the gates rusting is symbolic of how they do things.

A lot of people will compare them to the oligarch owners at Chelsea and Manchester City, who are also undoubtedly ruthless businessmen. But rightly or wrongly, those regimes demand success and dispense with those who fail to deliver it. Compare that with United, who persisted with the likes of Solskjaer for three years when it was obvious from early on that he was way off the standards set by Guardiola and Klopp.

The recruitment has also been pathetic, the likes of Sanchez, Pogba, Matic, Maguire etc. have all been major flops. The Super League fiasco was the cherry on top of the cake."
And the whole Frankie De Jong thing dragged on needlessly all summer long. 10 years ago the stars were queuing up to join United. Now they can't even attract anyone.

johnocarroll17 (Limerick) - Posts: 408 - 10/07/2022 21:11:43    2431195

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I see Klopp made some very good points about player burnout. It's absolutely crazy that PL action resumes on St Stephen's Day, a week after the World Cup final is played. The physical and mental effort that goes into winning a World Cup. Then the euphoria/devastation of winning/losing.

Imagine for example (the horror!) if England won it. There would obviously be a huge homecoming with all of the celebrations and dignitaries wanting their pound of flesh. Then you'd have the usual Christmas buzz on top of it.
But then they're saying to the players. Right lads - back to the day jobs now. You have 3 games in 10 days. Look we all know they're very well paid and looked after. But when will enough be enough.

Klopp is right - UEFA and FIFA really need to be careful or there will be a tipping point reached where the top stars of the game will start refusing to be pieces of meat anymore. I don't think this Super League idea has totally gone away.

Lockjaw (Donegal) - Posts: 7969 - 12/07/2022 11:58:59    2431619

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Congratulations to our rugby team, a fantastic performance to win the deciding game against the All Blacks this morning.

Cockney_Cat (UK) - Posts: 1872 - 16/07/2022 12:47:42    2432327

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great win. so many top level performances.
hope can build it on into autumn against south africa, fiji and australia and then into world cup next year.
new zealand or france in quarters very tough but we've now
won 5 of last tests v new zealand so they should hold no fear now.

KillingFields (Limerick) - Posts: 2729 - 16/07/2022 13:34:44    2432336

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Replying To KillingFields:  "great win. so many top level performances.
hope can build it on into autumn against south africa, fiji and australia and then into world cup next year.
new zealand or france in quarters very tough but we've now
won 5 of last tests v new zealand so they should hold no fear now."
A fantastic win but a word of caution…. We have been down this road before and then flopped when it matters most in the World Cup…. Let's hope it's different this time….

ForeverBlue2 (Cavan) - Posts: 988 - 16/07/2022 14:33:08    2432350

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Casual rugby fan here but are we not getting a bit too hung up on this New Zealand thing, a great rugby nation but just one nation none the less?

I couldn't give a damn if for example the Irish soccer team beat Brazil in a "test" game if they didn't back it up with winning a tournament soon after.

Galway9801 (Galway) - Posts: 1263 - 16/07/2022 16:11:48    2432359

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O'Driscoll said before the game that this was bigger than making a WC semi-final!

realdub (Dublin) - Posts: 8372 - 16/07/2022 16:25:28    2432363

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Replying To Galway9801:  "Casual rugby fan here but are we not getting a bit too hung up on this New Zealand thing, a great rugby nation but just one nation none the less?

I couldn't give a damn if for example the Irish soccer team beat Brazil in a "test" game if they didn't back it up with winning a tournament soon after."
Soccer teams don't play 'test' games, so why are you using them as a comparison?

Cockney_Cat (UK) - Posts: 1872 - 16/07/2022 17:23:41    2432368

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Replying To realdub:  "O'Driscoll said before the game that this was bigger than making a WC semi-final!"
I can't say I would agree with B.O.D. there.
True that the test series, much like cricket, are a very different beast than a 'friendly/challenge', but I'd take a WC semi-final over that any day.

35OLT (USA) - Posts: 55 - 16/07/2022 17:29:14    2432370

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Replying To realdub:  "O'Driscoll said before the game that this was bigger than making a WC semi-final!"
It's not for me to question a legend of the game, but it might be due to the fact Irish rugby can't make a WC semi final. Lets be honest, today was a great achievement but Ireland will not beat NZ or any other big team at the WC when it really counts.

Scotland will be 50 50 to make a QF but that would be the limit. In saying that congratulations to the team for winning a test series in NZ, as history shows it doesn't happen too often. We might regret it if we get them at the WC though lol.

sam1884 (UK) - Posts: 943 - 16/07/2022 17:36:42    2432371

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Replying To Gleebo:  "Hard to believe it's now been 20 years since Ireland's last world cup berth, and hard to see us qualifying soon.

We also went a very long time without an Olympic gold medal at one stage- was it 36 years between Ronnie Delaney's and Michael Carruth's?

We're poor enough as a sporting nation, in the international sense."
Foreign players coming into the premier league and youth academies finished Ireland for good.

Irish internationals starting now that can't get into championship teams now whereas one time you had a lot of Irish players starring for Man Utd, Liverpool, Aston Villa etc.

Past hurler (None) - Posts: 442 - 16/07/2022 17:48:56    2432373

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Replying To Past hurler:  "Foreign players coming into the premier league and youth academies finished Ireland for good.

Irish internationals starting now that can't get into championship teams now whereas one time you had a lot of Irish players starring for Man Utd, Liverpool, Aston Villa etc."
An innovative organisation would of reacted to the changing dynamics of soccer in England; at the time the Irish national team was successful with a lot of money in the Irish game. The IRFU stole a march on soccer and we know what happened at the FAI. If the FAI had of built a centre of excellence to run it's own academy or put funding into geographical areas to improve coaching things might have different, the LOI would of also benefited.

It's why I like Kenny as the soccer manager, he knows the game in Ireland and appears to realise the whole structure needs an overhaul which will take a decade or more. I don't agree Ireland is finished "for good", it just needs the right organisation, time and people to get things moving in the right direction.

sam1884 (UK) - Posts: 943 - 16/07/2022 18:05:50    2432378

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