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Replying To bdbuddah: "Now as a days as a forward in some ways it's harder to stand out (despite the fact that pulling and dragging is punished more than what it was back then). The game now a days often is to keep hand passing in front of the opposition until you find a free man in an uncontested position in scoring area of the pitch. It would be harder for a forward like James McCartin or Bernard Flynn, who used their pace to get to the ball before their man not just because their is less space due to tactics but the mindset is so different even if that type of ball is on most modern players wouldn't think of kicking the ball into space in front of them to begin with." Agree but is the game any better nowadays as a spectacle?
Take Down v Meath All Ireland 1991. It had everything. No faking injuries there. Great scores. Hard hitting.
The Sh@@e we watching nowadays is glorified basketball with a touch of playing it across the back 4 soccer style and back to the keeper.
Breffni1969 (Cavan) - Posts: 510 - 26/04/2022 15:39:59
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Replying To Breffni40: "Those lads, legends though they are, weren't operating at the same pace as modern football. There are corner backs in todays game with a greater skillset than a lot of, pre 1990 say, forwards. There's no comparison and it's pointless making them" Of course the corner backs now do, but the game is not even remotely close to the same thing but if those legends had the same access to bleep test, sports science, analytics and data that modern players it would be a vastly different story.
Those corner backs would also be out of the game going for the first ball against any of the legends because they'd break their shoulders with a solid tackle before the corner back would've broken out for the ball
As you rightly say "There's no comparison and it's pointless making them" and yet that's exactly what you're doing
brian (Meath) - Posts: 1954 - 26/04/2022 17:25:33
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Replying To Breffni1969: "Agree but is the game any better nowadays as a spectacle?
Take Down v Meath All Ireland 1991. It had everything. No faking injuries there. Great scores. Hard hitting.
The Sh@@e we watching nowadays is glorified basketball with a touch of playing it across the back 4 soccer style and back to the keeper." Funny I remember Gaelic football in the eighties in particular being described as glorified basketball. I was at that final in 1991 and I enjoyed it immensely. I was also at the final and replay in 2019. I enjoyedtjose games immensely too.
Greengrass (Louth) - Posts: 6031 - 26/04/2022 18:57:36
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Replying To brian: "Absolute horse manure. The games have developed since those days as everything in life has and lads that used to do a hard days labour on building sites, farms and other trades went out for a game and took out the frustrations of their day on another man and then had a pint and fag with said man. Those men all had natural strength from their every day lifes and didn't need gym programmes, S&C sessions and everything modern players has as they did it in their everyday life.
The GAA also has to admit that they've watered down their games to such an extent from those days that of course as a spectacle the game seems much "better" because they've taken all the physicality out of the game. A big shoulder now a days gets people off their seat and you'll have people looking for cards for it. Those were a matter of course in the times you referred too and not even free's in most cases.
Now admittedly some of the changes were for the better and hopefully we won't see as many players having knee, hip and other replacements in later life and they'll not be absolutely hobbled and crippled with injuries.
You say that teams only had 2-3 top class players back then and everyone else pulled and dragged, again BS. Those teams all had top class players but the game was so different in those times that pulling and dragging was part of the game. Transport those players into modern times, give them the same access to gym, S&C , Nutrition, skills training, analytics and data and i guarantee in my opinion they'd be as good as if not better than any current team. If you flipped the script and put the teams of now back in those days without all the support structures they have around them they'd struggle massively. Saying player intelligence and skill were a rare commodity, would you ever go and take a running jump. Some of the best players of all times played in the 70's, 80's and 90's. I'd put many of them so far ahead of current players i wouldn't be funny.
But ultimately they're not playing the same thing anyways. Theirs 15 players a ball and the same objective, but everything else has changed and the rules now a days are all about the spectacle and high scoring games to get people watching.
The plain truth is the games are totally different, some of the changes good (hopefully reduced long term injuries) but for the most part the watering down of the games has made the game a battle of who has the biggest and best access to support around them.
There's absolutely no point trying to compare the games as they're not even close to the same thing. Enjoy both for what they are and if you don't like the old product no one is forcing you to watch it." Bang on . Like that bit about flipping the script and sending some of the modern players back. A lot of them would lose their life if they were on the receiving end of a decent shoulder or heaven help us a clatter of a hurl. And I'm not advocating dirty play either, players before took a tackle and got on with it which for me was a much more honorable spectacle than what we witness today.Contrast that with what our footballers were at on Sunday vs Mayo, down scratching their head every minute even though you could clearly see there was no contact. I'm sure they were attempting to run the clock, and are coached to do so ,but either way its horrible to watch, and part of the reason why I'd much prefer to watch older games. (Such as the Meath Down final in 91 as another poster mentioned,which I came across at Christmas- football as it should be played)
UtahBlaine (Galway) - Posts: 147 - 26/04/2022 19:46:08
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Replying To Breffni1969: "Agree but is the game any better nowadays as a spectacle?
Take Down v Meath All Ireland 1991. It had everything. No faking injuries there. Great scores. Hard hitting.
The Sh@@e we watching nowadays is glorified basketball with a touch of playing it across the back 4 soccer style and back to the keeper." The hold possession at all cost tactics for me, despite the higher scoring rate make modern matches overall less exciting. The fact that modern tactics where top forwards slot in to the tactical system and don't get as much chance to shine reduces the spectacle. We need to get more man on man competition back into the game.
bdbuddah (Meath) - Posts: 1349 - 27/04/2022 10:19:51
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Replying To Greengrass: "Funny I remember Gaelic football in the eighties in particular being described as glorified basketball. I was at that final in 1991 and I enjoyed it immensely. I was also at the final and replay in 2019. I enjoyedtjose games immensely too." The 2019 replay?
Wasn't a great game, a comfortable win for Dublin, and the keep ball tactics at the end rendered the final minutes almost unwatchable.
Galway9801 (Galway) - Posts: 1708 - 27/04/2022 10:40:46
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In my opinion this boils down to the following:
1. More time and thought is put into the game from a training and tactical point of view now. The days of a player aimlessly belting the ball away are long gone and understandably so.
2. This has lead to fewer contests for possession and less unpredictability, which can lead to very boring passages of play.
3. There is an element of safety first being coached too much in some instances, which can stifle natural creativity.
4. In saying that, players are generally taking the right option far more often today than in the past.
5. Players are far more skillful today on average. Points being kicked off both feet from difficult angles are far more common than they were in previous decades. This is because top players put far more time into developing skills now.
6. Forwards are kicking scores now with much less space and often with more than one defender for company. In the past every forward generally had a 1-on-1 battle to win only.
7. The best teams today are still those that take a certain amount of risks and let their skillful players flourish. It tends to be poorer teams that overcoach and stick to very rigid gameplans.
In summary, whether it's better or worse is very much in eye of the beholder. I struggle to watch some old games where players seem to put little thought into a decision and give the ball away aimlessly over and over. At the same time, many of today's games can be turgid to watch, with players guarding possession at all costs and afraid to take the slightest risk.
The truth is the best teams are the ones who are best to watch. Tyrone-Kerry last year was a very enjoyable game. There was plenty kick passing and driving runs taking on their men. It had plenty turnovers as well due to the pressure being put on by the team without possession.
WanPintWin (Galway) - Posts: 2040 - 27/04/2022 11:21:23
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Replying To Galway9801: "The 2019 replay?
Wasn't a great game, a comfortable win for Dublin, and the keep ball tactics at the end rendered the final minutes almost unwatchable." And this is the thing with the modern game, its glorified handball, pass it around, low risk, minimise the chance of mistakes and no mavericks or characters at all. It's all process process process. I'm not having a go at Dublin, a great team that won 6 in a row which i don't think will ever be matched but in recent years they kill games with 10 minutes left on the clock. They could of course score at will when needed but 10 minutes to go 6 points clear and the passing around starts, over and back, up and back and no chances taken. That's a creation of the GAA's own causing.
TBF to the lads in hurling they still go at it to the final minutes as you can't play the game like that, but given the increase in the size of the bosses on hurls and the lighter ball being used it caters for the game being end to end with little to no tackling and no air or ground hurling ala Fenton's goal from however far out it was back in the 80's or Nicky's bullet half volley in 89. So talk of skills being gone where are those skills in 2022, non bleepin existent
brian (Meath) - Posts: 1954 - 27/04/2022 11:29:06
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This is going to offend people of a certain age.
Tallowman GAA on YouTube and TG4/Eir during Covid showing old matches have shone a light on many of the legendary hurling and football matches.
So many of these legendary games from the 80's and 90's were absolutely awful. Yes they were exciting finishes and in terms of heart and passion the players could not be faulted, but they were awful in terms of quality. Player intelligence and skill were scarce commodities, there was about 2-3 top class hurlers on every team and beyond that there was honest endeavour but an attitude of pull, wind and swing and ask questions later.
The real start of intelligent hurling came with the Cork team of the mid noughties, and in football with the Tyrone and Armagh teams. Before these teams came along, it was crash bang wallop.
This is by no means to insult those who won provincial or All-Ireland medals back then, but in my view GAA now is in a far better place than it was back then and while there were pulsating finishes to matches back then (and Ciaran Carey's point v Clare is still the best hurling point ever scored), these great moments of class very much paper over otherwise mundane games.
StoreysTash (Wexford) - Posts: 1486 - 22/04/2022 14:52:21 2412290
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Replying To StoreysTash: "This is going to offend people of a certain age.
Tallowman GAA on YouTube and TG4/Eir during Covid showing old matches have shone a light on many of the legendary hurling and football matches.
So many of these legendary games from the 80's and 90's were absolutely awful. Yes they were exciting finishes and in terms of heart and passion the players could not be faulted, but they were awful in terms of quality. Player intelligence and skill were scarce commodities, there was about 2-3 top class hurlers on every team and beyond that there was honest endeavour but an attitude of pull, wind and swing and ask questions later.
The real start of intelligent hurling came with the Cork team of the mid noughties, and in football with the Tyrone and Armagh teams. Before these teams came along, it was crash bang wallop.
This is by no means to insult those who won provincial or All-Ireland medals back then, but in my view GAA now is in a far better place than it was back then and while there were pulsating finishes to matches back then (and Ciaran Carey's point v Clare is still the best hurling point ever scored), these great moments of class very much paper over otherwise mundane games."
Its all relative in hindsight. If they were exciting at the time then thats all that matters. No doubt tactics play a major part now whereas in the 80's there wasn't even a manger in many cases just a coach. Moving the ball in the right direction was all that mattered.
When we look back at hurling in 30 years we might be cringing at the amount of hand passing, pulling and dragging and overcarrying that went on and saying how skill less that was.... I hope!
ZUL10 (Clare) - Posts: 650 - 22/04/2022 15:09:30 2412297
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I pity today's youngsters who never saw real Gaelic football.
Shame too that no real films are available to show how great the game was in the fifties when I started out.
The goalie minded the goals and the fullback never left the square.
There was no need for coaching.
Either you could play or you couldn't.
worple (Roscommon) - Posts: 303 - 22/04/2022 15:35:19 2412313
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Replying To StoreysTash: "This is going to offend people of a certain age.
Tallowman GAA on YouTube and TG4/Eir during Covid showing old matches have shone a light on many of the legendary hurling and football matches.
So many of these legendary games from the 80's and 90's were absolutely awful. Yes they were exciting finishes and in terms of heart and passion the players could not be faulted, but they were awful in terms of quality. Player intelligence and skill were scarce commodities, there was about 2-3 top class hurlers on every team and beyond that there was honest endeavour but an attitude of pull, wind and swing and ask questions later.
The real start of intelligent hurling came with the Cork team of the mid noughties, and in football with the Tyrone and Armagh teams. Before these teams came along, it was crash bang wallop.
This is by no means to insult those who won provincial or All-Ireland medals back then, but in my view GAA now is in a far better place than it was back then and while there were pulsating finishes to matches back then (and Ciaran Carey's point v Clare is still the best hurling point ever scored), these great moments of class very much paper over otherwise mundane games."
The same can be said for most sports to be fair
That's just the nature of the beast.
I'd argue that the Wexford team of 04 sort of reinvented the wheel out of nowhere.
Cork adopted a very similar game plan, but had better players so won 2 all Irelands.
That Ciarán Carey point was unreal, but my personal favourites are as follows :
Dj Carey vs Clare, 02 i think
Eoin Quigley vs kk in 05
Rory McCarthy vs Galway 96
Doylerwex (Wexford) - Posts: 1871 - 22/04/2022 17:20:23 2412333
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Replying To StoreysTash: "This is going to offend people of a certain age.
Tallowman GAA on YouTube and TG4/Eir during Covid showing old matches have shone a light on many of the legendary hurling and football matches.
So many of these legendary games from the 80's and 90's were absolutely awful. Yes they were exciting finishes and in terms of heart and passion the players could not be faulted, but they were awful in terms of quality. Player intelligence and skill were scarce commodities, there was about 2-3 top class hurlers on every team and beyond that there was honest endeavour but an attitude of pull, wind and swing and ask questions later.
The real start of intelligent hurling came with the Cork team of the mid noughties, and in football with the Tyrone and Armagh teams. Before these teams came along, it was crash bang wallop.
This is by no means to insult those who won provincial or All-Ireland medals back then, but in my view GAA now is in a far better place than it was back then and while there were pulsating finishes to matches back then (and Ciaran Carey's point v Clare is still the best hurling point ever scored), these great moments of class very much paper over otherwise mundane games."
I agree it's better to watch now, both football and hurling. Coaching and training and lifestyle for players pre-90s were unrecognisable to what it is now. But I wonder nowadays with coaching developments, nutrition, use of technology and/or S&C,longer season etc did players enjoy it more back then? Are players less willing to make the increasingly growing commitment to play intercounty football and hurling in comparison to pre 90s. And they could have a few pints mid-season without their business being shown on Snapchat.
GreenandRed (Mayo) - Posts: 6500 - 22/04/2022 18:04:26 2412337
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Its always annoyed me over the years when people go on about the good old days, how football is now terrible, and we need to go back to how it used to be played. The Dublin-Kerry rivalry of the seventies is held up as the ultimate golden age, but if we're being honest, its probably because people got to see it on TV and in colour.
The rivalry itself was almost as one sided as Dublin-Mayo in modern times, and the standard of football of football, through no fault of the players and coaches of the time, is poor compared to what we see today. The game has moved on, and will continue to evolve, which is a good thing.
petejoeduff (Donegal) - Posts: 329 - 22/04/2022 18:49:28 2412344
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Replying To StoreysTash: "This is going to offend people of a certain age.
Tallowman GAA on YouTube and TG4/Eir during Covid showing old matches have shone a light on many of the legendary hurling and football matches.
So many of these legendary games from the 80's and 90's were absolutely awful. Yes they were exciting finishes and in terms of heart and passion the players could not be faulted, but they were awful in terms of quality. Player intelligence and skill were scarce commodities, there was about 2-3 top class hurlers on every team and beyond that there was honest endeavour but an attitude of pull, wind and swing and ask questions later.
The real start of intelligent hurling came with the Cork team of the mid noughties, and in football with the Tyrone and Armagh teams. Before these teams came along, it was crash bang wallop.
This is by no means to insult those who won provincial or All-Ireland medals back then, but in my view GAA now is in a far better place than it was back then and while there were pulsating finishes to matches back then (and Ciaran Carey's point v Clare is still the best hurling point ever scored), these great moments of class very much paper over otherwise mundane games."
From a Tyrone prospective you are bang on the money. Only Micky came along we still would have been also rams.
Saynothing (Tyrone) - Posts: 1135 - 22/04/2022 19:03:48 2412349
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Replying To Saynothing: "From a Tyrone prospective you are bang on the money. Only Micky came along we still would have been also rams."
You couldn't pull the wool over Micky's eyes.
Cockney_Cat (UK) - Posts: 1658 - 22/04/2022 20:30:47 2412364
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Pensioners like me have largely given up on Gaelic football. It's now only for youngsters. I feel sorry for them as they have never had the chance to experience the kick/catch game which is what it was designed to be about. I would cross snow and ice to see the great players I remember from the fifties and sixties,but sadly "the game has moved on"
worple (Roscommon) - Posts: 303 - 22/04/2022 20:58:05 2412374
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Replying To Saynothing: "From a Tyrone prospective you are bang on the money. Only Micky came along we still would have been also rams."
Can say pretty much the same with ourselves and big Joe. He took training / coaching / use of data etc to a new level.
ardmhacha (Armagh) - Posts: 54 - 22/04/2022 21:34:57 2412384
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Hard to credit that people are saying football is better now than the previous century. Are people really that satisfied with the rugby league back passing like game we have now? The unwillingness to take a chance on your own skill and kick the ball back 20m when you are in a scoring position yourself?
I maintain the two most exciting things in gaelic football remain a kickout to centre field and a ball dropped high on the square. These don't suit the stats men that have blighted the game though.
Give me catch and kick anyday.
kentuckytucky (USA) - Posts: 162 - 23/04/2022 08:41:17 2412413
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Replying To kentuckytucky: "Hard to credit that people are saying football is better now than the previous century. Are people really that satisfied with the rugby league back passing like game we have now? The unwillingness to take a chance on your own skill and kick the ball back 20m when you are in a scoring position yourself?
I maintain the two most exciting things in gaelic football remain a kickout to centre field and a ball dropped high on the square. These don't suit the stats men that have blighted the game though.
Give me catch and kick anyday."
Unless you ban handpassing and backwards kicking you won't be seeing much of that again
Seanfanbocht (Roscommon) - Posts: 197 - 23/04/2022 11:13:53 2412442
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Replying To kentuckytucky: "Hard to credit that people are saying football is better now than the previous century. Are people really that satisfied with the rugby league back passing like game we have now? The unwillingness to take a chance on your own skill and kick the ball back 20m when you are in a scoring position yourself?
I maintain the two most exciting things in gaelic football remain a kickout to centre field and a ball dropped high on the square. These don't suit the stats men that have blighted the game though.
Give me catch and kick anyday."
The game did go through a serious rough patch for a decade or so with so many county and club sides obsessed with the safety first approach but I think you are describing the game as it was 7-10 years ago.
People are still complaining even though the game has obviously evolved and I think currently the game has the perfect blend. Skill levels are as high as they have ever been.
I would rather watch a division 3/4 game today that the best division 1 games from the 70s-90s.
Wally (Tyrone) - Posts: 805 - 23/04/2022 11:36:00 2412450
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Replying To Wally: "The game did go through a serious rough patch for a decade or so with so many county and club sides obsessed with the safety first approach but I think you are describing the game as it was 7-10 years ago.
People are still complaining even though the game has obviously evolved and I think currently the game has the perfect blend. Skill levels are as high as they have ever been.
I would rather watch a division 3/4 game today that the best division 1 games from the 70s-90s."
Tbh I watched a couple of div4 games this year and they weren't great Wally. I watched the AI final last year on TV in a bar in Limerick and it was a fantastic game. The semifinals also. While 2003 was very gritty 2005 and 2008 were good entertaining finals too.
Viking66 (Wexford) - Posts: 4431 - 23/04/2022 11:46:00 2412454
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Really enjoying hurling these days :)
skillet (Limerick) - Posts: 931 - 23/04/2022 12:05:43 2412456
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Always enjoy reading StoreysTach posts.
All I'll say is they were different times. The standing the GAA had in Ireland back then was different. People worked in different types of jobs and we didn't have technology like we do today. As a result management and coaching was not at the level it was now with a small number of expert people, often ex players. The GAA was slow to acknowledge other sports and usually did so through its own lens, eg the compromise rules series in 1984 which was interesting.
Nowadays coaches learn from each other, other sports and can access content within seconds on their phones or tablets. The best coaches challenge each other and are not afraid to innovate, perhaps see plans not work on big days but persevere with them until they beat fruition.
All that said those days of yesteryear were highly exciting. As a child watching the Limerick hurlers there was nothing like seeing Jimmy Carroll get on the ball out the field because we knew he would go directly to Joe McKenna on the edge of the square. It was a privilege to see players like Tony Doran play. These players seemed to be giants and in school we often mimicked things they did on the field of play. One thing to point out though - the level of training these guys did was huge. The sports science wasn't anything like today but the Kerry footballers who played under Mick O'Dwyer will tell of hours running in sand dunes to get to the level needed to play for Kerry.
Great times, but I do take your point. It all fits into a great history but some of the top level coaches in GAA now could probably work for major professional clubs given their education, talent and adaptability.
slayer (Limerick) - Posts: 6295 - 23/04/2022 12:26:06 2412461
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Replying To Viking66: "Tbh I watched a couple of div4 games this year and they weren't great Wally. I watched the AI final last year on TV in a bar in Limerick and it was a fantastic game. The semifinals also. While 2003 was very gritty 2005 and 2008 were good entertaining finals too."
Agree 2008 final was a good one but only if you were from kilkenny one of the most one sided finals ever.
Tiger1 (Wexford) - Posts: 79 - 23/04/2022 12:43:02 2412465
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Replying To Tiger1: "Agree 2008 final was a good one but only if you were from kilkenny one of the most one sided finals ever."
Was talking about the football finals in that post Tiger1. Nearly all the hurling games I ever watched from under 9 upwards were good games!!!!!
Viking66 (Wexford) - Posts: 4431 - 23/04/2022 14:03:20 2412484
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Replying To StoreysTash: "This is going to offend people of a certain age.
Tallowman GAA on YouTube and TG4/Eir during Covid showing old matches have shone a light on many of the legendary hurling and football matches.
So many of these legendary games from the 80's and 90's were absolutely awful. Yes they were exciting finishes and in terms of heart and passion the players could not be faulted, but they were awful in terms of quality. Player intelligence and skill were scarce commodities, there was about 2-3 top class hurlers on every team and beyond that there was honest endeavour but an attitude of pull, wind and swing and ask questions later.
The real start of intelligent hurling came with the Cork team of the mid noughties, and in football with the Tyrone and Armagh teams. Before these teams came along, it was crash bang wallop.
This is by no means to insult those who won provincial or All-Ireland medals back then, but in my view GAA now is in a far better place than it was back then and while there were pulsating finishes to matches back then (and Ciaran Carey's point v Clare is still the best hurling point ever scored), these great moments of class very much paper over otherwise mundane games."
Wrong on all counts.
Greengrass (Louth) - Posts: 5744 - 23/04/2022 14:27:51 2412488
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To be honest, watching these games back football is way better nowadays. Same with hurling particularly in the 70's and 80's was poor. Like how can the older generation no appreciate the skill levels involved in the current game.
The Dublin team in the last decade the talent they had Brogan, Connolly, Flynn, Mannion, McCarthy, Fenton, McCaffrey the list could go on and on were and are some of the most skilful and exciting players I would think to have ever played the game.
The skill levels are way higher particularly in the backs nowadays. Look at Tyrone's full back line last year, McKernan, McNamee and Hampsey could all go out and do a man marking job, but were able to come forward and kick important scores for their county.
Same with hurling but to be honest you don't really hear hurling people talking about the good auld days I think they probably understand that hurling is better nowadays.
CartaDubh (Clare) - Posts: 30 - 23/04/2022 15:50:51 24
I am not sure I agree Juvenille football is grand but some of these footballs matches today are awful 2 goalies stand on their 50 m line 28 players between these lines passing to & fro Hurlers score 30+++ Points no clashes or instinct left in game.
clooney (Clare) - Posts: 887 - 27/04/2022 11:33:52
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Replying To Galway9801: "The 2019 replay?
Wasn't a great game, a comfortable win for Dublin, and the keep ball tactics at the end rendered the final minutes almost unwatchable." The first half of that replay was outstanding. The second half was tight. After the early goal in the second half Kerry were playing catch up but they were never fully out of it until the closing stages. I agree that winding down the clock is hard to watch but I don't agree that the game wasn't great. The first half in particular was terrific. As I always say beauty is in the eye of the beholder and what someone feels about a match is entirely subjective.
Greengrass (Louth) - Posts: 6031 - 27/04/2022 14:14:18
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Replying To Greengrass: "The first half of that replay was outstanding. The second half was tight. After the early goal in the second half Kerry were playing catch up but they were never fully out of it until the closing stages. I agree that winding down the clock is hard to watch but I don't agree that the game wasn't great. The first half in particular was terrific. As I always say beauty is in the eye of the beholder and what someone feels about a match is entirely subjective." Didn't Dublin run up a big lead in the first 15/20? And stopped for a breather letting Kerry back into the game.
The second half after the goal was a case of just keep far enough ahead.
Seanfanbocht (Roscommon) - Posts: 1417 - 27/04/2022 14:51:07
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Replying To Galway9801: "The 2019 replay?
Wasn't a great game, a comfortable win for Dublin, and the keep ball tactics at the end rendered the final minutes almost unwatchable." That is what is always ignored, passing back and forth on your own 21 is not in any way entertaining, and it is something that didn't happen until this century. On this basis alone the game isn't as good as people think it is now. Large chunks of it are unwatchable, including last Sunday's Mayo v Galway
Leitrim_12 (USA) - Posts: 207 - 27/04/2022 15:22:29
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Replying To kentuckytucky: "That is what is always ignored, passing back and forth on your own 21 is not in any way entertaining, and it is something that didn't happen until this century. On this basis alone the game isn't as good as people think it is now. Large chunks of it are unwatchable, including last Sunday's Mayo v Galway" I'd hardly say it's ignored. Supporters have been complaining about lateral repetitive handpassing for a number of years now. I'll never forget the 2nd half of our 2019 Connacht Final against Roscommon, for all of the wrong reasons.
We spent the majority of it handpassing the ball over and back outside their 45 and attempting little else. If I remember rightly, we scored 1 point at the start of the half and another in injury time, with nothing in between.
At the same time, we'd also be complaining if players just belted the ball away and kept giving away possession. One point I'll always make is, if a team is winning and passing the ball around, it's up to the other team to push up and pressure them. There's no point sitting back and complaining afterwards. Dublin with only 14 men showed perfectly how this can be done at the end of the 2019 drawn final. They turned Kerry over 4 times in the last few minutes and actually wasted a few chances, before they kicked the equaliser.
WanPintWin (Galway) - Posts: 2040 - 27/04/2022 16:04:20
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Replying To kentuckytucky: "That is what is always ignored, passing back and forth on your own 21 is not in any way entertaining, and it is something that didn't happen until this century. On this basis alone the game isn't as good as people think it is now. Large chunks of it are unwatchable, including last Sunday's Mayo v Galway" Some games I have been at in recent years have been very bad to watch when I'm at the games. That evening when I have watched the highlight reel on TV they can look like great games, with a few good scores picked out. What you don't see is amount of time we have to look at monotonous handpassing (with the odd short foot pass thrown in) in front of packed defenses. We also get short kickouts to unmarked players. Often the crowd will be virtually silent as this goes on and on. Scoring rates may be higher now a days but the downside of the modern game more than makes up for these positives.
People talk about the skilful players we have now, the modern possession based game reduces the opportunities for skillful to use their football skills. The game now encourages hard running players rather than skilful players. We also hear the intelligence of the modern game, I'm not sure you need more intelligent players to play the game than in olden times. Nowadays players are programmed to play mostly short handpassing and play as a massed defense when the opposition have the ball. I don't think you need Einstein levels of intelligence to play this way.
bdbuddah (Meath) - Posts: 1349 - 27/04/2022 16:38:42
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Replying To bdbuddah: "Some games I have been at in recent years have been very bad to watch when I'm at the games. That evening when I have watched the highlight reel on TV they can look like great games, with a few good scores picked out. What you don't see is amount of time we have to look at monotonous handpassing (with the odd short foot pass thrown in) in front of packed defenses. We also get short kickouts to unmarked players. Often the crowd will be virtually silent as this goes on and on. Scoring rates may be higher now a days but the downside of the modern game more than makes up for these positives.
People talk about the skilful players we have now, the modern possession based game reduces the opportunities for skillful to use their football skills. The game now encourages hard running players rather than skilful players. We also hear the intelligence of the modern game, I'm not sure you need more intelligent players to play the game than in olden times. Nowadays players are programmed to play mostly short handpassing and play as a massed defense when the opposition have the ball. I don't think you need Einstein levels of intelligence to play this way." That's exactly it, just because you have a backroom team of 15-20 people with statisticians and video people, it doesn't make it any more appealing. Lads wearing gps trackers for God sake. What would the stats be for Jimmy Keaveney if he had one for example, he didn't need one, he scored on demand! Simple rule tweaks would make the game far more appealing, no short kick out, frees must be kicked forward, once you are in the attacking 45 you can't pass it back out of it etc.
Leitrim_12 (USA) - Posts: 207 - 28/04/2022 10:00:54
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Replying To Seanfanbocht: "Didn't Dublin run up a big lead in the first 15/20? And stopped for a breather letting Kerry back into the game.
The second half after the goal was a case of just keep far enough ahead." Eh no Dublin didn't run up a big lead in the first half and let Kerry back in to it. The largest lead in the half was four points. It was level at half time. Dublin went four ahead early in the second half. Kerry pulled it back to two. There was three points in it with eight to go. They were four up with two to go and it was from there that they wound down the clock. Put the whole package of the two games together and you get one of the greatest All Ireland finals hurling or football played in my lifetime.
Greengrass (Louth) - Posts: 6031 - 28/04/2022 17:05:47
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Nowadays GAA and before the noughties isn't worth comparing because they are like totally different sports. Before we can a more higher risk game it is now lower risk especially in the business end in football.
In the past i knew who was the best defenders and because they basically were one on one against forwards. Now all play with numbers back and the wing half forwards are expected to do as much defending as corner back.
Gaa_lover (USA) - Posts: 3347 - 28/04/2022 19:08:57
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I asked the question a couple of years ago What makes a good footballer today? You do not have to catch a high ball, You do not have to score from long range, You do not have to defend a man by yourself and you do not have to take on your marker as forward. I watched games recently and often went into the kitchen and made a cup of tea came back and missed nothing. I think the systems today are supressing the talent the players have today. They are incredible fit strong and I'am sure have great skills shame we rarely see what these players can do.
gatha (Kilkenny) - Posts: 318 - 28/04/2022 19:32:35
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Replying To Greengrass: "Eh no Dublin didn't run up a big lead in the first half and let Kerry back in to it. The largest lead in the half was four points. It was level at half time. Dublin went four ahead early in the second half. Kerry pulled it back to two. There was three points in it with eight to go. They were four up with two to go and it was from there that they wound down the clock. Put the whole package of the two games together and you get one of the greatest All Ireland finals hurling or football played in my lifetime." Galway team of 1998-2001 played great stuff, not sure what this discussion is even about
maroondiesel (Mayo) - Posts: 1196 - 28/04/2022 21:26:48
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Replying To Breffni40: "Those lads, legends though they are, weren't operating at the same pace as modern football. There are corner backs in todays game with a greater skillset than a lot of, pre 1990 say, forwards. There's no comparison and it's pointless making them" There comparisons as regards footballers. Take Cavan for example. The no present day footballer with the brain. Or engine or ability that Jim Reilly had in the 80s or Dmc Cabe had in the 90s. There not a man in Cavan present team could catch a ball in midfield like King could when there was no mark available. And there's not a goal poacher like Jason Reilly or Derek Mc Donald in the County either.
You have glorified basket ball players waiting for an opening. Standing where they are told to stand. Players in the 80s 90s were far more skilful though maybe not fitter than what's on the present Cavan team.
Breffni1969 (Cavan) - Posts: 510 - 29/04/2022 08:33:22
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