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That suggests that gaelic football has improved since the Noughties, if that is the case why then is it necessary to split the country into two groups of 16 one playing for the Sam Maguire cup and the bottom 16 playing in a new competition called the Tailteann Cup. Do you think the Tailteann Cup competition will help towards levelling the playing field.? Will we see the standards rise in the weaker counties and continue to rise. Will we see the day in the not too distant future where Croke Park can say, its now safe to dismantle the Tailteann Cup competition as the standards have risen and all 32 counties can safely play for the Sam Maguire again. The mystery of gaelic games to me is, why is the counties that were weak up to 80 years ago are more or less the same counties that are still weak today.? If we could solve that mystery there would be no need for the Tailteann Cup. supersub15 (Carlow) - Posts: 2907 - 23/04/2022 16:28:22 2412514 Link 4 |
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The mystery of Cavan's demise has never been properly explained I think, an Ulster superpower with was it five all irelands in the bag, and from the late sixties on you could count their Ulster titles on one hand. I think some of the counties have an inferior mindset. There's no reason overwhelmingly football counties like Leitrim and Longford can't be more competitive, there's practically no other sports to compete with gaelic football. I'd argue Longford if they were in Connacht would have more than one provincial title like they have in Leinster. Leitrim_12 (USA) - Posts: 207 - 23/04/2022 18:55:03 2412559 Link 0 |
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Agreed, they should be banned, along with fisted points, there's no footballing skill in that.
Leitrim_12 (USA) - Posts: 207 - 23/04/2022 18:57:02 2412560 Link 0 |
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They might have 2 like Leitrim or even 3 like Sligo!!. What was population of Cavan between 1933 and 1952? Seanfanbocht (Roscommon) - Posts: 1416 - 23/04/2022 19:48:57 2412581 Link 0 |
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Offaly 1994 to 1998 were an exceptionally skillful side 10 years before Cork. Young lad born 1998, my generation are great, tone to your post. We all thought like that when 24. Give you another 20 years and you might develop some nuance. Men were working hard in the fields with less mechanisation than today. No time for development squads or gym programmes. You need to learn a little about societal change. CC2020 (Kilkenny) - Posts: 173 - 23/04/2022 20:03:42 2412584 Link 3 |
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Well part of the reason behind Cavan's early success was they were playing in Ulster for a long time before the others actually joined on a requler basis. The Army, amongst other things, being based around the border also helped them as it kept fellas around. That's not the only reason behind it but I think it's part of it. oneoff (UK) - Posts: 1380 - 23/04/2022 20:22:56 2412588 Link 0 |
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Dublin beat Kerry in the All Ireland Final of 1976 and in the All Ireland semi Final in 1977 so it would be wrong to characterise the Dublin v Kerry rivalry of the 1970s as one sided in Kerry's favour.
endgame (Roscommon) - Posts: 2162 - 23/04/2022 21:05:38 2412608 Link 0 |
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Here's a question. If, for example, Pat Spillane were born 40 years later and were the same age now as he was in 1982, would he be playing now to a high degree as judged by 2020 standards? (If that makes sense) Tacaí Liatroma (Leitrim) - Posts: 1029 - 23/04/2022 21:08:50 2412611 Link 0 |
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Well it would be hard to break through the monopoly of the traditional big two in Connacht for sure. Population in Cavan declined to much less than what it is now during that period
Leitrim_12 (USA) - Posts: 207 - 24/04/2022 08:12:19 2412644 Link 0 |
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You've always got to look at who is saying the game is now better, or was better then. I don't mean individual opinions. I mean from the perspective of players, managers, or supporters. Players are far better: fitter, faster, stronger and most importantly much more intelligent when it comes to the usage of the ball. It is a far better game now for the players, hands down. Ironically, all those things that combine to make the game much better from a playing perspective, also contribute to it being a harder game for spectators to watch. The high ball in, is a sparsely used aspect of the modern game; far less 50-50 challenges, why give your teammate only a 50-50 chance when you can give him a 90-10 chance?; far less errors; far less giving the ball away to your opponent, etc. Many of the things that made the game more exciting, more human even, are gone. Hence, we have all this holding possession, side-ways, backwards; this "whatever you do, don't give it away" mentality", even this fear of giving the ball away. I couldn't watch that stuff, and rarely do. So yes, my overall analysis of Gaelic football, is that it is a far better game to play, but a far poorer game to watch. Hurling, I watch as often as I can. It has also evolved to a possession game, but evolved it has. Nowadays, big men like Gearoid Hegarty, Austin Gleeson, Padraig Walsh, etc. have the sublimes touches and wrist work that were once only the preserve of the likes of Eddie Keher, Jimmy Doyle or Eamonn Cregan. Every hurler on the pitch today needs to have speed (of both wrist and mind), skill, strength and stamina, like was never demanded in the game before. Hurling is a far more physical but also a far more intelligent game now, than it ever was before. And it is better than ever to watch. Looking back now on some of the old games, especially from the 70's and 80's, and even the 90's which has always been heralded as a golden era of the game, the game seems so pedestrian with what it is now. Back in those days hurlers had what seemed almost like a week to hit the ball; today, a mere few seconds. So yes, my overall analysis of hurling, is that it is a far better game to play, and also a far better game to watch. It's real battle now; survival of the fittest. Long may hurling continue. foreveryoung (USA) - Posts: 1910 - 24/04/2022 09:58:10 2412662 Link 1 |
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Football in the 1990's was very exciting, with a mixture of champions Ulsterchamps72 (Donegal) - Posts: 77 - 24/04/2022 10:11:28 2412667 Link 1 |
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Ah come on they were skillful, you have to take into account that the quality of pitches, hurls and sliotors which have improved. I was going through some of my hurls from 15 years ago and you could not use them today the boss was less than half the size. Even the rims on the ball back 20 years and it was way worse before that. Now most are school teachers which allows them so much time to prepare, gone are the days that someone can have a manual job and play, I think fintan Burke is the only player on the Galway team with a trade. Most are nearly school teachers or students. But hurling was a better spectacle back a few years ago. Im not a great fan of all the hand passing it's very controlled now and somewhat less exciting. Players are afforded more steps now and also the tackle has changed, the free arm tackle would be pulled up alot more back then. But they are very skillful now and I do really enjoy the games I just don't think it is better to watch now imo.
ecad123 (Galway) - Posts: 272 - 24/04/2022 11:15:26 2412684 Link 1 |
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That's a very good point Supersub15. Whatever about the ebb and flow of fortunes and players etc and counties having successful periods flowed by leaner times, why have some counties only ever had leaner times? I don't think changing structures etc is addressing what must be pretty core problems.
Viking66 (Wexford) - Posts: 11841 - 24/04/2022 12:34:22 2412704 Link 0 |
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I think the Troubles played a part also. From the late 60s onwards the GAA became a way for young lads in the "occupied" 6 counties of Ulster to express their Nationalism.
Viking66 (Wexford) - Posts: 11841 - 24/04/2022 12:37:05 2412705 Link 0 |
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It puzzles me that no player now worple (Roscommon) - Posts: 339 - 24/04/2022 12:53:38 2412712 Link 0 |
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Yes. He was a terrific footballer. Comparison between the generations always has to be qualified by the improvements in fitness and nutrition. I've attended 54 All Ireland Senior Football Finals and 50 All Ireland Senior Hurling Finals. I've seen all the great players of the past performing on the biggest stage, The great players and teams of the past were great in their own era. That is as much as they could be. Those contests and competitions were very eagerly awaited and were thoroughly enjoyed in their time. Both games have evolved and whether or not they are better spectacles is entirely subjective. However it is complete nonsense to say that Gaelic Games were terrible before the noughties.,
Greengrass (Louth) - Posts: 6031 - 24/04/2022 13:35:46 2412719 Link 4 |
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Superb post. I'd advise anyone to listen to someone with this much experience of attending Gaelic games. Respect! slayer (Limerick) - Posts: 6480 - 24/04/2022 13:55:43 2412722 Link 0 |
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As one of the better posters around here, I am surprised at your post. It is ridiculous to compare players/play from different decades & to imply that players & play nowadays are more intelligent is insulting. I have seen decades of games at all levels & you have to factor in many facets, such as societal change, food & drink/nutrition, gear, equipment, access to the outside world, education, socio economic growth. Young people nowadays with Broadband, MSM, mobile phones, laptops, cheap air travel, top class nutrition, state of the art pitches, clubhouses, gyms, healthcare, access to coaching techniques from around the world, gear & equipment think it was always the same. We are a nation that had a famine, saw mass emigration, poverty, no toilets in most homes, food shortages, low socio economic growth, eras where there was no air travel or prohibitively prices, very little contact with the outside world as post was the main means of communication. The education system was not what it is today but nonetheless people were smart, we all have relations who left in the 30's/40's some with no formal education & some who went as far as 6th class, yet they became engineers, teachers, business people in other countries when afforded the chance to progress themselves. A young guy now with a massive hurl & light sliotar & top class boots & gear & conditioning can drive the thing 80 mtrs but put him in the old gear & boots with older hurl & sliotar & he will struggle. Progress is perception at the particular time, I watch some football games now & really they are no better than 30 years ago, despite the improvements in everything. One thing for certain that has changed is the enjoyment factor, players & fans & volunteers were all in it together & enjoyed it. Nowadays people are in it for what they can gain from it & the advent of professionalism has taking the enjoyment out of it. It is now having a direct link & effect on the mental health of many young people who feel under pressure & unfortunately many of those take their own lives. You could debate forever over who is/was the best but it is all relevant. Players such as Sean Purcell, Mikey Sheehy, Maurice Fitzgerald we're legends of the game & would be in any era. So it's insulting to those who have gone before to insult them in such a lazy manner without making allowances for where we have come from in every part of life, as a Nation.
moc.dna (Galway) - Posts: 1212 - 24/04/2022 14:11:36 2412725 Link 1 |
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And then in the 80s you had seriously talented teams apart from Kerry and Dublin in Monaghan, Meath, Cork, Offaly, Mayo. Matt Connor and Colm O'Rourke were gifted.
Leitrim_12 (USA) - Posts: 207 - 24/04/2022 14:16:22 2412726 Link 0 |
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Thank you slayer. I think we are blessed to have two great games that we can enjoy.
Greengrass (Louth) - Posts: 6031 - 24/04/2022 16:07:45 2412753 Link 1 |