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Replying To SurelyToGod: "Dungloe's man Aaron Ward handled McGroddy, Murphy with ease on their way to the senior final and did a great job on NOD in the final. If their successes over the last two years in league and championship haven't caught the eye of Jim then I don't know what will.
Odhran McFadden-Ferry must be absolutely flying in training considering Ward and Curran were completely off Jim's radar this season. Haven't seen anything on the pitch since he went away to believe that he's a better defender." I suppose the league next spring will be informative. Hopefully we'll see a few players in action.
Lockjaw (Donegal) - Posts: 9954 - 31/07/2025 16:36:53
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the focus on McCole and Clifford is a bit strange to me. He did about as well as you could hope. But David Clifford is frankly unmarkable 1 on 1. He will do what he wants. McCole won a few battles and lost a few others. 2023 is a good comparison - look at the shots Clifford was missing that day compared to what he was scoring on Sunday. And every shot right over the black spot.
You do what you can and McCole is an excellent full back and man marker, but Clifford really is the wrong focus to me.
I also think the overall focus on the defence is a bit wrong. Of course there's tweaks and adjustments but I don't think we need to unearth a bunch of Karl Lacey types and move to man on man marking (as amazing as it would be to have even one Lacey).
At the end of the day in that first quarter, we couldn't get our hands on the ball and got cleaned out in midfield. We gifted some soft ball to Kerry which was ruthlessly punished. We looked lethargic at times and didn't engineer space for 2 point attempts. We didn't have a single attempt on goal all game. Without our hands on the ball we didn't get our attacking momentum going at all. 19 points wasn't enough to win games this year outside of the Mayo game at the Hyde - and we missed some big goal chances in that game. Every other time we hit 19 or lower, we lost.
Kerry have to be credited with a sensational performance with and without the ball. Any time we were slightly off or made a small mistake, we were severely punished - I don't think we faced a standard like Kerry brought once all year long, and it showed.
CCFabu (Donegal) - Posts: 274 - 31/07/2025 16:50:12
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On the club scene, Meath's Cian McBride has transferred to Downings.
Caoimhin Marley back for glenswilly too
donegalgael-12 (Donegal) - Posts: 21 - 31/07/2025 16:59:33
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Replying To totalrecall: "A bitter Louth supporter....known for bitterness as a tyrone referee can attest to. Clearly you haven't been to many Donegal games to see how freely players give their time to children at the final whistle. A fantastic goup, fantastic role models who don't need an Ireland title to cement their greatness to Donegal fans. The reception the squad got in Pettigo and Donegal town is vindication of what this Donegal team means to the people of Donegal. I wouldn't expect someone from outside the county to get it.
Some of the rubbish being posted by Kerry fans and other fans around the country in the wake of Donegals defeat is shameful. I wonder if Kerry had lost what kind of reception would have they have got in the self proclaimed kingdom,?? If any?" You post some rubbish kerry yourself. All sides have some fans that do I didn't see any credit give to jack or kerry yourself suppose a donegal fan as well.
Sour grapes they won they didn't lose though so hypothetical.
Yes soem kerry fans I egy maybe animals but same somebody begrudgers still out
Gaaforlife2023 (Longford) - Posts: 856 - 31/07/2025 17:18:44
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Replying To Lockjaw: "McCole also did well when direct ball went into Clifford. There was one instance in the second half particularly when a ball was fired in and McCole came out on top." Yeah he really didn't do a bad job. Was an incredibly selfless role requiring a lot of concentration and discipline. I do think he could have done better for the 2 pointer before half time. He was too tight and the problem is that there was no pressure on the pass at all. Paudie could literally wait and wait for David to make his move and once he got the yard on McCole its a simple fist pass and he gets the shot away. If there's pressure on the ball carrier the timing of that pass becomes a lot more difficult and a second delay or the pass not being perfect gives McCole a chance to get back but with no pressure it was too easy. Its up to McCole and the next line of defense to recognise that quicker and adjust. There were a few other similar occasions where the player on the ball just had to wait and wait for Clifford to make the space and then give him the ball - its an impossible challenge to defend a player that good when the timing of the pass isn't a variable.
benjyyy (Donegal) - Posts: 1444 - 31/07/2025 17:18:49
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Replying To naomh_conaill_4: "Two Theories about the final:
Theory 1.
PmB should not have led the team around on the parade. I realise he is our captain but if you watch the domineer of Gavin white. he is marching his team into battle make sure he is leading from the front. Whereas we have a sub leading us and it also doesn't give much belief in your vice captain. I believe if we had of put Michael Langan leading us around it would of put more confidence in Langan were he would know he is our leader from the start. Or even imagine if we stuck Murphy up there and everyone behind looking up at him at the front they would know we have our real leader leading us into battle.
Theory 2.
The 2 pointer was such a dagger and was such a crucial score for Kerry and Clifford.
Why not have a forward run back before the hooter causing a 13 metre free to Kerry meaning they would only have got 1 point but we would have the restart and could work up a 2 pointer effort ourselves or wait until after the hooter and give them the 1 point free. Clifford's two pointer was more than a two pointer as the whole team galloped of that field knowing the had us by the throat.
Just my 2 cents and I know loads of Ifs and Buts, but that's what hind sight is for after all." I don't agree with the first point. McBrearty's the captain, and it's a 20-man game. Honestly, we wouldn't even be in the final if he hadn't shown the leadership to get McGuinness back. And I thought it was brilliant that the whole panel got into the team photo at the start - it's only our fourth final ever, the group worked damned hard to get there and that photo matters. Win or lose it's something to cherish.
On the second point, what frustrated me most was the build-up to the two pointer. There were two minutes left, we'd got it back to five - just slow it down and make sure Donegal get the last play of the half. Instead, we handed it straight to the keeper. Can't afford mistakes like that. And unfortunately we did it a lot this year.
Ulsterchamps_32 (Donegal) - Posts: 924 - 31/07/2025 18:50:35
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Is Patton going for surgery on the ankle? Will he miss club ?
Whyme923 (Donegal) - Posts: 54 - 31/07/2025 21:30:10
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Replying To benjyyy: "Yeah he really didn't do a bad job. Was an incredibly selfless role requiring a lot of concentration and discipline. I do think he could have done better for the 2 pointer before half time. He was too tight and the problem is that there was no pressure on the pass at all. Paudie could literally wait and wait for David to make his move and once he got the yard on McCole its a simple fist pass and he gets the shot away. If there's pressure on the ball carrier the timing of that pass becomes a lot more difficult and a second delay or the pass not being perfect gives McCole a chance to get back but with no pressure it was too easy. Its up to McCole and the next line of defense to recognise that quicker and adjust. There were a few other similar occasions where the player on the ball just had to wait and wait for Clifford to make the space and then give him the ball - its an impossible challenge to defend a player that good when the timing of the pass isn't a variable." Great point . Paudie has too much time. Clifford's role was interesting. He gave up his game you could say for the team . He wandered out and let the rest take control and popping up when needed! If my notes are correct. He had ten possessions which resulted in 9 points. When you look at it like that he was willing to give up his game for the team.
Whyme923 (Donegal) - Posts: 54 - 31/07/2025 23:04:13
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Replying To naomh_conaill_4: "Two Theories about the final:
Theory 1.
PmB should not have led the team around on the parade. I realise he is our captain but if you watch the domineer of Gavin white. he is marching his team into battle make sure he is leading from the front. Whereas we have a sub leading us and it also doesn't give much belief in your vice captain. I believe if we had of put Michael Langan leading us around it would of put more confidence in Langan were he would know he is our leader from the start. Or even imagine if we stuck Murphy up there and everyone behind looking up at him at the front they would know we have our real leader leading us into battle.
Theory 2.
The 2 pointer was such a dagger and was such a crucial score for Kerry and Clifford.
Why not have a forward run back before the hooter causing a 13 metre free to Kerry meaning they would only have got 1 point but we would have the restart and could work up a 2 pointer effort ourselves or wait until after the hooter and give them the 1 point free. Clifford's two pointer was more than a two pointer as the whole team galloped of that field knowing the had us by the throat.
Just my 2 cents and I know loads of Ifs and Buts, but that's what hind sight is for after all." Well Theory 2 wouldn't have worked because they could have brought that 1 pt free back out for a 2 point free if a forward ran back..
donegalgael-12 (Donegal) - Posts: 21 - 31/07/2025 23:07:23
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Replying To benjyyy: "Yeah he really didn't do a bad job. Was an incredibly selfless role requiring a lot of concentration and discipline. I do think he could have done better for the 2 pointer before half time. He was too tight and the problem is that there was no pressure on the pass at all. Paudie could literally wait and wait for David to make his move and once he got the yard on McCole its a simple fist pass and he gets the shot away. If there's pressure on the ball carrier the timing of that pass becomes a lot more difficult and a second delay or the pass not being perfect gives McCole a chance to get back but with no pressure it was too easy. Its up to McCole and the next line of defense to recognise that quicker and adjust. There were a few other similar occasions where the player on the ball just had to wait and wait for Clifford to make the space and then give him the ball - its an impossible challenge to defend a player that good when the timing of the pass isn't a variable." Yep I think Clifford was averaging 9.5 points per game coming into final, McCole kept him to9 (which is good going considering 3 x 2pts) but that score conceded needs to come down big time going forward to impact scoreboard.
How that's done, I do not know.
ahsure. (Galway) - Posts: 1745 - 01/08/2025 02:25:38
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Replying To CCFabu: "the focus on McCole and Clifford is a bit strange to me. He did about as well as you could hope. But David Clifford is frankly unmarkable 1 on 1. He will do what he wants. McCole won a few battles and lost a few others. 2023 is a good comparison - look at the shots Clifford was missing that day compared to what he was scoring on Sunday. And every shot right over the black spot.
You do what you can and McCole is an excellent full back and man marker, but Clifford really is the wrong focus to me.
I also think the overall focus on the defence is a bit wrong. Of course there's tweaks and adjustments but I don't think we need to unearth a bunch of Karl Lacey types and move to man on man marking (as amazing as it would be to have even one Lacey).
At the end of the day in that first quarter, we couldn't get our hands on the ball and got cleaned out in midfield. We gifted some soft ball to Kerry which was ruthlessly punished. We looked lethargic at times and didn't engineer space for 2 point attempts. We didn't have a single attempt on goal all game. Without our hands on the ball we didn't get our attacking momentum going at all. 19 points wasn't enough to win games this year outside of the Mayo game at the Hyde - and we missed some big goal chances in that game. Every other time we hit 19 or lower, we lost.
Kerry have to be credited with a sensational performance with and without the ball. Any time we were slightly off or made a small mistake, we were severely punished - I don't think we faced a standard like Kerry brought once all year long, and it showed." We have problems with our defence since the mc gees retired. It's defenders like eamon and Neil that we need. Good footballers but no nonsense at the same time. We can beat most teams at the moment but to go a step further that's what I feel were missing.
rorysboys (Donegal) - Posts: 2660 - 01/08/2025 07:56:31
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Replying To rorysboys: "We have problems with our defence since the mc gees retired. It's defenders like eamon and Neil that we need. Good footballers but no nonsense at the same time. We can beat most teams at the moment but to go a step further that's what I feel were missing." definitely agree we could do with one or two more like that generally, but really I was talking more about the defensive set up, I don't think the zone needs to be done away with completely
CCFabu (Donegal) - Posts: 274 - 01/08/2025 09:55:55
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Replying To donegalgael-12: "On the club scene, Meath's Cian McBride has transferred to Downings.
Caoimhin Marley back for glenswilly too" I believe Cian's father is from Downings is that right?
CCFabu (Donegal) - Posts: 274 - 01/08/2025 10:19:16
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Replying To CCFabu: "definitely agree we could do with one or two more like that generally, but really I was talking more about the defensive set up, I don't think the zone needs to be done away with completely" Yea agree but apart from mc Cole we're not producing defenders like say Jason foley.mike breen etc big imposing defenders who are also mobile. Most of our defenders are small pacy who like to attack but who are not comfortable in 1 to 1. I know the zonal system has its merits but good footballers like kerry have, will work round it..
rorysboys (Donegal) - Posts: 2660 - 01/08/2025 10:27:40
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Replying To WeGoAgain: "You're right enough in all that. Every one is entitled to their opinion but there's plenty with the knives out for Donegal now over stupid stuff. There's a lad who's fairly prominent on twitter posting up the parade business instead of just enjoying the celebrations. The same fella is on plenty of other forums and is also over on the mayo blog sticking the boot into McGuinness revelling in the fact he's been "found out". I just find it all a bit pathetic and I certainly would have better things to be doing if we'd just won Sam. The same boy bleating on about "respect " didn't mention the kerry team continuing their warm up during the memorial section which in my book is a lot worse than cutting a parade short." There is a lot of resentment towards Jim McGuinness and Donegal, a lot of Counties see themselves as higher up the football pecking order to Donegal or some cases they wish they were, and others from top Counties hate hearing widespread praise for McGuinness and how he is held in such high esteem.
Generally people don't attack others like this unless they feel threatened or insecure, so that probably tells us something.
Commodore (Donegal) - Posts: 1452 - 01/08/2025 10:28:13
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Replying To Mousie34: "Hi Commodore, you are kind of reinforcing my point - of course Patton wasen't dropping the ball in top of Joe O'Connor [that would just be daft but if you seen that Joe O'Connor was being mobile switch it up. I think after the second one didn't work it should of been switched up, I don't think you need instruction from the side line to tell you that. It's a bit late at half time to get to grips with it. I was chatting to a family member of the squad before the match and he was telling me that the noise in Croker it is hard to hear the man beside you even! I don't think I'm being too critical, maybe I am, but as I said it is just my analysis of the season and thoughts for the future. Hopefully there will be lessons learnt, but I just can't see them bouncing back next year - hopefully I'm wrong though, I would gladly eat my words!! Whatever the storey is they will have my 100% support..."]Ok, well I get your logic, but I think the issue was with the outfield players, not Patton.
If you watch out the field when Patton is about to kick out, he looks around for a hand signal, different players hand signal to him to show they are open or space near them is open and he kicks then.
A lot of players didn't signal until it was too late, he was scanning the field before lining up his kick and numerous times I could see that nobody was signalling, Eventually a few of them would signal, but by then it was too late.
Commodore (Donegal) - Posts: 1452 - 01/08/2025 10:35:40
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My only issue with going for more out and out defenders is we could end up robbing Peter to pay Paul. Throughout the year and in build up to the game, one of our major strengths always referenced was our ability to get scores from anywhere, 10-12 different scorers per game. In the 2 games we lost this year, on Sunday we had 6 scorers and against Tyrone 5 scorers. I would have a fear if we were to replace 2 attack minded defenders with 2 out and out defenders, the lower spread will happen more often and it would require Gallen and COD to go to another level to make up the deficit.
While I agree more traditional defenders are needed in the 11v11, It definitely feels like a double edged sword.
Donegalexile (Donegal) - Posts: 5 - 01/08/2025 10:43:24
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Replying To Commodore: " Replying To Mousie34: "Hi Commodore, you are kind of reinforcing my point - of course Patton wasen't dropping the ball in top of Joe O'Connor [that would just be daft but if you seen that Joe O'Connor was being mobile switch it up. I think after the second one didn't work it should of been switched up, I don't think you need instruction from the side line to tell you that. It's a bit late at half time to get to grips with it. I was chatting to a family member of the squad before the match and he was telling me that the noise in Croker it is hard to hear the man beside you even! I don't think I'm being too critical, maybe I am, but as I said it is just my analysis of the season and thoughts for the future. Hopefully there will be lessons learnt, but I just can't see them bouncing back next year - hopefully I'm wrong though, I would gladly eat my words!! Whatever the storey is they will have my 100% support..."
If you watch out the field when Patton is about to kick out, he looks around for a hand signal, different players hand signal to him to show they are open or space near them is open and he kicks then.
A lot of players didn't signal until it was too late, he was scanning the field before lining up his kick and numerous times I could see that nobody was signalling, Eventually a few of them would signal, but by then it was too late."]A point I always thought was interesting was from Jim Gavin's training sessions. The dubs used to play A versus B in the buildup to a big game at Croke Park, but they weren't allowed to talk during the session, with the point being that you won't be able to hear each other on All Ireland final day so you need to be able to read your team mates body language etc
papa_pump (Donegal) - Posts: 88 - 01/08/2025 11:09:50
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Replying To CCFabu: "I believe Cian's father is from Downings is that right?" I wonder would Jim pull him into the county set up? He was far off the Meath starting XV and had AFL experience as well. Looking forward to seeing him in the club championship.
peiledoir20 (Donegal) - Posts: 1300 - 01/08/2025 11:18:38
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Replying To peiledoir20: "I wonder would Jim pull him into the county set up? He was far off the Meath starting XV and had AFL experience as well. Looking forward to seeing him in the club championship." His father is from Downings but I'd say he'll still play for Meath
donegalgael-12 (Donegal) - Posts: 21 - 01/08/2025 11:25:04
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