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Replying To leitrim4sam: "I think one of the major reasons that smaller sided games were done away with at underage level, and the reason that people wanted to push back to 15 a side games- is that our underage players were getting far too much time on the ball and too comfortable on the ball in non pressure situations.
What I mean by that is as a smaller sided game is played on a full sized pitch, our players grew up accustomed to no pressure on the ball and lots of time and space available to them without this pressure. When did then went up against 15 a side , they were completely not used to the way that that game was played. They were lost at sea with less of space available to them, and less time also.
Players who seem like good players at under 16 and minor level , lording it over the field in our underage club games, we are completely lost at intercounty level when they went up against other players used to playing in a pressure environment and who could move the ball quicker to get out of such pressure situations, as they were used to playing like this.
Whilst I agree smaller sided games can improve touch and skill levels. The ability to play under pressure in the modern game is huge, especially against mass defences when time and space is very limited.
There are so many problems with underage football and general club football in Leitrim currently, and we are so far behind others I don't know where the answers lie. However I think the answer lies somewhere within improving the standard of club football in Leitrim in all ages- clubs training their players to a high level from a very young age up. When The county then picks the best players from the club game to play for them, we are getting a quality player in every position that has all the skills, fitness, intelligence and talent to succeed" That is certainly a pit fall from having small sided games but overall with coaching that can be fixed. There is a huge amount of great ball players that came through small sided games where they have a far better appreciation of space and knew how to avoid contact which now is the most important skill you need at inter County level where swarming defences inevitably turn over the ball. Plus the mix of carrying and exploitation of space by utilising the kick pass never mind the one v one scenarios being a great schooling for youngsters. Time has proven the push for 15 a side football has reduced our playing pool and in all honesty a huge drop in standards.
bananapublican (Leitrim) - Posts: 878 - 13/05/2022 10:05:30
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Replying To threebogs: "There's a lot of talk about underage football etc here. What I see being a major problem is the larger towns having amalgam teams with neighbouring rural parishes. I think that should be stamped out anyway." Oh i agree. A wonderful point- it is ridiculous
makingaskitawans (Leitrim) - Posts: 2 - 13/05/2022 12:18:23
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Let me pose the question based on recent opinons expressed here.
If improving the club football standard coupled with long form S&C and a renewed focus on underage development are the three main ingredients for long term Senior I/C success, how do we improve the standard of club football at adult level in Leitrim?
Framing last weekend's result in the context of Ballinamore coming within a kick of a ball of the Mountbellew / Moylough last winter.
- Questions to consider
How soon does Senior need to be reduced to 8 teams?
Do we need Junior / Inter sides like Cloone / Aughavas / Eslin or Carrigallen / Drumreilly or 'Glera / Glenfarne amalgamating to play in the Senior Championship?
Should we play 1 League that has rounds with / without county players instead of this Spring League which is essentially the old 'Shield' Competition by another name?
Dodgy_Pass (Leitrim) - Posts: 373 - 13/05/2022 12:24:04
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Replying To Dodgy_Pass: "Let me pose the question based on recent opinons expressed here.
If improving the club football standard coupled with long form S&C and a renewed focus on underage development are the three main ingredients for long term Senior I/C success, how do we improve the standard of club football at adult level in Leitrim?
Framing last weekend's result in the context of Ballinamore coming within a kick of a ball of the Mountbellew / Moylough last winter.
- Questions to consider
How soon does Senior need to be reduced to 8 teams?
Do we need Junior / Inter sides like Cloone / Aughavas / Eslin or Carrigallen / Drumreilly or 'Glera / Glenfarne amalgamating to play in the Senior Championship?
Should we play 1 League that has rounds with / without county players instead of this Spring League which is essentially the old 'Shield' Competition by another name?" 8 senior teams is all we have really unless we start including amalgamation's.A senior championship with 8 competitive teams would be much better than what we have atm.It would make the intermediate more competitive too.
masseyferguson (Leitrim) - Posts: 96 - 13/05/2022 12:49:17
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Our underage has been neglected for far too long for me- inept coaches out of their depth with very little knowledge on the thing. We could try and import some coaches from other counties maybe to bring in their expertise and I mean at underage level- I cannot think of one good underage manager we have had at county level in the past twenty years.
We need someone who can develop the whole county underage set up, so a minor manager who has input into under 13, u15 etc and not have all individuals doing different things. Not one manager we have had over the past twenty years has had the foresight or wherewithal to do this- just people who filled a gap for a year or two taking heavy beatings along the way and then went onto manage clubs teams as they were an "ex county manager".
Why can't we import a good coach from Roscommon, Mayo, galway to oversee underage development and quit this messing of getting in managers for the county senior set up when it obviously is not and will not work. Get the big names in but lower down the ladder.
makingaskitawans (Leitrim) - Posts: 2 - 13/05/2022 13:22:36
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Replying To Dodgy_Pass: "Let me pose the question based on recent opinons expressed here.
If improving the club football standard coupled with long form S&C and a renewed focus on underage development are the three main ingredients for long term Senior I/C success, how do we improve the standard of club football at adult level in Leitrim?
Framing last weekend's result in the context of Ballinamore coming within a kick of a ball of the Mountbellew / Moylough last winter.
- Questions to consider
How soon does Senior need to be reduced to 8 teams?
Do we need Junior / Inter sides like Cloone / Aughavas / Eslin or Carrigallen / Drumreilly or 'Glera / Glenfarne amalgamating to play in the Senior Championship?
Should we play 1 League that has rounds with / without county players instead of this Spring League which is essentially the old 'Shield' Competition by another name?" I'd say those clubs would want to stave off amalgamations for as long as possible. Yes there should only be eight senior teams, and those should play each other in the normal league and another league for the championship with top four going on to semi finals.
threebogs (Leitrim) - Posts: 2 - 13/05/2022 13:51:37
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Replying To bananapublican: "Square B by an even minded view of where Leitrim are this year I can think of 6 positives;
1) Far better buy in from the best players to the squad.
2) conditioning on some of the players is far better than last year(doesn't necessarily legislate an improvement of a players impact)
3) a lot of players tried out.
4) youth and future seems to longterm thinking in the selection.
5) up to aftermath of London game, extremely positive vibe from the camp (which unfortunately came a cropper with a certain players individualistic outlook)
6) we went toe to toe for 20 minutes against oms of the stronger teams, other years game was gone from us at that stage.
7) the tradition of 1 v1 is gone in the GAA even now in hurling. Andy has played around with different sweepers but there was a much stronger sense of an attack plan added this year even if results were mixed.
Patience I stress is lacking in our county. We have an exaggerated sense of our standing within the sport. Most counties if asked to rank us would place us between 26th and 28th in Ireland. To expect a sudden transformation within 6 months from Andy Moran or any coach is making the same mistake we have done over and over again. U17s draw gives optimism as did the fighting spirit of u20s but not a conveyor belt of Clifford's coming through. Next years League and Championship is really when we can judge Andys impact. Give the man a chance and have realistic targets for him." I'm not expecting miracles, never have, but it's clear that Moran is very nieve manager... expecting that we'd go toe to toe with Galway is utter madness. He even said afterwards himself that he underestimated our ability to do that. This is not a job for learning the ins and outs of county management. However what I do expect is promotion and in my opinion, that is not something beyond this team despite everyone saying otherwise. You points 1-4 are hardly really positives... you'd expect that from any new management team and indeed Hyland before him did all those things. We'll see what happens in 2023....
Square_B (Leitrim) - Posts: 844 - 13/05/2022 14:51:35
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I think it was an article in the Irish Examiner I read a few years ago saying that young Kerry footballers under the age of 21 play up to 30+ games a season. Is there an argument that the lack of games is holding back our teams. This a senior club footballer in Leitrim is only guaranteed 16 games a season. Of this 5 our in the spring league which to date seems to be treated as a friendly competition. Kerry has more intermediate and junior players on there county panel then any other county. Obviously I'm not comparing our own circumstances with Kerry there population and large playing pool are the clear disparities. But surely there are 1-2 junior players or a few intermediate players that could add some value to the county panel.
The likes of Seamus Sweeney for example. For years people have said that he should be on the county panel . I'm not arguing whether or not he should be. But how are players like him expected to improve to even be near a county panel when they are only playing Junior football.
I think a second senior championship should be explored . Following a similar model to Kerry. Keep the League and our usual club championship. But then at the back end of the year have a championship with regions. You'd keep the top 6 clubs in the county (for example Manor, Mohill, Bmore, St Marys, Fenagh, leitrim village) and then add 4-5 regional teams. In doing this you could see the best of the Junior footballers playing with players at there level and against players of there level. I understand this would take a lot to acc work because of the rivalry between neighbouring clubs but if it could be done I believe it would greatly improve the county team and the standard of players throughout the county. The debate on who to put in each region alone would cause a civil war.
Another option would be to talk to Longford county board on setting up a cross border league like there is at underage. This is a more likely option. It would bring more games and have teams playing other teams at there own level. You only have to look at annaduff being in the division 1 league this year. No disrespect to them but going out against the likes of Mohill, Ballinamore and getting hammered is to no benefit of anyone. This idea shouldn't be alien to many players as this competition has been running at underage for a few years.
Maybe my solutions aren't what we need but what we do need is more games and more competitive games for our senior and underage clubs to help improve our county team. That at least everyone can agree on.
southleitrim_mafia (Leitrim) - Posts: 110 - 13/05/2022 15:02:27
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Replying To Square_B: "I'm not expecting miracles, never have, but it's clear that Moran is very nieve manager... expecting that we'd go toe to toe with Galway is utter madness. He even said afterwards himself that he underestimated our ability to do that. This is not a job for learning the ins and outs of county management. However what I do expect is promotion and in my opinion, that is not something beyond this team despite everyone saying otherwise. You points 1-4 are hardly really positives... you'd expect that from any new management team and indeed Hyland before him did all those things. We'll see what happens in 2023...." This is not a job for learning the ins and outs of county management.
em no... but for him... yes.
This is a stepping stone for him, with perhaps a step to a division 3/2 county before getting a shot with mayo..
he does not expect to stay with us long term unless we manage b2b promotions, not completely out of question- look at Louth and Limerick, 2 teams we have beaten in the recent past.. but if we played them in 2 weeks, they would likely beat us by 8 -10 points, as would any top div 3/bottom div 2 team.
he has improved us, but not enough to warrant stayin around post 2023 unless there is a good bit more improvement.
he deserves at least another year to see what happens, i didn't like how the likes of Sean O'H and Shane W were only given a year before shown the door, though it may just have been a personal realization on their part of the demands of the job at hand
gaelsboy (Leitrim) - Posts: 457 - 13/05/2022 15:12:45
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Leitrim in the northern section can draw one of
Antrim
Fermanagh
Down
Sligo
London
Longford
Cavan
In Mondays draw. Best possible draw for Leitrim would be getting London, worse would be Cavan.
Gaa_lover (USA) - Posts: 3338 - 13/05/2022 17:46:37
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Does the Tailteann Cup have a group stage next year?
Tacaí Liatroma (Leitrim) - Posts: 1029 - 14/05/2022 16:51:41
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Replying To Tacaí Liatroma: "Does the Tailteann Cup have a group stage next year?" Yes.
Gaa_lover (USA) - Posts: 3338 - 14/05/2022 18:28:44
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Replying To Square_B: "I'm not expecting miracles, never have, but it's clear that Moran is very nieve manager... expecting that we'd go toe to toe with Galway is utter madness. He even said afterwards himself that he underestimated our ability to do that. This is not a job for learning the ins and outs of county management. However what I do expect is promotion and in my opinion, that is not something beyond this team despite everyone saying otherwise. You points 1-4 are hardly really positives... you'd expect that from any new management team and indeed Hyland before him did all those things. We'll see what happens in 2023...." Hyland did all those things at the start of his tenure but by the end had most lads jumping ship. That's what Andy faced in trying to get lads back in to the fold. There of course will be a certain amount of inexperience with Andy at first but like his playing career I expect him to learn fast.
bananapublican (Leitrim) - Posts: 878 - 16/05/2022 08:58:58
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Antrim at home in the Tailteann Cup, a competition that the Gaa have managed to kill before it even got started, which is quite an achievement.
3rdmidfielder (Australia) - Posts: 294 - 16/05/2022 11:20:33
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Expect Pairc Sean will be a sell out for the Antrim game. Lack of home games is understandably one of the biggest issues among supporters of Leitrim. In fairness a home game v Antrim should be within the grasp of Leitrim. Ye will have learned from the galway game and surely Keith will be starting for this. Best of Luck...
Keephimthere (Roscommon) - Posts: 97 - 16/05/2022 11:27:00
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Replying To 3rdmidfielder: "Antrim at home in the Tailteann Cup, a competition that the Gaa have managed to kill before it even got started, which is quite an achievement." What's wrong with it? It was never going to be perfect but people like to complain. It's a great chance to play teams at your level with a realistic chance of getting to Croker or winning it
williesboy (Leitrim) - Posts: 340 - 16/05/2022 12:04:28
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Replying To Keephimthere: "Expect Pairc Sean will be a sell out for the Antrim game. Lack of home games is understandably one of the biggest issues among supporters of Leitrim. In fairness a home game v Antrim should be within the grasp of Leitrim. Ye will have learned from the galway game and surely Keith will be starting for this. Best of Luck..." No need for smart comments on any forum belittling other counties. Grow up and stop going onto other county pages pretending to be someone who you are not and saying you expect "a sell out" when you know well it will not be.
It is obvious WUM stuff from you and you should stop this behaviour as it belittles the good people in GAA who are doing their best.
howdareu (USA) - Posts: 220 - 16/05/2022 12:47:21
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Replying To williesboy: "What's wrong with it? It was never going to be perfect but people like to complain. It's a great chance to play teams at your level with a realistic chance of getting to Croker or winning it" Whats wrong with it? What's right with it? They have changed the format of it before it started. Making it up as they go along. I am in favour of a tiered championship but they have ruined this before it started.
3rdmidfielder (Australia) - Posts: 294 - 16/05/2022 14:39:24
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Leitrims two matches against Antrim under Hyland was a home win and a 1 point loss in Belfast
With home advantage this is opportunity for Leitrim to progress, failure to do so will prove Leitrim have regressed under Andy Moran.
Gaa_lover (USA) - Posts: 3338 - 16/05/2022 14:39:45
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Replying To 3rdmidfielder: "Antrim at home in the Tailteann Cup, a competition that the Gaa have managed to kill before it even got started, which is quite an achievement." I thought the draw produced fairly even matched draws in fairness, this being one. Look it's the Tommy Murphy Cup Mark 2 however with a few changes it could be a competition to win. I still think there should be a way back into the All Ireland proper for the winners... perhaps a Quarter Final spot itself. The qualifiers itself should probably be a group league type competition, 3 groups of 4 and the winner of each group qualify for the Quarters along with the winner of the Tailteann Cup. It needs something extra or it will just go the way of the Tommy Murphy Cup.
Square_B (Leitrim) - Posts: 844 - 16/05/2022 14:50:39
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