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Replying To Whammo86: "I think 5 from 8 division 1 teams making the playoffs is too soft of a standard. I also agree that the 4 division structure is bad for teams development. Is why I'd favour the old NFL style competition of 2 tiers of 2 groups of 8. I think you'd only want 2 or at a push 3 from each section moving forward to the playoffs. I think the 4 provinces of 8 was only solving the calendar issue and wasn't very good at getting teams playing more matches at their own level. It didn't address quality issues between provinces either. From the sounds of things there's little support for it." I like the 2x (2x8) as well, because in theory, the 6th ranked team and above should all advance (unlike the 4-div format, where the top 11 advance except for 6 to 8). As I like the KO matches, I'd want a wider playoff field than yours. omahant (USA) - Posts: 3100 - 30/09/2021 19:19:12 2383848 Link
Replying To omahant: "I like the 2x (2x8) as well, because in theory, the 6th ranked team and above should all advance (unlike the 4-div format, where the top 11 advance except for 6 to 8). As I like the KO matches, I'd want a wider playoff field than yours." I just think having 56 matches to only eliminate 4 teams is excessive. You'd be in danger of reducing 80% of your championship to a tickle fight in favour of adding 6 more knockout games to include teams that probably aren't deserving of being in the hunt. Whammo86 (Antrim) - Posts: 4416 - 01/10/2021 10:17:18 2383920 Link
Replying To omahant: "I like the 2x (2x8) as well, because in theory, the 6th ranked team and above should all advance (unlike the 4-div format, where the top 11 advance except for 6 to 8). As I like the KO matches, I'd want a wider playoff field than yours." I like the 1A / 1B/ 2A / 2B format as well particularly if this is to be the only show in town. I'd have 12 teams qualify for the knockouts in both tiers with provincial champions guaranteed spots in the Sam Maguire knockout. Those would be a couple of changes to Proposal B - but it wouldn't be overly radical. In a few years after we see how the Champions league is working to have more games among the top teams and more games in general we can have a proposal to merge 1A & 1B into a similar structure and allow every team to have at least 10 games. I also don't know why Bonus points are not thought of in GAA. We have suggestions to increase the value of a goal to 4 or more points - but surely in the league structure a bonus point for 3 goals would have a similar impact along with a bonus point for a narrow defeat? brianb (Kildare) - Posts: 401 - 01/10/2021 10:45:37 2383925 Link
Replying To bernardmessi: "Div 1and 2 in first bowl Div 3 and 4 in second bowl One from fist bowl plays one from second bowl Winner gets through to top tier Games could be played as a bumper weekend all over the country to kick start the champo 16 one off knock out games to decide who plays for Sam and who plays for second tier Leaves 4 groups of 4 for each competition 3 games per team with top 2 qualifying for knockout quarter final Good knock out games at start of championship and gud knock out fair at the end It's a very fair system as well" Nearly similar to what I suggested above, it's all about giving lower counties more games. Saynothing (Tyrone) - Posts: 2249 - 01/10/2021 11:34:28 2383938 Link
Replying To brianb: "I like the 1A / 1B/ 2A / 2B format as well particularly if this is to be the only show in town. I'd have 12 teams qualify for the knockouts in both tiers with provincial champions guaranteed spots in the Sam Maguire knockout. Those would be a couple of changes to Proposal B - but it wouldn't be overly radical. In a few years after we see how the Champions league is working to have more games among the top teams and more games in general we can have a proposal to merge 1A & 1B into a similar structure and allow every team to have at least 10 games. I also don't know why Bonus points are not thought of in GAA. We have suggestions to increase the value of a goal to 4 or more points - but surely in the league structure a bonus point for 3 goals would have a similar impact along with a bonus point for a narrow defeat?" There is room for more than 7 group games even with Provincials being played in advance. Whammo86 (Antrim) - Posts: 4416 - 01/10/2021 11:52:57 2383942 Link
Ulster Chief Slams GAA's Proposed New Format Of Gaelic Football Championship https://www.balls.ie/gaa/ulster-chief-gaa-championship-structure-486353 Ban (Westmeath) - Posts: 1467 - 01/10/2021 12:51:23 2383949 Link
Replying To Ban: "Ulster Chief Slams GAA's Proposed New Format Of Gaelic Football Championship https://www.balls.ie/gaa/ulster-chief-gaa-championship-structure-486353" He would wouldn't he? Seanfanbocht (Roscommon) - Posts: 2092 - 01/10/2021 15:26:41 2384020 Link
Replying To Ban: "Ulster Chief Slams GAA's Proposed New Format Of Gaelic Football Championship https://www.balls.ie/gaa/ulster-chief-gaa-championship-structure-486353" Two things caught my eye. Complaining about teams losing 3 or 4 games and facing relegation. That's how it should be. Also, round robin in provinces is a bad idea and will just lead to more uneven games. GAA made a mistake by sticking with provinces all those years ago. Every other sport opted for national system right from the start. Rolo2010 (Donegal) - Posts: 746 - 01/10/2021 15:51:59 2384029 Link
There needs to be a back door for the likes of Mayo v Galway and Cork v Kerry and Ulster where good teams don't get a second chance with Dublin walking through Leinster at their ease. Maybe a rule where girls can play on some Leinster teams to bring them on. Saynothing (Tyrone) - Posts: 2249 - 01/10/2021 16:20:17 2384038 Link
Replying To Rolo2010: " Replying To Ban: "Ulster Chief Slams GAA's Proposed New Format Of Gaelic Football Championship https://www.balls.ie/gaa/ulster-chief-gaa-championship-structure-486353" Two things caught my eye. Complaining about teams losing 3 or 4 games and facing relegation. That's how it should be. Also, round robin in provinces is a bad idea and will just lead to more uneven games. GAA made a mistake by sticking with provinces all those years ago. Every other sport opted for national system right from the start." There's some sense to what he's saying. Is the league the championship or is it not. What's the point of the Tailteann cup. Why does a relegated division 3 team winning the Tailteann cup deserve promotion to division 2 at the expense of the second placed team in division 3. With does a division 4 team winning Tailteann cup not deserve a place in division 2. It's this problem of trying to create a championship for weaker teams but also shoehorning them into the main championship. Just have 2 tiers and just do a normal promotion/relegation competition rather than trying to please everyone. Whammo86 (Antrim) - Posts: 4416 - 01/10/2021 18:58:03 2384065 Link
Replying To Whammo86: "I just think having 56 matches to only eliminate 4 teams is excessive. You'd be in danger of reducing 80% of your championship to a tickle fight in favour of adding 6 more knockout games to include teams that probably aren't deserving of being in the hunt." There's a bit of misunderstanding here - I meant 6th ranked overall (as in 4-divs) - that team could be 3rd in it's group if there was 2x (2x8) - I do think 12 of 16 advancing would be excessive (although I like 2x5). Maybe ideally, after the 2x (2x8) leagues, I'd have the top 4 in each Tier 1 group advancing to Aussie AFL-style playoffs - top 2 in each getting a 2nd chance provides incentive - crossover 1st Rd pairings (A1st v B2nd, B1v A2 & A3vB4, B3vA4). For Tier 2, have identical playoffs. Or better - merge Tier 2 top 8 (2x4) with Tier 1 bottom 8 (2x4) for a Super 16 Tier 2 Championship instead (again, AFL-style for incentive, Tier 2 both top 2s & Tier 1 both 5ths & 6ths get the backdoor). The QF 8 (or, SF 4 plus 2 highest placed non-SF teams from each League go or stay up for the following year's Tier 1 League). omahant (USA) - Posts: 3100 - 02/10/2021 16:30:37 2384162 Link
Replying To omahant: "There's a bit of misunderstanding here - I meant 6th ranked overall (as in 4-divs) - that team could be 3rd in it's group if there was 2x (2x8) - I do think 12 of 16 advancing would be excessive (although I like 2x5). Maybe ideally, after the 2x (2x8) leagues, I'd have the top 4 in each Tier 1 group advancing to Aussie AFL-style playoffs - top 2 in each getting a 2nd chance provides incentive - crossover 1st Rd pairings (A1st v B2nd, B1v A2 & A3vB4, B3vA4). For Tier 2, have identical playoffs. Or better - merge Tier 2 top 8 (2x4) with Tier 1 bottom 8 (2x4) for a Super 16 Tier 2 Championship instead (again, AFL-style for incentive, Tier 2 both top 2s & Tier 1 both 5ths & 6ths get the backdoor). The QF 8 (or, SF 4 plus 2 highest placed non-SF teams from each League go or stay up for the following year's Tier 1 League)." Still think the one I prefer is play league, then Provincials, then open draw 32 county championship. None of this tier stuff. If they use provincials then back door has to come into play. Every team gets their second matchwood complicate things with this A3 v A4 stuff. We don't need any AFL style anything. Saynothing (Tyrone) - Posts: 2249 - 02/10/2021 16:39:41 2384163 Link
Replying To brianb: "I think if we're going to go for a second tier it should be a second tier. The prize for winning is promotion to the top tier. The way you become a top tier county by consistent good performance against other tier 2 counties over the year. Similarly you become a tier two county by consistently bad performances against other tier 1 counties over the year. The ideas of running a shield type competition with nothing really at stake might be good for player development but will never have the same knock-out edge where something meaningful is at stake. Proposal B would become a lot more palatable to me if you introduce a middle tier competition as well and drop the parachuting of Division 3 & 4 teams into the knockout. The All Ireland 1/4 finals would be: Senior - Top 5 in DIv 1 & Top 3 in Div 2 Intermediate - 6/7/8 Div 1 + 4/5/6 Div 2 & 1 Div 3A & Div 3B Junior - All other teams (last 16) Then the next years league will have had the usual promotion / relegation but with the 6th place team replaced by the winners of the tier just below. So Div 1 - Top 5 & Top 2 Div 2 & Intermediate Winner Div 2 - 6/7/8 Div 1 + 3/4/5 Div 2 & 1 Div 3A & 1 Div 3B + Junior Winner - Intermediate winner Div 3A & 3B - All other teams I'd still prefer the provincial champions to get a path into the main competition - it could be done by changing the seeding - e.g. allow any unqualified provincial winners in (via a playoff if necessary) at the expense of 3rd Place team in Div 2 but that could likely lead to uncertainty in the calendar." I really like that. You'd probably want to ensure that an unlikely Div 2 3rd AI Champ goes up too. Merging in Prov Champs wouldn't make it too messy - Div 2 top 3 (and an extremely unlucky Div 1 5th) are all on notice that a Tier 2 Championship beckons if lower placed teams win their Provs. I still feel 2x (2x8) gives more teams access to top competition - the 4x8 is a bit elitist the top. Good Job ! omahant (USA) - Posts: 3100 - 02/10/2021 16:46:07 2384165 Link
Replying To Saynothing: "Still think the one I prefer is play league, then Provincials, then open draw 32 county championship. None of this tier stuff. If they use provincials then back door has to come into play. Every team gets their second matchwood complicate things with this A3 v A4 stuff. We don't need any AFL style anything." You seem to know. omahant (USA) - Posts: 3100 - 02/10/2021 17:29:37 2384174 Link
Replying To Saynothing: "Still think the one I prefer is play league, then Provincials, then open draw 32 county championship. None of this tier stuff. If they use provincials then back door has to come into play. Every team gets their second matchwood complicate things with this A3 v A4 stuff. We don't need any AFL style anything." Yours doesn't work practically. Antrim lose in the first round in Ulster at the start of April, what are the players doing for the 6 weeks before they're out for their All Ireland first round match. Takes 9 rounds to play your competition. Guarantees 2 games for counties only but including rest weeks would take around 14 weeks to run off. It's just not a good use of time and doesn't meet the want of players for more matches and a better season. Whammo86 (Antrim) - Posts: 4416 - 03/10/2021 09:50:21 2384208 Link
Replying To Whammo86: "Yours doesn't work practically. Antrim lose in the first round in Ulster at the start of April, what are the players doing for the 6 weeks before they're out for their All Ireland first round match. Takes 9 rounds to play your competition. Guarantees 2 games for counties only but including rest weeks would take around 14 weeks to run off. It's just not a good use of time and doesn't meet the want of players for more matches and a better season." Took Tyrone ten in 2015, what's your point. Since when did first round of Ulster begin at the start of April? You talk about doing nothing for 6 weeks, get some club football played. You'd think Antrim would be happy with open draw 32 team knockout. Saynothing (Tyrone) - Posts: 2249 - 03/10/2021 13:27:02 2384230 Link
Replying To Saynothing: "Took Tyrone ten in 2015, what's your point. Since when did first round of Ulster begin at the start of April? You talk about doing nothing for 6 weeks, get some club football played. You'd think Antrim would be happy with open draw 32 team knockout." You know there's a split season now. To fit in an Ulster championship before an All Ireland that needs to be completed by the end of July you'd need the Ulster championship to start in April. The game has moved on from a straight knockout format for the championship and the needs of the players just aren't met by your preference. Whammo86 (Antrim) - Posts: 4416 - 03/10/2021 15:06:34 2384248 Link
Replying To Whammo86: "You know there's a split season now. To fit in an Ulster championship before an All Ireland that needs to be completed by the end of July you'd need the Ulster championship to start in April. The game has moved on from a straight knockout format for the championship and the needs of the players just aren't met by your preference." Split season is rubbish. Back to the old road with All Ireland late September or later for that matter. As Spillane says, All Ireland at the end of July let other sports get a free run at it. Game has moved on you think, only in some counties. Saynothing (Tyrone) - Posts: 2249 - 03/10/2021 16:06:42 2384261 Link
Can"t believe Donegal wants to play out 3rd year of Super 8 trial - we are getting nowhere. omahant (USA) - Posts: 3100 - 03/10/2021 16:19:05 2384270 Link
Replying To omahant: "Can"t believe Donegal wants to play out 3rd year of Super 8 trial - we are getting nowhere." Super 8s were the way to go, USA don't have to worry about them. Saynothing (Tyrone) - Posts: 2249 - 03/10/2021 17:25:09 2384279 Link