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Decouple Provincial Champ In Football From All Ireland

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Keep the provinces in football but play them in spring. Start with a blank canvas for designing the football All Ireland championship. Teams split into divisions based on their ability with knockout phase and promotion/relegation. centerfield (Mayo) - Posts: 360 - 11/07/2021 15:36:10 2358603 Link
Replying To centerfield: "Keep the provinces in football but play them in spring. Start with a blank canvas for designing the football All Ireland championship. Teams split into divisions based on their ability with knockout phase and promotion/relegation." Separate them from the all ireland but no need to play them all in their entirety before the all ireland championship is played. you dont see soccer clubs play fa cup or league cup or champions league in their entirety before or after the premier league. KillingFields (Limerick) - Posts: 3513 - 11/07/2021 17:28:42 2358662 Link
Replying To KillingFields: "Separate them from the all ireland but no need to play them all in their entirety before the all ireland championship is played. you dont see soccer clubs play fa cup or league cup or champions league in their entirety before or after the premier league." Yeah and the FA Cup has died a death as a result. There's plenty that the GAA do wrong but having the secondary competition played in advance of the main competition is actually the right thing to do. Whammo86 (Antrim) - Posts: 4241 - 11/07/2021 18:37:26 2358717 Link
Replying To Whammo86: "Yeah and the FA Cup has died a death as a result. There's plenty that the GAA do wrong but having the secondary competition played in advance of the main competition is actually the right thing to do." FA cup died for lot of other reasons. playing other competitions one after the other has done little to get other teams to occasionally surprise the top teams though and a change where the league is played in its entirety before championship either provincial or all ireland even starts is ridiculous KillingFields (Limerick) - Posts: 3513 - 11/07/2021 20:23:25 2358745 Link
Replying To Whammo86: "Yeah and the FA Cup has died a death as a result. There's plenty that the GAA do wrong but having the secondary competition played in advance of the main competition is actually the right thing to do." The FA Cup was always played during the league season and it never did it any harm, its slow demise beginning only after 1999 in my opinion when treble champions Man Utd were pressured into not defending their title in order to swan off to Brazil ("I hope they get diarrhoea" - Brian Clough) to play in FIFA's new club world cup. I still think it has oodles of merit. They need to keep the final though to the weekend after the Premier League finishes. I'm sure winning it this season and doing the double would have been a massive deal for Man City, rather than losing to Chelsea. And then Leicester City went and won it after four final defeats! A good shot in the arm for the FA Cup. Tacaí Liatroma (Leitrim) - Posts: 1046 - 11/07/2021 20:39:09 2358751 Link
The GAA have created a monster. And as long as some counties operate at a professional level and some at an amateur level then the gap will widen. I listen to GAA pundits all the time and they offer the usual platitudes but then they are always from strong football counties who probably want to maintain the status quo. Why can't the GAA invest in the counties who need assistance in terms of coaching, expert advice, psychology etc as oppose to fringe changes and tinkering around the edges. wicklowsupport (Wicklow) - Posts: 1916 - 11/07/2021 21:29:42 2358776 Link
Replying To Tacaí Liatroma: "The FA Cup was always played during the league season and it never did it any harm, its slow demise beginning only after 1999 in my opinion when treble champions Man Utd were pressured into not defending their title in order to swan off to Brazil ("I hope they get diarrhoea" - Brian Clough) to play in FIFA's new club world cup. I still think it has oodles of merit. They need to keep the final though to the weekend after the Premier League finishes. I'm sure winning it this season and doing the double would have been a massive deal for Man City, rather than losing to Chelsea. And then Leicester City went and won it after four final defeats! A good shot in the arm for the FA Cup." It's a distraction from the main competition and teams don't prioritise it. The same would 100% happen in the GAA. There is precedent for it in the hurling in the early 90s the league was played in parallel to the All Ireland and it didn't work at all. Whammo86 (Antrim) - Posts: 4241 - 11/07/2021 22:04:51 2358792 Link
Replying To Whammo86: "Yeah and the FA Cup has died a death as a result. There's plenty that the GAA do wrong but having the secondary competition played in advance of the main competition is actually the right thing to do." The FA cup died a death for entirely different reasons. if it was played in its entirety before the league started or very early on in season its demise would be far greater KillingFields (Limerick) - Posts: 3513 - 11/07/2021 23:03:16 2358806 Link
Replying To wicklowsupport: "The GAA have created a monster. And as long as some counties operate at a professional level and some at an amateur level then the gap will widen. I listen to GAA pundits all the time and they offer the usual platitudes but then they are always from strong football counties who probably want to maintain the status quo. Why can't the GAA invest in the counties who need assistance in terms of coaching, expert advice, psychology etc as oppose to fringe changes and tinkering around the edges." You are so correct Wicklow. I have argued this for a long time but thegaa are only interested in the big boys and invest to make profit. Some think money does nt natter. Of course it matters. If a county has money it can have all their best players playing as they can compensate them for travel missing work etc. Also have the best coaches food gym memberships physios massuers medical care and so on. I know a few ex County footballers that gave up playing for their counties as it was costing them money to play. They were working in Dublin and playing for weaker counties. Now that does nt happen with Dublin Cork Galway Kerry etc. The gaa don't need to pump money into Dublin. They need to pump it into the small counties who don't have big financial backing. Help them with coaches and make sure their best players that are available to them are not out of pocket. OK the gaa might not get much in return financially but in the long term everyone gains. CiarraiMick (Dublin) - Posts: 3680 - 11/07/2021 23:50:36 2358815 Link
The problem won't be solved by giving the county boards money or better coaching. Counties like Leitrim simply don't have the population to facilate a successful county team. obviously Dublin with it's huge population is in the catbird seat (I do not advocate for nor do I want Dublin broken up). What i think might help would be an almagation of some weaker counties. It has worked at the club level so why not try it at county level. Can't see much else working cluichethar (Mayo) - Posts: 454 - 12/07/2021 01:48:57 2358830 Link
Replying To wicklowsupport: "The GAA have created a monster. And as long as some counties operate at a professional level and some at an amateur level then the gap will widen. I listen to GAA pundits all the time and they offer the usual platitudes but then they are always from strong football counties who probably want to maintain the status quo. Why can't the GAA invest in the counties who need assistance in terms of coaching, expert advice, psychology etc as oppose to fringe changes and tinkering around the edges." I agree the GAA could invest in some things in the weaker counties in both hurling and football but it still is up to the weaker counties to make the breakthrough themselves. Since the 90s Derry, Donegal, Armagh, Tyrone etc have won their 1st all Ireland titles. Counties like Down and Galway won again after many years. None of these counties got massive central funding allocated. There are 14 more counties that are yet to win it. I dont think anyone could say they will never win it as it took some counties over a hundred years to win it the 1st time. And some of the counties that have never won it are fairly populous and well off so it's not just about money or population. Viking66 (Wexford) - Posts: 12101 - 12/07/2021 07:26:28 2358836 Link
The GAA could be so much better. It all comes down to provincial councils caring more about the progression of the game more than their own importance. Ban (Westmeath) - Posts: 1415 - 12/07/2021 08:33:59 2358841 Link
Replying To Ban: "The GAA could be so much better. It all comes down to provincial councils caring more about the progression of the game more than their own importance." If you separate the Provincial Champions from the All Ireland Championship they will mean nothing. It will effectively kill off the game in counties like Limerick and indeed your own. where a Provincial victory, at certain times, might be a realistic asperation, but an outright All Ireland success would be highly unlikely. Oldtourman (Limerick) - Posts: 4344 - 12/07/2021 09:52:08 2358868 Link
Replying To cluichethar: "The problem won't be solved by giving the county boards money or better coaching. Counties like Leitrim simply don't have the population to facilate a successful county team. obviously Dublin with it's huge population is in the catbird seat (I do not advocate for nor do I want Dublin broken up). What i think might help would be an almagation of some weaker counties. It has worked at the club level so why not try it at county level. Can't see much else working" Well that's the point in that because of Leitrim small population they need every player they have to play. Some of their better players don't bother because they are out of pocket playing for their county. It's the poorer counties that need money the most. CiarraiMick (Dublin) - Posts: 3680 - 12/07/2021 09:54:20 2358873 Link
Replying To Oldtourman: "If you separate the Provincial Champions from the All Ireland Championship they will mean nothing. It will effectively kill off the game in counties like Limerick and indeed your own. where a Provincial victory, at certain times, might be a realistic asperation, but an outright All Ireland success would be highly unlikely." The main competition in Gaelic Football is knock-out with all teams are involved, regardless of their level. No other self respecting sport in the world is set-up like this! Ban (Westmeath) - Posts: 1415 - 12/07/2021 11:51:39 2358942 Link
Replying To KillingFields: "The FA cup died a death for entirely different reasons. if it was played in its entirety before the league started or very early on in season its demise would be far greater" The FA Cup is dying for a lot of reasons and I agree if it were a preseason competition it'd be worse. The thing is though it highlights that teams only care about their main competitions. Having the secondary competitions played in parallel with the championship would be a disaster. There's only 1 show in town in the GAA and it's the championship. It was the 97 hurling league that was played in parallel to the Championship. Tipperary were in the semifinals of the league and played a weakened team in that semifinal to prioritise the championship final. What good is that to anyone where a team pretty much forfeits a latter stage game in a competition. It just completely devalues it. In recent years in hurling the Ulster championship died because Down and Derry were prioritising the tiered All Ireland competition. In football this year some of the National league finals weren't played to not interfere with the opening rounds of the championship. For the good of secondary competitions in the GAA they should be wrapped up before the main event. Whammo86 (Antrim) - Posts: 4241 - 12/07/2021 12:05:25 2358952 Link
Replying To Whammo86: "The FA Cup is dying for a lot of reasons and I agree if it were a preseason competition it'd be worse. The thing is though it highlights that teams only care about their main competitions. Having the secondary competitions played in parallel with the championship would be a disaster. There's only 1 show in town in the GAA and it's the championship. It was the 97 hurling league that was played in parallel to the Championship. Tipperary were in the semifinals of the league and played a weakened team in that semifinal to prioritise the championship final. What good is that to anyone where a team pretty much forfeits a latter stage game in a competition. It just completely devalues it. In recent years in hurling the Ulster championship died because Down and Derry were prioritising the tiered All Ireland competition. In football this year some of the National league finals weren't played to not interfere with the opening rounds of the championship. For the good of secondary competitions in the GAA they should be wrapped up before the main event." In recent years players from weaker Counties have left for the states come Championship. I'm not sure its all about the Championship for everyone any more. Everyone loves the league. Its competitive and you have a good measure of where you are. The All-Ireland is the GAA. Combine the two and the constant moaning may go away. Leave as is, there's a fair chance nothing will go away only players and fans! Ban (Westmeath) - Posts: 1415 - 12/07/2021 13:21:20 2358987 Link
Replying To centerfield: "Keep the provinces in football but play them in spring. Start with a blank canvas for designing the football All Ireland championship. Teams split into divisions based on their ability with knockout phase and promotion/relegation." Be careful what you wish for. Look at what Jim McGuinness said on Sky on Saturday night about the provincial championships . Greengrass (Louth) - Posts: 6031 - 12/07/2021 13:43:38 2358996 Link
Replying To Greengrass: "Be careful what you wish for. Look at what Jim McGuinness said on Sky on Saturday night about the provincial championships ." That's only Jim McGuinness' personal opinion though and I doubt very much it's a reflection of what the general public feel. There is a much stronger case to be made for overall reform, which is long overdue. AfricanGael (UK) - Posts: 1947 - 12/07/2021 13:54:59 2359004 Link
Replying To Greengrass: "Be careful what you wish for. Look at what Jim McGuinness said on Sky on Saturday night about the provincial championships ." The Ulster championship is the only competitive one.The rest are not competitive. Change is needed more for the weaker counties than the strong counties. ifindoubt (Donegal) - Posts: 133 - 12/07/2021 14:01:02 2359005 Link