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Come On Engerland.....Peoples' Views???

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Replying To BarneyGrant: "Will Leitrim be taking the kneel later on, to go with the political jersey?" Have you seen our results? We've been on our knees for years :D Tacaí Liatroma (Leitrim) - Posts: 1045 - 11/07/2021 10:58:10 2358504 Link
Replying To AfricanGael: "Look at Croatia, with a population of only about 4 million, made it to the World cup final only 3 years ago, or Uruguay who got to four World cup finals and won two when their population was less than two million or Denmark who won the Euros in 1992 with no preparation knocking out the holders Holland in the semi finals and beating then beating the World Champions Germany in the final. Irish kids need to be given every opportunity to compete with the best of them on the European and World stages and I don't that's the case at the moment, what's holding them back is the national psyche as much as anything else. Everyone can dream of playing beautiful football and winning, even Tyrone." Soccer is always a poor relation in any country that has a superior team ball game(s): Ireland, US, Canada, New Zealand, South Africa etc.. FAI hoping to entice the best players away from hurling or football is like hoping that someone trained in classical music will start a rap group. BarneyGrant (Dublin) - Posts: 2588 - 11/07/2021 11:06:01 2358507 Link
Replying To AfricanGael: "Look at Croatia, with a population of only about 4 million, made it to the World cup final only 3 years ago, or Uruguay who got to four World cup finals and won two when their population was less than two million or Denmark who won the Euros in 1992 with no preparation knocking out the holders Holland in the semi finals and beating then beating the World Champions Germany in the final. Irish kids need to be given every opportunity to compete with the best of them on the European and World stages and I don't that's the case at the moment, what's holding them back is the national psyche as much as anything else. Everyone can dream of playing beautiful football and winning, even Tyrone." Hi, good post and you're correct to some extent; I've also mentioned this same thing on another post. What you're missing out though, is the countries you mention particularly Croatia and Urugury as to be fair Denmark do have a lot of winter sports, is these countries are soccer mad and almost exclusively soccer. Think of a GAA field in every community in Ireland, you might not have facilities like that in every area of those countries as the GAA is unique but you would have significant soccer coaches, facilities, pathways to develop soccer players from a young age up to a decent standard. If soccer run like the GAA did in Ireland and the GAA didn't exist Ireland could be a world player in soccer. We spend our resources, time, coaching on a large scale in developing All Ireland winners, as well as players to keep our games going; and for us that love the GAA we're happy with that. We'd be naive not to acknowledge the success of the GAA does hinder us in other international sports though; but at the same time the FAI haven't exactly been the most progressive over the last 20 years and so much money that could have went on developing pathways got wasted. As soccer goes we're right back to pre Charlton days and it's going to take a lot of will, finance and luck to make us anyway competitive in the next 20 years. Soccer might throw up good era's now and again but Ireland is a GAA country, and that will always be the priority for most on the island and hopefully that continues. Croata etc are constantly working on keeping golden era's with little other distractions, that is the big difference. sam1884 (UK) - Posts: 999 - 11/07/2021 11:22:29 2358513 Link
Replying To AfricanGael: "Look at Croatia, with a population of only about 4 million, made it to the World cup final only 3 years ago, or Uruguay who got to four World cup finals and won two when their population was less than two million or Denmark who won the Euros in 1992 with no preparation knocking out the holders Holland in the semi finals and beating then beating the World Champions Germany in the final. Irish kids need to be given every opportunity to compete with the best of them on the European and World stages and I don't that's the case at the moment, what's holding them back is the national psyche as much as anything else. Everyone can dream of playing beautiful football and winning, even Tyrone." The achievements of Denmark, Uruguay, and Croatia were dreams within the realms of the wildly possible since soccer would be far and away the no.1 sport in all these countries. Here GAA is no. 1 so dreaming of emulating those country's feats in international soccer is in the realm of fantasy. A better comparison would be a country like Wales where rugby is no. 1. They reached a European semi final.....for us to have even mild hopes of equalling that we would first need to unearth a couple of players of the calibre of Giles, Brady, Paul McGrath and have a number of good quality Premiership level players alongside them. Or if Rice and Grealish had stuck with us....... PoolSturgeon (Galway) - Posts: 1907 - 11/07/2021 11:33:24 2358518 Link
I think there are many reasons and explanations why so many Irish people support English clubs. First of all I don't buy into this idea that it's because the league of Ireland is so poor, that's nonsense. For me the main reason is the mass emigration of the past, I don't think it's a coincidence that the English clubs who still attract the most Irish support are Liverpool and Manchester United, two areas where many Irish emigrants settled. Support for these clubs was handed down from father to son and so, even when the emigrants returned home. It's very common to see very young kids wearing a Liverpool or Man Utd top in Ireland, they didn't choose it but their dad did, and on it goes. It's no different than politics in Ireland, the truth is that the vast majority of young voters have always voted for the party that their parent/s voted for. The GAA's historical fear of football may also be a contributory factor in some way, there's no better way to get people interested in something than banning it. AfricanGael (UK) - Posts: 1947 - 11/07/2021 12:07:13 2358529 Link
Replying To AfricanGael: "Look at Croatia, with a population of only about 4 million, made it to the World cup final only 3 years ago, or Uruguay who got to four World cup finals and won two when their population was less than two million or Denmark who won the Euros in 1992 with no preparation knocking out the holders Holland in the semi finals and beating then beating the World Champions Germany in the final. Irish kids need to be given every opportunity to compete with the best of them on the European and World stages and I don't that's the case at the moment, what's holding them back is the national psyche as much as anything else. Everyone can dream of playing beautiful football and winning, even Tyrone." God you are bitter. 05 and 08 finals were cracking end to end games. 05 semi v Armagh was a superb game. But sure look I've heard that bitterness is very energizing, half the country runs on it : ) essmac (Tyrone) - Posts: 1141 - 11/07/2021 12:11:15 2358530 Link
Replying To Rosineri1: "I have lived in England for the past twenty years and a lot of my best friends are English, go the games proud English people. Although I would not bemoan England winning it for them I still can never bring myself to cheer on an England team. The current batch of players seem a likeable bunch bar the odd exception (Maguire for example), Rashford has been great in what he has done regarding free school meals, Henderson and Sterling have also spoken out on social issues. Southgate himself wrote a great piece on the team taking the knee. The current team also a thumb into the face to those people who want to keep England English, they are a great advertisement for the benefits of immigration, and it is great to see that the team are being supported by a much more diverse following than in the past. But the reason I cannot support then is that the English football team appear to bring out the worst in certain English people. It is a minority but a vocal minority as demonstrating in the friendlies prior to the tournament when they booed their own players when they took the knee, versus Scotland when because they weren't beating little Scotland they booed the team off at half time and then last night they started to boo the Danish national anthem. Sadly the England national team seems to attract a large number of these bigoted morons. You also see people who may in polite company keep their views on certain matters to themselves when they get caught up in a crowd like this will quite happily start expressing their real feelings ( I have seen these first hand). Don't think I even need to mention what the English - Londoncentric media are like. One last point how can you want a team to win so that it allows Priti Patel to post victorious messages all over social media." Great post. I lived in England for a decade, and went to many games, so have a fair handle on the soccer culture. Southgate is a gent, and most of the English team are decent lads. Most pundits are less up themselves than in times past, too. But you're right - there is a hardcore element of bigoted national front / EDL mentality that one cannot overlook, like that mob of English fans who surrounded a bus and assaulted an Danish family (Mum, Dad and small child) after the previous game. Or the internet pile on of abusive comments, from grown men, gloating and jeering at a tearful little German girl of primary school age. And the assault on the Danish fan was after England had fluked a win, too! Can you imagine how much hate there'd have been if England had lost that game? Other country's fans do not have this problem. Our fans, and the Scots, whatever about the drinking and messing, at heart, they just want to be liked when they're abroad. By contrast, there is a subset of very Brexity English fans that view all foreigners as lesser. It's an old colonial mindset. They may win, and, if they do, I wont be that bothered, as the team and the manager conduct themselves very well. But while the team is a magnet for all the intolerance in English society, there's no way anyone would actively support England, as you'd be tainted by association. essmac (Tyrone) - Posts: 1141 - 11/07/2021 12:37:45 2358534 Link
Replying To Tacaí Liatroma: "Hahaha! Fair enough. Although I corrected it a couple of posts later." Sore head this morning? Cockney_Cat (UK) - Posts: 2481 - 11/07/2021 12:41:44 2358536 Link
Replying To essmac: "Great post. I lived in England for a decade, and went to many games, so have a fair handle on the soccer culture. Southgate is a gent, and most of the English team are decent lads. Most pundits are less up themselves than in times past, too. But you're right - there is a hardcore element of bigoted national front / EDL mentality that one cannot overlook, like that mob of English fans who surrounded a bus and assaulted an Danish family (Mum, Dad and small child) after the previous game. Or the internet pile on of abusive comments, from grown men, gloating and jeering at a tearful little German girl of primary school age. And the assault on the Danish fan was after England had fluked a win, too! Can you imagine how much hate there'd have been if England had lost that game? Other country's fans do not have this problem. Our fans, and the Scots, whatever about the drinking and messing, at heart, they just want to be liked when they're abroad. By contrast, there is a subset of very Brexity English fans that view all foreigners as lesser. It's an old colonial mindset. They may win, and, if they do, I wont be that bothered, as the team and the manager conduct themselves very well. But while the team is a magnet for all the intolerance in English society, there's no way anyone would actively support England, as you'd be tainted by association." But who knows how we would behave if we had a half decent football team? Who are we to judge? It's all well and good playing the part of the charming underdog when you know you're not going to win anything, but our arrogance and nastiness doesn't be long coming out when we're on top. Look at mcgregor, and the way he has conducted himself, the arrogance and obnoxiousness of irish fans over the last 6 years. Think we're throwing stones on glass houses tbh. And many of those so called "bigoted" English fans we're all having a go at (waving an English flag is almost enough these days to be labelled a bigot) come from perhaps the last communities in England it is now socially acceptable to despise and discriminate against. I can guarantee you that they face plenty of intolerance and prejudice from the enlightened intelligentsia in their day to day life too. Galway9801 (Galway) - Posts: 1732 - 11/07/2021 13:01:29 2358546 Link
Replying To Galway9801: "But who knows how we would behave if we had a half decent football team? Who are we to judge? It's all well and good playing the part of the charming underdog when you know you're not going to win anything, but our arrogance and nastiness doesn't be long coming out when we're on top. Look at mcgregor, and the way he has conducted himself, the arrogance and obnoxiousness of irish fans over the last 6 years. Think we're throwing stones on glass houses tbh. And many of those so called "bigoted" English fans we're all having a go at (waving an English flag is almost enough these days to be labelled a bigot) come from perhaps the last communities in England it is now socially acceptable to despise and discriminate against. I can guarantee you that they face plenty of intolerance and prejudice from the enlightened intelligentsia in their day to day life too." We know how we behave,perhaps you're too young to remember the Charlton years...we were the best behaved and most likeable fans in the World and done the country proud. ONdeDITCH (Limerick) - Posts: 873 - 11/07/2021 14:28:59 2358568 Link
Did I just read where the English players are so likeable and respectable...Raheem Sterling the cheater....someone to look up to and Maguire and what he got up to with the police while on holiday in Spain.And we know about Grealish and his motor crash etc etc etc! Living in England surely has coloured some peoples judgemen!...Stockholm Syndrome has come to mind again. I can understand why some people are grateful for getting the opportunity to make a living in England. Ireland was a great supplier of cheap labour to England for a long time and indeed cheap food. Not having an opportunity to make a living in Ireland in the past was not unconnected to British Imperialism. ONdeDITCH (Limerick) - Posts: 873 - 11/07/2021 14:44:28 2358581 Link
Replying To Cockney_Cat: "Sore head this morning?" No! Jober as a sudge last night, didn't touch a drop. Was falling asleep in bed though and didn't proofread the damn thing correctly. It was sent after quarter past 12. Tacaí Liatroma (Leitrim) - Posts: 1045 - 11/07/2021 15:02:16 2358592 Link
Replying To Galway9801: "But who knows how we would behave if we had a half decent football team? Who are we to judge? It's all well and good playing the part of the charming underdog when you know you're not going to win anything, but our arrogance and nastiness doesn't be long coming out when we're on top. Look at mcgregor, and the way he has conducted himself, the arrogance and obnoxiousness of irish fans over the last 6 years. Think we're throwing stones on glass houses tbh. And many of those so called "bigoted" English fans we're all having a go at (waving an English flag is almost enough these days to be labelled a bigot) come from perhaps the last communities in England it is now socially acceptable to despise and discriminate against. I can guarantee you that they face plenty of intolerance and prejudice from the enlightened intelligentsia in their day to day life too." Mc Gregor is a low life mouthy arrogant clown and he is surrounded and supported by similarly thuggish mouthy eejits. He's proved again and again the type of character he is. Not that soccer hasn't got it's hooligans and God knows they've caused enough hardship for plenty of people but Irish supporters were generally perceived as very good and well behaved when we had a team that was good enough to qualify for the bigger tournaments. catch22 (USA) - Posts: 2148 - 11/07/2021 15:23:49 2358600 Link
Replying To Galway9801: "But who knows how we would behave if we had a half decent football team? Who are we to judge? It's all well and good playing the part of the charming underdog when you know you're not going to win anything, but our arrogance and nastiness doesn't be long coming out when we're on top. Look at mcgregor, and the way he has conducted himself, the arrogance and obnoxiousness of irish fans over the last 6 years. Think we're throwing stones on glass houses tbh. And many of those so called "bigoted" English fans we're all having a go at (waving an English flag is almost enough these days to be labelled a bigot) come from perhaps the last communities in England it is now socially acceptable to despise and discriminate against. I can guarantee you that they face plenty of intolerance and prejudice from the enlightened intelligentsia in their day to day life too." McGregor is a shrewd operator who's making millions off being a clown. Fake slobbering, does it for money. He's a lot smarter than eejits like us who work for a living! No I think there's a major difference that you're missing. The anti foreigner aspect of Englishness doesn't come from having a competitive football team. Face it, England have been poor for decades anyway. It's not about football. Football is just a convenient place for a very English attitude to show itself. There is a contempt for foreigners that doesn't exist in Ireland. Unless you've lived there - and I don't mean "stayed in a flat in Kilburn with lads from Mayo and went to Irish pubs in Kentish town" - I mean really lived there, maybe got married, had mainly English friends, tried to play cricket, etc, integrated with ordinary English people at all levels of society, then it's hard for Irish people to get past the polite mask to the superiority complex underneath. It's why so many in Ireland were surprised by the Brexit vote. I wasn't - that undercurrent of sniggering contempt for Johnny foreigner exists, and I'm not talking white blokes iin sink estates - it's rife among well heeled City boys that I worked among too. Look, we're talking a significant minority. There are millions of decent English fans, of course. But their boot boys don't exist in a vacuum. If Ireland gets more right wing - if some of those anti immigrant anti EU anti lockdown fringe parties gain support - quite likely that in a decade or so, we'll have plenty of our own muppets to be embarrassed by. I agree no room for complacency, but we're culturally not quite there - yet. essmac (Tyrone) - Posts: 1141 - 11/07/2021 15:35:31 2358602 Link
Booing the national anthem is a mirror reflecting the type of people you are dealing with. It is also a reflexion in society today of how difference are treated. It may be said it is a minority and what can the good people do about it. How about for a start telling them it is not acceptable and quit. Either it is a majority doing it or showing support for it. In my life time I could give numerous example of GAA supporters controlling themselves. Actually booing opposition teams running on to the field and taking a free is seeping in a bit. In 1973 when Richie Bennis stepped up to the take that 70 in a packed stadium you could hear a pin drop. Canuck (Waterford) - Posts: 2671 - 11/07/2021 15:45:34 2358609 Link
Replying To essmac: "McGregor is a shrewd operator who's making millions off being a clown. Fake slobbering, does it for money. He's a lot smarter than eejits like us who work for a living! No I think there's a major difference that you're missing. The anti foreigner aspect of Englishness doesn't come from having a competitive football team. Face it, England have been poor for decades anyway. It's not about football. Football is just a convenient place for a very English attitude to show itself. There is a contempt for foreigners that doesn't exist in Ireland. Unless you've lived there - and I don't mean "stayed in a flat in Kilburn with lads from Mayo and went to Irish pubs in Kentish town" - I mean really lived there, maybe got married, had mainly English friends, tried to play cricket, etc, integrated with ordinary English people at all levels of society, then it's hard for Irish people to get past the polite mask to the superiority complex underneath. It's why so many in Ireland were surprised by the Brexit vote. I wasn't - that undercurrent of sniggering contempt for Johnny foreigner exists, and I'm not talking white blokes iin sink estates - it's rife among well heeled City boys that I worked among too. Look, we're talking a significant minority. There are millions of decent English fans, of course. But their boot boys don't exist in a vacuum. If Ireland gets more right wing - if some of those anti immigrant anti EU anti lockdown fringe parties gain support - quite likely that in a decade or so, we'll have plenty of our own muppets to be embarrassed by. I agree no room for complacency, but we're culturally not quite there - yet." , I was referring to mcgregor fans as opposed to the man himself, and no, I've never lived in England, in fact I've never even been there since a weekend visit about 25 years ago, but tbh I think it's almost ridiculous to suggest there isn't an anti foreigner sentiment here in Ireland, travellers get it bad too. Were quite politically correct, and we're very good at hiding our opinions and thoughts, and we like to play the part of the progressive enlightened modern European, but realistically I know loads of people who are unhappy with the profound demographic changes taking place here, look at oughterard last year for example. That's not an isolated incident. Galway9801 (Galway) - Posts: 1732 - 11/07/2021 16:24:27 2358630 Link
Replying To P.Mckenna: "Have you forgotten that trip to Fitzgerald stadium in June already?" Of course I have, can you mind what happened this date 11 years ago? clue, hand of Joe. Saynothing (Tyrone) - Posts: 2017 - 11/07/2021 16:34:34 2358633 Link
Replying To ForeverBlue2: "I was talking about a realistic dream if there is such a thing…ha ha" Only having the craic, fair play. Saynothing (Tyrone) - Posts: 2017 - 11/07/2021 16:35:51 2358635 Link
Man last night put it this way, "it's the Pope v the Queen " Come on you boys in blue. Saynothing (Tyrone) - Posts: 2017 - 11/07/2021 16:46:43 2358640 Link
Replying To Saynothing: "Man last night put it this way, "it's the Pope v the Queen " Come on you boys in blue." Rangers or the Dubs? :D realdub (Dublin) - Posts: 8597 - 11/07/2021 17:06:57 2358656 Link