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The GAA And "Northern Ireland"

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Replying To SaffronDon:  "You've remained vague about this entire scenario of yours throughout here. You still haven't explained how all '6 county Republicans' have a 'chip on both shoulders'. The fact that you went out of your way to post something like that might suggest you have one yourself actually. But I'm willing to hear your side if you have one beyond sweeping generalisations."
If your looking for a blow by blow account of what happened, well this isn't the platform for it and I don't intend of writing an account of it just for you.
If you don't believe me that's your own opinion and you are entitled to it, I'm sure its not an isolated incident of such.

Bon (Kildare) - Posts: 1271 - 27/05/2021 20:25:42    2345995

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Replying To Young_gael:  "Again to reiterate, I hate talking about politics on forums, Im here purely to talk GAA, namely football, and namely all things Meath. But in the spirit of the post where I am addressed twice, I have to respond.

I agree with you on education, by the way. It is thought from an Irish nationalist point of view, presented as an 800 year constant struggle of oppression and toil, and indulging the period from 1798 until 1922 as the tipping point in our history from which we prevailed into a free state and beyond. No mention of Tom Crean, nor Arthur Wellesley, and not a whole pile on Daniel O'Connell (which the main streets in 2/3 of our cities is named from, or my favourite Irish person of all time, CS Parnell. And the reason there isnt much on them and many others? They worked within the British system. Simple. It doesent suit a basic Irish history system to indulge the extremely complex nature of our history.

I dont have an attitude of superiority as you said of me... Im an Irish nationalist and id never call myself a Republican, again note the complexity of language in Irish society. I believe that truly deep down a lot of people, particularly when they study Ireland since partition, often wonder within themselves if freedom was even worth it, when you consider just how poor our leaders were almost non-stop for decades. When you consider the all-emcompassing rule of the catholic church. Absolutely. Ive often had this thought myself. I think that you, bloodyban, are probably a unionist yourself deep down. To further address your saying I have a patronising tone, I dont intend to. My way of writing has frequently been seen as patronsing on these forums, but its just the way I write.

Ireland must be unique among the nations on Earth in that aspousing nationalist views, and the nationalist ideal can be met with hostility. Again, I agree with a lot of what you said, just not the argumentative points. Im not here for arguments. Ive studied Irish history through every prism I can and I have enormous respect for figures far beyond the realms of what we teach our leaving certs. There were some great Irish people who worked within the empire, including 3 British prime ministers, one of which lived scarcely 10-12 miles from where I am writing. If Irish history teaches me one thing it is that conciliation is the most important thing, and accepting complexity and finding a common ground is the most important thing, but from my own learning I still conclude that we are better off by ourselves, ruling ourselves, and for that resason I am a 32 county nationalist and I think I always will be. Its not about starry eyed idealism for me, or slogans or chants, but I honestly believe the people of this country are better off free of Britain, while still accepting and coming to terms with our history. Theres only so much I can get across in a message on the forums but I hope your view point of me has changed, even slightly, and Im sure face to face we could discuss these things for hours."
Firstly young_gael I can't agree with your summation of what is taught of Irish history in our schools. I can't agree with you in relation to what I was taught or what my children in both the Leaving Cert and Junior Cert cycles are currently being. I would refer you to Ireland Since the Famine by F.S.L. Lyons. That was my text book for Leaving Cert Irish history. It was first issued in 1963. It treats comprehensively of all Irish Parliamentary politicians from the time of Daniel O Connell and Repeal up to John Redmond and Home Rule. It is entirely impartial and is still to this day an excellent book. I was most certainly taught very well about our Parliamentary politicians. That was back in the early eighties. I would refute your generalisations about the teaching of Irish history in my time. My children are also studying Irish history in secondary school. Their texts also consider Irish Parliamentary politicians such as Daniel O Connell, Isaac Butt, Charles Stewart Parnell, Edward Carson, James Craig and John Redmond. The subject is taught differently to when I was in school but the material studied is broad and comprehensive. You speak of three Irish born Prime Ministers. I can only find evidence of two, William Petty and Arthur Wellesley Duke of Wellington.
You express the opinion that many Irish people wonder whether the struggle for freedom was worth it. I don't believe you are correct in that assertion however I can't provide you with anything other than anecdotal evidence.
I would not classify myself as an extremist but I would view the empires of the European powers as obscenities. I wouldn't distinguish between the British, French, German or Turkish empires. Huge swathes of territories and entire populations were forcefully subjugated and systematically ruthlessly and viciously exploited. The British Empire was foremost amongst them. The Irish Famine, famines in India, concentration camps during the Boer War, the massacre in Amritsar and the slaughter in Kenya in the 1950s bear testimony to this. The British Gulag by Caroline Elkins is worth reading. It is not being melodramatic or incorrect to say that this country and it's people suffered at the hands of the British Empire. This suffering did stretch back centuries. Between Cromwell gracing these shores and dispensing his own particular brand of religious inspired justice in 1649 and further conflict up to 1658 it's estimated that at least half a million Irish people either lost their lives or were transported as slaves to the West Indies. The fight for freedom was worth it. Nationalism and Republicanism can and should coexist. I don't subscribe to the portrayal of Northern nationalists on this thread. I have many friends who are Northern nationalists and Republicans. They are the same as you and I. I could write a lot more but I have spent enough time on the phone. I had planned to answer Bon and Bloodyban ( again !!!) but enough is enough for one night.

Greengrass (Louth) - Posts: 5489 - 27/05/2021 21:59:24    2346004

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Replying To Greengrass:  "Firstly young_gael I can't agree with your summation of what is taught of Irish history in our schools. I can't agree with you in relation to what I was taught or what my children in both the Leaving Cert and Junior Cert cycles are currently being. I would refer you to Ireland Since the Famine by F.S.L. Lyons. That was my text book for Leaving Cert Irish history. It was first issued in 1963. It treats comprehensively of all Irish Parliamentary politicians from the time of Daniel O Connell and Repeal up to John Redmond and Home Rule. It is entirely impartial and is still to this day an excellent book. I was most certainly taught very well about our Parliamentary politicians. That was back in the early eighties. I would refute your generalisations about the teaching of Irish history in my time. My children are also studying Irish history in secondary school. Their texts also consider Irish Parliamentary politicians such as Daniel O Connell, Isaac Butt, Charles Stewart Parnell, Edward Carson, James Craig and John Redmond. The subject is taught differently to when I was in school but the material studied is broad and comprehensive. You speak of three Irish born Prime Ministers. I can only find evidence of two, William Petty and Arthur Wellesley Duke of Wellington.
You express the opinion that many Irish people wonder whether the struggle for freedom was worth it. I don't believe you are correct in that assertion however I can't provide you with anything other than anecdotal evidence.
I would not classify myself as an extremist but I would view the empires of the European powers as obscenities. I wouldn't distinguish between the British, French, German or Turkish empires. Huge swathes of territories and entire populations were forcefully subjugated and systematically ruthlessly and viciously exploited. The British Empire was foremost amongst them. The Irish Famine, famines in India, concentration camps during the Boer War, the massacre in Amritsar and the slaughter in Kenya in the 1950s bear testimony to this. The British Gulag by Caroline Elkins is worth reading. It is not being melodramatic or incorrect to say that this country and it's people suffered at the hands of the British Empire. This suffering did stretch back centuries. Between Cromwell gracing these shores and dispensing his own particular brand of religious inspired justice in 1649 and further conflict up to 1658 it's estimated that at least half a million Irish people either lost their lives or were transported as slaves to the West Indies. The fight for freedom was worth it. Nationalism and Republicanism can and should coexist. I don't subscribe to the portrayal of Northern nationalists on this thread. I have many friends who are Northern nationalists and Republicans. They are the same as you and I. I could write a lot more but I have spent enough time on the phone. I had planned to answer Bon and Bloodyban ( again !!!) but enough is enough for one night."
"Game, set and match" Greengrass.

tireoghainabu (Tyrone) - Posts: 141 - 27/05/2021 22:28:00    2346008

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Replying To Bon:  "If your looking for a blow by blow account of what happened, well this isn't the platform for it and I don't intend of writing an account of it just for you.
If you don't believe me that's your own opinion and you are entitled to it, I'm sure its not an isolated incident of such."
You can tell me about 20 different incidents if you want. It still doesn't account for anywhere near the amount of '6 county' Republicans there are. Big picture, that's all I'm saying. You get plenty of gobsh#tes both sides of the border. It doesn't make everyone around them one too.

SaffronDon (Antrim) - Posts: 2225 - 27/05/2021 22:28:40    2346009

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Replying To bloodyban:  "I'm not no but I do like Harris and what he writes. He represents a fair slice of the country. I dont find anything he writes unfair or wrong. But my views and his wouldn't always align. I just represent myself and I guess alot of my mates think the same. Do you make an effort to look at the Free State point of view...the pride we have in the 26 and the winning of the Civil War. Unfortunately youd swear the losers of the civil war were the goodies judging by the media these days. Iv played against Antrim and Down club teams a few times and they literally had no idea about the complexity of 'down south'. They were more ignorant of us then we were of Northern Ireland."
I call absolute nonsense on this .....care to name the clubs, you are totally spoofing now and just spouting tripe

ArmaghCat (Armagh) - Posts: 86 - 27/05/2021 22:56:00    2346015

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Every inch of ground on Earth was either fought for or roughly taken off of someone at one time or another down through history. North America and South America were taken from indigenous peoples that also stole from each other and practiced cruel savage acts to each other. Whether factual of me or not I think of Ireland as one solid country. Of course any of you could prove me wrong with an up to date map or textbook but I don't care. Also Derry City is Derry City not L****nderry. Galway Abu.

Trump2020 (Galway) - Posts: 1280 - 28/05/2021 01:43:31    2346023

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Replying To Greengrass:  "Firstly young_gael I can't agree with your summation of what is taught of Irish history in our schools. I can't agree with you in relation to what I was taught or what my children in both the Leaving Cert and Junior Cert cycles are currently being. I would refer you to Ireland Since the Famine by F.S.L. Lyons. That was my text book for Leaving Cert Irish history. It was first issued in 1963. It treats comprehensively of all Irish Parliamentary politicians from the time of Daniel O Connell and Repeal up to John Redmond and Home Rule. It is entirely impartial and is still to this day an excellent book. I was most certainly taught very well about our Parliamentary politicians. That was back in the early eighties. I would refute your generalisations about the teaching of Irish history in my time. My children are also studying Irish history in secondary school. Their texts also consider Irish Parliamentary politicians such as Daniel O Connell, Isaac Butt, Charles Stewart Parnell, Edward Carson, James Craig and John Redmond. The subject is taught differently to when I was in school but the material studied is broad and comprehensive. You speak of three Irish born Prime Ministers. I can only find evidence of two, William Petty and Arthur Wellesley Duke of Wellington.
You express the opinion that many Irish people wonder whether the struggle for freedom was worth it. I don't believe you are correct in that assertion however I can't provide you with anything other than anecdotal evidence.
I would not classify myself as an extremist but I would view the empires of the European powers as obscenities. I wouldn't distinguish between the British, French, German or Turkish empires. Huge swathes of territories and entire populations were forcefully subjugated and systematically ruthlessly and viciously exploited. The British Empire was foremost amongst them. The Irish Famine, famines in India, concentration camps during the Boer War, the massacre in Amritsar and the slaughter in Kenya in the 1950s bear testimony to this. The British Gulag by Caroline Elkins is worth reading. It is not being melodramatic or incorrect to say that this country and it's people suffered at the hands of the British Empire. This suffering did stretch back centuries. Between Cromwell gracing these shores and dispensing his own particular brand of religious inspired justice in 1649 and further conflict up to 1658 it's estimated that at least half a million Irish people either lost their lives or were transported as slaves to the West Indies. The fight for freedom was worth it. Nationalism and Republicanism can and should coexist. I don't subscribe to the portrayal of Northern nationalists on this thread. I have many friends who are Northern nationalists and Republicans. They are the same as you and I. I could write a lot more but I have spent enough time on the phone. I had planned to answer Bon and Bloodyban ( again !!!) but enough is enough for one night."
Hi Greengrass, very thorough and comprehensive reply, thanks for taking the time. I was hoping to not bother with this thread again but I guess as a mark of respect to your post I should reply.

I haven't a whole pile to say really, I would still slightly argue with your point that history *isnt* thought from an Irish nationalist viewpoint, and even though you listed off a number of prominent names, these are still the names of constitutional nationalists, republicans and the token arch-unionist Edward Carson who was in fact a Dub. Irish history is very complex and I wont insult your intelligence by getting into it but my overarching point is that even though the majority of the Irish suffered immensely at the hands of the empire, a number did benefit, notably Northern protestant industrialists and southern landowners, but also many others, and it is dissapointing that one has to go digging to find anything about those particular people, such as Shackleton, Crean, Wellesley, etc, and there is a general apathy from broader society toward the study of Irish people who actually worked within the system after the 1801 act of union. This doesent take away from my nationalism whatsoever, but it does show me that a sense of insecurity in the populace of the 26 counties is still common. I believe understanding our past and coming to terms with Irish identity in all its forms is the secret to unity. Northern unionists must also be willing to work in the same manner, only in reverse. This could take a very long time.

Btw the three British PM's who were Irish were the Duke of Wellington, my own countyman, Lord Shelbourne (who sat in an English seat. This may have thrown you off), and Lord Palmerston. Thats it for me on politics. Back to the GAA!

Young_gael (Meath) - Posts: 472 - 28/05/2021 07:09:10    2346024

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Replying To Greengrass:  "Firstly young_gael I can't agree with your summation of what is taught of Irish history in our schools. I can't agree with you in relation to what I was taught or what my children in both the Leaving Cert and Junior Cert cycles are currently being. I would refer you to Ireland Since the Famine by F.S.L. Lyons. That was my text book for Leaving Cert Irish history. It was first issued in 1963. It treats comprehensively of all Irish Parliamentary politicians from the time of Daniel O Connell and Repeal up to John Redmond and Home Rule. It is entirely impartial and is still to this day an excellent book. I was most certainly taught very well about our Parliamentary politicians. That was back in the early eighties. I would refute your generalisations about the teaching of Irish history in my time. My children are also studying Irish history in secondary school. Their texts also consider Irish Parliamentary politicians such as Daniel O Connell, Isaac Butt, Charles Stewart Parnell, Edward Carson, James Craig and John Redmond. The subject is taught differently to when I was in school but the material studied is broad and comprehensive. You speak of three Irish born Prime Ministers. I can only find evidence of two, William Petty and Arthur Wellesley Duke of Wellington.
You express the opinion that many Irish people wonder whether the struggle for freedom was worth it. I don't believe you are correct in that assertion however I can't provide you with anything other than anecdotal evidence.
I would not classify myself as an extremist but I would view the empires of the European powers as obscenities. I wouldn't distinguish between the British, French, German or Turkish empires. Huge swathes of territories and entire populations were forcefully subjugated and systematically ruthlessly and viciously exploited. The British Empire was foremost amongst them. The Irish Famine, famines in India, concentration camps during the Boer War, the massacre in Amritsar and the slaughter in Kenya in the 1950s bear testimony to this. The British Gulag by Caroline Elkins is worth reading. It is not being melodramatic or incorrect to say that this country and it's people suffered at the hands of the British Empire. This suffering did stretch back centuries. Between Cromwell gracing these shores and dispensing his own particular brand of religious inspired justice in 1649 and further conflict up to 1658 it's estimated that at least half a million Irish people either lost their lives or were transported as slaves to the West Indies. The fight for freedom was worth it. Nationalism and Republicanism can and should coexist. I don't subscribe to the portrayal of Northern nationalists on this thread. I have many friends who are Northern nationalists and Republicans. They are the same as you and I. I could write a lot more but I have spent enough time on the phone. I had planned to answer Bon and Bloodyban ( again !!!) but enough is enough for one night."
I also abhor the portrayal of northern nationalists on this thread by the commentators you've mentioned.

To be 'proud' of the 26 counties achieving freedom and saying to the other 6, "we got out our freedom, you should stop with the jealousy and bitterness" is a bit of a joke. 26 county freedom arrived as the last option before Lloyd George's threat of terrible war within days if the Irish delegation didn't accept. The 6 counties were left to the wolves. Most people in the south weren't happy with the division but saw the free state as a stepping stone as Michael Collins did. Ironically De Valera and his 'anti treaty' band of warriors did more to solidify the division of Ireland in the following decades than anyone. No Irish person was proud of the division of Ireland. Nobody saw it was satisfactory but most saw it as being better than the previous situation and hopefully temporary.

People in the 26 counties would not in those times have pointed a finger at northern nationalists and laughed or scoffed. As a people this division was forced on us. And what an utter failure it has been. Sectarianism, gerrymandering, discrimination. Yes, things have much improved and that is largely down to equality improvements and nationalists being on a more level footing. Reunification is the only answer to the Tory politics of chaos and ignorance.

But if northern nationalists are scarred to some extent after what they've been through, who could blame them? I challenge a few of the more arrogant, spiteful commentators bashing northern nationalists on this thread to live through the legacy of war being brought to your door, discrimination of all kinds and pogroms. If some residual hurts remains, who would blame anyone for that? It's pathetic. Some of the views here are disturbing but fringe views thankfully.

Donegal_abroad (Donegal) - Posts: 980 - 28/05/2021 07:47:53    2346025

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Replying To Donegal_abroad:  "I also abhor the portrayal of northern nationalists on this thread by the commentators you've mentioned.

To be 'proud' of the 26 counties achieving freedom and saying to the other 6, "we got out our freedom, you should stop with the jealousy and bitterness" is a bit of a joke. 26 county freedom arrived as the last option before Lloyd George's threat of terrible war within days if the Irish delegation didn't accept. The 6 counties were left to the wolves. Most people in the south weren't happy with the division but saw the free state as a stepping stone as Michael Collins did. Ironically De Valera and his 'anti treaty' band of warriors did more to solidify the division of Ireland in the following decades than anyone. No Irish person was proud of the division of Ireland. Nobody saw it was satisfactory but most saw it as being better than the previous situation and hopefully temporary.

People in the 26 counties would not in those times have pointed a finger at northern nationalists and laughed or scoffed. As a people this division was forced on us. And what an utter failure it has been. Sectarianism, gerrymandering, discrimination. Yes, things have much improved and that is largely down to equality improvements and nationalists being on a more level footing. Reunification is the only answer to the Tory politics of chaos and ignorance.

But if northern nationalists are scarred to some extent after what they've been through, who could blame them? I challenge a few of the more arrogant, spiteful commentators bashing northern nationalists on this thread to live through the legacy of war being brought to your door, discrimination of all kinds and pogroms. If some residual hurts remains, who would blame anyone for that? It's pathetic. Some of the views here are disturbing but fringe views thankfully."
saying to the other 6, "we got out our freedom, you should stop with the jealousy and bitterness" is a bit of a joke..

Who said this quote? I couldn't see on the thread...did you make it up to argue against ?

bad.monkey (USA) - Posts: 4508 - 28/05/2021 11:21:21    2346043

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Replying To bad.monkey:  "saying to the other 6, "we got out our freedom, you should stop with the jealousy and bitterness" is a bit of a joke..

Who said this quote? I couldn't see on the thread...did you make it up to argue against ?"
" Do you make an effort to look at the Free State point of view...the pride we have in the 26 and the winning of the Civil War. Unfortunately youd swear the losers of the civil war were the goodies judging by the media these days. Iv played against Antrim and Down club teams a few times and they literally had no idea about the complexity of 'down south'. They were more ignorant of us then we were of Northern Ireland."

Read the above type of sentiment and you know perfectly well what I'm on about. It's called deducing what someone is spouting and getting to the heart of their argument. Thanks for your own detailed input or have you little to say.

Donegal_abroad (Donegal) - Posts: 980 - 28/05/2021 13:00:40    2346068

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There is poetic justice in the fact that Unionism is imploding on the Centenary of the rotten statelet it founded a Century ago.

REDANDBLACK30 (Down) - Posts: 1529 - 28/05/2021 13:59:22    2346080

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"Btw the three British PM's who were Irish were the Duke of Wellington, my own countyman, Lord Shelbourne (who sat in an English seat. This may have thrown you off), and Lord Palmerston."
Young_gael (Meath) - Posts: 455 - 28/05/2021 07:09:10 2346024


Lord Palmerston, (Henry John Temple, 3rd Viscount Palmerston) Prime Minister of the United Kingdom, was not Irish. From Wikipedia:
Henry John Temple was born in his family's Westminster house to the Irish branch of the Temple family on 20 October 1784. His family derived their title from the Peerage of Ireland, although he would almost never visit Ireland.

Cockney_Cat (UK) - Posts: 1410 - 28/05/2021 14:19:30    2346083

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Overall a very depressing thread imo. I would certainly feel that I would have more in common with the unionists across the border than I would have with those of my fellow citizens of this southern state with their deeply ingrained partitionist mentality.

PoolSturgeon (Galway) - Posts: 1565 - 28/05/2021 16:57:37    2346111

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Replying To bloodyban:  "Good post. I dont mean to come across as dismissive or angry. My posts are genuine but my writing isn't top notch. I agree with you...My shade of green is pale. I'm am proud of the State as it is and we are getting on OK. I worry about the 'republicanisation ' of our country. I'm a Conservative and feel I'm not represented properly by FG even though I'm a member. But that's all an aside. I'm believe we are in no fit state to unify with Northern Ireland. I dont want it for cultural and economic reasons. Alot of it is Sinn Fein."
Why not put UK after your name like the other two that write in bold. You don't have to be a republican to want an united Ireland .

Saynothing (Tyrone) - Posts: 650 - 28/05/2021 19:25:07    2346133

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Rightly or wrongly, most people I know couldnt give a toss about the subject (don't shoot the messenger),, I mean for sure they're nominally in favour of a 32 county Republic, but it's not like they're too invested in the idea. People here in Galway would spend far more time whinging about the church or blaming everything on trump than they would talking about a united Ireland.

With that in mind im not sure the extent to which 26 county citizens would be willing to absorb any sacrifices that might be needed on their behalf (if any).

Is that selfish? Possibly yes, but it is what it is.

Ironically enough I feel that the real tensions may develop between northern nationalists and southern politicians/citizens.

I believe loyalists will ultimately be happy with the deal because (a) they know a 32 county Republic is inevitable, so they're psychologically prepared for it , and (b) in order to sweeten the deal for them I think the nationalists will ultimately have to make the greater concessions.

It'll also mean that sinn féin will have to adopt a unified strategy for the island instead of doing one thing down south and another thing up north, which will in itself be pretty tricky for them.

Galway9801 (Galway) - Posts: 622 - 28/05/2021 19:56:12    2346138

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Replying To PoolSturgeon:  "Overall a very depressing thread imo. I would certainly feel that I would have more in common with the unionists across the border than I would have with those of my fellow citizens of this southern state with their deeply ingrained partitionist mentality."
I understand what you are saying considering the Limerick poster blabbering on about " winning the civil war" almost 100 years after the event.

Recent polls indicate that a large majority in the 26 counties support re-unification. it is now purely a question of how soon that will happen.

tireoghainabu (Tyrone) - Posts: 141 - 28/05/2021 20:45:17    2346149

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I think it is important to point out that the likes of Sammy Wilson and Paisley jnr are not an accurate representation of unionism anymore. Increasing numbers from a unionist tradition have more to do with the south than Britain. Increasingly younger members are starting to complete their studies in the south and are loving life with more job opportunities available to them down here. This sort of change is vital development in the unification process

97Cavans (Cavan) - Posts: 169 - 28/05/2021 20:59:29    2346156

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Replying To bloodyban:  "Irish history is taught from a nationalist perspective. It's very poor. They don't teach much about our generals in the British army or hard fought campaigns all over the world in forging the Empire. Its all Norman invasion, Cromwell...failed up risings ect and the 1916 rising is seen as some sort of messianic pure revolt. No balance. Jez I forgot the 'Famine...the auld Gortha mor. Its only brought up every 10 mins by the beardie teachers and repubkicans....The uprisings failed because the people didn't want them to succeed by the way..spies and informers are used as reasons..all baloney..they didn't have support.
And the patronising tone of the poster who notes the partitionist views in the commuter belt. An awful attitude of superiority...as if we can't come to any conclusions that don't align with his one eyed republicanism. As if being proud of our state as it currently is ,is a heresy or slur on our ancestors. Give me a break. I love Ireland as it is without Northern Ireland . We fought a bitter civil war to keep the 26 counties and to keep Republicans from wrecking the whole island. . The Northern Nationalist view point has no respect for the 'free Stater' like me so why should I respect them. Id prefer a United Ireland with the Unionists but without the Northern Nationalists. Iv more in common with them ,except hurling..but then the Northern Republicans wouldn't know much about hurling either."
They dont teach much about the likes of Cromwell anyway. I had a young fella come into this house recently who received an A in his Junior cert history, he couldn't tell me a thing about Oliver Cromwell. I can assure you he knew all about Cromwell by the time he had left.
The current schools' history curriculum is embarrassing. History has been watered down to create the most non-offensive version of events as possible. It's the same in the UK. They are ashamed of teaching the grusome detail of their colonial past.

97Cavans (Cavan) - Posts: 169 - 28/05/2021 21:01:19    2346157

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Replying To Bon:  "If your looking for a blow by blow account of what happened, well this isn't the platform for it and I don't intend of writing an account of it just for you.
If you don't believe me that's your own opinion and you are entitled to it, I'm sure its not an isolated incident of such."
Well that post is a little bit disappointing to be honest. Considering you started out with such a big sweeping statement, you've finished quite tamely there

97Cavans (Cavan) - Posts: 169 - 28/05/2021 21:01:58    2346158

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Replying To Donegal_abroad:  "
Replying To bad.monkey:  "saying to the other 6, "we got out our freedom, you should stop with the jealousy and bitterness" is a bit of a joke..

Who said this quote? I couldn't see on the thread...did you make it up to argue against ?"
" Do you make an effort to look at the Free State point of view...the pride we have in the 26 and the winning of the Civil War. Unfortunately youd swear the losers of the civil war were the goodies judging by the media these days. Iv played against Antrim and Down club teams a few times and they literally had no idea about the complexity of 'down south'. They were more ignorant of us then we were of Northern Ireland."

Read the above type of sentiment and you know perfectly well what I'm on about. It's called deducing what someone is spouting and getting to the heart of their argument. Thanks for your own detailed input or have you little to say."
I wrote the paragraph you're quoting and I don't know what your on about. I'm very straight talking and you should quit the deduction or you'll give yourself a headache.. I meant what I said and no more. I and many like me have pride in our country and feel no guilt whatsoever. The Free State did the best they could and fought a hard and bitter Civil war to stop the extremists and ultimately to prevent Lloyd George from sending over a tonne of soldiers to restore peace. Who knows what would have happened then. We might have no country or we might have been better off. Who knows. What I do know is I'm tired of the free ride Northern Republicans get in the media and online. Its constant victim ,victim stuff and we don't like it. Make Northern Ireland work...make an effort at least before you turn our place upside down aswell.

bloodyban (Limerick) - Posts: 1460 - 28/05/2021 21:24:01    2346170

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