National Forum

"Level The Playing Field."

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Level the playing field, that's the new empowering catch phrase of the LGFA, they will be using it to seek equality in all walks of life and rightly so, at the moment they are applying it to their involvement in gaelic games. The impression from them that is coming through is if they level the playing fields then reward and recognition will follow, as a unit they are united, and because of that in a short length of time they have succeeded in getting decent sponsorships, reasonable TV, radio and media coverage, that doesn't include their involvement in International soccer and rugby and other sports. In fairness to the women they support one another within club and county.

From what I can see their male counterparts at the highest level of gaelic games appear to live on a different planet that doesn't see any further than the top 12 counties, like I said the women are looking for equality through levelling the playing field as they say, where their male counterparts are looking for elitism to be recognised at the top level.

There's a thread here that asks, "What can be done to save Offaly hurling." It's as if Offaly hurling is the life line and heartbeat of all that is hurling, to say the least it's not at all relevant to promoting or giving support that's badly needed to less fortunate hurling / football counties that have been neglected year after year without seeing silverware of any importance, never mind reward and recgonition. There's another thread that reads, 2020 Football All Stars, another reads Supreme All Stars, or Professional GAA - Clubs and Counties, not long ago we had one on Super 8's, right now we have super 8's at one end of the scale and weakest 8's at the other end, I have yet to see a worthwhile thread lending it's support to the less fortunate weaker counties in div 3 & 4, and so we have 12 counties (mostly) that takes all the rewards and recognition while the remaining counties gives them badly needed match practice.

supersub15 (Carlow) - Posts: 2467 - 20/02/2021 21:18:17    2332208

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Replying To supersub15:  "Level the playing field, that's the new empowering catch phrase of the LGFA, they will be using it to seek equality in all walks of life and rightly so, at the moment they are applying it to their involvement in gaelic games. The impression from them that is coming through is if they level the playing fields then reward and recognition will follow, as a unit they are united, and because of that in a short length of time they have succeeded in getting decent sponsorships, reasonable TV, radio and media coverage, that doesn't include their involvement in International soccer and rugby and other sports. In fairness to the women they support one another within club and county.

From what I can see their male counterparts at the highest level of gaelic games appear to live on a different planet that doesn't see any further than the top 12 counties, like I said the women are looking for equality through levelling the playing field as they say, where their male counterparts are looking for elitism to be recognised at the top level.

There's a thread here that asks, "What can be done to save Offaly hurling." It's as if Offaly hurling is the life line and heartbeat of all that is hurling, to say the least it's not at all relevant to promoting or giving support that's badly needed to less fortunate hurling / football counties that have been neglected year after year without seeing silverware of any importance, never mind reward and recgonition. There's another thread that reads, 2020 Football All Stars, another reads Supreme All Stars, or Professional GAA - Clubs and Counties, not long ago we had one on Super 8's, right now we have super 8's at one end of the scale and weakest 8's at the other end, I have yet to see a worthwhile thread lending it's support to the less fortunate weaker counties in div 3 & 4, and so we have 12 counties (mostly) that takes all the rewards and recognition while the remaining counties gives them badly needed match practice."
Bottom 12 teams are the red headed step child equilavent of the GAA world .

Bon (Kildare) - Posts: 1389 - 20/02/2021 21:33:59    2332210

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Replying To supersub15:  "Level the playing field, that's the new empowering catch phrase of the LGFA, they will be using it to seek equality in all walks of life and rightly so, at the moment they are applying it to their involvement in gaelic games. The impression from them that is coming through is if they level the playing fields then reward and recognition will follow, as a unit they are united, and because of that in a short length of time they have succeeded in getting decent sponsorships, reasonable TV, radio and media coverage, that doesn't include their involvement in International soccer and rugby and other sports. In fairness to the women they support one another within club and county.

From what I can see their male counterparts at the highest level of gaelic games appear to live on a different planet that doesn't see any further than the top 12 counties, like I said the women are looking for equality through levelling the playing field as they say, where their male counterparts are looking for elitism to be recognised at the top level.

There's a thread here that asks, "What can be done to save Offaly hurling." It's as if Offaly hurling is the life line and heartbeat of all that is hurling, to say the least it's not at all relevant to promoting or giving support that's badly needed to less fortunate hurling / football counties that have been neglected year after year without seeing silverware of any importance, never mind reward and recgonition. There's another thread that reads, 2020 Football All Stars, another reads Supreme All Stars, or Professional GAA - Clubs and Counties, not long ago we had one on Super 8's, right now we have super 8's at one end of the scale and weakest 8's at the other end, I have yet to see a worthwhile thread lending it's support to the less fortunate weaker counties in div 3 & 4, and so we have 12 counties (mostly) that takes all the rewards and recognition while the remaining counties gives them badly needed match practice."
Good post.
My own take on it is that over the coming years, the media will, outside of the race for Sam and Liam, focus all of their attention on promoting ladies football and camogie at the expense of lower tier and/or non top 12 counties,or even non top 6 counties who will become increasingly irrelevant to the point of barely existing outside of their own counties.
Male footballers will be forgotten about while female footballers who aren't as good as them will be showered with publicity and hero worship.
Rant over, bring on the hate.

Galway9801 (Galway) - Posts: 949 - 20/02/2021 21:46:28    2332216

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Replying To supersub15:  "Level the playing field, that's the new empowering catch phrase of the LGFA, they will be using it to seek equality in all walks of life and rightly so, at the moment they are applying it to their involvement in gaelic games. The impression from them that is coming through is if they level the playing fields then reward and recognition will follow, as a unit they are united, and because of that in a short length of time they have succeeded in getting decent sponsorships, reasonable TV, radio and media coverage, that doesn't include their involvement in International soccer and rugby and other sports. In fairness to the women they support one another within club and county.

From what I can see their male counterparts at the highest level of gaelic games appear to live on a different planet that doesn't see any further than the top 12 counties, like I said the women are looking for equality through levelling the playing field as they say, where their male counterparts are looking for elitism to be recognised at the top level.

There's a thread here that asks, "What can be done to save Offaly hurling." It's as if Offaly hurling is the life line and heartbeat of all that is hurling, to say the least it's not at all relevant to promoting or giving support that's badly needed to less fortunate hurling / football counties that have been neglected year after year without seeing silverware of any importance, never mind reward and recgonition. There's another thread that reads, 2020 Football All Stars, another reads Supreme All Stars, or Professional GAA - Clubs and Counties, not long ago we had one on Super 8's, right now we have super 8's at one end of the scale and weakest 8's at the other end, I have yet to see a worthwhile thread lending it's support to the less fortunate weaker counties in div 3 & 4, and so we have 12 counties (mostly) that takes all the rewards and recognition while the remaining counties gives them badly needed match practice."
Brilliant post Supersub and I agree with you 100%.All the talk and interest is of the top 12 when it's the bottom tiers that should be looked after more. However the gaa is a business and they care more about the top teams as they are the teams that put the bums on seats. It's about time the weaker were looked after.

CiarraiMick (Dublin) - Posts: 2769 - 20/02/2021 21:49:07    2332218

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Replying To Galway9801:  "Good post.
My own take on it is that over the coming years, the media will, outside of the race for Sam and Liam, focus all of their attention on promoting ladies football and camogie at the expense of lower tier and/or non top 12 counties,or even non top 6 counties who will become increasingly irrelevant to the point of barely existing outside of their own counties.
Male footballers will be forgotten about while female footballers who aren't as good as them will be showered with publicity and hero worship.
Rant over, bring on the hate."
So basically weaker male sportsmen are "better" than top women sportsmen? No where on the planet do women and men compete in same field team sport. So taking that logic, instead of TG4 showing ladies football we should watch crap male football? I have been watching ladies football for years and it is always competitive and exciting. It is worlds apart form its male counter parts. The mens game could certain learn from it especially in the way it grades counties.

arock (Dublin) - Posts: 4732 - 21/02/2021 00:34:44    2332233

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There is no top tier in men's football, let's nip that one in the bud. There's one team with all the advantages way out ahead and there's two counties maybe on their coattails hoping to catch them on an off day that never happens. The rest are second tier.
Some of the standard in ladies football is absolutely shocking, as it is in the mens. But the ladies seem to bristle more when that is suggested.

republicofcloone (Leitrim) - Posts: 375 - 21/02/2021 08:19:54    2332241

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Replying To arock:  "So basically weaker male sportsmen are "better" than top women sportsmen? No where on the planet do women and men compete in same field team sport. So taking that logic, instead of TG4 showing ladies football we should watch crap male football? I have been watching ladies football for years and it is always competitive and exciting. It is worlds apart form its male counter parts. The mens game could certain learn from it especially in the way it grades counties."
Sorry but those "crap male footballers" you're going on about (going by my post that would mean any mens intercounty team outside of the top 12) would beat whichever ladies team you put in front of them,like it or not.
For sure the ladies game has the potential to be more competitive and exciting than the men's, but my local junior c league is more competitive than the all Ireland right now, so let's all watch that instead eh?
The ladies game has its upsides, less thuggery, less sledging, less of the diving and feigning injury that is a toxic blight, and an embarrassment to the mens game, (same can be said for underage mens football too now I think of it).
Don't get worked up,I'm only saying what I think, and the wind is blowing in your direction anyway, so be happy :)

Galway9801 (Galway) - Posts: 949 - 21/02/2021 08:42:37    2332242

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I don't know. The not top 12 teams in the men's game have the opportunity to improve themselves. It's not a static list. Derry were a top 12 county 15-20 years ago and had a profile, now they don't. Cavan and Monaghan have gone the other way.

Women's sport has only recently started to get a profile, long may it continue.

Serena Williams or Naomi Osaka aren't as good as the 200th best men in the world but I'd have a lot more interest in them in an Australian Open semifinal than watch some qualifiers.

It is what it is.

There's no conspiracy against weaker teams, it's just not that compelling to know who the 20th v 21st best teams are.

I care about how Antrim do but only because I come from there. Honestly I can see why no one else cares about them. Why would they?

People need to live in the real world.

Whammo86 (Antrim) - Posts: 3625 - 21/02/2021 10:47:43    2332253

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Replying To Whammo86:  "I don't know. The not top 12 teams in the men's game have the opportunity to improve themselves. It's not a static list. Derry were a top 12 county 15-20 years ago and had a profile, now they don't. Cavan and Monaghan have gone the other way.

Women's sport has only recently started to get a profile, long may it continue.

Serena Williams or Naomi Osaka aren't as good as the 200th best men in the world but I'd have a lot more interest in them in an Australian Open semifinal than watch some qualifiers.

It is what it is.

There's no conspiracy against weaker teams, it's just not that compelling to know who the 20th v 21st best teams are.

I care about how Antrim do but only because I come from there. Honestly I can see why no one else cares about them. Why would they?

People need to live in the real world."
But using the tennis analogy, can't we absolutely hope to see the day when the weakest teams themselves are given a high profile.
If two players who according to you aren't even in the top 200 tennis players in the world can receive the level of fame and recognition that Williams and osaka have, why can't the 13th best team in Ireland hope to earn (or failing that, be given) a similar level of recognition within the GAA world here in Ireland?

Galway9801 (Galway) - Posts: 949 - 21/02/2021 11:51:55    2332261

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Replying To arock:  "So basically weaker male sportsmen are "better" than top women sportsmen? No where on the planet do women and men compete in same field team sport. So taking that logic, instead of TG4 showing ladies football we should watch crap male football? I have been watching ladies football for years and it is always competitive and exciting. It is worlds apart form its male counter parts. The mens game could certain learn from it especially in the way it grades counties."
Yes arock Lad ies football is very entertaining but also some of the lower tier football is very entertaining also. As a matter of fact its prob more entertaining than top tier football where its nearly all about possession nowadays.

CiarraiMick (Dublin) - Posts: 2769 - 21/02/2021 13:16:01    2332274

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Replying To Galway9801:  "But using the tennis analogy, can't we absolutely hope to see the day when the weakest teams themselves are given a high profile.
If two players who according to you aren't even in the top 200 tennis players in the world can receive the level of fame and recognition that Williams and osaka have, why can't the 13th best team in Ireland hope to earn (or failing that, be given) a similar level of recognition within the GAA world here in Ireland?"
Players who are 200th in the world don't receive the same recognition as Serena or Osaka.


Outside the top 50/60 men's tennis players plenty are struggling to make a living.

At Wimbledon qualifiers and even seeds play on outside courts unless they get far enough or draw a big name. Big name being a top 4 seed to 8th seed or so.

Whammo86 (Antrim) - Posts: 3625 - 21/02/2021 13:55:08    2332282

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Replying To Bon:  "Bottom 12 teams are the red headed step child equilavent of the GAA world ."
Ah yes but it is cyclical outside the top 6 or so. Maybe Kerry and Dublin would be the only 2 counties that would always be in around the top 12 in living memory. Wexford beat Armagh in an all Ireland FQF only losing narrowly to Tyrone in the semi. 15 years ago we were in a Division 1 Football league final too. Now we would be firmly in div 4 though hoping get back up to div 3 again. There isnt a set in stone top 12 nor was there ever.

Viking66 (Wexford) - Posts: 3310 - 21/02/2021 14:33:52    2332286

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Replying To Galway9801:  "But using the tennis analogy, can't we absolutely hope to see the day when the weakest teams themselves are given a high profile.
If two players who according to you aren't even in the top 200 tennis players in the world can receive the level of fame and recognition that Williams and osaka have, why can't the 13th best team in Ireland hope to earn (or failing that, be given) a similar level of recognition within the GAA world here in Ireland?"
No one cares who the 200th best male player is.

People care who the best female players are.

We all recognise that men are on average physically superior to women so sport is segregated on gender lines to keep it interesting.

It's not rocket science like.

Whammo86 (Antrim) - Posts: 3625 - 21/02/2021 14:56:11    2332289

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Replying To Viking66:  "Ah yes but it is cyclical outside the top 6 or so. Maybe Kerry and Dublin would be the only 2 counties that would always be in around the top 12 in living memory. Wexford beat Armagh in an all Ireland FQF only losing narrowly to Tyrone in the semi. 15 years ago we were in a Division 1 Football league final too. Now we would be firmly in div 4 though hoping get back up to div 3 again. There isnt a set in stone top 12 nor was there ever."
That's true. I don't think any county in the country (Kilkenny apart obviously) that couldn't reach the top 12. It might never happen for a lot, including my own, but Wexford, Tipperary and Fermanagh have made All Ireland semis not so long ago and any traditional lower tier county like them could do so again. That's in football though. Absolutely no chance of some lower tier hurling county making it to top 12.

Onion Breath (Carlow) - Posts: 1307 - 21/02/2021 15:06:49    2332291

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Replying To Whammo86:  "No one cares who the 200th best male player is.

People care who the best female players are.

We all recognise that men are on average physically superior to women so sport is segregated on gender lines to keep it interesting.

It's not rocket science like."
Sure I know its not rocket science whammo I'm just pointing out what I would see as the flaw.
First off, we don't all recognise that women are inferior to men athletically, if we did no one would promote the idea of equality,, (they would instead be looking for equity).
I also think it's unfair on a male footballer to be cast into obscurity while a female footballer who isn't as good as him is revered. I don't think it's fair.

And looking at the amount of players per team, it's quite conceivable that the 200th best male footballer in ireland just might be the one to come off the bench and score the winning point in a provincial final or a semi final,, and people would care then.

Galway9801 (Galway) - Posts: 949 - 21/02/2021 16:25:14    2332299

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Replying To CiarraiMick:  "Brilliant post Supersub and I agree with you 100%.All the talk and interest is of the top 12 when it's the bottom tiers that should be looked after more. However the gaa is a business and they care more about the top teams as they are the teams that put the bums on seats. It's about time the weaker were looked after."
You are so right CiarraiMick, The gaa is a business that's going from bad to worse, one day in the near future they will come looking with cap in hand to the bottom of the pile counties when they are in serious financial trouble and our Government through the tax payer refuse to cough up mega millions again to bail them out.

supersub15 (Carlow) - Posts: 2467 - 21/02/2021 20:23:36    2332336

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Replying To Onion Breath:  "That's true. I don't think any county in the country (Kilkenny apart obviously) that couldn't reach the top 12. It might never happen for a lot, including my own, but Wexford, Tipperary and Fermanagh have made All Ireland semis not so long ago and any traditional lower tier county like them could do so again. That's in football though. Absolutely no chance of some lower tier hurling county making it to top 12."
Onion Breath, as you know we own div.4 for the past mega years and its not going to change, we are not going to beat a flawless system, the also rans must be kept at bay so that the top 8 / 12 look good year on year. It's a flawless system that has worked over the past 50 ish years, why should they change something that's working at no extra cost, think about it.

supersub15 (Carlow) - Posts: 2467 - 21/02/2021 20:41:50    2332341

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Replying To republicofcloone:  "There is no top tier in men's football, let's nip that one in the bud. There's one team with all the advantages way out ahead and there's two counties maybe on their coattails hoping to catch them on an off day that never happens. The rest are second tier.
Some of the standard in ladies football is absolutely shocking, as it is in the mens. But the ladies seem to bristle more when that is suggested."
There is no top tier in men's football, let's nip that one in the bud. There's one team with all the advantages way out ahead and there's two counties maybe on their coattails hoping to catch them on an off day that never happens. The rest are second tier.
Some of the standard in ladies football is absolutely shocking, as it is in the mens. But the ladies seem to bristle more when that is suggested.

Other than the fact that you don't make overall sense, and when you say there is no top tier in mens football, but then you say the rest are "second tier", how can you have a second tier if you haven't a top tier, unless we are calling the " Super 8's a tier."

supersub15 (Carlow) - Posts: 2467 - 21/02/2021 21:01:22    2332344

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Replying To Whammo86:  "No one cares who the 200th best male player is.

People care who the best female players are.

We all recognise that men are on average physically superior to women so sport is segregated on gender lines to keep it interesting.

It's not rocket science like."
Whammo86
With the greatest of respect, in your two sizeable posts on the subject of " Level the playing field" not one line of the two makes reasonable sense to me, perhaps that's because your basking in the sunshine in sunny Australia with high profile female professional tennis players, (out of our mere mortals depth) instead of being at home sharing the issues and agonies of our home grown women that keep things going for our LGFA, - - - It's not rocket science.
Good health.

supersub15 (Carlow) - Posts: 2467 - 21/02/2021 21:21:25    2332354

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Replying To Bon:  "Bottom 12 teams are the red headed step child equilavent of the GAA world ."
Not sure your analogy & it's publication here is wholly appropriate on a few different levels.

P.Mckenna (Louth) - Posts: 72 - 21/02/2021 22:53:01    2332373

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