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Stepping Away And Retirements (Early)

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Replying To brian:  "Third at best John, not absolutely guaranteed."
Yes Brian if posters are judging Kerry on the championship then I'm afraid we only 4th rated team in munster cos Tipp needed extra time to beat Limerick..On the bright side though there s plenty of room for improvement.

CiarraiMick (Dublin) - Posts: 2687 - 21/01/2021 19:06:03    2328374

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Replying To FoolsGold:  "Paul Mannion opting out for the year."
That is 4 Dublin players SO FAR who wont be involved in 2021 for Dublin (Paddy, MDMA, Jack and Mannion)....
I know of another who wont be also - so that will be at least 5.....

As a kerry teppum would say....
So to me it looks like the Dublin team now think they can't win again with the amount of players walking away... which shows me that they actually know that they will not win it again. But I am not defeatist - I call it a realist...!!!!


;o)

Fionn (Dublin) - Posts: 3345 - 21/01/2021 19:17:14    2328377

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Replying To FoolsGold:  "Paul Mannion opting out for the year."
Yep heard it this morning by word of mouth, but heard the same before the champo and turned out to be untrue, what I was referring to earlier, another I think to go to.

Best of luck for the year Paul, you will be missed.

The Dubs just might beat themselves when no one else could.

TheUsername (Dublin) - Posts: 4115 - 21/01/2021 19:31:24    2328378

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Replying To Fionn:  "That is 4 Dublin players SO FAR who wont be involved in 2021 for Dublin (Paddy, MDMA, Jack and Mannion)....
I know of another who wont be also - so that will be at least 5.....

As a kerry teppum would say....
So to me it looks like the Dublin team now think they can't win again with the amount of players walking away... which shows me that they actually know that they will not win it again. But I am not defeatist - I call it a realist...!!!!


;o)"
Still it's an opportunity for someone else. I wouldn't stress.

In all our All Ireland wins I think it was only 2019 we really ever had a full deck to choose from every other year we'd have one, two, three missing and a few retirements, we've won All Ireland's without Dermo, Rory, Jack and Paul * 2, and retirements to. I wouldn't write of Jack just yet, I believe he was in with the lads at training toward the end of the champo.

Each time we rely on our youth, a chance given and an opportunity to someone else, we might not win an All Ireland but that's ok if we transition for a year, we really shouldn't have won it this year. Of the top of my head, I can think of P Small kicking on again, Collie Basquel plays out right and Ciaran Archer to. Some of these lads are up and coming or have waited a long time for a chance putting in the hard yards.

We will look to our own, it's our way.

TheUsername (Dublin) - Posts: 4115 - 21/01/2021 20:01:29    2328384

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Replying To Fionn:  "That is 4 Dublin players SO FAR who wont be involved in 2021 for Dublin (Paddy, MDMA, Jack and Mannion)....
I know of another who wont be also - so that will be at least 5.....

As a kerry teppum would say....
So to me it looks like the Dublin team now think they can't win again with the amount of players walking away... which shows me that they actually know that they will not win it again. But I am not defeatist - I call it a realist...!!!!


;o)"
If Mannion is taking a year out he will be a big loss. A terrific forward. No disrespect to MDMA or Paddy Andrews but they were nt really part of team anymore really. They would ve struggled to make match panel. Mannion however in his prime. Jack still might come back depending on circumstances. I don't think Philly offers anything anymore either tbh so maybe time for him to go also. Paddy MDMA gave great service and owe Dublin nothing but I don't like to see the younger lads go.

CiarraiMick (Dublin) - Posts: 2687 - 21/01/2021 20:09:28    2328385

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A class forward. Paddy Small held onto his place but Mannion a more lethal player. It was said he was later returning to the Squad after the lockdown last year , probaly ,was thinking of opting out for a while.

FoolsGold (Cavan) - Posts: 2364 - 21/01/2021 21:05:08    2328391

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Replying To catch22: "But sure Mick wouldn't know about that seeing as he's not from Kerry like. You can take that to the bank too."

Oh you didn't mean that......
crying laughing roling eyes emoji ;)
brian (Meath) - Posts: 972 - 15/01/2021 12:49:03


Classic ;o)

Fionn (Dublin) - Posts: 3345 - 21/01/2021 21:11:06    2328393

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Replying To TheUsername:  "
Replying To Fionn:  "That is 4 Dublin players SO FAR who wont be involved in 2021 for Dublin (Paddy, MDMA, Jack and Mannion)....
I know of another who wont be also - so that will be at least 5.....

As a kerry teppum would say....
So to me it looks like the Dublin team now think they can't win again with the amount of players walking away... which shows me that they actually know that they will not win it again. But I am not defeatist - I call it a realist...!!!!


;o)"
Still it's an opportunity for someone else. I wouldn't stress.

In all our All Ireland wins I think it was only 2019 we really ever had a full deck to choose from every other year we'd have one, two, three missing and a few retirements, we've won All Ireland's without Dermo, Rory, Jack and Paul * 2, and retirements to. I wouldn't write of Jack just yet, I believe he was in with the lads at training toward the end of the champo.

Each time we rely on our youth, a chance given and an opportunity to someone else, we might not win an All Ireland but that's ok if we transition for a year, we really shouldn't have won it this year. Of the top of my head, I can think of P Small kicking on again, Collie Basquel plays out right and Ciaran Archer to. Some of these lads are up and coming or have waited a long time for a chance putting in the hard yards.

We will look to our own, it's our way."
True User. And the players you mention all took time out in the midst of playing football. Dublin have been lucky with injuries but unlucky in that top players opted out at different times but it did nt affect the team. I recall Kerry s great team under Micko were missing at least one top player every year but it was injuries. Again Kerry were strong enough to overcome the losses. Kerry lost Pat Spillane for 2 and a half seasons. Lost Sheehy Bomber Jim Deenihan Tommy Doyle Ger Power Ger ó Keefe. Dublin have been so strong the overcame also. Although Dubs gave some great forwards to come in I do think Mannion is in a different class and will be a loss. Andrews and MDMA are not a loss as their time was up anyway. I still think Cian Ó Sullivan has something to offer but think Philly s time is up too.

CiarraiMick (Dublin) - Posts: 2687 - 21/01/2021 21:27:42    2328396

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Replying To FoolsGold:  "A class forward. Paddy Small held onto his place but Mannion a more lethal player. It was said he was later returning to the Squad after the lockdown last year , probaly ,was thinking of opting out for a while."
Goes to show the Dublin players are only human amateur sportsmen after all, and not robots or professional athletes...

Just normal extremely talented guys but they do have lives outside of GAA, and the commitment football is taking effects them all in different ways...

A couple more on the way also from what I am hearing but Archer, Basquel and Costello etc are at the ready to fill the void.

I predict in 2022 you will see a very new Dublin team with only a handful of current 1st teamers remaining...

Maybe then, all the doom and gloom merchants and perennial pessimists on here can learn to breathe again....!
(although I am convinced a lot of them are actually the same poster....!)

Fionn (Dublin) - Posts: 3345 - 21/01/2021 21:35:50    2328399

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Replying To KingdomBoy1:  "Well it's very hard to be positive when the sports governing body is favouring 1 team above all others by giving that team eternal home advantage and more than 10 times more money than their nearest rivals, those advantages along with dublins population advantages makes me very pessimistic.

A lot of posters from outside of dublin remind me of that picture of those native American Indians happily standing on the beach watching Christopher Columbus and his crew sailing towards them not knowing the annihilation that was going to happen their people."
Get a grip on yourself lad. Dublin always had a population advantage. Alot of the money that Dublin GAA gets goes into social projects trying offer young lads a way out of the bleakness they call home. Next time you are feeling misty eyed and whimsical and sorry for yourself ask yourself would you rather the Banna Strand or Ballymun? Yes Dublin have had a great team the last decade. We had a great team 2nd decade of last century. Ye have had more great teams than any other county in Ireland. You've had more underage and club success too. While Dublin will be favourites next year their odds will be longer than this year or last.

Viking66 (Wexford) - Posts: 3047 - 21/01/2021 22:13:49    2328404

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Replying To CiarraiMick:  "Yes Brian if posters are judging Kerry on the championship then I'm afraid we only 4th rated team in munster cos Tipp needed extra time to beat Limerick..On the bright side though there s plenty of room for improvement."
Proper positive attitude. Although Clare are making great strides too........

Viking66 (Wexford) - Posts: 3047 - 21/01/2021 22:16:30    2328405

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Replying To Fionn:  "Goes to show the Dublin players are only human amateur sportsmen after all, and not robots or professional athletes...

Just normal extremely talented guys but they do have lives outside of GAA, and the commitment football is taking effects them all in different ways...

A couple more on the way also from what I am hearing but Archer, Basquel and Costello etc are at the ready to fill the void.

I predict in 2022 you will see a very new Dublin team with only a handful of current 1st teamers remaining...

Maybe then, all the doom and gloom merchants and perennial pessimists on here can learn to breathe again....!
(although I am convinced a lot of them are actually the same poster....!)"
Only if ye lose. If yet another group of new young players come together for ye guys and walk their way to the all Ireland then the doom and gloom merchants will be more vocal than ever.
As it stands those who said that losing the likes of Connolly, Mccaffrey and the brogans would put Dublin back into the pack have been proven completely wrong {yeve improved since they left}.

Galway9801 (Galway) - Posts: 885 - 21/01/2021 22:39:14    2328410

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Replying To CiarraiMick:  "
Replying To TheUsername:  "[quote=Fionn:  "That is 4 Dublin players SO FAR who wont be involved in 2021 for Dublin (Paddy, MDMA, Jack and Mannion)....
I know of another who wont be also - so that will be at least 5.....

As a kerry teppum would say....
So to me it looks like the Dublin team now think they can't win again with the amount of players walking away... which shows me that they actually know that they will not win it again. But I am not defeatist - I call it a realist...!!!!


;o)"
Still it's an opportunity for someone else. I wouldn't stress.

In all our All Ireland wins I think it was only 2019 we really ever had a full deck to choose from every other year we'd have one, two, three missing and a few retirements, we've won All Ireland's without Dermo, Rory, Jack and Paul * 2, and retirements to. I wouldn't write of Jack just yet, I believe he was in with the lads at training toward the end of the champo.

Each time we rely on our youth, a chance given and an opportunity to someone else, we might not win an All Ireland but that's ok if we transition for a year, we really shouldn't have won it this year. Of the top of my head, I can think of P Small kicking on again, Collie Basquel plays out right and Ciaran Archer to. Some of these lads are up and coming or have waited a long time for a chance putting in the hard yards.

We will look to our own, it's our way."
True User. And the players you mention all took time out in the midst of playing football. Dublin have been lucky with injuries but unlucky in that top players opted out at different times but it did nt affect the team. I recall Kerry s great team under Micko were missing at least one top player every year but it was injuries. Again Kerry were strong enough to overcome the losses. Kerry lost Pat Spillane for 2 and a half seasons. Lost Sheehy Bomber Jim Deenihan Tommy Doyle Ger Power Ger ó Keefe. Dublin have been so strong the overcame also. Although Dubs gave some great forwards to come in I do think Mannion is in a different class and will be a loss. Andrews and MDMA are not a loss as their time was up anyway. I still think Cian Ó Sullivan has something to offer but think Philly s time is up too."]Jus chatting with a few heads there Mick. Paul is class, wonderful, well rounded player, hugely skilled, pace, decision making, shot execution, can beat a man, can get inside, can stretch a defense, very understated on work rate and defensively to.

I remember being in the stands his first year and lads calling for Macker to come in and drop the slight green horn, who could be wasteful and sloppy. Jim persevered.

We have to have the same attitude, no one bigger then the team. Not long ago we were lamenting Jack and Robbie steps up and put in a stars turn. That is how it has to be, it's an opportunity for someone else. If you stand still you are left behind, look at Rory.

Of the candidates we have P Small. I was chatting to someone on the same Dublin minor team with him, he said they were all good players, but Paddy was miles ahead of them all, supremely talented, he was saying he thinks there is bags more to come from him.

Collie Basquel, I won't be breaking any confidences in saying is the most deadly forward in Dublin club football, just absolutely shoots the lights out every championship and a lot of lads feel strongly he's been wasted at County so far, even though he's still relatively young. He will have a spring in step come training.

Archer is the outlier, shot the lights out at U 20, he's a prodigious talent, is one of the best kickers of a dead ball in the country, that's not hyperbole he's astonishing and some scorer of goal placement. He's been hugely hyped, if Iim Honest my own opinion is he's not ready. Doesn't win his own ball yet and masters a man marker yet, but he will be brought in to the panel I'd say and is another talent.

Then we have Cormac Costello who can play the right side. I don't think I've ever seen a more supremely talented player, capable of double digits in a match not getting a starting shirt.

It's perpetuall motion Mick, it never stops the lads above will duke it out that competition will drive them on and they will be better players for it.

Truth is we need to build and develop lads for the next five to ten years, we're on the road since 2011 being hugely successful, but that inevitably comes and will come with endings, the last two years we have seen a lot of change, we did well to win an All Ireland this year in my opinion, but we weren't pushed to the pin of our color either , the cards fell very nicely and I thought we were there to be shot at. We won't have things our own way, this year and I think we will see some transition in Dublin as we build. What that will lead to in results? Lads will have a different opinion.

If I'm honest Paul didn't look happy all year, I suspect his face might just not fit for Dessie or maybe each other for whatever reason, maybe he just needs a break.

Yep fair play, I never realised that Kerry team had so many injuries, a supremely talented bunch.

I think we have a couple more retirements to come Mick, I heard one anyway, heard a whisper Macker is weighing. COS I think has something to offer if the body holds up, I'd say that would be the deciding factor, Philly Iid be surprised if he didnt go again. Let's not even think about the unthinkable of you know who. It none of the lads owe Dublin anything and deserve to go when they feel it's right.

TheUsername (Dublin) - Posts: 4115 - 21/01/2021 22:54:12    2328413

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Replying To Fionn:  "Goes to show the Dublin players are only human amateur sportsmen after all, and not robots or professional athletes...

Just normal extremely talented guys but they do have lives outside of GAA, and the commitment football is taking effects them all in different ways...

A couple more on the way also from what I am hearing but Archer, Basquel and Costello etc are at the ready to fill the void.

I predict in 2022 you will see a very new Dublin team with only a handful of current 1st teamers remaining...

Maybe then, all the doom and gloom merchants and perennial pessimists on here can learn to breathe again....!
(although I am convinced a lot of them are actually the same poster....!)"
Paul finishing his degree I think. I don't think Archer is ready to be thrown into the physical senior scene just yet. It's a huge step up but certainly deserves a slow intro from the bench. I think Aaron Byrne deserves some game time and Collie is in the wings also. Paddy is more than capable but he needs to hone his shooting to reach Mannion levels, too many wasted punts from him but in time he will be deadly from that right wing. I expect announcements from Cian and the ROC. I would say that Philly is touch and go but may hang on. Midfield is a slight concern with neither Emmet O Conghaile nor POCB quite breaking through. Not sure what's happening with POCB but Emmet is still on the fringes. A big changing of the guard now.

Joxer (Dublin) - Posts: 4438 - 21/01/2021 23:17:27    2328414

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We lost Tomás O'Sé Paul Galvin and Gooch all starters for Kerry against dublin in 2013 for 2014 and we still won the allireland, dublin losing 2 players in paddy and MDMA means nothing, Manion only part timer.

KingdomBoy1 (Kerry) - Posts: 13454 - 22/01/2021 00:31:52    2328418

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Replying To Fionn:  "Goes to show the Dublin players are only human amateur sportsmen after all, and not robots or professional athletes...

Just normal extremely talented guys but they do have lives outside of GAA, and the commitment football is taking effects them all in different ways...

A couple more on the way also from what I am hearing but Archer, Basquel and Costello etc are at the ready to fill the void.

I predict in 2022 you will see a very new Dublin team with only a handful of current 1st teamers remaining...

Maybe then, all the doom and gloom merchants and perennial pessimists on here can learn to breathe again....!
(although I am convinced a lot of them are actually the same poster....!)"
Oh Fionn....

You didn't mean that last sentence surely....
Crying laughing rolling eyes emoji ;)

brian (Meath) - Posts: 1274 - 22/01/2021 07:13:44    2328428

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Replying To KingdomBoy1:  "Well it's very hard to be positive when the sports governing body is favouring 1 team above all others by giving that team eternal home advantage and more than 10 times more money than their nearest rivals, those advantages along with dublins population advantages makes me very pessimistic.

A lot of posters from outside of dublin remind me of that picture of those native American Indians happily standing on the beach watching Christopher Columbus and his crew sailing towards them not knowing the annihilation that was going to happen their people."
And you'd be the lad on top of the mountain shouting into the wind that the natives had a pain in their hole with and told him to get the hell outta the village as you're giving them the scour Tommy.
Yourself and the other dose of scutter would be safe enough.

catch22 (USA) - Posts: 2148 - 22/01/2021 08:34:44    2328431

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Dublin will still be starting roughly the same team as last year despite the retirements so no big deal really. They might blood in a few younger lads in preparation for Cooper, Fitzsimons, Rock and McCarthy retiring in the coming years. Get them a bit of experience in Croke Park during the Leinster championship - sure why not!
MDMA and Andrews aren't a loss at all. Mannion is - but the Dubs can manage without him no problem.
Howard will probably start next year. Costello will get more game time.
Cluxton will be the big one if he ever decides to go. The short seasons with Covid are suiting him.

hopballref (Galway) - Posts: 318 - 22/01/2021 10:08:58    2328444

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Replying To KingdomBoy1:  "We lost Tomás O'Sé Paul Galvin and Gooch all starters for Kerry against dublin in 2013 for 2014 and we still won the allireland, dublin losing 2 players in paddy and MDMA means nothing, Manion only part timer."
In fairness, 2 of them were well at the end of the road at that stage. Gooch was obviously injured for 2014, but he was a shadow of himself after that.
I'd say those lads not being there actually helped to freshen up the team and it got some impetus from the younger players.
While Andrews and McAuley were barely making the panel, Mannion is still a serious player. He lost his place to Paddy Small, but was a great option to bring on and is far from done.

WanPintWin (Galway) - Posts: 1128 - 22/01/2021 10:20:56    2328450

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Replying To KingdomBoy1:  "We lost Tomás O'Sé Paul Galvin and Gooch all starters for Kerry against dublin in 2013 for 2014 and we still won the allireland, dublin losing 2 players in paddy and MDMA means nothing, Manion only part timer."
Ah but 2014 was a handy All Ireland for the whingers :-)

superbluedub (Dublin) - Posts: 2723 - 22/01/2021 10:30:10    2328454

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