National Forum

Government Intervention

(Oldest Posts First) - Go To The Latest Post


The reasons Dublin are so strong is because the population is bigger. this is where most of our industry is located.
Most people around the country will go to work and live permanently in Dublin. It's where the best paying jobs are at. So you can't blame the GAA people of Dublin for taking full advantage of a huge population, money etc. the players still have to commit to the panel and train extremely hard.
Around the country people are being shoved into small towns because of difficulty in attaining planning permission in the country. So if I want to build a house on the brothers farm I will face planning permission problems. It's true for most counties.
So in 20/30 years from now club football will be dead in most country areas. The towns will be the strongest.
So I think it's up to the Irish government and local councils to step up to attract more jobs and businesses to urban areas and small towns around the country so people can live and raise their family's without migrating to Dublin.
Otherwise our clubs will hurt badly.

Crossgaa (Mayo) - Posts: 553 - 22/12/2020 13:38:55    2325380

Link

Replying To Crossgaa:  "The reasons Dublin are so strong is because the population is bigger. this is where most of our industry is located.
Most people around the country will go to work and live permanently in Dublin. It's where the best paying jobs are at. So you can't blame the GAA people of Dublin for taking full advantage of a huge population, money etc. the players still have to commit to the panel and train extremely hard.
Around the country people are being shoved into small towns because of difficulty in attaining planning permission in the country. So if I want to build a house on the brothers farm I will face planning permission problems. It's true for most counties.
So in 20/30 years from now club football will be dead in most country areas. The towns will be the strongest.
So I think it's up to the Irish government and local councils to step up to attract more jobs and businesses to urban areas and small towns around the country so people can live and raise their family's without migrating to Dublin.
Otherwise our clubs will hurt badly."
Is it the same reason Mayo and Galway are significantly stronger than the likes of Sligo and Leitrim in Connacht?

Ban (Westmeath) - Posts: 1415 - 22/12/2020 14:00:16    2325389

Link

That's a wider issue than the GAA.

The only solution is regional subsidies to encourage folk to live in whatever part of the country you want. Pay for it with higher taxes on city dwellers.

Few governments have had the courage to pursue it.

Consequently, cities all over the world get more crowded (which has its own problems) and the countryside more sparsely populated.

lionofludesch (Down) - Posts: 475 - 22/12/2020 14:02:00    2325391

Link

Replying To Crossgaa:  "The reasons Dublin are so strong is because the population is bigger. this is where most of our industry is located.
Most people around the country will go to work and live permanently in Dublin. It's where the best paying jobs are at. So you can't blame the GAA people of Dublin for taking full advantage of a huge population, money etc. the players still have to commit to the panel and train extremely hard.
Around the country people are being shoved into small towns because of difficulty in attaining planning permission in the country. So if I want to build a house on the brothers farm I will face planning permission problems. It's true for most counties.
So in 20/30 years from now club football will be dead in most country areas. The towns will be the strongest.
So I think it's up to the Irish government and local councils to step up to attract more jobs and businesses to urban areas and small towns around the country so people can live and raise their family's without migrating to Dublin.
Otherwise our clubs will hurt badly."
The restrictions of people building houses in the country is nothing short of scandalous, and nothing is being done about it. I suspect they want to turn Leitrim into a giant ugly forest of non native trees. Already 20% of the land is covered in these trees where wildlife does not enter. There is no motorways to the north west or to Mayo which again shows how much the government cares about an equal playing field. But then some politicians that are in the Dail are also GAA members I reckon so they should be let know the worry there is about this major problem coming down the line.

republicofcloone (Leitrim) - Posts: 375 - 22/12/2020 14:09:00    2325393

Link

Replying To lionofludesch:  "That's a wider issue than the GAA.

The only solution is regional subsidies to encourage folk to live in whatever part of the country you want. Pay for it with higher taxes on city dwellers.

Few governments have had the courage to pursue it.

Consequently, cities all over the world get more crowded (which has its own problems) and the countryside more sparsely populated."
That is only partly the issue though lionofludesch. The issue in the republic is it is extremely hard to get one off housing planning permission in certain areas such as Leitrim, even if it is on your own family land. And there are many houses in counties such as Leitrim that are holiday homes for city dwellers which means there is a shortage of rural housing stock. Not every rural person wants to live in a town, and i don't think folk such as the green party realise this, or want to acknowledge it. I don't think that higher taxes should happen for city dwellers, as i suspect many of them would like to move, particularly from Dublin also full time, and not just on a holiday.

republicofcloone (Leitrim) - Posts: 375 - 22/12/2020 14:58:55    2325406

Link

The reasons Dublin are so strong is because the population is bigger. this is where most of our industry is located.
Most people around the country will go to work and live permanently in Dublin. It's where the best paying jobs are at. So you can't blame the GAA people of Dublin for taking full advantage of a huge population, money etc. the players still have to commit to the panel and train extremely hard.
Around the country people are being shoved into small towns because of difficulty in attaining planning permission in the country. So if I want to build a house on the brothers farm I will face planning permission problems. It's true for most counties.
So in 20/30 years from now club football will be dead in most country areas. The towns will be the strongest.
So I think it's up to the Irish government and local councils to step up to attract more jobs and businesses to urban areas and small towns around the country so people can live and raise their family's without migrating to Dublin.
Otherwise our clubs will hurt badly.
Crossgaa (Mayo) - Posts: 545 - 22/12/2020 13:38:55 If it was all about population Dublin should have a lot more all irelands than they do have.
People are not being shoved into small towns and planning permission for one off houses should be reduced. We dont need sprawl. We have enough of that already. Look at how badly dublin has built out due to sprawl.
Club football will not be dead in most country areas. Thats a complete exaggeration.

Is it the same reason Mayo and Galway are significantly stronger than the likes of Sligo and Leitrim in Connacht?
Ban (Westmeath) - Posts: 1098 - 22/12/2020 14:00:16 Yep. Shock/Horror counties with biggest population in provinces are very dominant.

KillingFields (Limerick) - Posts: 3511 - 22/12/2020 16:09:22    2325435

Link

Replying To republicofcloone:  "That is only partly the issue though lionofludesch. The issue in the republic is it is extremely hard to get one off housing planning permission in certain areas such as Leitrim, even if it is on your own family land. And there are many houses in counties such as Leitrim that are holiday homes for city dwellers which means there is a shortage of rural housing stock. Not every rural person wants to live in a town, and i don't think folk such as the green party realise this, or want to acknowledge it. I don't think that higher taxes should happen for city dwellers, as i suspect many of them would like to move, particularly from Dublin also full time, and not just on a holiday."
Ach - jaysus - I'd be the first to agree that you can't summarise the drift to the cities in a few sentences.

But the basic problem is a financial one.

lionofludesch (Down) - Posts: 475 - 22/12/2020 16:13:12    2325436

Link

Replying To Crossgaa:  "The reasons Dublin are so strong is because the population is bigger. this is where most of our industry is located.
Most people around the country will go to work and live permanently in Dublin. It's where the best paying jobs are at. So you can't blame the GAA people of Dublin for taking full advantage of a huge population, money etc. the players still have to commit to the panel and train extremely hard.
Around the country people are being shoved into small towns because of difficulty in attaining planning permission in the country. So if I want to build a house on the brothers farm I will face planning permission problems. It's true for most counties.
So in 20/30 years from now club football will be dead in most country areas. The towns will be the strongest.
So I think it's up to the Irish government and local councils to step up to attract more jobs and businesses to urban areas and small towns around the country so people can live and raise their family's without migrating to Dublin.
Otherwise our clubs will hurt badly."
A lot of what you want the government to do will occur without any government intervention in the post Covid society that will emerge. Anyone who has been able to work from home during this pandemic -- and tens of thousands of people have been able to do so with a large share of them being people from other counties who are domiciled in Dublin --- will be able to continue working from home and have the possibility of moving back to their home towns and villages if they want to. Of course young people often do like the nightlife and social scene of a big city so they may need a bit of coaxing but I expect that more people will want to move from the city to rural locations than will want to go in the opposite direction when the full impact of the social shifts brought about by Covid are felt in a few years time.

PoolSturgeon (Galway) - Posts: 1904 - 22/12/2020 18:05:12    2325469

Link

Dublin homeowners are taxed enough by the high property taxes and high cost of living unless they're fairly wealthy. The bigger towns in counties could still provide most or even more of the jobs but if people were incentivised to live in smaller towns, villages and parishes and a short commute to those towns the smaller clubs could still thrive and so could the communities there. Hopefully then as infrastructure and broadband improve rurally more and more people will move out to the country. I'm living more in the countryside now in Meath than where I grew up in Mayo, and it's not for everyone, but I think they don't realise what they're missing if they changed city life for the country. Work is work but the quality of life depends a lot on your time off and if you can afford to live where you live.

GreenandRed (Mayo) - Posts: 7360 - 22/12/2020 19:28:30    2325496

Link

To a large portion of the population, Covid has altered their work/life balance FOR THE BETTER. (Yes, it's been awful for an awful lot more, but that's another story).

But there is definitely a section of people who now see beyond the 50-60 hour working week in the city and who will pursue a split week to include working from home or from decentralised (yes, that word!) offices.

There's a fair argument to be made that Covid has a big impact on Cavan winning Ulster this year, for example. A few of the lads didn't have to travel down from Dublin 3 times a week.

By accident rather than design, decentralisation looks like it will finally happen. That the national broadband plan is still a work-in-progress is, frankly, a disgrace! But if anything positive is to be taken from the last 10 months (and the best part of 2021) it is that rural Ireland will experience a rejuvenation.

Yes, the planning beurocracy that plagues rural Ireland is horrendous, but in a housing emergency (which we are in and will be in for the next decade) enough pressure can be put on those in government to intervene and relax those laws nationwide.

cavanman47 (Cavan) - Posts: 5016 - 22/12/2020 20:43:17    2325524

Link

Replying To KillingFields:  "The reasons Dublin are so strong is because the population is bigger. this is where most of our industry is located.
Most people around the country will go to work and live permanently in Dublin. It's where the best paying jobs are at. So you can't blame the GAA people of Dublin for taking full advantage of a huge population, money etc. the players still have to commit to the panel and train extremely hard.
Around the country people are being shoved into small towns because of difficulty in attaining planning permission in the country. So if I want to build a house on the brothers farm I will face planning permission problems. It's true for most counties.
So in 20/30 years from now club football will be dead in most country areas. The towns will be the strongest.
So I think it's up to the Irish government and local councils to step up to attract more jobs and businesses to urban areas and small towns around the country so people can live and raise their family's without migrating to Dublin.
Otherwise our clubs will hurt badly.
Crossgaa (Mayo) - Posts: 545 - 22/12/2020 13:38:55 If it was all about population Dublin should have a lot more all irelands than they do have.
People are not being shoved into small towns and planning permission for one off houses should be reduced. We dont need sprawl. We have enough of that already. Look at how badly dublin has built out due to sprawl.
Club football will not be dead in most country areas. Thats a complete exaggeration.

Is it the same reason Mayo and Galway are significantly stronger than the likes of Sligo and Leitrim in Connacht?
Ban (Westmeath) - Posts: 1098 - 22/12/2020 14:00:16 Yep. Shock/Horror counties with biggest population in provinces are very dominant."
In your first reply you insinuate that having a bigger population is not necessarily a guarantee of success,, in your second reply you insinuate the exact opposite.

Galway9801 (Galway) - Posts: 1717 - 22/12/2020 20:53:16    2325533

Link

Replying To Galway9801:  "
Replying To KillingFields:  "The reasons Dublin are so strong is because the population is bigger. this is where most of our industry is located.
Most people around the country will go to work and live permanently in Dublin. It's where the best paying jobs are at. So you can't blame the GAA people of Dublin for taking full advantage of a huge population, money etc. the players still have to commit to the panel and train extremely hard.
Around the country people are being shoved into small towns because of difficulty in attaining planning permission in the country. So if I want to build a house on the brothers farm I will face planning permission problems. It's true for most counties.
So in 20/30 years from now club football will be dead in most country areas. The towns will be the strongest.
So I think it's up to the Irish government and local councils to step up to attract more jobs and businesses to urban areas and small towns around the country so people can live and raise their family's without migrating to Dublin.
Otherwise our clubs will hurt badly.
Crossgaa (Mayo) - Posts: 545 - 22/12/2020 13:38:55 If it was all about population Dublin should have a lot more all irelands than they do have.
People are not being shoved into small towns and planning permission for one off houses should be reduced. We dont need sprawl. We have enough of that already. Look at how badly dublin has built out due to sprawl.
Club football will not be dead in most country areas. Thats a complete exaggeration.

Is it the same reason Mayo and Galway are significantly stronger than the likes of Sligo and Leitrim in Connacht?
Ban (Westmeath) - Posts: 1098 - 22/12/2020 14:00:16 Yep. Shock/Horror counties with biggest population in provinces are very dominant."
In your first reply you insinuate that having a bigger population is not necessarily a guarantee of success,, in your second reply you insinuate the exact opposite."
Both can be true at the same time.
If it was all about population Dublin would have a lot more all irelands than they have. Theyve never not been one of the largest counties and didnt act on it for years.

KillingFields (Limerick) - Posts: 3511 - 22/12/2020 21:41:36    2325549

Link

Replying To Galway9801:  "
Replying To KillingFields:  "The reasons Dublin are so strong is because the population is bigger. this is where most of our industry is located.
Most people around the country will go to work and live permanently in Dublin. It's where the best paying jobs are at. So you can't blame the GAA people of Dublin for taking full advantage of a huge population, money etc. the players still have to commit to the panel and train extremely hard.
Around the country people are being shoved into small towns because of difficulty in attaining planning permission in the country. So if I want to build a house on the brothers farm I will face planning permission problems. It's true for most counties.
So in 20/30 years from now club football will be dead in most country areas. The towns will be the strongest.
So I think it's up to the Irish government and local councils to step up to attract more jobs and businesses to urban areas and small towns around the country so people can live and raise their family's without migrating to Dublin.
Otherwise our clubs will hurt badly.
Crossgaa (Mayo) - Posts: 545 - 22/12/2020 13:38:55 If it was all about population Dublin should have a lot more all irelands than they do have.
People are not being shoved into small towns and planning permission for one off houses should be reduced. We dont need sprawl. We have enough of that already. Look at how badly dublin has built out due to sprawl.
Club football will not be dead in most country areas. Thats a complete exaggeration.

Is it the same reason Mayo and Galway are significantly stronger than the likes of Sligo and Leitrim in Connacht?
Ban (Westmeath) - Posts: 1098 - 22/12/2020 14:00:16 Yep. Shock/Horror counties with biggest population in provinces are very dominant."
In your first reply you insinuate that having a bigger population is not necessarily a guarantee of success,, in your second reply you insinuate the exact opposite."
Both can be true at the same time.
If it was all about population Dublin would have a lot more all irelands than they have. Theyve never not been one of the largest counties and didnt act on it for years.

KillingFields (Limerick) - Posts: 3511 - 22/12/2020 21:42:14    2325550

Link

Replying To lionofludesch:  "That's a wider issue than the GAA.

The only solution is regional subsidies to encourage folk to live in whatever part of the country you want. Pay for it with higher taxes on city dwellers.

Few governments have had the courage to pursue it.

Consequently, cities all over the world get more crowded (which has its own problems) and the countryside more sparsely populated."
Cities shouldn't be taxed more to subsidise rural living. Few governments pursue it because it is unfair and wrong to penalise people for where they born or choose to live. You have people on here wanting more one-off housing.

Rolo2010 (Donegal) - Posts: 739 - 22/12/2020 22:24:47    2325557

Link

People are to blame also, small developments turned down in rural areas because of people objecting. Rural clubs need developments to boost numbers but the "not on my doorstep brigade " out in force.

Saynothing (Tyrone) - Posts: 2017 - 22/12/2020 22:38:54    2325561

Link

Replying To GreenandRed:  "Dublin homeowners are taxed enough by the high property taxes and high cost of living unless they're fairly wealthy. The bigger towns in counties could still provide most or even more of the jobs but if people were incentivised to live in smaller towns, villages and parishes and a short commute to those towns the smaller clubs could still thrive and so could the communities there. Hopefully then as infrastructure and broadband improve rurally more and more people will move out to the country. I'm living more in the countryside now in Meath than where I grew up in Mayo, and it's not for everyone, but I think they don't realise what they're missing if they changed city life for the country. Work is work but the quality of life depends a lot on your time off and if you can afford to live where you live."
I'm a small farmer from west kerry Greenandred and yesterday evening I was out watching jupiter crossing saturn something that hasn't been visible from the earth since the 12th century, now it was overcast and I couldn see shite but still you can't beat country living.

When I was a young lad I craved the bright lights and went to college in tralee and emersed myself in everything tralee but after enjoying myself as every young man does while in exile I felt the call of that basterd land of home, I found myself ringing my friends from my small town more and more and eventually I moved back done up my grandparents old house and I couldn't be happier.

KingdomBoy1 (Kerry) - Posts: 14092 - 22/12/2020 23:02:12    2325563

Link

Replying To Rolo2010:  "Cities shouldn't be taxed more to subsidise rural living. Few governments pursue it because it is unfair and wrong to penalise people for where they born or choose to live. You have people on here wanting more one-off housing."
Should a son not be able to build on his ancestral land Rolo? I was lucky back here in West kerry as I renovated my grandparents derelict house other than that I wouldn't have been able to live on my land unless I moved in with my parents yet Dolores O'Riordan god rest her was able to get planning for a house worth 3-4 million.

I have friends that have grown up here that have struggled to get planning where there are people from up the country that have holiday homes that are only used a few months a year.

KingdomBoy1 (Kerry) - Posts: 14092 - 22/12/2020 23:14:17    2325565

Link

I have to be the devil's advocate.
I think you've the whole thing upside down. Ireland is very unique in that it traditionally accomodated one off housing, rural sprawl and enriching counties with agricultural support. This goes back to the earliest days of the state in the 1920s and 1930s when politicians such as Dev in particular had notions about the sanctity of the Irish countryside and the importance of our agriculture and Peat production at the time. And rightly so.

However as said earlier, Ireland is very unique in this regard. Even driving around England for example you see a big difference in housing strategies; towns are bigger ad nauseum, and population coverage is handled from extending town and city boundaries and building out. The countryside is sparsely populated and is develoed for forest, wind and electrical grids, and future infrastrucutre. Housing is laughed at. Every country in Europe is much the same. Im sorry to be a bubble burster boys but Ireland is now following this example; in the name of renewable energy, cost effectiveness, and centralising services. The days of old Ireland have been numbered for a long time and the one off townlands all over the country will be a thing of the past in the future. We'll all be townies, god help us.

Now to unleash my inner Thatcherite; The state has no responsibility to accomodate the GAA in this whole process. Its up to the organisation to tackle this issue in its good time. The game needs radical changes as it is based off of the provincial
and county boundary system, which is around since the 1500s and is quite frankly outdated, stale, and now incredibly biased toward the population centre and services centre on the island. The GAA has never been a social innovator but it must become one lads... or risk irrelevance. Times are changing.

Young_gael (Meath) - Posts: 589 - 23/12/2020 00:13:42    2325580

Link

Replying To cavanman47:  "To a large portion of the population, Covid has altered their work/life balance FOR THE BETTER. (Yes, it's been awful for an awful lot more, but that's another story).

But there is definitely a section of people who now see beyond the 50-60 hour working week in the city and who will pursue a split week to include working from home or from decentralised (yes, that word!) offices.

There's a fair argument to be made that Covid has a big impact on Cavan winning Ulster this year, for example. A few of the lads didn't have to travel down from Dublin 3 times a week.

By accident rather than design, decentralisation looks like it will finally happen. That the national broadband plan is still a work-in-progress is, frankly, a disgrace! But if anything positive is to be taken from the last 10 months (and the best part of 2021) it is that rural Ireland will experience a rejuvenation.

Yes, the planning beurocracy that plagues rural Ireland is horrendous, but in a housing emergency (which we are in and will be in for the next decade) enough pressure can be put on those in government to intervene and relax those laws nationwide."
I'm not so sure about the government intervening in planning laws Cavanman. It suits them to keep housing availability low to keep prices ramped up. There's too many landlords in leinster house also, and in the park.

republicofcloone (Leitrim) - Posts: 375 - 23/12/2020 08:05:24    2325598

Link

Replying To KingdomBoy1:  "I'm a small farmer from west kerry Greenandred and yesterday evening I was out watching jupiter crossing saturn something that hasn't been visible from the earth since the 12th century, now it was overcast and I couldn see shite but still you can't beat country living.

When I was a young lad I craved the bright lights and went to college in tralee and emersed myself in everything tralee but after enjoying myself as every young man does while in exile I felt the call of that basterd land of home, I found myself ringing my friends from my small town more and more and eventually I moved back done up my grandparents old house and I couldn't be happier."
Great post!! Tell me kingdomboy, have u ever heard of a film called "Pilgrim Hill" made by a young Kerry director. It's one of the best Irish films ever made, it's about rural isolation. Check it out; it's a masterpiece.

avonali (Dublin) - Posts: 1974 - 23/12/2020 10:26:03    2325613

Link