National Forum

Qualifiers Or Round Robin

(Oldest Posts First)

After watching this years All- Ireland Championship to me the qualifiers is a much better system then the round robin system of last year. Everyone gets a second chance but you still have the element of a knock out. No dead rubber games. Galway were hard done last year by getting knock out by score differential. If they were in the qualifiers they very well could have won an All Ireland. If scheduled properly it would be done in a proper frame time with a lot less wear and tear on a lot of the players. I don't know what the set up is for next year but to me it is a no brainer.

gatha (Kilkenny) - Posts: 260 - 29/11/2020 11:53:32    2316423

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Replying To gatha:  "After watching this years All- Ireland Championship to me the qualifiers is a much better system then the round robin system of last year. Everyone gets a second chance but you still have the element of a knock out. No dead rubber games. Galway were hard done last year by getting knock out by score differential. If they were in the qualifiers they very well could have won an All Ireland. If scheduled properly it would be done in a proper frame time with a lot less wear and tear on a lot of the players. I don't know what the set up is for next year but to me it is a no brainer."
lets be honest , best championship I have seen in a very long time. If Cavan, Mayo or tipp topple the dubs ill cream meself. I do think mayo might huge maybe , lets light the candles, for the best championship in history. Tipp winning Munster and mayo with sam id be laughing daily for about 6 days, even if tipp did, actually id rather that, up tipp

GameofTyronesIsBackhere (Tyrone) - Posts: 46 - 29/11/2020 12:03:09    2316427

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Up until recently, Kildare championships had a fantastic structure for 16 teams. It was done away with for teams to have more games but it was intense, gave teams two chances and there were no dead rubbers.

Round 1, open draw.. 8 games= 8 winners and 8 losers.

Round 2, winners from rd.1 play winners, losers play losers.

(Teams with 2 wins now take 4 quarter final spots, teams with 2 loses take relegation semi final spots)

Round 3, teams with 1 win and 1 loss play for the other 4 quarter final spots.

Each team is guaranteed 3 games and all games are meaningful... I'd love to see it introduced at inter county level. Scrap the provincials.

Sweetspot (Kildare) - Posts: 212 - 29/11/2020 12:08:37    2316430

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I don't know, I'd slightly prefer the round robin system but maybe they could be used in conjunction with each other so you would have the 4th, 5th and 6th (If Leinster's getting six teams anymore) placed teams dropping into the qualifiers too after the provincials. It's definitely better for the likes of Laois, Dublin and Antrim (if they go up) to have 4+ games rather than 2, or 3 max.

eoghan6688 (Galway) - Posts: 148 - 29/11/2020 12:30:37    2316439

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I think in both codes just a league and provincials, with 1 qualifying spot coming from the league.

Football

4 Provincial champions plus best ranked non provincial champion to AI series.

4th best Provincial champion v best ranked non provincial champion plays in a preliminary semifinal.

This year that would have been Kerry v Tipperary in a preliminary semifinal.

They have to have finished in the top 4.

In hurling Galway stay in Leinster. You've a league division 1 of 10 teams play each other once.

Best team in the league plays 2nd best ranked provincial champion in an All Ireland semi final.

They have to have finished in the top 2 in the league.

Make the league and Championship games all high stakes.

Whammo86 (Antrim) - Posts: 3387 - 29/11/2020 12:33:28    2316442

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Replying To gatha:  "After watching this years All- Ireland Championship to me the qualifiers is a much better system then the round robin system of last year. Everyone gets a second chance but you still have the element of a knock out. No dead rubber games. Galway were hard done last year by getting knock out by score differential. If they were in the qualifiers they very well could have won an All Ireland. If scheduled properly it would be done in a proper frame time with a lot less wear and tear on a lot of the players. I don't know what the set up is for next year but to me it is a no brainer."
Tough one, there is nothing like more matches gatha.
The drama of last summer in Wexford Park when trying to figure out who was in the Leinster Final was great!
But I am inclined to think 4 matches to eliminate 2 teams is too many.
Either:
1. The provincial finalists are in the All-Ireland semi, end of story
2. Back to the qualifiers.

StoreysTash (Wexford) - Posts: 1109 - 29/11/2020 14:09:13    2316475

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Replying To StoreysTash:  "Tough one, there is nothing like more matches gatha.
The drama of last summer in Wexford Park when trying to figure out who was in the Leinster Final was great!
But I am inclined to think 4 matches to eliminate 2 teams is too many.
Either:
1. The provincial finalists are in the All-Ireland semi, end of story
2. Back to the qualifiers."
Just don't like rubber games and to have a team loose out because they didn't hammer a weaker team doesn't seem fair. Plus I love the knock out element in matches.

gatha (Kilkenny) - Posts: 260 - 29/11/2020 15:25:02    2316506

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Replying To StoreysTash:  "Tough one, there is nothing like more matches gatha.
The drama of last summer in Wexford Park when trying to figure out who was in the Leinster Final was great!
But I am inclined to think 4 matches to eliminate 2 teams is too many.
Either:
1. The provincial finalists are in the All-Ireland semi, end of story
2. Back to the qualifiers."
The groups in hurling are great. its a lot more than 4 matches to eliminate 2 teams considering its deciding semi and quarter finalists

KillingFields (Limerick) - Posts: 2279 - 29/11/2020 16:46:19    2316524

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Replying To KillingFields:  "The groups in hurling are great. its a lot more than 4 matches to eliminate 2 teams considering its deciding semi and quarter finalists"
Yeah. The weaker counties coming up from Joe McDonagh want more games as well.

Rolo2010 (Donegal) - Posts: 263 - 29/11/2020 18:38:44    2316578

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Replying To StoreysTash:  "Tough one, there is nothing like more matches gatha.
The drama of last summer in Wexford Park when trying to figure out who was in the Leinster Final was great!
But I am inclined to think 4 matches to eliminate 2 teams is too many.
Either:
1. The provincial finalists are in the All-Ireland semi, end of story
2. Back to the qualifiers."
3 teams will be eliminated in Leinster next year.

Rolo2010 (Donegal) - Posts: 263 - 29/11/2020 18:39:52    2316579

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Replying To Whammo86:  "I think in both codes just a league and provincials, with 1 qualifying spot coming from the league.

Football

4 Provincial champions plus best ranked non provincial champion to AI series.

4th best Provincial champion v best ranked non provincial champion plays in a preliminary semifinal.

This year that would have been Kerry v Tipperary in a preliminary semifinal.

They have to have finished in the top 4.

In hurling Galway stay in Leinster. You've a league division 1 of 10 teams play each other once.

Best team in the league plays 2nd best ranked provincial champion in an All Ireland semi final.

They have to have finished in the top 2 in the league.

Make the league and Championship games all high stakes."
No. Linking league and provincials is just too messy. I think most fans will read this and still be none the wiser. Also, a preliminary semi-final is just a quarter-final. A league of 9 games won't work when the other 4 divisions only play 5 games and you can't merge them because there would be some almighty hammerings.

Rolo2010 (Donegal) - Posts: 263 - 29/11/2020 18:44:48    2316582

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Replying To Rolo2010:  "No. Linking league and provincials is just too messy. I think most fans will read this and still be none the wiser. Also, a preliminary semi-final is just a quarter-final. A league of 9 games won't work when the other 4 divisions only play 5 games and you can't merge them because there would be some almighty hammerings."
Ah you can merge them no bother.

Divisions of 10,10,8,7.

There's not as big a disparity between tiers as some would make out.

Offaly came down from the Leinster championship, relegated again and didn't get themselves back up.

There are too many tiers in hurling.

Honestly if someone can't understand giving 1 All Ireland place to the best performing league team they're going to be really struggling in life. It's not complicated. It took me 2 lines to explain it.

After 1 season of play everyone would get it.

It's less complex than the qualifiers or hurling championship right now.

Whammo86 (Antrim) - Posts: 3387 - 29/11/2020 19:04:27    2316602

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Replying To Whammo86:  "Ah you can merge them no bother.

Divisions of 10,10,8,7.

There's not as big a disparity between tiers as some would make out.

Offaly came down from the Leinster championship, relegated again and didn't get themselves back up.

There are too many tiers in hurling.

Honestly if someone can't understand giving 1 All Ireland place to the best performing league team they're going to be really struggling in life. It's not complicated. It took me 2 lines to explain it.

After 1 season of play everyone would get it.

It's less complex than the qualifiers or hurling championship right now."
It isn't less complex. None of these changes are necessary. The provincial round robin is a popular format and the crowds before Covid showed that.

Rolo2010 (Donegal) - Posts: 263 - 29/11/2020 19:47:47    2316625

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Replying To KillingFields:  "The groups in hurling are great. its a lot more than 4 matches to eliminate 2 teams considering its deciding semi and quarter finalists"
I think he means 4 matches per team to eliminate two teams per prov group (3 of 5 per group to AI KO).

omahant (USA) - Posts: 1999 - 01/12/2020 03:15:29    2317213

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How about keeping 2 KO Provs of 5 and 'building' 2 mixed groups as those KO results unfold - like this:
Muns QF loser (MQFL) to Group A
Muns QF winner (MQFW) to Group B
MQFW's SF opponent to Group A.
2nd Muns SF winner to other group from 1st Muns SF winner and 2nd SF loser.

Do similar with Lein, except Lein QFL to Group B.
There will be 5 teams in each group and teams complete their 5v5 schedule.
Top 6 of 10 to AI KO (intra group non-repeat pairings, where possible).

In 2020, the KO Provs would have formed -
Group A. Group B
Clare. Tipp
Lime. Water
Cork. Laois
Dublin. Kilk
Galw. Wex

AI SFs could hve been - Lime v Galw or Clare
Water v Kilk or Tipp

Do similar with football (merge one half of a Prov draw, with half from another).
The 4 Prov Finals are bonus matches.

omahant (USA) - Posts: 1999 - 01/12/2020 04:01:29    2317214

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