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Replying To gatha: "Fortunate because it was a ridiculous call if you look at the game you will see at least 3 times when a Tipp player put his head down and ran right into a Kilkenny player and the free was given to Tipp. Brian Hogan tried to avoid Maher. Maher stood his ground and flatten Hogan, which he was entitled to do. It was a no call no foul on either man. To say the time of a game has no bearing on a call is just naive. A good ref understands what is on the line and how a match should be determined. Loosing a hard fought sporting match on a soft or controversial free is not right for the players who put so much into it." You say a good ref understands what is on the line, which suggests you didn't regard Barry Kelly as a good referee, despite the fact that he refereed four senior All-Ireland finals. You say he gave at least three frees to Tipp and then penalised Kilkenny for the same thing. This implies that he was biased which comes very close to questioning his integrity. And you still haven't explained what you meant in saying that Kelly was fortunate that Bubbles missed the free. Why was he fortunate? What difference would it have made to Barry Kelly if Tipp had won?
midlands (Westmeath) - Posts: 542 - 24/11/2020 21:45:45
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Replying To Texas: "I honestly don't get the complaints over the second Cavan black card. Most people have been categorizing it as a "push".
Rule 5.12, under Category II Infractions - Cynical Behaviour
To deliberately collide with an opponent after he has played the ball away or for the purpose of taking him out of the movement of play
Eoin McHugh hand-passed the ball to Eoghan Bán Gallagher, and after the ball was gone, Madden ran into the back of him at full speed, leading with the forearm to McHugh's back. No attempt to play the ball. Only intent was to knock him to the ground (take him out of the movement of the play). You can categorize it as a just a "push", but I think that's a very rose-tinted view of what happened. He landed on top of him, like!
That kind of play has plagued GAA for years. You would regularly see the smarter/more cynical teams drag or knock down Ryan McHugh or Lee Keegan or Jack McCaffrey in their own half to take them out of the game. The problem isn't the decision by the ref on Sunday. The problem is other referees not enforcing that rule when they see it." the ref on the sideline who notified the ref brannigan i think it was called it a push as rte said during commentary it was heard on his microphone but cassidy decided on a black card
breffnibluewhite (Cavan) - Posts: 454 - 24/11/2020 22:35:02
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Replying To indaknownow: "If handled properly it could be a positive thing for referees. I'm not saying that the Referee should necessarily be grilled after every game but if there was some explanation (from Official GAA) then that might help. Referees are human and make Mistakes so there has to be some tolerance for that. But referees that are constantly below the standard required should not get the Big games. IMO the ref in the Ulster game made 3 or4 errors on Sunday. Often these Errors cancel out but on Sunday they all went against Cavan. If there was some explanation of them that might go some way to alleviating the frustration of Cavan supporters.
The Idea of a referee Pundit being employed to look at specific issues has some merit. I honestly don't Rate Sean Cavanagh as a pundit on football matters and he hasn't a clue about refereeing. But I was very surprised that there was so little analysis of the Referees performance on Sunday given the huge focus on the Cavan Penalty the week before. Similarly very little made of the Tipp Goal that was Disallowed. Maybe the attitude would have been different if Cavan And Tipp had lost. If that's the case then it's too late - The whole idea is to improve the standard of ~Refereeing and for transparency across the board.
Final Shot - Neither of the two referees I have mentioned should be involved for the remainder of the season - and that also goes for the linesman in Ulster who appears to have called the 2nd black Card." According to the rte commentary during the match brannigan the ref on the side line who was 4 yards away from the incident called the foul and informed the ref of a push but cassidy who was 35 yards away and with his back to the action produced a black card which makes it more infuriating
breffnibluewhite (Cavan) - Posts: 454 - 24/11/2020 22:45:22
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Replying To breffnibluewhite: "Barry Cassidy had an absolute shocker yerterday. he should have cost Cavan an ulster title but by some miraculous display of heart and guts we overcame his 5 blatant incorrect decisions. The two black cards were incorrect the foul on Tomas galligan when viewed on rte angle was a definite red card and would most definitely been one if it had of been a yellow and green jersey lying on the ground. Gearoid was denied a definite mark and martin reilly a definite free after a double foul in a very good position. The second black card should have cost cavan the match. Donegal only scored three points in total when cavan had their full fifteen players on the feel. My blood boils when after following Cavan for fifty years to think that our second anglo celt was so close to be robbed oft us by this mans ineptitude. To make matters worse none of this was highlighted on RTE last night and yet Sean Cavanagh tried to create controvesry over Cavan goal against down which no one had any problem with during the match and never mentioned that Downs goal should have been disallowed because it came from a mark that should not have been given.
Mickey was right the underdog never gets a break and because barry cassidy abject performance was never discussed last night he is probably in line for an all ireland final some joke" Agree with all your points regarding the Ulster final ref. Only on one incident would I give the ref the benefit of the doubt, the red-card hit on Galligan's head, it was very difficult to see clearly even on replay and I don't think anyone, including the ref saw the intentional strike in real time. The pity is the fact that Cavan perservered to win, has to some extent taken the spotlight off Cassidy's shocking performance.
sligo joe (Dublin) - Posts: 676 - 24/11/2020 23:28:48
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Replying To midlands: "You say a good ref understands what is on the line, which suggests you didn't regard Barry Kelly as a good referee, despite the fact that he refereed four senior All-Ireland finals. You say he gave at least three frees to Tipp and then penalised Kilkenny for the same thing. This implies that he was biased which comes very close to questioning his integrity. And you still haven't explained what you meant in saying that Kelly was fortunate that Bubbles missed the free. Why was he fortunate? What difference would it have made to Barry Kelly if Tipp had won?" You obviously didn't read the post previous to the last one. I am implying nothing. He had a bad game. Just as players have bad games. You are implying I am questioning his integrity I can tell you I am not. I did say he was lucky because if Kilkenny had lost on that call Kelly would have come under criticism. He proved to me he wasn't a great referee when he put Henry Shefflin off in 2013 for a slap on the hand and followed that up with his performance in 2014. I really don't care how many finals he was involved in. That is just my opinion.
gatha (Kilkenny) - Posts: 318 - 25/11/2020 00:25:23
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Replying To indaknownow: " Replying To Texas: "I honestly don't get the complaints over the second Cavan black card. Most people have been categorizing it as a "push".
Rule 5.12, under Category II Infractions - Cynical Behaviour
To deliberately collide with an opponent after he has played the ball away or for the purpose of taking him out of the movement of play
Eoin McHugh hand-passed the ball to Eoghan Bán Gallagher, and after the ball was gone, Madden ran into the back of him at full speed, leading with the forearm to McHugh's back. No attempt to play the ball. Only intent was to knock him to the ground (take him out of the movement of the play). You can categorize it as a just a "push", but I think that's a very rose-tinted view of what happened. He landed on top of him, like!
That kind of play has plagued GAA for years. You would regularly see the smarter/more cynical teams drag or knock down Ryan McHugh or Lee Keegan or Jack McCaffrey in their own half to take them out of the game. The problem isn't the decision by the ref on Sunday. The problem is other referees not enforcing that rule when they see it." I took a few looks at this again because what you describe wasn't what I remember happening. What actually happened was that the Cavan player attempted to Shoulder McHugh as he passed the ball. McHugh ducked /leaned forward and the Cavan guy went behind him and caught him on the back rather than shoulder to shoulder. His left arm was out trying to block the pass but because McHugh had leaned forward he caught him with it.(to the front) At worst it was rough play (Yellow card). I think it's a prime example of a ref( or rather a linesman) who never played the game and doesn't understand the difference between bad timing and a deliberate cynical foul. There was no forearm to McHughs Back as you suggest. Poor Call by the officials. You sound a bit like the Kilkenny boys last year trying to Argue Against Richie Hogans sending off for His Elbowing incident. And speaking of Elbows What did you think of the Donegal lad that Elbowed the Galligan fella in the Eye and had no card of any colour produced? All the big calls went for Donegal on Sunday - Officials had a poor day - End of!!"
[url=]https://twitter.com/DannyAdelante/status/1331427472211136515?s=20
Here is a link to photos that show how far away the ball had already gone when Madden made contact, and that he made no actual attempt at a fair shoulder or at blocking the pass. The third photo clearly shows him shoving him with the forearm into the back.
[url=]https://twitter.com/DannyAdelante/status/1331437494114668546?s=20
If you can't accept that's a textbook black card, then it's the rule you have an issue with.
As for the elbow - Caolan McGonagle on Galligan, at first I thought McGonagle inadvertently ran into him and hit him with his hip, even on the replay. I rewatched it after the game, and it does look like he made contact with the elbow first. Should have been a straight red. Would have had no problem with him being sent off for that.
Texas (Donegal) - Posts: 163 - 25/11/2020 04:02:12
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Replying To Texas: "I honestly don't get the complaints over the second Cavan black card. Most people have been categorizing it as a "push".
Rule 5.12, under Category II Infractions - Cynical Behaviour
To deliberately collide with an opponent after he has played the ball away or for the purpose of taking him out of the movement of play
Eoin McHugh hand-passed the ball to Eoghan Bán Gallagher, and after the ball was gone, Madden ran into the back of him at full speed, leading with the forearm to McHugh's back. No attempt to play the ball. Only intent was to knock him to the ground (take him out of the movement of the play). You can categorize it as a just a "push", but I think that's a very rose-tinted view of what happened. He landed on top of him, like!
That kind of play has plagued GAA for years. You would regularly see the smarter/more cynical teams drag or knock down Ryan McHugh or Lee Keegan or Jack McCaffrey in their own half to take them out of the game. The problem isn't the decision by the ref on Sunday. The problem is other referees not enforcing that rule when they see it." when I started to read this post... i was thinking ...this is nothing like what happened, completely spun ... so I skipped the rest and saw Texas (Donegal) ...so move on
Jimjo (Cavan) - Posts: 65 - 25/11/2020 12:57:41
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Refs can end an entire teams season with a few bad calls. Months of hard work and training potentially undone in a decision. Gaa love fiddling with the rules to try to improve the game. Improving the standard and consistency of refs would be a big start.
kevin03 (Tyrone) - Posts: 244 - 23/11/2020 20:52:52And how would you suggest to improve standard and consistency of refs?
Most often teams blame a ref but ignore the countless mistakes, bad calls they make themselves.
I think referees should be given an opportunity to defend and outline their decisions and positions, it's become an almost national pass time to scapegoat referees and blame them for the ineptitude of many county teams, players, managers etc.
Moving forward these are some recommendations that should be considered.
a) just like the managers they should be allowed to do a pre and post match interview on RTÉ.
b) be micked up and explain their decisions during the games- like American football.
c) The referees, linesman and umpires be brought on the Sunday game after big matches and discuss their officiating to the panel.
Galway4ever (Galway) - Posts: 134 - 24/11/2020 00:44:40I dont know any ref who would want to go on tv, radio and have to defend their positions. Have someone on occasionally to clarify specifics on rules but not a ref after their games. A referee would never want to or should have to do pre or post match interviews. What sports have that. Mic up the officials but dont have it like american football where it goes on loudspeaker in ground. Have it to hear on tv and those at ground can get a ref link.
If handled properly it could be a positive thing for referees. I'm not saying that the Referee should necessarily be grilled after every game but if there was some explanation (from Official GAA) then that might help. Referees are human and make Mistakes so there has to be some tolerance for that. But referees that are constantly below the standard required should not get the Big games. IMO the ref in the Ulster game made 3 or4 errors on Sunday. Often these Errors cancel out but on Sunday they all went against Cavan. If there was some explanation of them that might go some way to alleviating the frustration of Cavan supporters.
The Idea of a referee Pundit being employed to look at specific issues has some merit. I honestly don't Rate Sean Cavanagh as a pundit on football matters and he hasn't a clue about refereeing. But I was very surprised that there was so little analysis of the Referees performance on Sunday given the huge focus on the Cavan Penalty the week before. Similarly very little made of the Tipp Goal that was Disallowed. Maybe the attitude would have been different if Cavan And Tipp had lost. If that's the case then it's too late - The whole idea is to improve the standard of ~Refereeing and for transparency across the board.
Final Shot - Neither of the two referees I have mentioned should be involved for the remainder of the season - and that also goes for the linesman in Ulster who appears to have called the 2nd black Card.
indaknownow (Offaly) - Posts: 40 - 24/11/2020 10:17:18What exactly determines standard of refs?
A ref will always make a mistake in a game. a perfect game never happens.
KillingFields (Limerick) - Posts: 3510 - 25/11/2020 13:17:19
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Replying To essmac: "Yes, ye won it despite the Ref. Don't agree with explaining after, but agree with explaining during, like in Rugby, which works well" Yes but rugby is a start stop game and the time is there for the referee to explain it. In the GAA its about getting on with the game and believe me if players were allowed to discuss the reason for a free with the ref it would take all day at times. We want speed not delays in the GAA. Most of the times a ref will gesture to the player the reason for the free and regardless of if he agrees with it or not he will argue its wrong, its just the way players are, they never do anything wrong!
zinny (Wexford) - Posts: 1804 - 25/11/2020 13:49:10
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Replying To breffnibluewhite: "According to the rte commentary during the match brannigan the ref on the side line who was 4 yards away from the incident called the foul and informed the ref of a push but cassidy who was 35 yards away and with his back to the action produced a black card which makes it more infuriating" Was is Brannagan?
No surprise there. He tried to drag Monaghan over the winning line in Clones!
cavanman47 (Cavan) - Posts: 5012 - 25/11/2020 14:08:10
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Replying To zinny: "Yes but rugby is a start stop game and the time is there for the referee to explain it. In the GAA its about getting on with the game and believe me if players were allowed to discuss the reason for a free with the ref it would take all day at times. We want speed not delays in the GAA. Most of the times a ref will gesture to the player the reason for the free and regardless of if he agrees with it or not he will argue its wrong, its just the way players are, they never do anything wrong!" You can and should still be able to get an explanation of why you are penalised.
KillingFields (Limerick) - Posts: 3510 - 25/11/2020 14:18:36
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All Referees in the GAA have different ways they apply the rules. Before championship games every county team takes into account who the referee is and plans their game plan around the way he refs the game and thats a fact. To be fair to the referees they have the hardest job in the GAA because there are so many different rules they have to know probably the most rules to be known as a ref in any sport in the world and in the last few years they have been added with extra rules like the black card, inside and kick-out marks.
I do believe senior referees should come out after inter county matches and explain their big decisions and sometimes admit they got it wrong. This would not only help the players understand their decisions but it would also help other referees including referees at lower levels within county's and this could improve consistency of referees in the game.
Look at the Tipp/Cork game last weekend for example, I thought Maurice Deegan had a poor game overall but he got the biggest decision of the game right and that was the Tipp goal that was a square ball. The player was off the pitch when the ball was played into the square which is not aloud. He got a lot of abuse online about this call but that just shows that people don't know they rules. Fair Play to Maurice for knowing the rule.
In the Cavan/Donegal game Cassidy had a poor game and got many decisions wrong. The two black cards should have been two yellows for late hits they were not "cynical" fouls. These late hits and happen in every GAA game and are not given as black cards. It would good to see Cassidy come out and and admit he got them wrong because these decisions could have cost Cavan the match.
Temple56 (Westmeath) - Posts: 386 - 25/11/2020 14:41:36
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All Referees in the GAA have different ways they apply the rules. Before championship games every county team takes into account who the referee is and plans their game plan around the way he refs the game and thats a fact. To be fair to the referees they have the hardest job in the GAA because there are so many different rules they have to know probably the most rules to be known as a ref in any sport in the world and in the last few years they have been added with extra rules like the black card, inside and kick-out marks.
I do believe senior referees should come out after inter county matches and explain their big decisions and sometimes admit they got it wrong. This would not only help the players understand their decisions but it would also help other referees including referees at lower levels within county's and this could improve consistency of referees in the game.
Look at the Tipp/Cork game last weekend for example, I thought Maurice Deegan had a poor game overall but he got the biggest decision of the game right and that was the Tipp goal that was a square ball. The player was off the pitch when the ball was played into the square which is not aloud. He got a lot of abuse online about this call but that just shows that people don't know they rules. Fair Play to Maurice for knowing the rule.
In the Cavan/Donegal game Cassidy had a poor game and got many decisions wrong. The two black cards should have been two yellows for late hits they were not "cynical" fouls. These late hits and happen in every GAA game and are not given as black cards. It would good to see Cassidy come out and and admit he got them wrong because these decisions could have cost Cavan the match.
Temple56 (Westmeath) - Posts: 69 - 25/11/2020 14:41:36 Does Gaelic football or hurling really have more rules than any other sport in world?
Refs shouldnt have to explain themselves to the media or public after games. You dont see it in any sport as it isnt whats needed. It doesnt help refs. It doesnt encourage more people to take up refereeing. If you want to improve players understanding of rules get coaches to attend briefings every year or 6 months where a GAA appointed ref development officer explains why when x or y happened that the ref chose to do one thing over another.
KillingFields (Limerick) - Posts: 3510 - 25/11/2020 14:51:18
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Replying To KillingFields: "Refs can end an entire teams season with a few bad calls. Months of hard work and training potentially undone in a decision. Gaa love fiddling with the rules to try to improve the game. Improving the standard and consistency of refs would be a big start.
kevin03 (Tyrone) - Posts: 244 - 23/11/2020 20:52:52And how would you suggest to improve standard and consistency of refs?
Most often teams blame a ref but ignore the countless mistakes, bad calls they make themselves.
I think referees should be given an opportunity to defend and outline their decisions and positions, it's become an almost national pass time to scapegoat referees and blame them for the ineptitude of many county teams, players, managers etc.
Moving forward these are some recommendations that should be considered.
a) just like the managers they should be allowed to do a pre and post match interview on RTÉ.
b) be micked up and explain their decisions during the games- like American football.
c) The referees, linesman and umpires be brought on the Sunday game after big matches and discuss their officiating to the panel.
Galway4ever (Galway) - Posts: 134 - 24/11/2020 00:44:40I dont know any ref who would want to go on tv, radio and have to defend their positions. Have someone on occasionally to clarify specifics on rules but not a ref after their games. A referee would never want to or should have to do pre or post match interviews. What sports have that. Mic up the officials but dont have it like american football where it goes on loudspeaker in ground. Have it to hear on tv and those at ground can get a ref link.
If handled properly it could be a positive thing for referees. I'm not saying that the Referee should necessarily be grilled after every game but if there was some explanation (from Official GAA) then that might help. Referees are human and make Mistakes so there has to be some tolerance for that. But referees that are constantly below the standard required should not get the Big games. IMO the ref in the Ulster game made 3 or4 errors on Sunday. Often these Errors cancel out but on Sunday they all went against Cavan. If there was some explanation of them that might go some way to alleviating the frustration of Cavan supporters.
The Idea of a referee Pundit being employed to look at specific issues has some merit. I honestly don't Rate Sean Cavanagh as a pundit on football matters and he hasn't a clue about refereeing. But I was very surprised that there was so little analysis of the Referees performance on Sunday given the huge focus on the Cavan Penalty the week before. Similarly very little made of the Tipp Goal that was Disallowed. Maybe the attitude would have been different if Cavan And Tipp had lost. If that's the case then it's too late - The whole idea is to improve the standard of ~Refereeing and for transparency across the board.
Final Shot - Neither of the two referees I have mentioned should be involved for the remainder of the season - and that also goes for the linesman in Ulster who appears to have called the 2nd black Card.
indaknownow (Offaly) - Posts: 40 - 24/11/2020 10:17:18What exactly determines standard of refs?
A ref will always make a mistake in a game. a perfect game never happens." You ask some very pertinent questions. I think openness is a start to improving the standard. I'm not saying that a referee should be asked to go in TV but if there was a respected retired referee that might give some guidance that might help. My point is the likes of Brannigan and Cassidy have been average referees for the past few years in my opinion. I was shocked when Cassidy got the ulster final because he rarely does a game without some controversy. Mistakes happen I agree. but if it is a mistake I would like it called out as such.
Regarding the 2nd Black card on Sunday - it would appear that the rule book has changed slightly - when the black card came in first that rule was a 'deliberate body collision'. It now says 'deliberate collide'.. Which opens up the interpretation of the rule greatly. If it is the case that referees have been told that any contact after the ball has gone it to be interpreted as such thats fine but it would be helpful if the public at large knew that.
All I want is that we know what is happening and Why. for the improvement of all our game.
indaknownow (Offaly) - Posts: 112 - 25/11/2020 14:56:01
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On the Ulster final, when the mark wasn't called - BBC commentary said that it wasn't given because the ball in was part-blocked by a Donegal defender? I didn't notice that myself but that's what they said on BBC commentary - can anyone clarify if that is the rule, once a kick pass has been partially blocked or deflected, no mark can be called?
JoeSoap (Donegal) - Posts: 1432 - 25/11/2020 14:57:36
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Replying To KillingFields: "All Referees in the GAA have different ways they apply the rules. Before championship games every county team takes into account who the referee is and plans their game plan around the way he refs the game and thats a fact. To be fair to the referees they have the hardest job in the GAA because there are so many different rules they have to know probably the most rules to be known as a ref in any sport in the world and in the last few years they have been added with extra rules like the black card, inside and kick-out marks.
I do believe senior referees should come out after inter county matches and explain their big decisions and sometimes admit they got it wrong. This would not only help the players understand their decisions but it would also help other referees including referees at lower levels within county's and this could improve consistency of referees in the game.
Look at the Tipp/Cork game last weekend for example, I thought Maurice Deegan had a poor game overall but he got the biggest decision of the game right and that was the Tipp goal that was a square ball. The player was off the pitch when the ball was played into the square which is not aloud. He got a lot of abuse online about this call but that just shows that people don't know they rules. Fair Play to Maurice for knowing the rule.
In the Cavan/Donegal game Cassidy had a poor game and got many decisions wrong. The two black cards should have been two yellows for late hits they were not "cynical" fouls. These late hits and happen in every GAA game and are not given as black cards. It would good to see Cassidy come out and and admit he got them wrong because these decisions could have cost Cavan the match.
Temple56 (Westmeath) - Posts: 69 - 25/11/2020 14:41:36 Does Gaelic football or hurling really have more rules than any other sport in world?
Refs shouldnt have to explain themselves to the media or public after games. You dont see it in any sport as it isnt whats needed. It doesnt help refs. It doesnt encourage more people to take up refereeing. If you want to improve players understanding of rules get coaches to attend briefings every year or 6 months where a GAA appointed ref development officer explains why when x or y happened that the ref chose to do one thing over another." Not just players. Referees and other officials at lower levels of the GAA don't know the rule book. This is frustrating when week after week at club level referees have different approaches to rules and it confuses players. Some club referees will now think that Cassidys two black cards were black card offences and lead to more bad decisions. Maybe the GAA should come out and explain if these decisions are right or not after every inter county weekend to clear up confusion. Yes it doesn't look good for the ref involved but I think we all understand that referees are human and make mistakes so they should be able to hold there hand up
Temple56 (Westmeath) - Posts: 386 - 25/11/2020 15:25:44
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Not just players. Referees and other officials at lower levels of the GAA don't know the rule book. This is frustrating when week after week at club level referees have different approaches to rules and it confuses players. Some club referees will now think that Cassidys two black cards were black card offences and lead to more bad decisions. Maybe the GAA should come out and explain if these decisions are right or not after every inter county weekend to clear up confusion. Yes it doesn't look good for the ref involved but I think we all understand that referees are human and make mistakes so they should be able to hold there hand up
Temple56 (Westmeath) - Posts: 70 - 25/11/2020 15:25:44The training refs and other officials get needs to improve. Refs having slightly different approaches in some areas is fine but there needs to be consistency in others. This would improve a lot if you have refs being informed more. You dont need the GAA to explain these decisions to public every weekend.
You ask some very pertinent questions. I think openness is a start to improving the standard. I'm not saying that a referee should be asked to go in TV but if there was a respected retired referee that might give some guidance that might help. My point is the likes of Brannigan and Cassidy have been average referees for the past few years in my opinion. I was shocked when Cassidy got the ulster final because he rarely does a game without some controversy. Mistakes happen I agree. but if it is a mistake I would like it called out as such.
Regarding the 2nd Black card on Sunday - it would appear that the rule book has changed slightly - when the black card came in first that rule was a 'deliberate body collision'. It now says 'deliberate collide'.. Which opens up the interpretation of the rule greatly. If it is the case that referees have been told that any contact after the ball has gone it to be interpreted as such thats fine but it would be helpful if the public at large knew that.
All I want is that we know what is happening and Why. for the improvement of all our game.
indaknownow (Offaly) - Posts: 41 - 25/11/2020 14:56:01
That isnt needed. Not all refs are going to be top level. you need to have some who're just average.
KillingFields (Limerick) - Posts: 3510 - 25/11/2020 16:11:05
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Replying To indaknownow: "You ask some very pertinent questions. I think openness is a start to improving the standard. I'm not saying that a referee should be asked to go in TV but if there was a respected retired referee that might give some guidance that might help. My point is the likes of Brannigan and Cassidy have been average referees for the past few years in my opinion. I was shocked when Cassidy got the ulster final because he rarely does a game without some controversy. Mistakes happen I agree. but if it is a mistake I would like it called out as such.
Regarding the 2nd Black card on Sunday - it would appear that the rule book has changed slightly - when the black card came in first that rule was a 'deliberate body collision'. It now says 'deliberate collide'.. Which opens up the interpretation of the rule greatly. If it is the case that referees have been told that any contact after the ball has gone it to be interpreted as such thats fine but it would be helpful if the public at large knew that.
All I want is that we know what is happening and Why. for the improvement of all our game." I agree with your points. On the black cards referees should also have some common sense when giving black cards. People have to remember why black cards were brought in. They should only be given inside the 45 when a cyclical foul is committed because that's where you are stopping a scoring opportunity and within the last 10 mins of a game they should be given all over the pitch. The two black cards at the weekend we not stopping scoring opportunity's or stopping someone's run that could hurt a team.
Both black cards at the weekend were late tackles and with common sense they both should of got yellow cards and even at that the 1st one would of been a harsh yellow card
Temple56 (Westmeath) - Posts: 386 - 25/11/2020 16:29:19
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Replying To JoeSoap: "On the Ulster final, when the mark wasn't called - BBC commentary said that it wasn't given because the ball in was part-blocked by a Donegal defender? I didn't notice that myself but that's what they said on BBC commentary - can anyone clarify if that is the rule, once a kick pass has been partially blocked or deflected, no mark can be called?" To answer your question the rule on the Mark reads as follows.
When a player catches the ball cleanly on or inside a 45m line from a kick in play (i.e. not from set-play) delivered by an attacking player on or beyond the opposing team's 45m line, that travels at least 20m and without it touching the ground.
There is no mention of a block in the rule the only one is that it hasn't touched the ground which it didn't.
In any case there was no block on the Kick so that's not the issue. It was just a mistake by the Ref.. one of a few he made on Sunday.
indaknownow (Offaly) - Posts: 112 - 25/11/2020 16:53:49
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Replying To Temple56: "I agree with your points. On the black cards referees should also have some common sense when giving black cards. People have to remember why black cards were brought in. They should only be given inside the 45 when a cyclical foul is committed because that's where you are stopping a scoring opportunity and within the last 10 mins of a game they should be given all over the pitch. The two black cards at the weekend we not stopping scoring opportunity's or stopping someone's run that could hurt a team.
Both black cards at the weekend were late tackles and with common sense they both should of got yellow cards and even at that the 1st one would of been a harsh yellow card" I have a slightlydifferent perspective on black cards - There should be no sin bin.
Punishment for a black card offence is a yellow card for the individual - and a 14 meter free to the team regardless of where the foul occurred. BUT in the last five minutes of a game a penalty will be awarded. I think that would drive the correct behaviour.
Unfortunately that wont address the vagries of the Referees.
indaknownow (Offaly) - Posts: 112 - 25/11/2020 16:59:56
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