National Forum

Should The Rebel Flag Be Banned At Cork Matches?

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Replying To Tirchonaill1:  "Fly the flag, it's only a bit of craic, people are too sensitive these days, snowflakes everywhere looking for a reason to complain."
Ah sure your right. And seeing as Finn Harps are blue I bet no one will have a problem with waving Union Jack's in Ballybofey

Breezy (Limerick) - Posts: 1106 - 17/06/2020 14:37:58    2281123

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It is a class flag from a pure aesthetic point of view. I would like to know more how the non white community feel about it before banning it. There is a certain community that like to get offended on other peoples behalf. I understand it was the Confederate flag but that war was about more the slavery (i think). I get it that a lot of white supremacists use the flag however just because the nationalist paramilitaries use the tri-colour it is still our flag not theirs.

I do not understand the history of the flag enough to offer an opinion and I wonder do the people that made the ruling?

Mayonman (Galway) - Posts: 1292 - 17/06/2020 14:58:40    2281124

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Replying To Mayonman:  "It is a class flag from a pure aesthetic point of view. I would like to know more how the non white community feel about it before banning it. There is a certain community that like to get offended on other peoples behalf. I understand it was the Confederate flag but that war was about more the slavery (i think). I get it that a lot of white supremacists use the flag however just because the nationalist paramilitaries use the tri-colour it is still our flag not theirs.

I do not understand the history of the flag enough to offer an opinion and I wonder do the people that made the ruling?"
But the tricolour is the official flag of the republic. The Confederate flag doesnt represent any place that currently is in existence. By flying it you are showing your belief in what that flag did represent

KillingFields (Limerick) - Posts: 1638 - 17/06/2020 15:58:16    2281127

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Replying To Mayonman:  "It is a class flag from a pure aesthetic point of view. I would like to know more how the non white community feel about it before banning it. There is a certain community that like to get offended on other peoples behalf. I understand it was the Confederate flag but that war was about more the slavery (i think). I get it that a lot of white supremacists use the flag however just because the nationalist paramilitaries use the tri-colour it is still our flag not theirs.

I do not understand the history of the flag enough to offer an opinion and I wonder do the people that made the ruling?"
The war was about nothing more than some states wanting to retain the right to buy and sell human beings for profit.

MesAmis (Dublin) - Posts: 13145 - 17/06/2020 16:11:55    2281131

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Replying To MesAmis:  "The war was about nothing more than some states wanting to retain the right to buy and sell human beings for profit."
War is never that simple mes.

KingdomBoy1 (Kerry) - Posts: 11740 - 17/06/2020 16:24:49    2281133

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Replying To Mayonman:  "It is a class flag from a pure aesthetic point of view. I would like to know more how the non white community feel about it before banning it. There is a certain community that like to get offended on other peoples behalf. I understand it was the Confederate flag but that war was about more the slavery (i think). I get it that a lot of white supremacists use the flag however just because the nationalist paramilitaries use the tri-colour it is still our flag not theirs.

I do not understand the history of the flag enough to offer an opinion and I wonder do the people that made the ruling?"
I think it's fair to say that most people offended in this case aren't those who normally get offended on other peoples behalf

Superglue (Kerry) - Posts: 1283 - 17/06/2020 16:31:18    2281134

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Replying To KingdomBoy1:  "War is never that simple mes."
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/American_Civil_War

In this instance it was fairly straightforward.

Wally (Tyrone) - Posts: 727 - 17/06/2020 16:44:25    2281135

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New that this symbol isn't just a symbol of the past.

It is an active symbol used today by white supremacists. At best anyone using it in the USA is comfortable with being labelled a white supremacist, at worst is actually engaged in white supremacy.

White supremacy is a real world today problem. There's been a spate of black people being lynched over the last couple of weeks between California and Florida and possibly other southern states.

There's a lot of defenders of what this flag means, anyone with half a brain knows how deeply linked it is with white supremacy now, today, in this day and age.

Those arguing against that are just wrong to be honest.

What sort of a person is happy to have themselves associated with such a symbol. I'd say they're absolute disgraces.

Keep up your defences of the indefensible. Keep up with your pretence about it's meaning and try to fog it all you like. You're not fooling anyone. It's an insult to all our intelligences. Thankfully Cork county board have the sense to cut through all that and have nothing to do with it.

It's got no place in our association.

Whammo86 (Antrim) - Posts: 3114 - 17/06/2020 18:03:51    2281141

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Replying To KingdomBoy1:  "War is never that simple mes."
US Civil War was down to the southern states wanting to bring slaves to the new Western territories.

The democratic election of Lincoln as president in 1860 meant that this would be blocked and that the right of states to decide if they could keep slavery or not was threatened so the southern states formed the Confederacy and rebelled by withdrawing from the Union. The northern states attacked them and the war began.

The Confederacy was founded to protect the institution of slavery and no other reason.

Slavery was completely the root of the war.

Read the Cornerstone Speech by the Confederacy's Vice President where he laid out their reason to withdrawing from the Union.

It really wasn't that complicated.

MesAmis (Dublin) - Posts: 13145 - 17/06/2020 18:23:02    2281145

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From what I remember Cork are called the rebels from the time of the 'war of the roses' in England, whatever the hell that was about,
fly the union jack in Ballybofey?? them soccer boys probably do, oul foreign game that it is.
I always liked the southern cross flag, maybe it's because of Daisy Duke!! The good old General Lee was some bus,
cry me a river for this BLM crowd, half of them will be crying over some other cause that has nothing to with them next week, change your facebook profile pics and get butt hurt about some other awful thing that affects your snowflake little brains.

Tirchonaill1 (Donegal) - Posts: 1076 - 17/06/2020 20:40:02    2281158

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Replying To Tirchonaill1:  "From what I remember Cork are called the rebels from the time of the 'war of the roses' in England, whatever the hell that was about,
fly the union jack in Ballybofey?? them soccer boys probably do, oul foreign game that it is.
I always liked the southern cross flag, maybe it's because of Daisy Duke!! The good old General Lee was some bus,
cry me a river for this BLM crowd, half of them will be crying over some other cause that has nothing to with them next week, change your facebook profile pics and get butt hurt about some other awful thing that affects your snowflake little brains."
Now your talking, that was some ball of a car, the ould dodge charger, although my favourite car is the 1969 Ford mustang, it will be mine at some stage.

KingdomBoy1 (Kerry) - Posts: 11740 - 17/06/2020 21:59:50    2281161

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Replying To Tirchonaill1:  "From what I remember Cork are called the rebels from the time of the 'war of the roses' in England, whatever the hell that was about,
fly the union jack in Ballybofey?? them soccer boys probably do, oul foreign game that it is.
I always liked the southern cross flag, maybe it's because of Daisy Duke!! The good old General Lee was some bus,
cry me a river for this BLM crowd, half of them will be crying over some other cause that has nothing to with them next week, change your facebook profile pics and get butt hurt about some other awful thing that affects your snowflake little brains."
How messed up do you have to be to criticise an anti-racism movement or for it to anyway annoy you. What does that say about you deep down?

Whammo86 (Antrim) - Posts: 3114 - 17/06/2020 23:53:16    2281167

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Replying To MesAmis:  "Exactly.

The Cork County Board should be let get on with their own business rather than people getting offended by how they wish to portray their organisation."
The results weren't great when they were given the cheque book for Pairc Uí Chaoimh & especially now that there will be a recession & no Govt bailouts. Anyhow isn't it great that all this takes the heat out of us talking about the multi million overspend with three different spend figures from some of the most senior administrators in the game. How long before they start to levy clubs. Next bandwagon will be jumped on again to create another smokescreen, just don't mention the debt.

moc.dna (Galway) - Posts: 1049 - 18/06/2020 00:10:33    2281168

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Replying To Whammo86:  "New that this symbol isn't just a symbol of the past.

It is an active symbol used today by white supremacists. At best anyone using it in the USA is comfortable with being labelled a white supremacist, at worst is actually engaged in white supremacy.

White supremacy is a real world today problem. There's been a spate of black people being lynched over the last couple of weeks between California and Florida and possibly other southern states.

There's a lot of defenders of what this flag means, anyone with half a brain knows how deeply linked it is with white supremacy now, today, in this day and age.

Those arguing against that are just wrong to be honest.

What sort of a person is happy to have themselves associated with such a symbol. I'd say they're absolute disgraces.

Keep up your defences of the indefensible. Keep up with your pretence about it's meaning and try to fog it all you like. You're not fooling anyone. It's an insult to all our intelligences. Thankfully Cork county board have the sense to cut through all that and have nothing to do with it.

It's got no place in our association."
Well said and I totally agree !

omahant (USA) - Posts: 1824 - 18/06/2020 01:34:34    2281170

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Whatever about flying this flag, which I would not myself. When will we see matches again in Pairc Uí Chaoimh. The stadium has large debts and at present it is sitting empty.

galwayford (Galway) - Posts: 1927 - 18/06/2020 10:22:24    2281177

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Replying To galwayford:  "Whatever about flying this flag, which I would not myself. When will we see matches again in Pairc Uí Chaoimh. The stadium has large debts and at present it is sitting empty."
Well the munster football semifinal between ourselves and Cork will be played their around the 1st of November but I don't know will their be hurling games their as it'll be straight knockout I think.

KingdomBoy1 (Kerry) - Posts: 11740 - 18/06/2020 10:47:35    2281178

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Replying To moc.dna:  "The results weren't great when they were given the cheque book for Pairc Uí Chaoimh & especially now that there will be a recession & no Govt bailouts. Anyhow isn't it great that all this takes the heat out of us talking about the multi million overspend with three different spend figures from some of the most senior administrators in the game. How long before they start to levy clubs. Next bandwagon will be jumped on again to create another smokescreen, just don't mention the debt."
I think you missed my point.

People are entitled to question others assertion, opinions, belief, actions etc. That's a free democracy.

I was responding to a poster who both wanted to question the Cork County Board's decision but also thought it better to 'live and let live' and not question some Cork fans flying white supremacist flags.

MesAmis (Dublin) - Posts: 13145 - 18/06/2020 10:50:53    2281179

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This is more of a grey issue than some are seeing it as. . .

There is no suggestion being made that Cork fans are flying the flag in support of white supremacy, slavery, racism, etc.

My assumption (having not spoken to ever Cork fan who's ever flown the flag) is that they see the flag as representing their novel status as the Rebel county from the south of the country, nothing more.

It just so happens that the current bandwagon rolling through town has found yet another thing to be needlessly outraged by. The amount of energy that has been wasted in the last few weeks on issues that in no way help the anti-racism cause is ridiculous. It would suit people better to educate themselves and contribute to the betterment of an inclusive society than to focus on something so arbitrary that it takes focus of the real reform it claims to support.

cavanman47 (Cavan) - Posts: 4137 - 18/06/2020 12:22:27    2281189

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Replying To cavanman47:  "This is more of a grey issue than some are seeing it as. . .

There is no suggestion being made that Cork fans are flying the flag in support of white supremacy, slavery, racism, etc.

My assumption (having not spoken to ever Cork fan who's ever flown the flag) is that they see the flag as representing their novel status as the Rebel county from the south of the country, nothing more.

It just so happens that the current bandwagon rolling through town has found yet another thing to be needlessly outraged by. The amount of energy that has been wasted in the last few weeks on issues that in no way help the anti-racism cause is ridiculous. It would suit people better to educate themselves and contribute to the betterment of an inclusive society than to focus on something so arbitrary that it takes focus of the real reform it claims to support."
You clearly don't understand the role that these symbols play in continuation of the problem. These symbols have a meaning and in this case its one of white supremacy. How are we to educate people about the evils of racism when the very symbol of it is flow at our national sports events? What does that say about the GAA and Irish society? People who say this is a bandwagon typically are doing it to try and discredit the message that people are trying to send, I am not saying that is you but neither should you align yourself with the people who try to discredit the message.

zinny (Wexford) - Posts: 982 - 18/06/2020 13:24:55    2281194

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Replying To zinny:  "You clearly don't understand the role that these symbols play in continuation of the problem. These symbols have a meaning and in this case its one of white supremacy. How are we to educate people about the evils of racism when the very symbol of it is flow at our national sports events? What does that say about the GAA and Irish society? People who say this is a bandwagon typically are doing it to try and discredit the message that people are trying to send, I am not saying that is you but neither should you align yourself with the people who try to discredit the message."
Zinny if you and others keep walking around looking for things to be offended by you'll never be happy.

KingdomBoy1 (Kerry) - Posts: 11740 - 18/06/2020 14:32:54    2281200

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