National Forum

Cathal McShane Going To The AFL?

(Oldest Posts First) - Go To The Latest Post


Replying To freddy2:  "I've no issue with young McShane going to the AFL, i think any lad that has an opportunity being a professional sportsman, should at the very least give it a chance and see if they like it or not.
What i wouldn't mind seing though, the club or county being compensated somewhat by the AFL. As in, if you want one of our best guys/gals, they pass your trials/tests and will be offered a contract, then pay $100,000 (for example).
That way their club will benefit in a way from all work that went into helping said player reach their potential and same goes for the county. Maybe 50/50 kinda thing.
The loss of the player will somehow be eased by the club recieving extra cash , which can be put towards the next crop of youngsters coming through, better facilities etc.
or something along those lines.."
A noble thought but the obvious question to ask is why the AFL clubs would choose to do this? There is no legal requirement for them to do so and they are all professional businesses. While I agree with you in that it would undoubtedly be a nice gesture and very welcome boost for any club, it is extremely doubtful that they would do so as a goodwill gesture.

Lockjaw (Donegal) - Posts: 9115 - 07/01/2020 16:31:34    2258015

Link

Paying clubs whose players go to the AFL could open up a serious can of worms.

The chairman calling round "you know Cathal, the club could really do with that 100k"

Completely unworkable in anyways, what about a lad relocating overseas with his company? Clubs going to be looking for compo for that too? Coz that's what this amounts to at the end of the day, a lad getting a job opportunity overseas.

MesAmis (Dublin) - Posts: 13704 - 07/01/2020 17:22:22    2258019

Link

Why arent people more worried about all the players stepping away from there counties this year, its a crazy number of players (important players for there counties) not committing.
There might be 2 or 3 players at most going AFL, but thats going to a professional sport, bettering themselves and getting paid for it so why wouldn't they go

tommy132 (Mayo) - Posts: 600 - 07/01/2020 17:38:49    2258021

Link

Replying To MesAmis:  "Paying clubs whose players go to the AFL could open up a serious can of worms.

The chairman calling round "you know Cathal, the club could really do with that 100k"

Completely unworkable in anyways, what about a lad relocating overseas with his company? Clubs going to be looking for compo for that too? Coz that's what this amounts to at the end of the day, a lad getting a job opportunity overseas."
Yep. There is just no way to do this right. The payments would be a millstone around the player.

Its sad to see great talents do this but at the end of the day its a great opportunity for them (career wise and life experience).

I'm just surprised it doesn't happen more often.

Gator (Monaghan) - Posts: 238 - 07/01/2020 18:01:27    2258024

Link

Replying To Wally:  "And what would you have him say?

This whole argument is totally pointless. Unless we can offer these guys an alternative professional contract to stay at home and play Gaelic Football and pay then accordingly then it is a total non starter.

These are grown men who play an amateur sport in their spare time. None of us and that includes the president of the GAA have any right to tell these guys to stay at home and turn down a professional contract abroad.

Also I think Mickey Hartes comments were extremely petty. McShane has worked extremely hard for Tyrone of the past number of years and the least he deserved was for his manager to wish him all the best on his new venture."
Wally I'm a volunteer at my club the same as you and a lot of other people, I help out so that my club might have a chance of winning a County championship someday or maybe an allireland god be good but Im not doing it so geelong can win an AFL title we've lost 1 serious player already with probably another to go in 6 _12 months,

Why will you or I or anyone else want to keep on trucking volunteering with our clubs if this is what we have to look forward to?

KingdomBoy1 (Kerry) - Posts: 14092 - 07/01/2020 21:11:18    2258058

Link

Replying To KingdomBoy1:  "Wally I'm a volunteer at my club the same as you and a lot of other people, I help out so that my club might have a chance of winning a County championship someday or maybe an allireland god be good but Im not doing it so geelong can win an AFL title we've lost 1 serious player already with probably another to go in 6 _12 months,

Why will you or I or anyone else want to keep on trucking volunteering with our clubs if this is what we have to look forward to?"
Completely agree kingdom boy. If players want to leave and play a professional sport fair enough. What we have here is hours of work going into young men and women and it's then the whislings of our own games who sell out by acting as scouts for AFL clubs. Clarke made a fool of himself in trying to belittle Mickey Harte's comments by completely missing the point.
The sooner we cut ties with this mercenary game the better

mayotyroneman (Tyrone) - Posts: 1821 - 07/01/2020 21:47:46    2258073

Link

17 players are currently playing AFL. A lot higher number have opted out of County football for 2020? I'd say most or all who have opted out would consider the Afl contract too. Training for 8 or 9 months, for 9 games or more if they are lucky..

FoolsGold (Cavan) - Posts: 2763 - 08/01/2020 00:15:56    2258109

Link

Replying To KingdomBoy1:  "Wally I'm a volunteer at my club the same as you and a lot of other people, I help out so that my club might have a chance of winning a County championship someday or maybe an allireland god be good but Im not doing it so geelong can win an AFL title we've lost 1 serious player already with probably another to go in 6 _12 months,

Why will you or I or anyone else want to keep on trucking volunteering with our clubs if this is what we have to look forward to?"
So you are saying the only reason you volunteer at your club is so that you can achieve success on the field?

If I was you I would I would give it up. You are clearly not in it for the right reasons.

I volunteer at my club because I want the young people in my local area to have a sense of community. I want them to be active and learn about teamwork and make friends and enjoy the games and culture which the GAA provide. If success on the field is a byproduct of this then all the better but it is definitely not the primary reason why I do it.

If you are willing to give up volunteering because about 0.01% of the amateur playing population decide to avail of a lucrative professional career abroad then I think the GAA is better rid of you.

Wally (Tyrone) - Posts: 912 - 08/01/2020 08:56:12    2258128

Link

Replying To KingdomBoy1:  "Wally I'm a volunteer at my club the same as you and a lot of other people, I help out so that my club might have a chance of winning a County championship someday or maybe an allireland god be good but Im not doing it so geelong can win an AFL title we've lost 1 serious player already with probably another to go in 6 _12 months,

Why will you or I or anyone else want to keep on trucking volunteering with our clubs if this is what we have to look forward to?"
Why will you or I or anyone else want to keep on trucking volunteering with our clubs if this is what we have to look forward to?

You keep on trucking for the lads that stay. Sin é.

Jackeen (Dublin) - Posts: 4097 - 08/01/2020 09:12:51    2258129

Link

Replying To tommy132:  "Why arent people more worried about all the players stepping away from there counties this year, its a crazy number of players (important players for there counties) not committing.
There might be 2 or 3 players at most going AFL, but thats going to a professional sport, bettering themselves and getting paid for it so why wouldn't they go"
True and a hell of a lot more players heading to the states every year than heading to the AFL. I just dont understand why anyone would begrudge a talented player that can make a living playing sport something we unfortunately cant provide here in Gaa.

sourmilk93 (Roscommon) - Posts: 1143 - 08/01/2020 10:01:54    2258136

Link

Replying To Wally:  "So you are saying the only reason you volunteer at your club is so that you can achieve success on the field?

If I was you I would I would give it up. You are clearly not in it for the right reasons.

I volunteer at my club because I want the young people in my local area to have a sense of community. I want them to be active and learn about teamwork and make friends and enjoy the games and culture which the GAA provide. If success on the field is a byproduct of this then all the better but it is definitely not the primary reason why I do it.

If you are willing to give up volunteering because about 0.01% of the amateur playing population decide to avail of a lucrative professional career abroad then I think the GAA is better rid of you."
Look you're obviously happy being mediocre and you're in it for the social aspects of the games but some people have ambitions for their clubs beyond that and for those ambitions to be met you need your best players.

We won the County minor championship in 2014 and our best player from that team is now in oz last year we were in the senior county final against crokes after beating this years champions East Kerry we were trying to win our first county championship in 50 years but we came up short because our best player was in oz.

So yeah you would kinda start thinking what's the point.

KingdomBoy1 (Kerry) - Posts: 14092 - 08/01/2020 10:42:05    2258144

Link

Replying To KingdomBoy1:  "Look you're obviously happy being mediocre and you're in it for the social aspects of the games but some people have ambitions for their clubs beyond that and for those ambitions to be met you need your best players.

We won the County minor championship in 2014 and our best player from that team is now in oz last year we were in the senior county final against crokes after beating this years champions East Kerry we were trying to win our first county championship in 50 years but we came up short because our best player was in oz.

So yeah you would kinda start thinking what's the point."
if you believe the reason for falling short in a county final is due to 1 player being in oz then you should count yourself very lucky for even making that far because with an attitude like that around any club I wouldn't be far wrong in saying you might not get back there for a while. If you even made it to the final alone you can hardly look back now and say the reason you lost the final was due to 1 player being missing. My club won Intermediate championship this year for the first time in 42 years with possibly our best player in Dubai at the time, championships are won by top teams not by top players my friend.

If your players are that good and you desperately need them this much then pay them. Otherwise how could you expect them to miss out on such an opportunity? Pretty selfish look on things if you ask me, these lads dedicate a lot of their time and have done for the most part of their lives, so if and when the opportunity comes knocking you would be a fool to not consider it, after all it wont last forever

boman11 (Antrim) - Posts: 237 - 08/01/2020 11:19:35    2258157

Link

Did former Leitrim manager get offered a trial but stayed to play with his county?? Think so- could have been offered a coaching role also but stayed to coach the Leitrim minor team- dedication

ros4sammywilson (Roscommon) - Posts: 25 - 08/01/2020 11:29:12    2258161

Link

Replying To ros4sammywilson:  "Did former Leitrim manager get offered a trial but stayed to play with his county?? Think so- could have been offered a coaching role also but stayed to coach the Leitrim minor team- dedication"
yeah that fair but that is one mans choice, others may choose to make the leap

boman11 (Antrim) - Posts: 237 - 08/01/2020 11:44:21    2258162

Link

Wally I'm a volunteer at my club the same as you and a lot of other people, I help out so that my club might have a chance of winning a County championship someday or maybe an allireland god be good but Im not doing it so geelong can win an AFL title we've lost 1 serious player already with probably another to go in 6 _12 months,

Why will you or I or anyone else want to keep on trucking volunteering with our clubs if this is what we have to look forward to?
KingdomBoy1 (Kerry) - Posts: 10143 - 07/01/2020 21:11:18

That's a quite sad way at looking at a young man from your club getting an opportunity to make a good life for himself.

Such an insular and unhealthy way of defining your reasons for volunteering as well.

Luckily the vast majority of volunteers, like Wally mentions above, don't look at their volunteering in such a narrow viewpoint.

Essentially Mark O'Connor is more important to you than all the other players/members of your club combined. That's a little weird to be honest, bordering on obsessive.

If every volunteer stopped volunteering because a club member decided to take a job somewhere else the association wouldn't have folded in 1885.

MesAmis (Dublin) - Posts: 13704 - 08/01/2020 11:49:14    2258166

Link

Replying To KingdomBoy1:  "Look you're obviously happy being mediocre and you're in it for the social aspects of the games but some people have ambitions for their clubs beyond that and for those ambitions to be met you need your best players.

We won the County minor championship in 2014 and our best player from that team is now in oz last year we were in the senior county final against crokes after beating this years champions East Kerry we were trying to win our first county championship in 50 years but we came up short because our best player was in oz.

So yeah you would kinda start thinking what's the point."
I really don't know where to start with this one.

Being a volunteer for your GAA club is not about accepting mediocrity or aiming for more ambitious heights.

Its about being a volunteer. It's means you are there for your club and your community regardless.

Basically your attitude is that if your club has no chance of proper success then there is no point in being part of it. This goes against the entire ethos of our organisation.

Honestly I feel sorry for your club. They would be better off staying away from guys like you.

What sort of message is that to promote with the young people in your club. 'lads its looks like we are going to get relegated this year so just don't bother coming back cause changes of success are now gone. Turn the lights off on your way out'

Also it is not like you lost your best player to another club. He emigrated aboard to play a professional sport. What about the welfare of this player. Surely you would wish him success in life. What if one of your best players decided to take a step back for a few years to concentrate on their career as a barrister or teacher or doctor or engineer. Are these guys then black listed also?

Wally (Tyrone) - Posts: 912 - 08/01/2020 12:10:46    2258171

Link

Replying To ros4sammywilson:  "Did former Leitrim manager get offered a trial but stayed to play with his county?? Think so- could have been offered a coaching role also but stayed to coach the Leitrim minor team- dedication"
Benny Guckian I am referring to

ros4sammywilson (Roscommon) - Posts: 25 - 08/01/2020 12:11:36    2258172

Link

Replying To KingdomBoy1:  "Look you're obviously happy being mediocre and you're in it for the social aspects of the games but some people have ambitions for their clubs beyond that and for those ambitions to be met you need your best players.

We won the County minor championship in 2014 and our best player from that team is now in oz last year we were in the senior county final against crokes after beating this years champions East Kerry we were trying to win our first county championship in 50 years but we came up short because our best player was in oz.

So yeah you would kinda start thinking what's the point."
I totally understand your frustration in losing your best minor player but not sure what you are suggesting. Are you thinking these lads should be tied to the club forever because they have been coached by the club? What Cathal McShane is doing is not really much different from some lad travelling abroad for work and better lifestyle. Personally I don't volunteer my time coaching kids to prevent them going on and doing other things in their life, we don't own these lads and they should be free to make their own choices.

As other posters have stated, a bigger issue is the number of top class players opting out of county football because of the demands. Even the demands on club footballers is absurd, training over Christmas and the like.

Green_Gold (Donegal) - Posts: 1873 - 08/01/2020 12:11:43    2258173

Link

Replying To boman11:  "if you believe the reason for falling short in a county final is due to 1 player being in oz then you should count yourself very lucky for even making that far because with an attitude like that around any club I wouldn't be far wrong in saying you might not get back there for a while. If you even made it to the final alone you can hardly look back now and say the reason you lost the final was due to 1 player being missing. My club won Intermediate championship this year for the first time in 42 years with possibly our best player in Dubai at the time, championships are won by top teams not by top players my friend.

If your players are that good and you desperately need them this much then pay them. Otherwise how could you expect them to miss out on such an opportunity? Pretty selfish look on things if you ask me, these lads dedicate a lot of their time and have done for the most part of their lives, so if and when the opportunity comes knocking you would be a fool to not consider it, after all it wont last forever"
Congratulations to your team on winning the intermediate championship its a great achievement to win any championship but there is a big difference between intermediate and seniors.

I have no doubt if my club played the intermediate championship we'd probably most likely win the intermediate allireland but we have higher ambitions than that.

One great player can make a big difference to any club. Why do you think the aussies pay big bucks for these lads.?

KingdomBoy1 (Kerry) - Posts: 14092 - 08/01/2020 13:17:56    2258179

Link

Replying To mayotyroneman:  "Completely agree kingdom boy. If players want to leave and play a professional sport fair enough. What we have here is hours of work going into young men and women and it's then the whislings of our own games who sell out by acting as scouts for AFL clubs. Clarke made a fool of himself in trying to belittle Mickey Harte's comments by completely missing the point.
The sooner we cut ties with this mercenary game the better"
I thought Clarke's comments were respectful and measured when in fact he could have laughed and made a real show of comments that were made by Harte. Clarke spoke about facts - the AFL is first and foremost the organisation overseeing a number of multi million pound business's. Yes this business is a sporting one but like all professional business the end goal is to ensure their shareholders and interests are protected. Every penny spent or invested is planned in a structured way and spent in the best interest of the business. Yes it's true some people in Ireland may be a local contact for the AFL but ultimately the amount of research, planning and decision making is taken at the very top of these organisations.

The players are the main assest to this business so in no way are they going to offer any form of trial, contract on the recommendation of one person in Ireland. Even as some seem to want GAA memberships are stripped, a ban put on some watching GAA or entering grounds (clarke must of had a giggle) the multi million Australian business will still use video analysis, player profile, statistical experts, life coaches, Psychologists to name a few experts to identify an asset and make moves towards assessing suitability. When I last looked I think you can fly from Australia and enter Ireland to undertake research.

Some want the old Parish honour of remaining in the GAA and dare they look towards better opportunties. But in this case the GAA is dealing with multi million pound organisations with all the resources in the world, but yes lets close the club gates, turn off all media streams in Ireland and hide our players from outside influences. As I said Clarke was respectful in public when he had every right to laugh.

sam1884 (UK) - Posts: 999 - 08/01/2020 13:55:28    2258188

Link