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It Will Be 21 Years Since Meath Won Sam

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Just because

Buachaillbui (Clare) - Posts: 95 - 03/09/2019 15:38:40    2232440

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Here's to 21 more ;)

MesAmis (Dublin) - Posts: 13196 - 03/09/2019 17:34:19    2232482

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It's September, I thought the silly season was over?

Tirchonaill1 (Donegal) - Posts: 1164 - 03/09/2019 18:18:06    2232501

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Replying To MesAmis:  "Here's to 21 more ;)"
And so say all of us

jobber (Westmeath) - Posts: 856 - 03/09/2019 18:26:53    2232505

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Ah sure that's nothing....try 68 years and counting....

yew_tree (Mayo) - Posts: 10415 - 03/09/2019 18:34:15    2232509

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Replying To Tirchonaill1:  "It's September, I thought the silly season was over?"
A bit rich coming from you trolling on a hurling thread today.

Defaulter1831 (Kilkenny) - Posts: 40 - 03/09/2019 19:51:03    2232532

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Replying To Defaulter1831:  "A bit rich coming from you trolling on a hurling thread today."
Tirchonaill is an anagram for I Trollchain.

GreenandRed (Mayo) - Posts: 5997 - 03/09/2019 20:17:51    2232539

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So Galway's famine is not going to get mocked for another 2 years? Fine by me

eoghan6688 (Galway) - Posts: 137 - 03/09/2019 20:28:12    2232541

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Not long enough :D

realdub (Dublin) - Posts: 7842 - 03/09/2019 20:35:57    2232543

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Replying To jobber:  "And so say all of us"
Remind me how long it is since Westmeath won one??? :)

royaldunne (Meath) - Posts: 17142 - 03/09/2019 20:59:28    2232549

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It was 20 years before in 1987. Meath have put down a marker this year, mcentee given another 3 years. Rome wasn't built in a day, think the aim next year will be for division 1 retention and seeing can we make last 4 in championship, getting closer to Dublin has also to be up there. We getting there and threads like this will only make it sweeter when we destroy teams again.
Hon the royal.

royaldunne (Meath) - Posts: 17142 - 03/09/2019 21:03:11    2232551

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Replying To royaldunne:  "It was 20 years before in 1987. Meath have put down a marker this year, mcentee given another 3 years. Rome wasn't built in a day, think the aim next year will be for division 1 retention and seeing can we make last 4 in championship, getting closer to Dublin has also to be up there. We getting there and threads like this will only make it sweeter when we destroy teams again.
Hon the royal."
This silly thread was created as a joke. It's in reference to another ridiculous thread which was created by a guy who happens to be from Meath. Nothing to see here. Best of luck to you.

Buachaillbui (Clare) - Posts: 95 - 03/09/2019 21:56:14    2232570

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For whatever reason Meath can not get it together underage, even when they have a decent minor side it never develops into a decent u21/u20 side. In 1997 they won their 7th Leinster u21 title in 9 years, hence a conveyor belt of talent to senior team and serious success, they won their last in 2001(18 yrs) when one S. Cluxton played against one S. Bray!
Mind you, to compound that, since 2011 in Leinster you can have all the underage success you want but unless you've a generous billionaire/oil baron or multinational co. backing your team its a waste of time/money.

cuttothebone (Kildare) - Posts: 125 - 03/09/2019 22:23:09    2232580

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Replying To Defaulter1831:  "A bit rich coming from you trolling on a hurling thread today."
Truth hurts, obviously you can't handle it.

Tirchonaill1 (Donegal) - Posts: 1164 - 03/09/2019 22:40:00    2232585

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Replying To royaldunne:  "It was 20 years before in 1987. Meath have put down a marker this year, mcentee given another 3 years. Rome wasn't built in a day, think the aim next year will be for division 1 retention and seeing can we make last 4 in championship, getting closer to Dublin has also to be up there. We getting there and threads like this will only make it sweeter when we destroy teams again.
Hon the royal."
I actually don't see any of the above happening any time soon

superdub (Dublin) - Posts: 372 - 03/09/2019 23:19:39    2232595

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21 years in gaa terms is very very small time scale

let's do a trip nationwide starting with leinster

91 Years since kildare won Sam
62 years since louth won Sam
37 years since Offaly won Sam
101 years since Wexford won Sam
132 years and no Sam yet for Wicklow Westmeath Kilkenny Carlow laois
68 years since Mayo won Sam
75 years since Roscommon won Sam
68 years since Cavan won Sam
132 years and no Sam yet for leitrim Sligo Antrim Waterford Clare Monaghan Fermanagh
26 years since Derry won Sam
25 years since Down won Sam
99 years since Tippearey won Sam
123 years since Limerick won Sam

The fact is vast majority of counties are starved of All Ireland sucess for generations and generations. Only an handful of counties have had consistent sucess they would be Kerry Dublin Cork Galway and yes Meath. 21 years seems long but in gaa terms its a not huge gap. The fact is championship is not fit for purpose. The straightjacket of the proviencial system thwarts counties growth and sucess. When you look at the roll of honours there is a lack of sucess nationwide, with a few counties dominating , it is very startling. People think hurling is dominated by three counties. Football is nearly just as bad.

And provicial sucess is even worse

Let's take leinster
Meath have not won leinster in 9 years
laois have not won leinster in 16 years
Westmeath have not won leinster in 15 years
Kildare have not won leinster in 18 years
Offaly have not won leinster in 22 years
Louth have not won leinster in 68 years
Wexford have not won leinster in 74 years
Carlow have not won leinster in 73 years
longford have not won leinster in 51 years
kilkenny have not won leinster in 108 years
Wicklow have never won leinster.


Ulster
Cavan have not won Ulster in 22 years
Armagh have not won Ulster in 11 years
Down have not Ulster in 25 years
Derry have not won Ulster in 23 years
Antrim have not won Ulster in 68 years
Fermanagh have never won Ulster
Clare have not won Munster in 27 years
Tippearey have not won Munster in 85 years
limerick have not Munster in 123 years
Waterford have not won Munster in 121 years

And if you look at national league division 1 winners it even a less spread of winners, division 1 league titles are won by handful of counties eg Kerry 20 titles, Dublin 13 titles , Mayo 12 , Cork 8 ,Meath 7 , Derry 6 .

Connacht
Galway have 4 div 1 titles and last league div 1 win was 38 years
Roscommon have 1 div 1 title and last league div 1 win was 41 years ago
Sligo leitrim have never won national league div 1 title

Leinster
Meath have 7 league div 1 titles and last div 1 league win was 25 years ago
Offaly have 1 leagur div 1 title and last div 1 league win was 21 years ago
laois have 2 league div 1 title and last div q win was 33 years ago
longford have 1 league div 1 title and last div 1 title was 53 years ago
kildare, louth ,Wexford, Wicklow , Westmeath have never won national league div 1 title

Ulster
Down have 4 national league div 1 titles the last win div 1 title was 29 years
Monaghan have 1 national league div 1 title and last div 1 title win was 34 years ago
Cavan have 1 national league division title and last div 1 title win was 71 years ago
Armagh have 1 national league division 1 title and last win was 14 years ago
Tyrone have 2 national league division 1 title and last win was 16 years ago
Donegal have 1 league div 1 title and last win was 12 years ago
Fermanagh Antrim Tippearey Waterford Clare limerick have never won national league div 1 title

The spread of winners in football is not large. The championship doesn't work for must counties. Most counties are starved of national and provicial sucess for decades. Maybe an open draw champions league might help. I dont know. But when u look at the roll of honour its quite startling. People think a few counties have dominated hurling, football is just as bad. And if anything things are getting worse.

Less counties are less and less closing gaps between wins, in the 90s every year counties were closing gaps between wins. The only team this decade was Monaghan who won Ulster after 25 year wait and Donegal ended a 20 year wait for Sam. Thats it. In the 90s every year a county ended a mini famine or longer.


1987 Meath won All Ireland title after a 20 year wait
1989 Cork won All Ireland title after a 16 year wait
1991 Down won an All Ireland after a 23 year wait
1992 Clare won Munster title after a 75 year wait
1994 leitrim won Connacht after a 65 year wait
1995 Dublin won an All Ireland after a 12 year wait
1997 Kerry won an All Ireland after a 11 year wait
1998 Galway won an All Ireland after 26 year wait
1998 kildare won leinster title after a 42 year wait
2003 laois won leinster title after a 57 year wait
2007 Sligo won Connacht title after 32 year wait

U dont see counties anymore closing gaps between sucess at provicial or All Ireland level. In the last ten years Only Monaghan who closed a 25 year gap between Ulster titles and Donegal closed a 20 year gap between All Ireland wins and Cork closed a 20 year gap between All Irelands.

Furlong1949 (Meath) - Posts: 1048 - 04/09/2019 00:16:32    2232600

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Sorry I made a mistake above I should have said Galway ended 32 year wait for Sam in 1998 and Down ended a 23 year wait for Sam in 1991. Sorry about that my mistake.

Furlong1949 (Meath) - Posts: 1048 - 04/09/2019 00:42:23    2232606

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Replying To Tirchonaill1:  "Truth hurts, obviously you can't handle it."
What 'truth' might that be? Your little rant that you don't understand the hurling championship structure? Your bitterness towards hurling? I can't do anything about the latter but I'll go through the former as it seems you're still having difficulty getting your head around it. I'm a patient man.

Each team in the provinces of Leinster and Munster play each other once in a round robin system. The top two teams in each province play in the provincial final. The top 3 are in the All Ireland series, that's 6 teams plus the 2 Joe McDonagh Cup finalists. The Joe McDonagh is a tier directly below the Liam McCarthy teams. Joe McDonagh is a former GAA president who died a few years ago. I won't say at what stage of the all Ireland series provincial winners, losers, 3rd place teams and Joe McDonagh teams enter as it'll confuse you. I know you probably got a parent or older sibling to explain the Super 8s to you.

I think that's enough for now. We wouldn't want to overload your brain, that's a highly probable scenario.

Defaulter1831 (Kilkenny) - Posts: 40 - 04/09/2019 01:41:54    2232610

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Replying To cuttothebone:  "For whatever reason Meath can not get it together underage, even when they have a decent minor side it never develops into a decent u21/u20 side. In 1997 they won their 7th Leinster u21 title in 9 years, hence a conveyor belt of talent to senior team and serious success, they won their last in 2001(18 yrs) when one S. Cluxton played against one S. Bray!
Mind you, to compound that, since 2011 in Leinster you can have all the underage success you want but unless you've a generous billionaire/oil baron or multinational co. backing your team its a waste of time/money."
That is true we have a problem at under 20 / under 21. But that doesn't necessary mean we will always have a problem at under 20/ 21. Cork hurling had a problem having sucess at under 20 / under 21 they have turned it around. Ur own county up to this decade had a poor record at under 20/ 21, u turned it around. Cavan had a very poor record at under 20 / under 21 up to recent times , but in recent years they turned it around with 5 under 21 Ulster titles in a row. Meath cud turn it around in the future at this level also. Meath like every county is not static , it goes up and down at every level. Just because we didnt have no sucess at under 20/ 21 in the last decade so doesn't mean that this will continue for the next decade or so. Time will tell. But Meath have got their act together at underage , and Meath and ur own county I believe our potentially on the verge of a much more positive era then the last 15 years . Time will tell.


In many ways Meath and kildare r in the same boat. For the last 15 years but counties have followed very similar paths. Both have failed v Dublin, both have tried to break into stay in top 8 teams in country and failed and but have at times showed potential eg Kildare in 2010 2011 2017 Meath in 2007 2009 2010 2019. Both are under the east leinster project with louth and Wicklow and both have had massive population growth in last few years. Which in my view cud be the key to sucess in future.

Just regards Meath under 20 / 21 u r right our record is apalling at this level. It is one of the main reasons we have failed to suceed since Boylan. But I do believe there d signs of change. Our record at minor has improved and much stronger. In last 3 years we have won 2 Under 17 leinster titles in a row , including last years leinster minor title and have won last 2 under 16 leinster titles in a row beating Dublin in under 16 leinster final recently. We r also the only county in leinster in this decade outside Dublin to reach a All Ireland minor final. Next years minor team sud be strong again with players from 2 under 16 leinster winning teams. We have also beating Dublin at minor 4 times in last 5 years at minor. But yes it hasn't translated to under 20 / 21 , yet.

The reasons for lack of sucess at under 21 since early 00s was talent dried up we didnt take it serious and we were behind Dublin and then kildare at underage. In last 4 years we have got our act together at underage with development panels , strenght and conditioning and almost immediately we have seen closing of gap with kildare and Dublin and sucess at minor. The next step is under 20. The last two years we had strong under 20 teams but we underperformed . To prove this we defeated All Ireland champions last year and 7 of last years under 20 team played senior for Meath this year and 5 of last year's under 20 team played v Kerry Donegal and Mayo in the super 8s and performed excellently. This year team was very young and most are eligible next year at under 20 and hopefully we have a new management team at that level. If Meath continue to have sucess at minor and there is reasons to believe it will continue , it will surely inevitably it will happen at under 20.

The reasons to be optimistic for Meath in short term is Meath have good natural defenders who are young and two top class defenders keoghan and McGill who would walk onto every team in the country. Meath have manager who has being sucessful in every job he has been in . Meath have great tradition and Meath are one toungest teams in the country with new exciting young talent. The youngest set of forwards to play in super 8 was Meath. 5 forwards from last years under 20 team played in super 8 this year very well eg James Conlon 20 , Ethan Devine 20 , Dara Campion 20 , Thomas McGovern 20 and Shane Walsh 18. And there is allot of exciting young forward talent in the county other then these players like Matthew Costello and luke Mitchell particularly. And Meath could have up to 7 or 8 panelist returning next year eg Eamon Wallace , Donal lenihan, Ronan Jones, Joey Wallace , Niall kane , Ruari O Coilean, Alan Forde and Paddy Kennelly. With players peaking in next 2 years Meath look in a position of strenght in next 2 to 3 years. But Meath do need to find a top class midfielder and 2 top class forwards to move on to next level. Time will tell if that happens.

But in the long term there are good signs for Meath and kildare.

1 Meath and kildare have now this year recieved increased funding and coachs and so have louth and Wicklow. Meath had 3 full time coachs , kildare had 4. Dublin had 70 plus since mid 00s. Meath ans kildare both have 15 full.time coachs and 22 coachs in total each from this year. Yes it still behind Dublin. But it still 5 times more then before. And they were only introduced this year after both counties have had sucess. Also 4 counties have recieved increased finding circa 300000 annually. Again this can only be a positive. The people in charge of these programmes believe it will take 5 or 6 years before it impacts senior team.

2 The second reasons is population explosion in both counties. It does guratees nothing.
For example look at Wicklow , big population yet no provicial title , look at Antrim big population yet no sucess since 1940s. look at limerick big population no Munster title since 1890s in football and 2 hurling All-Irelands in 80 years , look at kildare big population and no sucess from 1930s to 1990 and finally look at Dublin from 1940s to 2010 Dublin underachieved with huge population. Population gurantees nothing.

Also growth in both counties is Dubs who support and want kids to play for Dublin or have no interest in gaa. 70% of people who live in Meath are not from Meath , 20% of people in live in Cork or Donegal are not from Donegal.

However if Meath and kildare can tap into population growth this could be massive. Dublin tapping into a new denographic has being one of keys to Dublins sucess. St Vincents and other clubs traditional Dublin clubs r still strong but the Kilmacud Crokes ballyboden and Cualas have brought Dublin to a new level. 25 years ago there was little gaa in south side Dublin suburbia. There has been a massive growth of gaa in middle class gaelgoir Dublins south side suburbs recently. This has brought a whole new demographic to Dublin gaa. Basically the parents of so many of these footballers are from the country. So many from kerry or Donegal. They came up to Dublin became civil servants etc and brought a love of gaa and passed it to their kids. Their kids grew up and many of them became Dublins current great generation. The darling of the hill was Jimmy Keaveny from Marino in 70s Charlie Redmond from Finglas in 90s and now its Con Callaghan from Dalkey, Bonos parish who is currently hero of the hill. This has been one of the reasons for Dublins sucess , the explosion of popularity of gaa in Dublins southside suburbs.

This is where Meath and kildare need to tap into. Both need to keep football alive in the heartlands of the county eg kildare mid part and south. Meath in Northern villages and traditional clubs like Skyrne. But both need to tap into new suburbs in both counties eg Meath south east Rataoth Ashbourne Dunshaughlin and kildare eg Maynooth leixlip. Families who move to the area who support Dublin will have no interest in Meath or kildare. But familes who move to the area who have no interest in gaa or little , their children who get involved in gaa they could be next future stars for Meath and kildare. The population growth in both counties is so large that the numbers could be there to lead to sucess. Kildare and Meath are following the Dublin blueprint on the ground and coachs are going into populated areas to promote gaa. It worked in Dublin and Dublin had unprecedented sucess.

If Meath and kildare tap into this new demographic eg suburbs in north kildare or south east Meath sucessfully this potentially could lead to huge positives and benefits and yes sucess for both counties. Maybe even unprecedented sucess for both counties. If eitheir county doesn't tap into or is unable it will probaly mean that those counties will not be sucessful.

Meath had a run of 80 years of sucess. We look like we could be the new Cavan. Something extraordinary wud need to happen to stop this. Meaths population doubling in 10 years going from 100000 to 200000 in 15 years going from smaller population then Mayo, going from rural county to county with has in parts become suburbia , that is an extraordinary demographic change and could be the factor that cud kickstart Meath.

When a county has decades sucess when stops it seem to stop for decades eg Wexford after 1918 , kildare after1930s , Cavan and Mayo after 1950s. Cavan had no underage sucess for decades until recently. And Cavans population declined after 1950s. Meaths has exploded in last 15 years. It has had no benefit whatsoever to football in the county in last 15 years . However if it is tapped into it could be pivotal.

Meaths football can be divided into two eras demographically
1 1930s 1940s 1950s 1960s. It was thought that west of Ireland families brought love of gaa to Meath. This is wrong. Movement to Meath was in 30s 40s and 50s when Meath had sucess. So many of Meaths players in first successful Meath teams came from old Meaths families in the area for generations. It was the next generation that was west of Ireland parents.

2 Meath teams of 1970s 1980s and 1990s these are players many of the players had parents from the west eg O Rourke born in leitrim , Coyle family ftom Donegal, O Malley family from Mayo , Mark Reilly family like kerry. And many more. The current Dublin team and Meath of 80s and 90s many of their parents came from.the west and brought a love of gaa from the west.

3 The next phase of Meath football could it be like Dublin current sucess which has been built in new area, Dublins south suburbs . Could suburbs in Meath south east kickstart and be a strong foundation for future Meath sucess. That could be the extraordinary factor that stops Meath becoming the new Cavan after 1950s..Time will tell. I could be wrong I could be right who knows. But I believe fhere is a massive new population in Meath and in kildare and if it is tapped into it can only be a positive in the future. Time will tell.

Furlong1949 (Meath) - Posts: 1048 - 04/09/2019 05:35:47    2232618

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Replying To superdub:  "I actually don't see any of the above happening any time soon"
Many said that this year when we set 3 objectives, promotion, Leinster final and super 8s. But we achieved all 3.

royaldunne (Meath) - Posts: 17142 - 04/09/2019 09:16:47    2232632

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