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Replying To Seanfanbocht: "1 thing is sure- you have to have a separate "window" (hate that word) for the Club and inter Co Championships." Would 4 windows be better? - club league, inter-co league, club champp, inter-co champp?
omahant (USA) - Posts: 3275 - 29/05/2025 17:39:23
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Replying To Whammo86: "I guess what I'm thinking is that designated club weekends double up as rest weeks from the county action.
I know that you have to rely though on inter county managers releasing players." The current system means the Club Championships have the scene to themselves with no County manager interventions or players being "injured" etc .
Seanfanbocht (Roscommon) - Posts: 2377 - 29/05/2025 18:42:53
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In the real world of the 2026 format, seems a weekend off after league finals might win out as a priority for the weekend freed up.
If all the Round 1 games are played on the same weekend two weeks after the Leinster and Ulster finals - it will be a football only weekend, as the Leinster and Munster hurling finals are the weekend after. If they do that, there should be no need for the Round 1 draw until all football provincial finals have been played.
Rounds 2A and 2B then can be two weeks after Round 1 - another all football weekend.
Round 3 can be the weekend after Rounds 2A & 2B. Just a matter of deciding football round 3 and hurling quarter finals on the Saturday or Sunday.
Quarter finals then the weekend after Round 3 - another all football weekend.
legendzxix (Kerry) - Posts: 8888 - 29/05/2025 18:58:20
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Replying To Seanfanbocht: "The current system means the Club Championships have the scene to themselves with no County manager interventions or players being "injured" etc ." Yeah I know. It's just the split between Inter county and club is terrible.
Inter county gets 27 weeks of the year to their competitions. If you count March to October as the best months for playing, inter county gets 22 of the 35 best months. There's very little time allocated to club championship because of the inter county footprint.
I know clubs will play leagues in that but in a lot of counties those aren't overly prestigious. So you have club players getting very few good games.
I don't know that we should just give in to county dominating the access to players in the way in which we do.
I actually think in a lot of counties the clubs would have more sway than you'd imagine.
Like if you're in Derry and there's club championship being played you are not going to listen to your county manager telling you to fake injury.
Whammo86 (Antrim) - Posts: 4561 - 30/05/2025 08:38:09
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The Super 8s had 4 rounds of qualifiers before 2 groups of 4. The All Ireland 16 could have 2 rounds of qualifiers before 4 groups of 4. Sometimes things are over complicated! League seeding could have come into play for byes to Q2 and seeding draws.
Seven Q2 losers and the highest ranked Q1 loser could compete in a Tier 2 - 2 groups of 4.
Eight Q1 losers could compete in a Tier 3 - 2 groups of 4.
It would be up to counties how they would embrace the lower tier competitions.
Antrim lose to Armagh in Ulster quarter final. Antrim beat Cork in Q1. Best case scenario for Antrim is they win in Q2 and qualify for the All Ireland. Worst case scenario then is that they lose in Q2 but go into Tier 2 that has an obvious higher status than Tier 3.
Waterford on the other hand lose to Tipperary in Munster quarter final. Waterford lose to Cavan in Q1. Waterford along with seven other Q1 losers compete in Tier 3.
UEFA have three tiers Champions League, Europa League and Conference League. GAA can have All Ireland, Mid Tier Cup (name to be decided) and Tailteann Cup.
Run all three as tiered qualification competitions. If there is ever agreement to separate provincials from the All Ireland - the three tiered competitions can evolve to be standalone with promotion and relegation. Rome wasn't built in a day!
legendzxix (Kerry) - Posts: 8888 - 30/05/2025 10:43:09
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Replying To legendzxix: "In the real world of the 2026 format, seems a weekend off after league finals might win out as a priority for the weekend freed up.
If all the Round 1 games are played on the same weekend two weeks after the Leinster and Ulster finals - it will be a football only weekend, as the Leinster and Munster hurling finals are the weekend after. If they do that, there should be no need for the Round 1 draw until all football provincial finals have been played.
Rounds 2A and 2B then can be two weeks after Round 1 - another all football weekend.
Round 3 can be the weekend after Rounds 2A & 2B. Just a matter of deciding football round 3 and hurling quarter finals on the Saturday or Sunday.
Quarter finals then the weekend after Round 3 - another all football weekend." I think in a perfect world, championship would be every 2 weeks, giving teams adequate time to prepare for each next round.
This would mean every 2nd week is an all football weekend or an all hurling weekend, giving fans a chance to follow both.
Ciaran359 (Galway) - Posts: 27 - 30/05/2025 12:32:49
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Replying To legendzxix: "The Super 8s had 4 rounds of qualifiers before 2 groups of 4. The All Ireland 16 could have 2 rounds of qualifiers before 4 groups of 4. Sometimes things are over complicated! League seeding could have come into play for byes to Q2 and seeding draws.
Seven Q2 losers and the highest ranked Q1 loser could compete in a Tier 2 - 2 groups of 4.
Eight Q1 losers could compete in a Tier 3 - 2 groups of 4.
It would be up to counties how they would embrace the lower tier competitions.
Antrim lose to Armagh in Ulster quarter final. Antrim beat Cork in Q1. Best case scenario for Antrim is they win in Q2 and qualify for the All Ireland. Worst case scenario then is that they lose in Q2 but go into Tier 2 that has an obvious higher status than Tier 3.
Waterford on the other hand lose to Tipperary in Munster quarter final. Waterford lose to Cavan in Q1. Waterford along with seven other Q1 losers compete in Tier 3.
UEFA have three tiers Champions League, Europa League and Conference League. GAA can have All Ireland, Mid Tier Cup (name to be decided) and Tailteann Cup.
Run all three as tiered qualification competitions. If there is ever agreement to separate provincials from the All Ireland - the three tiered competitions can evolve to be standalone with promotion and relegation. Rome wasn't built in a day!" I don't think a 3rd tier is better for weaker counties than what we have currently.
Whammo86 (Antrim) - Posts: 4561 - 30/05/2025 13:25:21
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Replying To Ciaran359: "I think in a perfect world, championship would be every 2 weeks, giving teams adequate time to prepare for each next round.
This would mean every 2nd week is an all football weekend or an all hurling weekend, giving fans a chance to follow both." It is possible to extend the inter county season by two weeks.
1. Extending by one week still allows 12 weekends until the end of October for completing club championships.
2. Extending by another week can mean the All Ireland club hurling and football semi finals being on the same weekend at the start of January.
This would result in:
All Ireland hurling and football finals on the first two weekends of August. 12 weekends from mid August to the first weekend of November for club championships to be completed. The rest on November and December then for completing the provincial club championships in the current timescale.
legendzxix (Kerry) - Posts: 8888 - 30/05/2025 13:26:41
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Here's my idea....
Provincial championships as normal and the 16 in the All-Ireland consist of the provincial finalists, the Tailteann Cup winners from the year before, and then the best-placed league teams (As is the case now)
The four provincial winners go to to the preliminary SFs; the provinces rotate each year i.e. Leinster v Munster this year, Leinster v Ulster next year, and Leinster v Connacht the year after. Say this year we had Louth v Kerry and Galway v Donegal. The winners of the two PSFs would go straight to the AISFs while the two losers would go to the AIQFs. This way provincial winners would get two shots at qualifying for an AISF (Incentivises winning provincial finals)
The eight teams in the All-Ireland series who did not make a provincial final would go to Section A of the Qualifiers. R1 would consist of 4v4. R2 would have a winners' section (The 4 winners from R1) and a losers' section (The 4 losers from R1); the two winners of the winners' section would advance to R4 and the two losers of the winners' section would go to R3 while the two winners of the losers' section would go to R3 and the two losers of the losers' section would be eliminated. The two winners of the R3 game would then play the two winners of the winners' section games in R4
The four provincial runners-up would go to Section B of the qualifiers; these teams would play off in R1. The two winners in R1 would advance to R3 of Section B while the two losers would go to R2 of Section B where they would play the two winners of Section A's R4 games. The two winners of the Section B R2 games would go to R3; the two winners of these games would advance to the AIQFs
ElGranSenor (Wexford) - Posts: 557 - 31/05/2025 23:21:56
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Replying To Whammo86: "I agree with a lot of what you are saying.
I'd just think a lot of it also applies to 2 groups of 8 and that would be superior to 4 by 4.
Groups of 4 are particularly bad in the GAA where there a fewer draws and more chance of things being wrapped up after 2 rounds.
Dividing the field into 4 reduces the number of games between teams around the same level. Say there's a top 8 and bottom 8, with 4 groups of 4 you get 4 games involving 2 top 8 teams. If you have groups of 8 you'd get 12 games involving 2 top 8 teams." And you could double that to 24 'top 8' games in my AILC.
omahant (USA) - Posts: 3275 - 01/06/2025 13:12:22
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@legendzxix (Kerry) - Posts: 8871 - 30/05/2025
Coming 'round to my AILC?
omahant (USA) - Posts: 3275 - 01/06/2025 13:28:47
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Replying To Whammo86: "I don't think a 3rd tier is better for weaker counties than what we have currently." I think my AILC 3rd tier KO has value after those teams played a 'bottom 16' league campaign.
omahant (USA) - Posts: 3275 - 01/06/2025 13:34:42
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Replying To ElGranSenor: "Here's my idea....
Provincial championships as normal and the 16 in the All-Ireland consist of the provincial finalists, the Tailteann Cup winners from the year before, and then the best-placed league teams (As is the case now)
The four provincial winners go to to the preliminary SFs; the provinces rotate each year i.e. Leinster v Munster this year, Leinster v Ulster next year, and Leinster v Connacht the year after. Say this year we had Louth v Kerry and Galway v Donegal. The winners of the two PSFs would go straight to the AISFs while the two losers would go to the AIQFs. This way provincial winners would get two shots at qualifying for an AISF (Incentivises winning provincial finals)
The eight teams in the All-Ireland series who did not make a provincial final would go to Section A of the Qualifiers. R1 would consist of 4v4. R2 would have a winners' section (The 4 winners from R1) and a losers' section (The 4 losers from R1); the two winners of the winners' section would advance to R4 and the two losers of the winners' section would go to R3 while the two winners of the losers' section would go to R3 and the two losers of the losers' section would be eliminated. The two winners of the R3 game would then play the two winners of the winners' section games in R4
The four provincial runners-up would go to Section B of the qualifiers; these teams would play off in R1. The two winners in R1 would advance to R3 of Section B while the two losers would go to R2 of Section B where they would play the two winners of Section A's R4 games. The two winners of the Section B R2 games would go to R3; the two winners of these games would advance to the AIQFs" I think it favours Provincial champions too much.
You've too many streams all going at the same time. I don't think people will follow it very easily.
Whammo86 (Antrim) - Posts: 4561 - 02/06/2025 09:22:36
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Replying To GreenandRed: "Do you think we'll see the day that intercounty players will be separated from clubs in same way that players from other sports go to the next level and don't return to play for clubs until their next level team has finished their season? Don't see many interpro rugby players of League of Ireland players return to their first club through the season. I know they're semi-professional or professional and GAA isn't, but the club calendar and intercounty calendar should then be easier to schedule." Sure this is close to already being the case. I don't know the structure in every county but say in donegal the league runs away without the county players. Panelists do see game time for their club. Caolan mccolgan played for his club last week as he didn't see game tine against tyrone. He did yesterday against cavan.
Though the county players who play week in week out won't play for their club until donegal are out. Last year I think the league was over by the time donegal were out. The league is decoupled from championship and teams get a guaranteed fixture list and know where they stand. Plenty bemoan the league in donegal but I'm not so sure. There's a little bit of new teams this year with termon on top and four masters doing well.
Then for championship the county players are back and there are groups. People bemoan the lack jeopardy but if they don't play these group games there's a risk of county players playing maybe on or two matches with their club.
Tyrone link league and championship and play star games for maybe four rounds and then wait to their county men are back. Championship is straight knock out. It appeals to traditionalists but they only started their league at the weekend and it was pushed out to allow the 20s all ireland to finish. To me that's a very late start to the year and they end up losing players over the summer to the us and other travel. I'd say the average club players must find it frustrating.
Ulsterchamps_32 (Donegal) - Posts: 853 - 02/06/2025 11:48:43
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Replying To omahant: "I think my AILC 3rd tier KO has value after those teams played a 'bottom 16' league campaign." Is there anything at stake for that? In my head your tier 2nd tier includes top group teams and making the quarterfinals was most important.
Your tier 3 had nothing at stake in terms of progressing levels.
Whammo86 (Antrim) - Posts: 4561 - 02/06/2025 13:07:00
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The Allianz hurling league is getting on fine without being linked to the All Ireland. Especially with the improved format this year of a top 7, next 7 and so on.
The Allianz football league didn't necessarily need to be linked to the All Ireland. It is a very balanced format however. It is understandable that players were in favour of linking it to the All Ireland series in some way.
Using the league for byes and seeded qualifiers would have been a fair link. 23 non finalists, with the Tailteann winner already qualified, playing off over two qualifying rounds for 7 league qualifier places. 5 byes based on league ranking from Q1. 9 seeded v 9 non seeded in Q1. 7 seeded v 7 non seeded in Q2.
The Tailteann 16 after All Ireland qualifiers arguably could be straight knockout. The All Ireland 16 after knockout qualifying rounds possibly more suited to 4 groups of 4, with top 2 only going through.
legendzxix (Kerry) - Posts: 8888 - 02/06/2025 13:51:52
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Replying To Whammo86: "Is there anything at stake for that? In my head your tier 2nd tier includes top group teams and making the quarterfinals was most important.
Your tier 3 had nothing at stake in terms of progressing levels." Tier 3 AIC KO is stand alone and akin to winning hurling's Rackard Cup.
The 8 Tier 3 participants are all eligible to qualify for the Tier 2 AIC KO the next year (would need a top 4 finish in the Bottom 16 league).
Tier 2 AIC KO is stand alone and akin to winning hurling's McDonagh Cup.
8 of 12 Tier 2 participants are eligible to qualify for the Tier 1 Sam AIC playoffs the next year (would need a Prelim QF win or bye to QFs this year and a top 8 finish next year in the Top 16 league).
Tier 2 AIC KO ties are:
Prelim QFs 11,12,13,14 host 20,19,16,15; and
QFs 9,10,17,18 host Prelim QF 'reverse seed' winners.
So, 2-4 go up and down.
There is plenty of scope to win an AIC at own level and a wider net in league for development.
omahant (USA) - Posts: 3275 - 02/06/2025 15:22:51
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Replying To legendzxix: "The Allianz hurling league is getting on fine without being linked to the All Ireland. Especially with the improved format this year of a top 7, next 7 and so on.
The Allianz football league didn't necessarily need to be linked to the All Ireland. It is a very balanced format however. It is understandable that players were in favour of linking it to the All Ireland series in some way.
Using the league for byes and seeded qualifiers would have been a fair link. 23 non finalists, with the Tailteann winner already qualified, playing off over two qualifying rounds for 7 league qualifier places. 5 byes based on league ranking from Q1. 9 seeded v 9 non seeded in Q1. 7 seeded v 7 non seeded in Q2.
The Tailteann 16 after All Ireland qualifiers arguably could be straight knockout. The All Ireland 16 after knockout qualifying rounds possibly more suited to 4 groups of 4, with top 2 only going through." I like it (not as much as my AILC though :)
omahant (USA) - Posts: 3275 - 02/06/2025 15:27:31
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Replying To omahant: "Tier 3 AIC KO is stand alone and akin to winning hurling's Rackard Cup.
The 8 Tier 3 participants are all eligible to qualify for the Tier 2 AIC KO the next year (would need a top 4 finish in the Bottom 16 league).
Tier 2 AIC KO is stand alone and akin to winning hurling's McDonagh Cup.
8 of 12 Tier 2 participants are eligible to qualify for the Tier 1 Sam AIC playoffs the next year (would need a Prelim QF win or bye to QFs this year and a top 8 finish next year in the Top 16 league).
Tier 2 AIC KO ties are:
Prelim QFs 11,12,13,14 host 20,19,16,15; and
QFs 9,10,17,18 host Prelim QF 'reverse seed' winners.
So, 2-4 go up and down.
There is plenty of scope to win an AIC at own level and a wider net in league for development." It's not akin to the Rackard.
A team that wins the Rackard gets promoted.
A team that wins your top tier starts the following season in exactly the same place as the previous season.
The tier 2 doesn't really make sense either. Can 0 teams get promoted?
It just doesn't make sense compared to having 2 tiers and the top teams in each tier qualify for their own tier's knockout rounds.
Whammo86 (Antrim) - Posts: 4561 - 02/06/2025 19:38:30
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Wicklow should be given a bye to the final every year.
This will ensure maximum viewing figures and advertising revenue.
sponger (Wicklow) - Posts: 2931 - 02/06/2025 21:39:13
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