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Replying To Pikeman96: "I also agree 100% and it's a point I've made myself sometimes in the past.
I think it's particularly relevant at underage level, including U20. For example, there's been a lot of talk here lately about how our U19 & U20 hurling sides fared against Kilkenny. But fact is, all our players of that age have probably spent around 40% or more of their time with their clubs playing football since they first started playing. The Kilkenny lads, probably no more than 10%, and even that's probably a push." My question to that point is what about the Wexford players who won Leinster u21s the likes of Dee O Keefe, Mogie, Chin , Jippo, Aidan Nolan, Donohoe and the rest of the players who all would have all played football, this crop of players just aren't up to standard obviously , sure didn't we hammer Kilkenny in 2015 by near 20 points, wonder did Kilkenny blame football that year
WexMurph (Wexford) - Posts: 181 - 06/04/2024 16:32:34
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Replying To Viking66: "Most Kilkenny lads play football up to u12. It's when they get to their teens that most do more hurling. More probably hurl at home, or outside of training, which is a big difference. Culture boss!" Yep that's a crucial point.
As Kilkenny relations keep telling me their success isn't from the training field, it's the field out the back of the house!
tearintom (Wexford) - Posts: 1381 - 06/04/2024 16:41:54
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Replying To WexMurph: "My question to that point is what about the Wexford players who won Leinster u21s the likes of Dee O Keefe, Mogie, Chin , Jippo, Aidan Nolan, Donohoe and the rest of the players who all would have all played football, this crop of players just aren't up to standard obviously , sure didn't we hammer Kilkenny in 2015 by near 20 points, wonder did Kilkenny blame football that year" Mogie and Matthew won a Leinster u21 in Football but not Hurling. Doesn't seem to have done their hurling any harm, they've been 2 of our best hurlers the last 10 years.
Viking66 (Wexford) - Posts: 12904 - 06/04/2024 18:46:46
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Replying To Viking66: "Mogie and Matthew won a Leinster u21 in Football but not Hurling. Doesn't seem to have done their hurling any harm, they've been 2 of our best hurlers the last 10 years." Yes forgot MOH a fantastic servant to Wexford hurling aswell.
WexMurph (Wexford) - Posts: 181 - 06/04/2024 19:11:56
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Replying To WexMurph: "My question to that point is what about the Wexford players who won Leinster u21s the likes of Dee O Keefe, Mogie, Chin , Jippo, Aidan Nolan, Donohoe and the rest of the players who all would have all played football, this crop of players just aren't up to standard obviously , sure didn't we hammer Kilkenny in 2015 by near 20 points, wonder did Kilkenny blame football that year" Also alot of these lads were unlucky to lose the 21 LMF by a couple points, and half hurled u20 last year. Are you sure they aren't up to standard? It's surely a bit early to say that?
Viking66 (Wexford) - Posts: 12904 - 06/04/2024 19:15:53
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Replying To Viking66: "Also alot of these lads were unlucky to lose the 21 LMF by a couple points, and half hurled u20 last year. Are you sure they aren't up to standard? It's surely a bit early to say that?" I wasn't at the game but from reading previous posters who were it appears as a team they are not, that's not saying any of them won't go onto hurl senior for Wexford, I'd hope we'd get two or three to come through. And I wouldn't read into the first game either, think we will beat Laois and get a bit of confidence from that.
WexMurph (Wexford) - Posts: 181 - 06/04/2024 20:02:50
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Replying To WexMurph: "I wasn't at the game but from reading previous posters who were it appears as a team they are not, that's not saying any of them won't go onto hurl senior for Wexford, I'd hope we'd get two or three to come through. And I wouldn't read into the first game either, think we will beat Laois and get a bit of confidence from that." I was at the game and I don't think it's fair to blame just the players for that defeat. Laois will be no pushovers.
Viking66 (Wexford) - Posts: 12904 - 06/04/2024 20:55:47
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Replying To Viking66: "I was at the game and I don't think it's fair to blame just the players for that defeat. Laois will be no pushovers." So just to be clear, Rory O Connor has not left the panel then(as was mentioned by someone earlier)?
hunting (Wexford) - Posts: 1012 - 06/04/2024 22:07:34
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Replying To Viking66: "Mogie and Matthew won a Leinster u21 in Football but not Hurling. Doesn't seem to have done their hurling any harm, they've been 2 of our best hurlers the last 10 years." So imagine how good they'd have been at hurling if they'd given all their time to it, instead of spending so much time playing football as well ;)
Ah, but seriously - it's not as simple as a case of "all hurling is bad for football", and "all football is bad for hurling". But it surely stands to logical reason that if a young lad spends all his time playing just one sport instead of dividing his time between two or more, then chances are he'll end up better at the one sport he concentrates on.
Anyway, I think the reaction over even the last page or so here shows just exactly why this will be always be an elephant in the room, rather than something being considered seriously as a potential action point. There's an old adage that a strength can also be a weakness, and I think Wexford GAA and the dual question is a real example of that.
Pikeman96 (Wexford) - Posts: 2324 - 06/04/2024 22:18:23
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Replying To hunting: "So just to be clear, Rory O Connor has not left the panel then(as was mentioned by someone earlier)?" He definitely hasn't left the panel. God only knows what rumour the other poster here must have heard, but it's not true anyway.
Pikeman96 (Wexford) - Posts: 2324 - 06/04/2024 23:32:31
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Replying To Pikeman96: "He definitely hasn't left the panel. God only knows what rumour the other poster here must have heard, but it's not true anyway." He was sitting right in front of me in Nowlan Park only a week ago.
Viking66 (Wexford) - Posts: 12904 - 07/04/2024 09:13:59
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Replying To Pikeman96: "He definitely hasn't left the panel. God only knows what rumour the other poster here must have heard, but it's not true anyway." In the absence of real information there will be plenty of rumours flying round the county;-)
Viking66 (Wexford) - Posts: 12904 - 07/04/2024 10:38:19
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That good, because if we can get him right. He is a top quality player
hunting (Wexford) - Posts: 1012 - 07/04/2024 11:15:14
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Replying To Pikeman96: "So imagine how good they'd have been at hurling if they'd given all their time to it, instead of spending so much time playing football as well ;)
Ah, but seriously - it's not as simple as a case of "all hurling is bad for football", and "all football is bad for hurling". But it surely stands to logical reason that if a young lad spends all his time playing just one sport instead of dividing his time between two or more, then chances are he'll end up better at the one sport he concentrates on.
Anyway, I think the reaction over even the last page or so here shows just exactly why this will be always be an elephant in the room, rather than something being considered seriously as a potential action point. There's an old adage that a strength can also be a weakness, and I think Wexford GAA and the dual question is a real example of that." Agreed Pikeman - anytime this point is raised people tend to take offence for some reason.
It's not an easy one to solve as playing both is a part of the ingrained culture in a lot of clubs now.
Giving us examples of fellas who were great hurlers and footballers is not a valid argument or an argument at all, I am sure that if players like Henry Sheflin, Tommy Walsh , Eoin Larkin , JJ Delaney etc played football they would have been great footballers too because they were athletes with a very high level of coordination. The point is they didn't play football and they have drawers full of All Ireland medals to show for playing hurling only.
Look at the most successful clubs in the history of the hurling and football all Ireland championships-
Hurling:
Ballyhale
Portumna
Birr
Newtownshandrum
Hurling only clubs
Football -
Corofin
Crossmaglen Rangers
Neno Rangers
Football only clubs
Wexford are in a position where we are a county with serious potential due to the interest levels in the county and our obvious love for the games but we are Jack's of all trades and masters of none as a result.
Again if you are going to argue against this point I've no problem but don't take offence by the issue being raised. There may well be lots of arguments for Wexford to stick to the current approach let's discuss them if they exist.
OasisorBlur (Wexford) - Posts: 37 - 07/04/2024 11:15:41
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Replying To OasisorBlur: "Agreed Pikeman - anytime this point is raised people tend to take offence for some reason.
It's not an easy one to solve as playing both is a part of the ingrained culture in a lot of clubs now.
Giving us examples of fellas who were great hurlers and footballers is not a valid argument or an argument at all, I am sure that if players like Henry Sheflin, Tommy Walsh , Eoin Larkin , JJ Delaney etc played football they would have been great footballers too because they were athletes with a very high level of coordination. The point is they didn't play football and they have drawers full of All Ireland medals to show for playing hurling only.
Look at the most successful clubs in the history of the hurling and football all Ireland championships-
Hurling:
Ballyhale
Portumna
Birr
Newtownshandrum
Hurling only clubs
Football -
Corofin
Crossmaglen Rangers
Neno Rangers
Football only clubs
Wexford are in a position where we are a county with serious potential due to the interest levels in the county and our obvious love for the games but we are Jack's of all trades and masters of none as a result.
Again if you are going to argue against this point I've no problem but don't take offence by the issue being raised. There may well be lots of arguments for Wexford to stick to the current approach let's discuss them if they exist." What's all Ireland club championship wins got to to do with it?
We've been consistently poor when it's comes to Leinster and all Ireland Club championshios.
When we've had club teams playing all Ireland club championship we haven't been successful despite the fact some of these clubs didn't play any football whatsoever.
The fact is we have only ever won one all Ireland club championship in 1989, Buffers Alley who obviously won the Senior Hurling Championship in Wexford and Leinster that year. What else did they win that year? Oh yeah, Intermediate Football!
tearintom (Wexford) - Posts: 1381 - 07/04/2024 12:15:05
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Replying To OasisorBlur: "Agreed Pikeman - anytime this point is raised people tend to take offence for some reason.
It's not an easy one to solve as playing both is a part of the ingrained culture in a lot of clubs now.
Giving us examples of fellas who were great hurlers and footballers is not a valid argument or an argument at all, I am sure that if players like Henry Sheflin, Tommy Walsh , Eoin Larkin , JJ Delaney etc played football they would have been great footballers too because they were athletes with a very high level of coordination. The point is they didn't play football and they have drawers full of All Ireland medals to show for playing hurling only.
Look at the most successful clubs in the history of the hurling and football all Ireland championships-
Hurling:
Ballyhale
Portumna
Birr
Newtownshandrum
Hurling only clubs
Football -
Corofin
Crossmaglen Rangers
Neno Rangers
Football only clubs
Wexford are in a position where we are a county with serious potential due to the interest levels in the county and our obvious love for the games but we are Jack's of all trades and masters of none as a result.
Again if you are going to argue against this point I've no problem but don't take offence by the issue being raised. There may well be lots of arguments for Wexford to stick to the current approach let's discuss them if they exist." Eoin Larkin was still playing Football for his club last year! Along with Jackie Tyrell he has only 1 less Senior club county football medal than he has county hurling ones.
We had a discussion about this on this forum over the winter. Slightly less than half the clubs in Wexford have their 1st team playing at a higher grade in hurling than football, or did better last year in hurling when playing both at the same grade. How do you intend deciding which clubs should be hurling only and which football only? Most clubs have lads in them that like both, and even have lads that prefer hurling and others that prefer football. Many of our club and county players like both equally, and most play both.
I agree that we as a county would probably do better in both if our players were closer to half hurlers and half footballers but how do you intend to make this happen? As a county our clubs evolved the way they are. Its going to be very difficult to change that now.
Viking66 (Wexford) - Posts: 12904 - 07/04/2024 12:19:41
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Does no one ask the question why they play football . From where I see it most of the so called hurling men, top brass ,,the coaches managers do all they can to stop them maybe not in direct terms but quiet conversations clashing with football training matches , veiled threats etc and yet they still play football why .
Is it because we were a football county first trafition plays its part ,is it because they are told not to play reverse physiology , don't tell me what to do , maybe they think more of their club than county no problem with that , all county hurling managers have little or no time for football and change every few years whilst your club will always be your club .
Or just maybe they enjoy it after the pressure they felt to perform in the hurling and the deflation they felt when they did nt succeed and listening or reading how they let the county or club down again .
Play foitball they can cut loose and if they are successful so be it they enjoy it. if the don't win theres no enquiry or witch hunt ..
I kniw why I d play football for the release the fun and play with my mates .
If hurling wants to blame football so be it but look at the reasons they play football.
Maybe just maybe if hurling was made to be more enjoyable in wexford instead of the constant pressure, expectation and sense of failure when we don't succeed.
They might then decide to choose hurling only .
On a side note soccer is probably more of a hindrance than football in the early years . How many of the current seniors or 20s played soccer county (kennedy cup ) or Loi in their developing years . The best hurlers are best footballers soccer and rugby players too . We don't choose what they play we provide the opportunity until we make it the most attractive . We ll continue this debate .
What they do outside of training is their choice of sport.
A hurl and ball ,a football , a rugby ball , PlayStation, Netflix or drink ,drugs . . Or a combination of all above .
Would Cork welcome Ben o Connor back to hurling if the rugby does nt work out or would they tell him sorry u made your choice . Its hurling only or go away never to return .
Formertownie (Wexford) - Posts: 218 - 07/04/2024 12:25:55
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Replying To Viking66: "Eoin Larkin was still playing Football for his club last year! Along with Jackie Tyrell he has only 1 less Senior club county football medal than he has county hurling ones.
We had a discussion about this on this forum over the winter. Slightly less than half the clubs in Wexford have their 1st team playing at a higher grade in hurling than football, or did better last year in hurling when playing both at the same grade. How do you intend deciding which clubs should be hurling only and which football only? Most clubs have lads in them that like both, and even have lads that prefer hurling and others that prefer football. Many of our club and county players like both equally, and most play both.
I agree that we as a county would probably do better in both if our players were closer to half hurlers and half footballers but how do you intend to make this happen? As a county our clubs evolved the way they are. Its going to be very difficult to change that now." Yeah very valid points Viking and trying to address it is very difficult now , this would piss some people off but would a shortened football championship help ? We are more of a hurling county so we might aswell be straight up about it and design our championships in such a way that more time is given to hurling - as a game it needs more time to develop and master the skills etc. Give lads the opportunity to play football still but don't be tied to having the very same championship and league structure for both.
Again this would really piss off the football fraternity but are we trying to keep everyone happy? Go with the vast majority instead.
OasisorBlur (Wexford) - Posts: 37 - 07/04/2024 13:04:13
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Replying To OasisorBlur: "Agreed Pikeman - anytime this point is raised people tend to take offence for some reason.
It's not an easy one to solve as playing both is a part of the ingrained culture in a lot of clubs now.
Giving us examples of fellas who were great hurlers and footballers is not a valid argument or an argument at all, I am sure that if players like Henry Sheflin, Tommy Walsh , Eoin Larkin , JJ Delaney etc played football they would have been great footballers too because they were athletes with a very high level of coordination. The point is they didn't play football and they have drawers full of All Ireland medals to show for playing hurling only.
Look at the most successful clubs in the history of the hurling and football all Ireland championships-
Hurling:
Ballyhale
Portumna
Birr
Newtownshandrum
Hurling only clubs
Football -
Corofin
Crossmaglen Rangers
Neno Rangers
Football only clubs
Wexford are in a position where we are a county with serious potential due to the interest levels in the county and our obvious love for the games but we are Jack's of all trades and masters of none as a result.
Again if you are going to argue against this point I've no problem but don't take offence by the issue being raised. There may well be lots of arguments for Wexford to stick to the current approach let's discuss them if they exist." Henry Shefflin played football and was on a Kilkenny minor football team that nearly defeated Laois
WexMurph (Wexford) - Posts: 181 - 07/04/2024 13:06:13
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Replying To WexMurph: "Henry Shefflin played football and was on a Kilkenny minor football team that nearly defeated Laois" Wexmurph I am aware of that but are you suggesting in anyway that KKs approach to football is on a par with Wexfords? I mean there is literally 0 comparison - KK minors used to come together for a few weeks before championship and probably still do so let's not waste our time letting on they give anytime to football
OasisorBlur (Wexford) - Posts: 37 - 07/04/2024 13:12:10
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