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Fair point bdbuddah. It's hard to compare games now to say 40 years ago. There's underage LGFA club teams now doing strength and conditioning work. There's more live intercounty hurling and football games on in one weekend than you'd see in an entire year. Maybe there's some paralysis by analysis now with TV cameras and supporters with phone cameras capturing different parts of the game. And technology allowing club teams to watched tagged video analysis of games in preparation for the next game. It's taken way more seriously now. Too much maybe. But when you give a risk averse coach the tech to breakdown their opponents weaknesses without any great coaching skills we get in bother. But online media nitpicking for negativity when there have been great spots in games have a lot to answer for too and they also include an audience that rarely go to games. They won't go away if rule changes improve things either because, unfortunately, bad news sells morevthan good news. And more games on television or online, schools, colleges, club, intercounty, gives them clickbait vultures more negativity over positivity. When they're changingbthe rules the GAA should promote the positive aspects of our games too. And tax the negative GAA clickbait stories. This should be a sports headline, not Liverpool losing to Man Utd.
GreenandRed (Mayo) - Posts: 7982 - 19/03/2024 18:22:58 2532218 Link 1 |
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As Tommy Tiernan would say, "Oh Mother of God!!!
Greengrass (Louth) - Posts: 6178 - 19/03/2024 18:56:44 2532223 Link 1 |
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I'm sorry It genuinely wasn't meant as an insult, it's more that some of the attitudes on the game are a bit tunnel visioned around what it should look like and that's what frustrates me.
Whammo86 (Antrim) - Posts: 4526 - 19/03/2024 19:14:22 2532226 Link 2 |
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We'll have to agree to disagree but I do struggle to see how some of the recent Kerry, Dublin and Mayo games since say 2011 are among some of the best games of all time. Some of the moments that have been produced, the skill levels of the average player. It does annoy me some of the negativity around the game. I accept that I'm probably in the minority around thinking some of the negativity is overblown but I genuinely can't understand it and in particular when I do watch games pre 2000. I loved your Meath team of the late 90s and the Joyce Galway team and I do miss the likes of Trevor Giles and that silky centre forward type is way less effective but overall the game is just so much better to me now. Likes some of the brain dead passing at times. Stupid play annoys me in any sport and as a game it was so naively played for such a long time. Whammo86 (Antrim) - Posts: 4526 - 19/03/2024 20:15:45 2532234 Link 2 |
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I've heard people mentioning 3 main type of rules changes to combat massed defenses/ aimless holding of possession and encouraging more contests for possession. 1. Limiting handpassing. 2. Confining a certain no. of players to certain areas of pitch. 3. Bring in an Aussie Rules type tackle to give the tackling player more of a option to dispossess the player in possession. The one that made most sense was a variation of confining players to a certain area of pitch. That was when I heard Joe Brolly suggesting getting players to line in positions for kickouts. The advantage of this is kickouts are a natural stoppage in game so easier to implement and practically make it harder to get blanket tactics in place. My initial thoughts on your idea is it's complicated and alien to how we have always refereed the game. I'd worry players and spectators would be confused. I do understand where your coming from in that rugby seems to have a very complex rulebook which works in their game and I do remember in the old International rules matches the referees calling out how many handpasses players had completed to enforce handpass limits. bdbuddah (Meath) - Posts: 1413 - 19/03/2024 23:10:17 2532265 Link 1 |
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In fairness a lot of GAA supporters are the ones who are most critical of the tactics in modern gaelic football. Jaralth Burns setting up a committee is a reflection of this. If you talk to people at games you often hear people saying modern tactics are boring and spoil the excitement of the sport (but they would all accept that you have to play like this to be competitive). I can't say I've talked to current players below their mid thirties regarding it (as they a different generation than me) but I have heard older players who stayed playing for years so experienced playing a more old style and a more modern style say that football years ago was much more enjoyable to play. But again they are happy to go along with how it's played as there is little choice if you want to be competitive. I've heard a coach of a senior club in a neighbouring county joke about the diminished entertainment value in modern gaelic football. People have been saying similar to above for years but nothing is ever done about it, to me its a no brainer we have to use the rule book to push the game away from these tactics. bdbuddah (Meath) - Posts: 1413 - 20/03/2024 15:42:29 2532349 Link 1 |
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The thing is years ago, at club level anyway, playing direct football maybe was smart as I don't think the fitness levels would have been there to play in the modern possession style. Years ago tacklers got away with a lot more so keeping possession might not have been as easy. If you had a rule say that 3 players had to be inside the opposition 20 meter line for kickouts playing quick balls in after a kickout could again, at times become a smart option. bdbuddah (Meath) - Posts: 1413 - 20/03/2024 15:53:15 2532351 Link 1 |
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World Rugby continues to be restless, rolling out innovation after innovation to improve their product -and although too much for most posters on this forum, I wish the GAA could learn a trick or two.... omahant (USA) - Posts: 3243 - 20/03/2024 22:16:51 2532414 Link 2 |
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US NFL now introducing a "radical" kickoff rule change, to be "trialled" for one year in their regular season. Time for the GAA to step up.... https://apnews.com/article/nfl-owners-meetings-new-kickoff-rules-fc1bf4fddc86ef03cf6fbc44ba6c26a0 omahant (USA) - Posts: 3243 - 27/03/2024 14:45:29 2534110 Link 2 |
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Another game yesterday showing that maybe it's not the rules of the game but the attitude of the teams that results in borefests. Super game yesterday, maybe even the best league final ever? sligo joe (Dublin) - Posts: 892 - 01/04/2024 13:00:28 2534973 Link 0 |
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Yes the Division 1 Final was a great game because as you say both teams went at it but the Div 2 Final while close was a tough watch…. Westmeath set up ultra defensive to suck the life out of Down and got their reward but it was far from entertaining… Coaches have taken the good out of the game and players are no longer allowed to play off the cuff in fear of loosing possession hence the drab over and back passing… The Division 1 Final was a real outlier and I wouldn't expect too many Championship games to be that entertaining….
ForeverBlue2 (Cavan) - Posts: 3856 - 01/04/2024 14:00:14 2534983 Link 2 |
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You are some craic lad. Analysing games to death. Sick to death of the negative stuff. We have a brilliant product which can thrive if championship is restructured properly and teams are on a pretty similar level.
TheFlaker (Mayo) - Posts: 8385 - 01/04/2024 14:25:34 2534991 Link 1 |
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Both A.I semis last year and the A.I final last year, all good games. Living here in Sligo I went to a few div 3 games this year, evenly matched teams, good games. A lot of the problems are mismatches with weak teams playing much stronger teams. Messing with the rules to force the weaker teams to be less defensive will only result in hammerings and will also take away from contests like yesterday
sligo joe (Dublin) - Posts: 892 - 01/04/2024 14:28:42 2534992 Link 0 |
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When ever the rules revision group meet their main priority should be to incentivise the attacking team and penalise the 14 /15 players behind the ball system. The div 1 final was great stuff but only because the result wasn't vital especially for Dublin. It'll be back to the cagey ultra defence again ala Westmeath as soon as championship starts. Let's hope jarlath is not too taken in by yesterday's game. It was a one off.
Overthebar53 (Carlow) - Posts: 347 - 01/04/2024 14:34:18 2534993 Link 1 |
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So how come so many of the recent championship semi finals and finals have been absolutely brilliant games as well? Should i start naming the games to refresh the memory? There was plenty at stake in those games.
TheFlaker (Mayo) - Posts: 8385 - 01/04/2024 17:17:39 2535029 Link 1 |
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We have a brilliant product that's simply not producing…. A paltry 33k at yesterday's 2 games just proves the point but people like you keep your head buried in the sand and can't admit to the problems…
ForeverBlue2 (Cavan) - Posts: 3856 - 01/04/2024 17:31:39 2535034 Link 2 |
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Westmeath won Division 3. They're a football team not a song and dance act. Big difference, for me, between watching a game on television and being at the game. Being on the sidelines, even if not high scoring, the hitting, the $hI+hou$ing, buying frees, good defending is good entertainment. There are more and more live games available to view live and on playback and most media will highlight the negatives. It doesn't mean we shouldn't try to improve the attacking aspect of our games but also improve the defending, not the blanket defending. If Gaelic Football coaches are learning from other sports would it do any harm for a few neutral set of eyes from other sports to give a few thoughts on how to improve our great sport? Like the basketball three pointer, draw lines 3 metres in from the sideline, parallel between the 45s and a score from play inside the parallel lines is worth 2 points. Or after 6 frees conceded in a half it's a 14 yard free to the opposition in front of the posts. Might loosen up the defending a bit knowing a 7th or more free will cost you. But there will still be what people consider to be unentertaining games, the minority, where coaches will be risk averse. Unfortunately a television viewing social media will continue to highlight negativity and advertisers and sponsors pay too much heed to them. It's a sport, it's great to have entertaining games, but get a Disney+ account if you want entertainment. GreenandRed (Mayo) - Posts: 7982 - 01/04/2024 20:33:10 2535065 Link 1 |
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I didn't see any of the league finals live but got the highlights on TV last night (it's always hard to comment saying how good a football match is or not from watching highlights as watching a few good scores can make the most boring matches seem good). Listening to reports the division 1 final was good as 2 good teams went at each other (this usually doesn't happen nowadays). General consensus seems to be division 2 final was boring apart from last 10 when Armagh tried to go at Donegal. In division 3 final accounts were that it was a terrible game where Westmeath played hugely defensively. Division 4 final seemed to be one sided but Laoise kicking game was good to watch (on the highlights anyway). All these games are between teams that should be evenly matched. You said the 2 AI semi finals were good last year. I was at the Dublin Monaghan semi final last year, it was a close game for most of it but it was a boring game with plenty of crowd silences because Monaghan played very defensively which led to Dublin having to play keep ball (I should have wanted Monaghan to win but ended up happy that Dublin got a good few scores late on due to the way Monaghan's approach spoiled the game). I was at the Dublin Monaghan game because the Tailteann cup final was on before it, the discussion in our car on way home was watching the Dublin Monaghan game wouldn't encourage us to travel to Croke Park as a neutral to watch other big games. I take your point that blanket defense is seen as a means of weaker teams keeping the score down but I'm not sure how well this actually plays out. Is a game where a team plays a thick blanket so as to lose by say 9 points really a better game than an open game where they lose by 16 points? The games with a thick blanket are really hard watches even if they sometimes do help weaker teams to keep the score down a bit. If we want more competitive matches let's start by going back to 3 subs. bdbuddah (Meath) - Posts: 1413 - 01/04/2024 20:43:48 2535068 Link 1 |
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You seemed to have missed my many, many posts where i said league and championship should be merged and where i have pointed out the league is still very much a secondary competition. I want radical restructuring, hardly an attitude of someone with their head buried in the sand.
TheFlaker (Mayo) - Posts: 8385 - 01/04/2024 20:51:46 2535070 Link 0 |
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Good sensible post and the reason attendance figures are dwindling
ForeverBlue2 (Cavan) - Posts: 3856 - 01/04/2024 21:20:43 2535075 Link 2 |